When government pays Insurance Premiums it is a Scam on the Taxpayers

[guyser]

So you an insurance salesman. Big deal. You are one step up from a Vacuum Cleaner salesman and one step down from an Encyclopidia salesman while I was growing up.

In other words , you can present no evidence, certainly no examples, but you can try to mock me with vacuum and encyclopedia salesman.

Guess I will have to repeat----- Busted.

Insurance companies have a bad reputation as businesses generally and nothing to be proud of being in that racket. But nothing is worse than the incestious relationships between Insurance Companies and Public Buisiness Officials. The whole idea of taxpayers paying for private Insurance on government activities, people or property should be outlawed.

I agree 100% ....as soon as you show me where/when this happens, I will be right on it.

[guyser]

How is this done? One might ask:

Very simply...

Let me correct you.....Very simply in your mind. There , thats better

When a public business official is found pocketing millions of dollars habitually from his personal professional activities a claim for the losses is made against the insurance policy.

And the Insurance Co. will contact the police, before any monies are paid.

When a claim is made Insurance adjusters are dispatched to investigate.

Okay, you have that one correct.

When the loss is identified the insurance company pays the amount that was stolen and adds it to is losses for the year to be passed on in future years premium calculations. (like the way they raise your auto insurance by several times over what it cost to fix your car... so you pay for the repairs several times over after they pay for your repairs initially).

Nope. Try again.

The cost to fix your car does not come into play. The premium charged is already established prior to the accident. (if you have a 6 star record and have an at fault, I can tell you what you will pay next year before I know how bad your accident is or how much it will be settled for)

[iamcanadian2]

Tell that to all the people that have had no-fault accidents fixed by their insurance company and then paid a few thousand dollars each year for the next few years till they paid for it over and over again by higher premiums.

Insurance companies in Canada don't loose money. They are in bed with Government (eg. no-fault car insurance scam among others). It's a monopoly arrangement here where outside multi-national insurers are discouraged from oiperating so the incestious relationships can continue to rule that where established in the 1800's.

[Peter F]

The insurance company agrees that I have in fact stolen $500k.

So the insurance company fulfills the terms of thier agreement and pay the municipality $500k.

I am forced to resign but keep my $500k

Is that how you say it is working?

You got the scam right but you have under estimated the amount that tends to be taken. $500K over five years would not easily be found out. It takes millions before anyone notices.

The Insurance Company will not necessarily agree that anyone specifically took the money. They will never the less agree to pay the amount that's gone missing under your care, if they want to as a supplier of insurance products to municipal organizations.

You will be asked to resign which you will do on terms that involve you getting another $500,000 in severance pay-out. You will also get a 30 day vacation to enjoy some of your gains, before you start yous new government job in some other municipality or level of government.

This is the rule rather than the exception. These scams are pervasive throughout the system. Pretty much every resignation is associated with million dollar level intentional mismanagement like this.

So nobody notices until I pocket Millions of dollars. Then I resign and my employer gives me another half million or so. Then the insurance company repays the millions I absconded with.

Nobody is aware of this happening because they don't advertise it (except you, of course).

Even the Insurance companies are happy to fork out the 10s of Millions because the governments of various levels pay them 20's of millions as premiums.

And this is better than arresting me how? And what insurance company in the world would gladly fork out millions in claims each year (because as you say, it happens all the time.) without a peep to the police?

Sounds like impossible bunk to me. People steal millions of taxpayers money. We don't know about it because insurance pays the millions back, then collect millions in premiums from the tax payer. Forensic accountants never come across the scam because the books are cooked.

The proof? Nobody knows about it - so it must be happening. Typical conspiracy theory.

I'm off. Thanks for the entertainment.

[guyser]

Tell that to all the people that have had no-fault accidents fixed by their insurance company and then paid a few thousand dollars each year for the next few years till they paid for it over and over again by higher premiums.

You know, if you had any idea what " no fault" insurance was you would also know how wrong you are. Why not tell us what no fault insurance is.

Do you know what it is?

Insurance companies in Canada don't loose money. They are in bed with Government (eg. no-fault car insurance scam among others). It's a monopoly arrangement here where outside multi-national insurers are discouraged from oiperating so the incestious relationships can continue to rule that where established in the 1800's.

Again, all talk no back up.

Ins Cos dont < loose> money.....they bundle it up into bags and deposit it in the bank.

Perhaps you meant lose money, and in that case they do, and quite a lot of it in the years following 9-11.

Again, no examples from you huh?

Oops......Busted.

