Vietnam

[snowbound]

Hello all,

i'm new here and not sure if this is the right place to post but iam very curious as too what folk's here general views are about the country of Vietnam. Most people i know, know nothing of this country other than the war but i've been there many times(was married to a vietnamese woman), and having travelled to many countries, surprisingly to some, it is one of the most beautiful with the most friendly people i have ever met.

It always fasinates me when i hear other views of this otherwise scorned country. Iam no fan of the communists who still hold power there, but thankfully the door is slowly opening and some day freedom will return to the good people there.

snowbound

[ceemes]

Hello all,

i'm new here and not sure if this is the right place to post but iam very curious as too what folk's here general views are about the country of Vietnam. Most people i know, know nothing of this country other than the war but i've been there many times(was married to a vietnamese woman), and having travelled to many countries, surprisingly to some, it is one of the most beautiful with the most friendly people i have ever met.

It always fasinates me when i hear other views of this otherwise scorned country. Iam no fan of the communists who still hold power there, but thankfully the door is slowly opening and some day freedom will return to the good people there.

snowbound

I have a number of friends and business acquaintances in that so-called scorned nation and I think they would be very surprised at your assertion that they are lacking in "freedom" or that it needs to be "returned" to them. Most of us in the west still cannot wrap our heads around the fact that the people of Vietnam for the most part not only choose their form of government, but actually fought and bled for it.

True Veitnam is run by a Communist government, but it is not a Stalinist government by any stretch of the imagination. Vietnam has for the most part adopted the same model of today's China, a blend of hard core capitalism and communist ideals. And like in China, it seems to be working for the Vietnamese people.

Economically speaking, Vietnam is about where China was about 10 years ago, with free markets, investment and private ownership of land, houses and means of production. One of the bench marks we in the west use to judge the amount of freedom so-called repressed people have is access to outside information via the internet. In Vietman, Internet Cafes are doing a roaring trade, indeed I was a minority partner in two Internet Cafes in Ho Chi Minh City. The profit from those two were astounding by Vietnamese standards, about C$2000 per month each. Even with the stiff competition, our cafes were always full from opening to closing, with chat and online gaming being the biggest draws. We sold them both off an made a tidy little profit.

One of my partners was able to afford to send his daughter off to Japan for two years to study the Japanese language and to make business contacts. He did this without help or hinderance from the Central Government.

Life for the peasent classes has improved, although it has not changed all that much. Farming and family are still the staples of life for many of the Vietnames people. But now their children have access to education and a better chance of advancement in life.

Universal Military service is the norm, but for the most part it is only for about six months after high school, enough to just get your basic training.

Vietnam still has a long ways to go, but it is making head way under its own terms and is no longer being dicated to by foreign powers such as France, China or the US. If you are looking to cash in on the Asian Century, then I suggest you consider Vietnam. However, bewarned, there are a lot of scammers there and you still have to deal with the infamous Vietnamese "Directors".

[Rue]

I would love to hear more from people as to their reflections on Vietnam. I have never been there. I have heard stories from former American GI's and from Vietnamese people and have seen their pictures and listened to their stories.

From what I gather it is geographically a beautiful country but politically it is a struggling nation and interestingly although it is called communist, from what Vietnamese people tell me, foreign nationals have no problems setting up huge factories and hiring employees and paying them very small wages.

I also have been told by Vietnamese natives that they have always had a problem with Chinese Vietnamese

based on historical issues and that although China supported North Vietnam, there is always an ethnic tension there.

I also have a family friend from Cambodia. Again all I can say is their countries sound beautiful but full of hardships.

I can only also say from a purely subjective point of view, the Cambodian and Vietnamese people I have met were gentle buddists...so for me I am always interested how gentle buddists live in countries that end up with so much violence.

I have read of the French colonial history in Vietnam a bit.

Am I wrong to believe that although technically the communists won, it doesn't seem to have stopped Nike and Coca Cola from doing business?

[Shady]

One of the bench marks we in the west use to judge the amount of freedom so-called repressed people have is access to outside information via the internet

Actually, I think the ability to criticize one's government comes first. Unfortunately, these people aren't "so-called" repressed, they are repressed. Thanks to the Korean War, South Korea is a vibrant, prosperous country, opposite that of North Korea. Things may have been similar had the communists not prevailed during the Vietnam conflict.

[ceemes]

One of the bench marks we in the west use to judge the amount of freedom so-called repressed people have is access to outside information via the internet

Actually, I think the ability to criticize one's government comes first. Unfortunately, these people aren't "so-called" repressed, they are repressed. Thanks to the Korean War, South Korea is a vibrant, prosperous country, opposite that of North Korea. Things may have been similar had the communists not prevailed during the Vietnam conflict.

One thing you have failed to mention, that South Korea like Taiwan have only become a true democracy only very recently. Democractic institutions, including a truly free press, the right to belong to opposing Political Parties, the right to citicized the powers that be, the right to unionize, the right of free association took a back seat to economic development in both nations. Indeed, to this day the Government of South Korea steps down hard on student and labour activist.

And you would be amazed at the amount of citicism that is leveled at the Communist Part in Vietnam by the Vietnamese people, especially at that street level. For a repressed people, they are very out spoken.

I think the biggest problem we in the west have with countries such as Vietnam and China is that they for the most part rejected us and went their own way. They took what they liked and could make work from both the Communist and Capitalist systems and created a third way, one that works for them, but may not work for us.

North Korea on the other hand went completely the Stalinist route, much to the detriment of its people. North Korea is seen by many in both Communist China and Vietnam as an aborition and an eye sore, however they see she does play an important role of diverting US and Western attention way from their own gains in the world.