Disasterous Ticking Bombshell For Martin Liberals

[bigdude]

Grewal Tapes 'Clean And Unadulterated' Says Audio Experts Hired By Tories

“Mr. Dash’s analysis of the recordings shows that they are clean and unaltered,” Kenney said. “These recordings speak for themselves. Now, it’s time for Paul Martin, Ujjal Dosanjh and Tim Murphy to begin answering the questions about their involvement in offering rewards to members of parliament in exchange for their votes. To this day, there has been no information produced by any of these individuals to dispute the facts on these recordings.”

If this proves to be accurate it actually could spell the end of PM Martin's career, let alone Dosanjh and obviously Murphy as well.

After all who said that the tapes had been doctored:

The Martin Liberals - give me a break!

Canada's mainstream media, who contribute financially to the political parties (read Liberal) of their choice - Please give me a break!!

No wonder we have seen such an all out attack on Gurmant Grewal by the Liberals.

[cybercoma]

Grewal Tapes 'Clean And Unadulterated' Says Audio Experts Hired By Tories

“Mr. Dash’s analysis of the recordings shows that they are clean and unaltered,” Kenney said. “These recordings speak for themselves. Now, it’s time for Paul Martin, Ujjal Dosanjh and Tim Murphy to begin answering the questions about their involvement in offering rewards to members of parliament in exchange for their votes. To this day, there has been no information produced by any of these individuals to dispute the facts on these recordings.”

If this proves to be accurate it actually could spell the end of PM Martin's career, let alone Dosanjh and obviously Murphy as well.

After all who said that the tapes had been doctored:

The Martin Liberals - give me a break!

Canada's mainstream media, who contribute financially to the political parties (read Liberal) of their choice - Please give me a break!!

No wonder we have seen such an all out attack on Gurmant Grewal by the Liberals.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I don't believe it was within his rights to record the conversation without letting them know he was doing so. I'm seriously disappointed in this whole situation. What happened is quite possibly illegal. I'm not familiar enough with the particular laws involved, so I can't say for sure.

[The Terrible Sweal]

So the Tories claim to have finally released the 'real' tapes. (With yet more previously unreleased minutes too.) And their credibility is now so low they had to hire someone to vouch for them. Great.

How on Earth this is can be bad for the Liberals escapes me.

But it sure undermines the CPC yet further. All the questions still remain. Why the delay and the piecemeal selective release? Who had the tapes and what were they doing with them? When did the Tory leadership get knowledge and control of the tapes? Why did Harper make faulty accusations based on fake evidence? Why has he not retracted such scurillous slander?

[Argus]

I don't believe it was within his rights to record the conversation without letting them know he was doing so.  I'm seriously disappointed in this whole situation.  What happened is quite possibly illegal.  I'm not familiar enough with the particular laws involved, so I can't say for sure.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

This has already been discussed ad naseum. There is absolutely no law preventing anyone from taping a conversation when they are a part of that conversation. There are some rules when it is police taping a conversation for court evidence, but no private citizen is under any restriction.

[Newfie Canadian]

Perception, perception, perception.

All that this whole fiasco has shown, so far, is that the Liberals play politics (some would call it dirty politics, but really, is there such a thing as clean politics?), and the perception is there once again that the CPC has something to hide. And I'm not talking about Grewal the MP, the party. First they hold onto the tapes and release tidbits and parts of conversations. They finally release the tapes (some?) and they appear to be altered (whether or not they have been doctored may never be known, unless the Mounties get involved), all the while defending the MP who started this mess while quietly keeping him out of sight.

What perception does this instill in the populace?

Even if the tapes are technically damaging to the Liberals, realistically the damage will be worse to the CPC because of the way it was done and handled by the CPC.

At least that's the way I see it so far.

[cybercoma]

I don't believe it was within his rights to record the conversation without letting them know he was doing so.  I'm seriously disappointed in this whole situation.  What happened is quite possibly illegal.  I'm not familiar enough with the particular laws involved, so I can't say for sure.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

This has already been discussed ad naseum. There is absolutely no law preventing anyone from taping a conversation when they are a part of that conversation. There are some rules when it is police taping a conversation for court evidence, but no private citizen is under any restriction.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I stand corrected and in that case I fully support what he did, even though it was a bit underhanded.

