When Dion whips Harper in the next election.....

[gerryhatrick]

...will there be a loud call for Albertan seperation?

[Canadian Blue]

Aren't you getting a bit ahead of yourself John Edward.

[blueblood]

...will there be a loud call for Albertan seperation?

Don't know about that, it'll be the same pissed off you see from westerners during recent history. I wouldn't say whip, I could see the Liberals getting a minority gov't next election, I could also see Harper getting unloaded pretty quick for a more progressive type candidate.

[gerryhatrick]

Don't know about that, it'll be the same pissed off you see from westerners during recent history. I wouldn't say whip, I could see the Liberals getting a minority gov't next election, I could also see Harper getting unloaded pretty quick for a more progressive type candidate.

Excellent answer.

I agree, the likely future is a Liberal minority. With an NDP balance of power.

[Canuck E Stan]

Excellent answer.

I agree, the likely future is a Liberal minority. With an NDP balance of power.

You're definitely going waaaay too far in the future.

[B. Max]

...will there be a loud call for Albertan seperation?

Why wait for spring, do it now.

[gerryhatrick]

Excellent answer.

I agree, the likely future is a Liberal minority. With an NDP balance of power.

You're definitely going waaaay too far in the future.

I'm talking about this spring.

I understand your retreat into humor. The situation is not good for partisan Conservatives.

[watching&waiting]

Dion leading the Liberals will take the party down and he will never even come close to getting power. First off he will lose seats in Quebec mostly to Bloq but some to CPC. Then he will lose many seats in and around Toronto as he will not be taken to by the people there. His hopes of getting any seats west of the Ontario border is slim to non-existant. So Gerry just where is he going to get 25 or so seats to be a Minority, or the 3-40 seats to be a majority? It just will not happen. You are stuck with him now for at least two runs at elections and there will be no chance to gain power in either. You know that, but you still try to shine the bad apple, but it will still be rotten no matter how shiny you make it .

[gerryhatrick]

Dion leading the Liberals will take the party down and he will never even come close to getting power.

This is your opinion, and it's based upon nothing.

I think WISHFUL THINKING is where you're at.

[geoffrey]

Dion leading the Liberals will take the party down and he will never even come close to getting power.

This is your opinion, and it's based upon nothing.

I think WISHFUL THINKING is where you're at.

Your's is even larger wishful thinking. There has not been a poll that shows anything but less support for the Dippers now than before.

[Canadian Blue]

I'm talking about this spring.

I understand your retreat into humor. The situation is not good for partisan Conservatives.

GH, and the Liberal's aren't partisan Liberal's. I haven't heard anything coming from their camp trying to reach out to Western Canadian's voters by giving their interests a place at the table.

GH, I think everyone on here know's your the most partisan member here.

The election will be a nail biter, thats my prediction. People will moan about how their party is going to get an easy win, yet I don't see easy sailing for the Liberal party or the Conservatives. I wouldn't pay much attention to polls until the actual election, if your decision at the ballot box is based on some poll of 1,000 people then your simply an idiot.

[gc1765]

Your's is even larger wishful thinking. There has not been a poll that shows anything but less support for the Dippers now than before.

What about that poll that is the subject of another thread? The one where the Liberals are at 37% and the Conservatives are at 31%.

[geoffrey]

Your's is even larger wishful thinking. There has not been a poll that shows anything but less support for the Dippers now than before.

What about that poll that is the subject of another thread? The one where the Liberals are at 37% and the Conservatives are at 31%.

And the NDP at 14%. Hardly the balance of power. The Bloc will hold that balance for some time to come.

[gc1765]

And the NDP at 14%. Hardly the balance of power. The Bloc will hold that balance for some time to come.

Ooops, you were talking about the dippers (NDP) not the Liberals. My bad.

[Saturn]

GH, and the Liberal's aren't partisan Liberal's. I haven't heard anything coming from their camp trying to reach out to Western Canadian's voters by giving their interests a place at the table.

Western Canadian voters will never be satisfied - especially Albertans. Even if Dion crawls on the floor, kisses their feet and gives them everything they claim they want, they will still hate the Eastern bastards. Hopefully Dion is smart enough to know that and he won't try to waste his time with westerners (like that fool Martin did. Or Mulroney). See, westerners have nothing to offer and hopefully Dion will concentrate his effors where it matters - Ontario, Quebec and the Atlantic provinces. If he does, Harper will be gone in no time.

[geoffrey]

GH, and the Liberal's aren't partisan Liberal's. I haven't heard anything coming from their camp trying to reach out to Western Canadian's voters by giving their interests a place at the table.