[iamcanadian2]

Well maybe someone will look into this scam. It's been going on since the days of Sir John A MacDonald and Sir Alexander Gault. There ain't many insurance companies specializing in exclusive procurements of public sector director fidelity or general public sector insurance for that mater.

The problem is too many people in control are benefitting from the systemic problem identified. The courts, the top law firms and the rest of the system expected to catch this sort of thing are in on the scam since they all benefit from these shenanigans. Truth is stranger than fiction....

[geoffrey]

I enjoy making up random stories with no proof, and claiming that these things have been happening since Confederation. But I don't go portraying them as truth.

You've got nothing, you should admit this, and realise that this is all one big fantasy. Again, I think guyser and I have both been very clear that you need at least a little ounce of proof before this is to be taken seriously.

[iamcanadian2]

The $500,000 severance packages dolled out to municipal public servant directors in Ontario when they resign is common knowledge. It happens everytime. Google any combination of words and you will get more than enough proof.

The fact that when they resign they get another job (sometimes even better and higher pay) within 30 days is also quite common knowledge.

The fact that Insurance companies pay claims for losses from municipal organization is common knowledges and properly infered by the fact that there are no court cases involving municipalities getting court orders to get paid millions from their Insurers, however few citizens will get paid significant amounts without a court order.

The fact that NO court orders exist on record of Insurers going after Public Service directors to get money back from them when they pay out on policies is also shows by the lack of evidence of any of them being sued to get the money back that this is also factual.

Fidelity insurance on Public Directors and employees is a scam. The insurance companies involved in this kind of thing as very few and pre-selected. If any of them deny claims or go after directors for the money they will be removed from the procurement lists and be put out of business by the other public directors in retaliation. They are all in similar illicit relationships and work together to protect those few that get nabbed.

This is why Insurance in government procurement is a scam and should be outlawed. The government should be free to pursecute the individual public business officials and remove from them their illgotten gains in a public manner (rather than allow for dirty deals behind closed doors) which involving Fidelity Insurance products naturally produces.

Like the war on drugs, the producers of illicit activities need to be targetted rather than the pushers and junkies. The producers of corrupt activity are ALWAYS public business officials who are ingrained in the system and use all manner of systems systemically to rape and pillage from the public purse.

[geoffrey]

If it's all common knowledge, please provide some links because no one here has heard of this before, suggesting that we all must live in caves.

It's up to you to prove your assertions.

[guyser]

The $500,000 severance packages dolled out to municipal public servant directors in Ontario when they resign is common knowledge. It happens everytime. Google any combination of words and you will get more than enough proof.

By god you are right. I got all the proof I needed. NONE !

The fact that when they resign they get another job (sometimes even better and higher pay) within 30 days is also quite common knowledge.

Yes they do, and it occurs in the private sector too. Nothing illegal nor nefarious about it.

The fact that Insurance companies pay claims for losses from municipal organization is common knowledges and properly infered by the fact that there are no court cases involving municipalities getting court orders to get paid millions from their Insurers, however few citizens will get paid significant amounts without a court order.

Goobledygook. Say it with me now......

The fact that NO court orders exist on record of Insurers going after Public Service directors to get money back from them when they pay out on policies is also shows by the lack of evidence of any of them being sued to get the money back that this is also factual.

Factual only in your world.

Fidelity insurance on Public Directors and employees is a scam. The insurance companies involved in this kind of thing as very few and pre-selected. If any of them deny claims or go after directors for the money they will be removed from the procurement lists and be put out of business by the other public directors in retaliation. They are all in similar illicit relationships and work together to protect those few that get nabbed.

Laughable that is. Lets say you are an ins co. You underwrite a policy for $1M and get $100G premium, policy has claim, you pay $1M claim and try and go after the culprit. But then you remember you wont get more business......would you care?....you are getting a million dollars back, and you keep the $100,000. If you say No.....dont open a business,just find someone and give them money instead.

Like the war on drugs, the producers of illicit activities need to be targetted rather than the pushers and junkies.

The war on drugs is a huge waste of money. You want to waste more. BUSTED !

So. .............

1) where are your examples?

2) what/who are your sources

3) what is no fault?

So you see, your pattern is to throw mud around and hope it sticks. It isnt and you know it. Should you want to post again on this I suggest you not, unless you start with a concrete example of all your allegations.

[iamcanadian2]

The war on drugs is a huge waste of money. You want to waste more.

I dont' think any money spent by the government pursecuting corrupt public official can ever be a waste of money. It's the best money the government can spend. I would like to see the government spend $100 Million to persucute the entire estate of any corrupt public officials even if they recover nothing in the end.