[ScottBrison]

[sarcasm]Really? A Tory Hack said they weren't doctored? Well I guess I have to believe that I mean it's not like the Tories would lie or anything.[/sarcasm]

[I miss Reagan]

I think you're right Newf. I don't think the CPC played the Grewal thing right. I think they don't play the game well most of the time. However, wouldn't you say the CPC is handicapped from the beginning by not having the decades of experience in government that the Libs have. Most of all the CPC is handicapped by an unfair press.

[Netherlands]

Grits, Tories continue to spar over tapes

TERRY WEBER

396 words

10 June 2005

The Globe and Mail (Breaking News)

Sparring over the authenticity of tapes that the Conservatives say prove the government was trying to buy votes ahead of last month's crucial confidence vote continued Friday in Ottawa, with the Conservatives insisting new tests show no evidence of tampering.

But the Liberals – responding to the latest suggestions in the House of Commons – dismissed calls for Tim Murphy, chief of staff for Prime Minister Paul Martin, to step aside. They insisted that a series of earlier tests clearly showed evidence that the tapes had been altered.

“I wonder how these members subscribe to the theory of pristine tapes when five independent experts, not partisan experts, Mr. Speaker, but independent experts have testified that these tapes have been altered, doctored and spliced and sliced,” Liberal Deputy House Leader Mauril Bélanger said.

“So to ask for anybody to step aside on the basis of such tapes is ludicrous.”

Earlier, Conservative Deputy House Leader Jason Kenny released a letter from Ottawa audio editor Randy Dash that the Conservatives said counters earlier claims that tapes secretly recorded by B.C. Conservative MP Gurmant Grewal were altered.

In the letter, Mr. Dash said that on the original recordings made by Mr. Grewal, three of the four clips are “clean and unaltered,” and that while a fourth contains several unusual noises, he cannot conclude that it was edited.

Several other audio experts, however, have concluded that the tapes initially posted on a website by Conservatives were altered.

“It's time they updated their talking points,” Ontario Conservative MP Jeff Watson charged during Friday's session in the House.

“A leading audio expert has confirmed that the full recordings are clean and unedited. What isn't clean, Mr. Speaker, is this Prime Minister's right-hand man, Tim Murphy.”

Mr. Grewal has accused the government of offering him and his MP wife Nina Grewal cabinet postings and other positions in exchange for their support in last month's crucial confidence vote. Mr. Grewal secretly recorded talks he had with both Mr. Murphy and Health Minister Ujjal Dosanjh.

The government has said that Mr. Grewal approached the Liberals and demanded he and his wife be given positions in exchange for their votes, a proposition that the Liberals say was immediately rejected.

Mr. Grewal has since gone on stress leave.

Globe and Mail Update

[ScottBrison]

The Conservative message:

we were lying before, but we're not lying anymore! Honestly we're not! so you can believe us this time, because we wouldn't lie to you, well except for that one time but that was just a misunderstanding yeah that's it yeah that's the ticket.....

[The Terrible Sweal]

I think you're right Newf.  I don't think the CPC played the Grewal thing right.  I think they don't play the game well most of the time.  However, wouldn't you say the CPC is handicapped from the beginning by not having the decades of experience in government that the Libs have.  Most of all the CPC is handicapped by an unfair press.

No, most of all the CPC is handicapped by having an attitudinal impairment.

[I miss Reagan]

No, most of all the CPC is handicapped by having an attitudinal impairment.

That's what I love about you Sweal, your well thought out and well articulated arguments.

[Canuck E Stan]

With the RCMP on the take with Adscam, and the Liberal's ethics commissioner Shapiro feeding Judy Sgro information before making a inconclusive decision on her strippergate probe, where do you think the tapes will go? First like Chretien,the RCMP will take forever to come to a conclusion,and second the Liberals will be told by their ethics commissioner that they almost crossed the line, but should be more careful about almost getting caught in the future.

[bigdude]

Just asking

Since Tim Murphy apparently has so much spare time on his hands that he was able to spend most of a week hanging out with Gurmant Grewal, would it really make much difference, either way, to the tickety-boo smooth running of this government if he stepped aside?

Nothing like an intelligent mind to focus the issue, eh!

[The Terrible Sweal]

No, most of all the CPC is handicapped by having an attitudinal impairment.

That's what I love about you Sweal, your well thought out and well articulated arguments.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Is anything about my comment unclear to you?