Maritimes continue the burden on Canada

[geoffrey]

A great case of what years of socialist policies of endless welfare and EI have caused:

http://www.ctv.ca/servlet/ArticleNews/stor...0513?hub=Canada

A PEI lobster processing company is importing Russian workers because they have tried unsuccessfully to hire workers from PEI... a province with an over 10% unemployment rate.

I've always said that Eastern Canada has serious problems, refusing to migrate west to fill high paying jobs and instead continue their burden on the rest of us taxpayers.

But now, it goes a step further. They are refusing work in their cities/towns in order to stay on welfare.

Disgusting. Kick them all off their bottle fed lifestyles, those that can't eat, tough, its about time for them to get off their asses and get a job, especially when there is an apparently labour shortage in a province that has over 10% unemployment.

Canada really is a second-rate socialist false-paradise. What can we do to fix it other than send a strong message to those in our society that we have convinced into this 'oh you don't have to work to live here' mentality.

Brian Lee Crawley of the right-wing Atlantic Institute for Market Studies says what's shocking is how this is happening despite the large number of PEI residents drawing employment insurance cheques.

"The question we have to ask ourselves is why are so many of our unemployed receiving unemployment insurance not interested in taking that work?" he said.

That sums it up nicely. Why are they so convinced they don't have to work? Why are they convinced they can wait on my dollar to find the 'ideal' job.

Hey, when your unemployed, you take what you can get, not a time to be picky. All I can say is that this is truly the biggest case I've seen of completely state-bred laziness.

[BHS]

Dude, you may be sticking your hand into the lobster pot, so to speak, by including condescending generalities in your post. I'm interested to see how some of the East coast members reply to this.

That said, it's pretty sad that paying jobs in the fishing industry can't be filled in a region full of unemployed fisherman.

[rogue state]

immigrating them to west ?

and after they become disabilitated, or old, ship them back in east, because "alberta is for albertans"?

i know that that province tried to ship homeless people in british columbia, so they don't have to be a burden for hardworking taxpayer.

that's a shameful shunning of responsibility.

[Riverwind]

A PEI lobster processing company is importing Russian workers because they have tried unsuccessfully to hire workers from PEI... a province with an over 10% unemployment rate.

It made my blood boil when I heard this story. I heard an representative from the company that said the problem was not finding the workers: the problem was stopping them from quiting as soon as they qualified for EI. He said he hoped the Russian workers would stay on the job year round.

Clearly, the EI system is completely broken in Atlantic Canada.

[BHS]

A PEI lobster processing company is importing Russian workers because they have tried unsuccessfully to hire workers from PEI... a province with an over 10% unemployment rate.

It made my blood boil when I heard this story. I heard an representative from the company that said the problem was not finding the workers: the problem was stopping them from quiting as soon as they qualified for EI. He said he hoped the Russian workers would stay on the job year round.

Clearly, the EI system is completely broken in Atlantic Canada.

Correct me if I'm wrong here - but the last time I checked an employee who voluntarily quits his/her job doesn't qualify for EI. Is this some sort of fishing industry loophole? Or am I just too far removed from the intricacies of government slush funds posing as manditory insurance (aka a tax)?

[Riverwind]

Correct me if I'm wrong here - but the last time I checked an employee who voluntarily quits his/her job doesn't qualify for EI. Is this some sort of fishing industry loophole?

Whether or not someone qualifies depends on the box checked off by the employer the ROE. I suspect companies many companies are forced to promise lay offs in order to get the workers to sign on in the first place. This kind of abuse could be stopped by a system of escalating premiums for companies that frequently lay off workers.

[BHS]

Correct me if I'm wrong here - but the last time I checked an employee who voluntarily quits his/her job doesn't qualify for EI. Is this some sort of fishing industry loophole?

Whether or not someone qualifies depends on the box checked off by the employer the ROE. I suspect companies many companies are forced to promise lay offs in order to get the workers to sign on in the first place. This kind of abuse could be stopped by a system of escalating premiums for companies that frequently lay off workers.