It's a question of deterrent. Stalin excecuted and exilled millions of corrupt public officials after taking over his country. We should not have to wait till those drastic measures are all thats left for Canada to do.

Deal with those that we can now and make examples of them without sparing any expense to ensure they don't enjoy any of it by pursecuting them for the rest of their natural lives and then some. After all, its only money that they are forced to spend till they are deprived of it, and then thy can retire on dog food after they file for personal bankruptcy and forgo their golden pensions from being suspected of betraying the public trust. Treason was met with a firing squad not long ago and betrayal of public trust is a form of treason.

[guyser]

I dont' think any money spent by the government pursecuting corrupt public official can ever be a waste of money. It's the best money the government can spend. I would like to see the government spend $100 Million to persucute the entire ...

blah

blah

blah

...deprived of it, and then thy can retire on dog food after they file for personal bankruptcy and forgo their golden pensions from being suspected of betraying the public trust. Treason was met with a firing squad not long ago and betrayal of public trust is a form of treason.

Yup fine, so where are those examples ?

[iamcanadian2]

Yup fine...

So why don't you come clean and blow the whistle on Insurance scams like giving public officials free home and car insurance in return for lucrative public insurance contracts? As a broker you should know first hand about such activity.

When a broker pockets 25% commission on a $100K premium policy the $5000 in home and auto insurance you kick back is peanuts to write off in promo overhead. You still net $20K for a bunch of standard forms issued acting as an Attorney-in-Fact.

[iamcanadian2]

Why not tell us what no fault insurance is.

Do you know what it is?

I think a more relavant question to this topic is "What is Fidelity Insurance or Bond?"

In this scenario it is the LAZY BUREACRATIC WAY of avoiding to go after the money.

Rather than track down the money pilffered (by going through the banking records of transactions like the government would do to private citizens) they absolve themselves of this necessary act when they themselves are caught or called into question and can simply claim gainst the insurance policy. Thereby leaving the public officials, their families and their companies with which they funneled the millions of dollars (off to Ireland or whereever they are sending their money today after pilaging the public purse), leaving them alone to enjoy the fruits of their illgotten gains pilfering the public at will.

This is what it realy all boils down to. Fidelity insurance is a way to get money without having to chace the culprits responsible, which is very easy to do today with modern banking systems. Howver they prefer to use a system created for the Railroad Barrons when people caried bags of gold and cash to pay payrol and other things across Canada.

Fidelity insurance in public sectors is a redundant concept that is now used to let people get away with the loot, rather than having to get court orders and freeze the assets of public officials (and their companies and dependats suspected of corrupt public business activities.

[iamcanadian2]

Public Sector Fidelity products are one of the things that make Canada one of the most corrupt government systems in history. It is a symbol of systemic depravity where the people and system feed on themselves to undermine public services and enslave the citizens in massive taxation required to pay for all the Billions in rape and pillaging of the public purse concocted by public business officials and their bretherens in monopoly business arrangements leaching off the public's back.

[guyser]

So why don't you come clean and blow the whistle on Insurance scams like giving public officials free home and car insurance in return for lucrative public insurance contracts? As a broker you should know first hand about such activity.

If it happened and I was involved I would know about it. I have never seen nor heard of it happening. Do some inducements occur? I suspose so, like any business we have to smooze the client . But as far as outright purchase of contract for contract...nope.

When a broker pockets 25% commission on a $100K premium policy the $5000 in home and auto insurance you kick back is peanuts to write off in promo overhead. You still net $20K for a bunch of standard forms issued acting as an Attorney-in-Fact.

25%......hahahahahahahaha......shows what you know. It would be nice I can tell you that.

[guyser]

Why not tell us what no fault insurance is.

Do you know what it is?

I think a more relavant question to this topic is "What is Fidelity Insurance or Bond?"

Let me interpret this for everyone.....it means " I have no idea what I am talking about but if I move the goallines quick enough people wont be able to follow along"

Ok so we have this established-you dont know what no fault is- now we move onto Fidelity Bonds-and we see, again,that you have no idea.

In this scenario it is the LAZY BUREACRATIC WAY of avoiding to go after the money.

Comedy central right there baby .....

This is what it realy all boils down to. Fidelity insurance is a way to get money without having to chace the culprits responsible, which is very easy to do today with modern banking systems. Howver they prefer to use a system created for the Railroad Barrons when people caried bags of gold and cash to pay payrol and other things across Canada.