Western Canadian voters will never be satisfied - especially Albertans. Even if Dion crawls on the floor, kisses their feet and gives them everything they claim they want, they will still hate the Eastern bastards. Hopefully Dion is smart enough to know that and he won't try to waste his time with westerners (like that fool Martin did. Or Mulroney). See, westerners have nothing to offer and hopefully Dion will concentrate his effors where it matters - Ontario, Quebec and the Atlantic provinces. If he does, Harper will be gone in no time.

Westerns have nothing to offer! Heh! Try paying your own way in the Roc... oh that's right, you couldn't...

Your the typical example of the 'screw the west, we'll take the rest' mentality of Trudeau on. That's why the Liberals are the regional party now and the CPC is the only, that's right, only national party in Canada.

Elect a guy in Alberta or your not a Canadian party, bottom line. 10% of the population isn't PEI or the Yukon, it's a sizeable chunk of people and a very sizeable chunk of contribution to the coffers (and job market).

[Saturn]

GH, and the Liberal's aren't partisan Liberal's. I haven't heard anything coming from their camp trying to reach out to Western Canadian's voters by giving their interests a place at the table.

Western Canadian voters will never be satisfied - especially Albertans. Even if Dion crawls on the floor, kisses their feet and gives them everything they claim they want, they will still hate the Eastern bastards. Hopefully Dion is smart enough to know that and he won't try to waste his time with westerners (like that fool Martin did. Or Mulroney). See, westerners have nothing to offer and hopefully Dion will concentrate his effors where it matters - Ontario, Quebec and the Atlantic provinces. If he does, Harper will be gone in no time.

Westerns have nothing to offer! Heh! Try paying your own way in the Roc... oh that's right, you couldn't...

Btw, 10% of the population may be enough to elect 1 Green MP but it isn't a whole lot more than that.

Your the typical example of the 'screw the west, we'll take the rest' mentality of Trudeau on. That's why the Liberals are the regional party now and the CPC is the only, that's right, only national party in Canada.

Elect a guy in Alberta or your not a Canadian party, bottom line. 10% of the population isn't PEI or the Yukon, it's a sizeable chunk of people and a very sizeable chunk of contribution to the coffers (and job market).

Hehe... the only national party in Canada is a party of greedy hicks who can't see further than a foot ahead of them. That's why the "only national party in Canada" doesn't have a single vote in urban Ontario, Montreal or Vancouver. Albertans are the prime example of how rigid conservatives are and how useless it would be do anything for them. Because normal people appreciate a nice thing but in Alberta all you can get is a kick in the rear for doing a nice thing. All Albertans can appreciate is the vulgar "humour" of swine Klein. See, if Albertans were capable of some sort of civil interaction they would be welcome but given that all they can do is curse and swear at you and talk down because they consider themselves "rich", you are way better off showing them the door.

Now get over this arrogant bull about buying your way into this and that because it doesn't get you anywhere. If you think that you make friends by being an arrogant rich bitch, then you are very very wrong. Especially when you are barking at people who couldn't care less about your money. Ok?

Btw, 10% of the population may be enough to elect 1 green MP but it isn't a whole lot more than that, so don't overestimate your importance. Especially when there isn't a single seat at play in Alberta, you can't expect anyone to take you very seriously.

[geoffrey]

Hehe... the only national party in Canada is a party of greedy rural hicks who can't see further than a foot ahead of them. That's why the "only national party in Canada" doesn't have a single vote in urban Ontario, Montreal or Vancouver.

Not a single vote? Ha! Your hyperbole is amusing.

Maybe not in Toronto, but Ottawa is Urban... as is the fact that the CPC won almost all suburban (those people work downtown Van city) Vancouver.

Much better anyways than a party that has one seat across 4 million population representing 13% of the total population and 16% of the national GDP. That's Saskatchewan and Alberta by the way.

Albertans are the prime example of how rigid conservatives are and how useless it would be do anything for them. Because normal people appreciate a nice thing but in Alberta all you can get is a kick in the rear for doing a nice thing. All Albertans can appreciate is the vulgar "humour" of swine Klein. See, if Albertans were capable of some sort of civil interaction they would be welcome but given that all they can do is curse and swear at you and talk down because they consider themselves "rich", you are way better off showing them the door.

Hmmm... when that's all you hear from the East, it's hard not to return the favour every once and awhile.

The Conservatives also weren't the policy with campaign organizers claiming they were going to 'screw the west, we'll take the rest'.

Now get over this arrogant bull about buying your way into this and that because it doesn't get you anywhere. If you think that you make friends by being an arrogant rich bitch, you are very very wrong. Especially when you are barking at people who couldn't care less about your money. Ok?