Laying off workers is a legitimate business tactic, especially in a seasonal industry. What would make a real difference would be government investigations of insurance fraud that lead to real fines or jail time. Some how I get the picture that this doesn't happen too often the way things currently stand. It serves the industry right that they can't keep it's labour supply if it's employers are willing to perpetrate fraud on the employees behalf.

[margrace]

Correct me if I'm wrong here - but the last time I checked an employee who voluntarily quits his/her job doesn't qualify for EI. Is this some sort of fishing industry loophole?

Whether or not someone qualifies depends on the box checked off by the employer the ROE. I suspect companies many companies are forced to promise lay offs in order to get the workers to sign on in the first place. This kind of abuse could be stopped by a system of escalating premiums for companies that frequently lay off workers.

Laying off workers is a legitimate business tactic, especially in a seasonal industry. What would make a real difference would be government investigations of insurance fraud that lead to real fines or jail time. Some how I get the picture that this doesn't happen too often the way things currently stand. It serves the industry right that they can't keep it's labour supply if it's employers are willing to perpetrate fraud on the employees behalf.

Yes BHS its very easy to sit in front of a computer and make judgements on something we know nothing about. Maybe before we do this we should find out about that company, we should find out how much they pay, we should find out if the Russian workers get any benefits, we should find ou who is profiting from this. And yes there are people who do not want to work but they live right across Canada and they are few and far between.

[Michael Hardner]

Geoffrey decried the islanders for not taking jobs in the west, yet the article states:

"Young people are now going on to further their education and moving to more prosperous areas," said the company's Blaine Sullivan. "(It's) hard to compete with the oil boom in Alberta."

Also, it's not clear if there are unemployed people near the plant or not. People might not be willing to commute 80km for a $9/hr job, given the price of gas and so forth.

[margrace]

Geoffrey decried the islanders for not taking jobs in the west, yet the article states:

"Young people are now going on to further their education and moving to more prosperous areas," said the company's Blaine Sullivan. "(It's) hard to compete with the oil boom in Alberta."

Also, it's not clear if there are unemployed people near the plant or not. People might not be willing to commute 80km for a $9/hr job, given the price of gas and so forth.

Yes remember there's always two side too every question and My son works in the oil patch in Albert and he says there are lot of People from down east working there. He says they are hard working and friendly. Easy to judge when you don't know all the fact.

[geoffrey]

Geoffrey decried the islanders for not taking jobs in the west, yet the article states:

"Young people are now going on to further their education and moving to more prosperous areas," said the company's Blaine Sullivan. "(It's) hard to compete with the oil boom in Alberta."

Also, it's not clear if there are unemployed people near the plant or not. People might not be willing to commute 80km for a $9/hr job, given the price of gas and so forth.

Yes remember there's always two side too every question and My son works in the oil patch in Albert and he says there are lot of People from down east working there. He says they are hard working and friendly. Easy to judge when you don't know all the fact.

I do know that there is over 10% unemployment on the Island, and people don't want to work. Easy enough. Cut the welfare cheques off and force them into jobs.

It's ridiculous that you could come back with a 'you don't know the realities' statement yet provide no reasonable statistics or proof of these realities.

I have, 10% of PEI people choose not to work, and I group all of them in that category, because obviously there is jobs and they don't want them.

Good for those from the East moving to Alberta to work in the oil patch, they should be forced to. If Canada is really one country, we can't see borders to employment opportunities. When there simply isn't work, you MOVE to find it. I honestly have no patience for people that feel they are so entitled to my money to just sit there and wait for something to show up in their town... so they can work 2 weeks and get their EI cheques. Albertans should not be paying for unemployment cheques in another part of the country when they have thousands of jobs available for them to fill. The Easterner's culture of defeat is actually hurting us financially in Alberta, in both the EI we pay, and in the lost productivity from not having enough workers.

We also have the NDP that's actually advocating making it EASIER to get EI and have the payouts larger. Can you imagine what this will do?