So....tell me what the conviction clause is and how it will affect this?

But, once again, more gobbledegook will come, or take another tact. I wonder which one you will choose?

Troll = Busted

[iamcanadian2]

Public Sector Fidelity products are one of the things that make Canada one of the most corrupt government systems in history. It is a symbol of systemic depravity where the people and system feed on themselves to undermine public services and enslave the citizens in massive taxation required to pay for all the Billions in rape and pillaging of the public purse concocted by public business officials and their bretherens in monopoly business arrangements leaching off the public's back.

I thought I answered you with this post before you even asked your questions.

You're the one BUSTED = Shill

[guyser]

I thought I answered you with this post before you even asked your questions.

You're the one BUSTED = Shill

Well you , once again, thought wrong. Sorry but you have evaded , changed tactics, ignored all questions and generally made yourself look foolish with this thread.

Answer any of the questions and I will answer. Should you elect not to, fine, but remember it is you that is making allegations that cannot be proven.

[iamcanadian2]

Answer any of the questions and I will answer. Should you elect not to, fine, but remember it is you that is making allegations that cannot be proven.

And who do you think is going to allow these things to be prooven?

The lawyers?

The judges?

The insurance industry?

Our puppet politicians?

Man o man you have blinders on...

Canada is so systemically corrupt that it is not even perceived corrupt and can't be from all the people raping and pilaging the public purse at the highest levels (i.e. by those that have Fidelity Insurance paid for by the taxpayers)....

[guyser]

And who do you think is going to allow these things to be prooven?

The lawyers?

The judges?

The insurance industry?

Our puppet politicians?

Man o man you have blinders on...

Canada is so systemically corrupt that it is not even perceived corrupt and can't be from all the people raping and pilaging the public purse at the highest levels (i.e. by those that have Fidelity Insurance paid for by the taxpayers)....

Let me get this straight. Neither lawyers,judges, ins co people,nor politicians will allow for this to be proven? But if that holds true, then where do you get your knowledge about this from?

Here , I will answer my own questions for you.

NO Fault insurance---means that there will be "no fault" determined before an insurance co responds.It used to be fault was establisehd and the carrier for the "at fault" driver would call the not at fault person and deal with them . So your assertion that no fault causes premiums to rise is not true. Simply not true.

Now the "conviction clause " on fidelity bonds means in order to get a claim paid , there must be a charge and a conviction.

That clause means whatever someone has told you, and in fact it is merely innuendo and whispering you engage in since zero documentation has been presented, is proven incorrect.

As for blinders , I assure you I do not. I see fraud on virtually a daily basis. In 99% of the cases it is the client doing it.

But never with bonds, the underwriting is extreme , they crawl up your butt to write these things, financial audits, statements of accounts, cash on hand disclosures, signed letters from the bank(s) and much more.

However , or whereever you have been given this info, they are wrong.

[iamcanadian2]

Now the "conviction clause " on fidelity bonds means in order to get a claim paid , there must be a charge and a conviction.

Have you never heard of dirty settlements out of court to save on legal fees?

What about negligence and related aspects which are plea bargains for avoiding criminal convictions (again to save on dreaded legal costs to government BULLSHIT).

Insurance companies are forced into these scenarious inevitably by corrupt public business officials who hold the "Approved List" and threaton to Blackball insurance companies who do not pay claims regardless of the merits and many multi-million dollar pay-offs occur in the public sector to avoid prosecuting, charging and convicting public servants who betray the public trust.

Its a corrupt system maintained by corrupt people living off the taxpayers illigitimately who produce nothing and provide nothing of value to anyone.

[guyser]

iamcanadian , it is obvious you have absolutely no idea what you are talking about. You have neither case info nor personal knowledge of which you speak.

In your world as President of a large insurance company you would pay a claim of $1M just to keep business that generates $500,000. You wont be Pres very long....say how about to the end of today?

You are a troll.

[iamcanadian2]

iamcanadian , it is obvious you have absolutely no idea what you are talking about. You have neither case info nor personal knowledge of which you speak.

In your world as President of a large insurance company you would pay a claim of $1M just to keep business that generates $500,000. You wont be Pres very long....say how about to the end of today?

No but you would pay tens of millions to keep business that generates PROFITS of Hunders of millions from Fidelity Products to government business activities from which you would be blackballed if you did not do as you are told.

You have a nieve view or are just a shill for the monopolists in bed with ginetic turds doing public business activities betraying the public trust as a rule rather than the exception.

[guyser]

Simple really, you have no clue what you are talking about.