Of course you couldn't care less about where your social welfare programs, economic growth and jobs come from. And that's why your party of choice will never win a seat in Alberta, especially not Calgary where they haven't done so since the '60's. Zero appreciation, in fact, condemnation for what we do.

If Quebec got the treatment Alberta does, they'd be gone long ago.

[gc1765]

That's why the "only national party in Canada" doesn't have a single vote in urban Ontario, Montreal or Vancouver.

Actually, that's a good point. Why is it that no seats in Alberta is not a national party, but no seats in Toronto, Vancouver or Montreal is? There's almost as many people in the GTA as Alberta, so what makes Alberta a "region" but not Toronto? (or Vancouver & Montreal)

[geoffrey]

That's why the "only national party in Canada" doesn't have a single vote in urban Ontario, Montreal or Vancouver.

Actually, that's a good point. Why is it that no seats in Alberta is not a national party, but no seats in Toronto, Vancouver or Montreal is? There's almost as many people in the GTA as Alberta, so what makes Alberta a "region" but not Toronto? (or Vancouver & Montreal)

The Tories have seats in the GTA and Vancouver. The only place that's an issue is Montreal.

[Saturn]

Hehe... the only national party in Canada is a party of greedy rural hicks who can't see further than a foot ahead of them. That's why the "only national party in Canada" doesn't have a single vote in urban Ontario, Montreal or Vancouver.

Not a single vote? Ha! Your hyperbole is amusing.

Maybe not in Toronto, but Ottawa is Urban... as is the fact that the CPC won almost all suburban (those people work downtown Van city) Vancouver.

Much better anyways than a party that has one seat across 4 million population representing 13% of the total population and 16% of the national GDP. That's Saskatchewan and Alberta by the way.

And TO, Van, and Montreal represent a third of the population and half of the economy. It's the first time in the history of the country that a sitting prime minister had to bribe a political opponent and appoint an unelected friend just so that his party could have some representation in urban Canada.

Albertans are the prime example of how rigid conservatives are and how useless it would be do anything for them. Because normal people appreciate a nice thing but in Alberta all you can get is a kick in the rear for doing a nice thing. All Albertans can appreciate is the vulgar "humour" of swine Klein. See, if Albertans were capable of some sort of civil interaction they would be welcome but given that all they can do is curse and swear at you and talk down because they consider themselves "rich", you are way better off showing them the door.

Hmmm... when that's all you hear from the East, it's hard not to return the favour every once and awhile.

The Conservatives also weren't the policy with campaign organizers claiming they were going to 'screw the west, we'll take the rest'.

Albertans crowned swine "Let the Eastern bastards freeze in the dark" Klein king for 14 years.

Now get over this arrogant bull about buying your way into this and that because it doesn't get you anywhere. If you think that you make friends by being an arrogant rich bitch, you are very very wrong. Especially when you are barking at people who couldn't care less about your money. Ok?

Of course you couldn't care less about where your social welfare programs, economic growth and jobs come from. And that's why your party of choice will never win a seat in Alberta, especially not Calgary where they haven't done so since the '60's. Zero appreciation, in fact, condemnation for what we do.

If Quebec got the treatment Alberta does, they'd be gone long ago.

Dude, that's where our jobs are going because you are ripping us off with that oil of yours. You are not creating jobs, you are killing jobs elsewhere in the country. Not to mention poisoning our air. You can't screw others and expect us to be thankful for it. You don't just get respect, you have to earn it. Paying a few bucks into equalization doesn't compensate the rest of the country for the harmful side effects of your "boom". As far as I am concerned, Alberta is more harmful than beneficial to the country. Your arrongance is intolerable and you can't pay anyone enough to tolerate it. Just take your money and your attitudes and separate already!

[Saturn]

That's why the "only national party in Canada" doesn't have a single vote in urban Ontario, Montreal or Vancouver.

Actually, that's a good point. Why is it that no seats in Alberta is not a national party, but no seats in Toronto, Vancouver or Montreal is? There's almost as many people in the GTA as Alberta, so what makes Alberta a "region" but not Toronto? (or Vancouver & Montreal)

The Tories have seats in the GTA and Vancouver. The only place that's an issue is Montreal.

The GTA has twice the population of Alberta. To say that the tories have seats in Toronto is like saying that the NDP have seats in Alberta cause they have some in BC. Also, the only reason they have a seat in Van is because they bribed Emerson to join them. Besides, Montreal has the population of Alberta and if you can say that a party without a seat in Alberta is not a national party, you'll have to admit that this implies that a party without a seat in Montreal is not a national party.