When there is a labour shortage in a province with 10% unemployment, there needs to be a radical shake up of the status quo. It proves that laziness has taken over as the prevailent attitude. Don't worry, I don't blame Easterners, I blame the government for handing them massive payments in welfare and destroying any and all motivation to work.

Cut them off, force them to work, and everyone will be better off.

From Michael's post:

Geoffrey decried the islanders for not taking jobs in the west, yet the article states:

QUOTE

"Young people are now going on to further their education and moving to more prosperous areas," said the company's Blaine Sullivan. "(It's) hard to compete with the oil boom in Alberta."

Also, it's not clear if there are unemployed people near the plant or not. People might not be willing to commute 80km for a $9/hr job, given the price of gas and so forth.

Well then, too bad. Move to a job. Are you actually ok with people staying put on your tax dollar simply because they don't want to move?

[margrace]

I do know that there is over 10% unemployment on the Island, and people don't want to work. Easy enough. Cut the welfare cheques off and force them into jobs.

It's ridiculous that you could come back with a 'you don't know the realities' statement yet provide no reasonable statistics or proof of these realities.

I have, 10% of PEI people choose not to work, and I group all of them in that category, because obviously there is jobs and they don't want them.

Good for those from the East moving to Alberta to work in the oil patch, they should be forced to. If Canada is really one country, we can't see borders to employment opportunities. When there simply isn't work, you MOVE to find it. I honestly have no patience for people that feel they are so entitled to my money to just sit there and wait for something to show up in their town... so they can work 2 weeks and get their EI cheques. Albertans should not be paying for unemployment cheques in another part of the country when they have thousands of jobs available for them to fill. The Easterner's culture of defeat is actually hurting us financially in Alberta, in both the EI we pay, and in the lost productivity from not having enough workers.

We also have the NDP that's actually advocating making it EASIER to get EI and have the payouts larger. Can you imagine what this will do?

When there is a labour shortage in a province with 10% unemployment, there needs to be a radical shake up of the status quo. It proves that laziness has taken over as the prevailent attitude. Don't worry, I don't blame Easterners, I blame the government for handing them massive payments in welfare and destroying any and all motivation to work.

Cut them off, force them to work, and everyone will be better off.

From Michael's post:

Geoffrey decried the islanders for not taking jobs in the west, yet the article states:

QUOTE

"Young people are now going on to further their education and moving to more prosperous areas," said the company's Blaine Sullivan. "(It's) hard to compete with the oil boom in Alberta."

Also, it's not clear if there are unemployed people near the plant or not. People might not be willing to commute 80km for a $9/hr job, given the price of gas and so forth.

Well then, too bad. Move to a job. Are you actually ok with people staying put on your tax dollar simply because they don't want to move?

E.G. young couple move into our area with several children. They come because of a job opportunity and cheaper cost of living. Wife gets sick, has to go 200 miles for cancer treatment and is required to stay there for several weeks. Who looks after the children?

[Michael Hardner]

Geoffrey:

The Easterner's culture of defeat is actually hurting us financially in Alberta

Another example of an anti-Easterner comment from an Albertan. Let me reiterate that I have never heard an anti-Western comment spoken in conversation in Ontario, and have heard several pro-Western comments.

Are you actually ok with people staying put on your tax dollar simply because they don't want to move?

I don't expect people to do what I wouldn't do, and I wouldn't move fifty miles for $9/hr.

[Rue]

I just dissed Albertans in another post so I am in no position to say don't generalize when I made several generalizations (albeit tonque in cheek). But to be serious, I think it is unfair to Spud Islanders to depict them as lazy and not wanting to work. I think the story here is a bit more complicated then them not wanting to work. The Spud Islanders I know are not sitting around collecting welfare because they have to. If there is a problem finding workers, it is not because they are lazy but because they have to go elsewhere in Canada for work.

More to the point, Spud Island is under-going the same demographic changes as much of the rest of Canada. As its population ages, its next generation are going to university and looking for computer and professional jobs.