[gc1765]

The Tories have seats in the GTA and Vancouver. The only place that's an issue is Montreal.

In the suburbs, yes. If you count places like Burlington as the GTA then fine. But what about Toronto (& even surrounding areas like Mississauga & brampton)? There's what, 2 and a half million in Toronto alone?

Anyways, take a look at this map: Link

There's a lot more seats in that red/orange chunk then there is in all of Alberta.

[geoffrey]

The GTA has twice the population of Alberta. To say that the tories have seats in Toronto is like saying that the NDP have seats in Alberta cause they have some in BC.

Not at all really. Shows your disconnect with your fellow citizens to say something that ridiculous. You know nothing about Alberta, or BC.

Also, the only reason they have a seat in Van is because they bribed Emerson to join them. Besides, Montreal has the population of Alberta and if you can say that a party without a seat in Alberta is not a national party, you'll have to admit that this implies that a party without a seat in Montreal is not a national party.

They have seats in Langley, Burnaby, Delta, White Rock, Port Moody/Port Coquitlam, Maple Ridge... ect. ect. They have more seats in the GVA than any other party actually (not a plurality though). So what exactly are you talking about?

Montreal does not have the population of Alberta. It's a serious concern yes, but they are part of that distinct nation right? So ya, they've got representation there. There is no Liberal within 700km of Calgary and further from Edmonton. That's a bit of a problem.

The Tories have seats in the GTA and Vancouver. The only place that's an issue is Montreal.

In the suburbs, yes. If you count places like Burlington as the GTA then fine. But what about Toronto (& even surrounding areas like Mississauga & brampton)? There's what, 2 and a half million in Toronto alone?

Oshawa isn't far. Do that many live in just Toronto? By population, who holds the most representation in Southern Ontario? Would be interesting to figure out, I'm a little too tired and not interested in doing so though.

If you want to play that game, then the Liberals aren't represented in rural/suburban Ontario as much as the CPC isn't in Toronto. That's just ridiculous.

The Liberals do though, in fact have a major suburbia problem, they can't get elected there. And they struggle in rural everywhere other than Northern Ontairo. The CPC does have an urban problem, no doubt.

Anyways, take a look at this map: Link

There's a lot more seats in that red/orange chunk then there is in all of Alberta.

No doubt. But here's the deal. Toronto represents immigrant urban. Alberta represents: immigrant urban (Edmonton/Calgary), white urban (Calgary/Edmonton), lots and lots of white suburban, and considerable rural. And the Liberals can't even convince one riding. That's trouble. I can understand why the CPC doesn't appeal to blacks in inner city Toronto. But I can't understand the Liberals happy acceptance of not being able to be elected no matter the demographic in Alberta.

The fact that they just give up and say oh well shows why we really need not bother with Liberal governments from an Alberta perspective. They have no interest in gaining seats here... though I'll tell you it's alot easier for them to do so then they think.

[Who's Doing What?]

Canadian Metropolitan Populations

I don't want to get into my specific personal experiences with people across this country, but bar none the ones who think they are getting screwed the most and complain about it the loudest and most often are Albertans.

Next time your Cattle industry goes down the tubes, you can keep your mad cow beef. I have never heard anyone say thanks for accepting tons of it in Toronto, and Southern Ontario. Yet apparently all Easterners do is try and screw you.

In July, at the Toronto SARS concert, Molson Canadian Rocks, the ABP supported a program called Canadian Beef Rocks. "A delegation went to the concert and participated in the mile-long BBQ," says Cockwill. "We wore cowboy hats, and Premier Klein was there flipping burgers. We had Beef Without Borders." And Canadians responded. Immediately after the crisis broke, consumption rose 60%. "It was the first country in the world that increased consumption in a BSE crisis," says Glaser.

http://www.albertaventure.com/abventure_49...938&doc_id=5563

Yep the first country in the world to increase it's beef consumption during a BSE crisis yet the rest of Canada is out to get you. Time for some prozac in the water system. Cure the paranoia. Not only are we not out to get you, the rest of Canada came together to bail out your beef industry in it's time of need. But hey the rest of Canada doesn't care about Alberta, right? All they want to do is steal your oil money, right?

A year before we ate the BSE Crisis beef, eastern Canada helped keep it alive during the last drought. Sending thousands of bales of hay out west to help farmers in need.

http://www.tdc.ca/hay.htm

http://archives.cbc.ca/IDC-1-70-1407-9044/...gedies/drought/

So the next time you want to get on your soapbox and cry about how the rest of Canada doesn't care about Alberta why not try this first.