The only thing I will say is that I personally feel McCain and Irving have turned all of Atlantic Canada into a captive economy for their financial empires and have choked off any free enterprise or genuine market competition. Even if a Spud Islander or Atlantic Canadian wanted to try make a go of it, they have to deal with the reality of a limited market place and limited jobs.

I am sure Atlantic Canadians and Spud Islanders will speak for themselves and answer this one better then me.

By the way to understand Spud Island is to appreciate what kind of juice they can make out of their potatoes. I drank some once. It came out of a tube and a plastic bucket. Sort of looked like dirty water. Makes your car angine purr. You drink this stuff and you suddenly can't breath and you go blind but man it has a kick. You drink that stuff you can do anything. So careful. You do not want to rile a Spud Islander. All kidding aside, they are honest hard working people.

[BHS]

I don't expect people to do what I wouldn't do, and I wouldn't move fifty miles for $9/hr.

And so I'm supposed to pay for your intransigence? Come on!

[Michael Hardner]

And so I'm supposed to pay for your intransigence? Come on!

If you were laid off, would you take $9/hr to move 50 miles ? Sorry, but seeing as I have about 6 months to find a job, I'm going to hold out for something better. That's within the rules, and that's what I'm going to do.

[BHS]

And so I'm supposed to pay for your intransigence? Come on!

If you were laid off, would you take $9/hr to move 50 miles ? Sorry, but seeing as I have about 6 months to find a job, I'm going to hold out for something better. That's within the rules, and that's what I'm going to do.

Fine. Don't blame me for wanting to end equalization payments then. Being paid to be unproductive invariably ruins economies. The only reason the East Coast requires equalization is because of this sort of bulls**t attitude. Why the hell should my 2080 hours of productivity be tapped to keep a bunch of EI moochers from sinking into the Atlantic? I'm supposed to feel all warm and fuzzy about unemployed fish plant workers just because of their cute accents and picturesque villages? Bah.

[Michael Hardner]

Fine. Don't blame me for wanting to end equalization payments then. Being paid to be unproductive invariably ruins economies. The only reason the East Coast requires equalization is because of this sort of bulls**t attitude. Why the hell should my 2080 hours of productivity be tapped to keep a bunch of EI moochers from sinking into the Atlantic? I'm supposed to feel all warm and fuzzy about unemployed fish plant workers just because of their cute accents and picturesque villages? Bah.

I note that you didn't answer my question.

[BHS]

I note that you didn't answer my question.

In every job I've taken as an adult I've chosen to move to a new area if it meant an improvement in my prospects. If $9.00 an hour jobs were all I was qualified for and the only jobs available were 50 miles away I'd move.

But my answer here is moot, because I live in an area of the country where the economy hasn't been made stagnant by EI molly-coddling.

[Michael Hardner]

In every job I've taken as an adult I've chosen to move to a new area if it meant an improvement in my prospects. If $9.00 an hour jobs were all I was qualified for and the only jobs available were 50 miles away I'd move.

So would I, assuming my wife was okay with it. So you have two "ifs" and I have three "ifs". Maybe the people who didn't apply had a similar number of "ifs".

But my answer here is moot, because I live in an area of the country where the economy hasn't been made stagnant by EI molly-coddling.

Yes, we've already had several threads dealing with Albertans who believe that their province's policies caused oil to appear below their feet. Also, I wasn't aware that EI qualification varied from region to region, but I may be wrong on that.

[Leafless]

The argument here is ' should seasonal workers be entitled to extended E.I. benefits.'

I think I heard the numbers of hours required for E.I. in Maritime provinces various according to the unemplyment rate which means, higher unemployment, seasonal workers need less hours to qualify.

With that being said and in regards to importing Russian workers, what is the actual amount of time these jobs will last.

In other words it would not be worth going off U.I. if the $9.00 per hr. job did not provide sufficient hours to re-apply for E.I. after that temporary $9-per hr. job terminates, thus the need for Russian workers.

I think the federal government is to generous with equalization payments and an effort should be made to federally re-locate workers to areas of the country where the work is rather than guarantee a certain lifestyle.

Here is a link to some stats in P.E.I. concerning this situation"

http://www.upei.ca/islandstudies/art_wm_1.htm

[mcqueen625]

Dude, you may be sticking your hand into the lobster pot, so to speak, by including condescending generalities in your post. I'm interested to see how some of the East coast members reply to this.

That said, it's pretty sad that paying jobs in the fishing industry can't be filled in a region full of unemployed fisherman.

Some of what you say has some merit, hjowever when you have makers of pharmaseuticals moving to places like PEI so they can pay $15.00 per hour instead of $30.00 plus it say a lot about "Big Business." I remember back a few years when Michalin coericed the government of Nova Scotia into passing legislation virtually outlawing the formation of a union at their plant as a condition of moving their plant to that province. Those in government at the time should have been hauled before the human rights commission for violating the rights of the workers to join a union if they chose to.

New Brunswick has done virtually the same thing by allowing the Irving Empire to run roughshod over worker's rights to allow this family to ship even more profits off to Burmuda where the tax-man cannot touch it. Now this same family has bullied both a civic government and a willing provincial government into passing a piece of legislation that virtually allows this company to take a property tax holiday for the next 25 years. A tax holiday I might add that this unavailable to anyone else in the province, all in the name of corporate greed.

Instead of talking about lazy Maritimers, lets instead talk about corporate welfare afforded to "Big Business," while the rest of us are expected to subsidize these lazy corporate bums.

[Riverwind]

Yes, we've already had several threads dealing with Albertans who believe that their province's policies caused oil to appear below their feet. Also, I wasn't aware that EI qualification varied from region to region, but I may be wrong on that.

Actually it does. The EI system is used a way to provide equalization through the back door.

[Duke]

[ Atlantic Canada.

Correct me if I'm wrong here - but the last time I checked an employee who voluntarily quits his/her job doesn't qualify for EI. Is this some sort of fishing industry loophole? Or am I just too far removed from the intricacies of government slush funds posing as manditory insurance (aka a tax)?

The whole system in the maritimes is geared to screwing the taxpayer in central Canada,imo

[geoffrey]

Working one day a week for anywhere between 8-12 weeks gives you full EI for the rest of the year, if your involved in a seasonal industry back East (and West coast fishermen too). But ski resort workers have to find summer jobs... why? Such a ridiculous double standard and big rip off from taxpayers. It's all about buying votes.

We watched a movie in an economics class I took last year where it interviewed Maritimers. One of them actually said they deserved their 'EI Vacation.' This is the attitude the government in Ottawa has created.

I don't blame Maritimers, they've been given a bad deal from the Feds. If Ottawa wasn't involved in provincial jurisdiction (social programs) then there would be very little at issue there. Most of those provinces elect Tory governments remember, its not like they are all crazy socialists.

Another poster, mcqueen, brings up a very good point about the whole Irving situation. Of course when Irving is (well now was due to the accountability act) a major funder of all political parties, the Federal government will gladly keep them repressed and poor, in order to create cheap labour. No doubt that has something to do with it.

Bernie Lord has made significant steps to increase free enterprise though, so its good to see some progress. And low and behold, unemployment is shrinking.

I'm telling you, if these people went hungry for a few weeks, they'd be moving out to Alberta to fill all the $25 an hour unskilled labour jobs in the oil patch. It's required of them, we are one country, one side shouldn't be in a labour shortage while the other side sits on their ass. Newfoundland has nearly 1 in 4 people unemployed... not to mention their participation rate is 55% compared to Alberta's nearly 80%. So when you actually look at the numbers, about 45% of Newfies work, and 78% of Albertans do. There is an injustice there, we are paying for laziness when there are plenty of jobs across Canada.

There is no longer an excuse to be unemployed in Canada. If this was a recession, then I'd be on your side, calling for more welfare for the unemployed. But it's not. This has the potential to be the most prosperous time in Canadian history and instead we waste it away creating a big culture of continual laziness back East.