What can you do to stop racism?

[Guest TrueMetis]

Wiki? The Source for Lazy people. You are further intellectually behind than I thought. You aren't in a ~special~ class are you?

Ouch I'm hurt. I get it you can't admit when you're wrong or back up your arguments so you must resort to ad hominems instead.

If you are a card carrying Metis, then you are not First Nation. If you are a card-carrying First Nation, then you are not Metis. If you do not have a Metis Status card, or a First Nation Status card then you are neither. You ~might~ have native ancestry, or you could be non-status native, but neither makes you First Nation.

In any case, miss-identification is a major problem for aboriginal people, since the mainstream often try to generalize aboriginal people into one group, using the lowest common denominator (you know...the sleezy drunk homeless "Injun") as their preferred stereotype...

My ancestors were amongst the first persons to come to Canada and the Americas. That makes me First Nations, I couldn't care less what you a$$holes want to label me as. Who the hell are you to tell me who I am anyway? You're bloody delusional if you think you're any different than the people who put the First Nations into the situation.

I'm not pretending to be YOU, or pretending to try to save First Nations people. Rather, I am engaged in a number of processes that actually are doing something about the inequity, and lawlessness of our government. I research and provide advice to actual Status FN people on a regular basis as well as providing legal advice to the Crown on sovereignty issues. Maybe you should be sure about who you are talking to before you attempt to miss-identify people to suit your predominantly white agenda.....?

Ok mighty whitey. If they're talking your advice most of them are screwed.

Edited November 13, 2010 by TrueMetis

[CANADIEN]

Ouch I'm hurt. I get it you can't admit when you're wrong or back up your arguments so you must resort to ad hominems instead.

I wouldn't trust Wiki either. Except when the authors of a particular articles have done their homework... As is the case here.

Ok mighty whitey. If they're talking your advice most of them are screwed.

I strongly suspect that said "advice" to the Government is in the form of long, rambling e-mails or letters that are looked at once for the sake of getting a good laugh then filed and never read again.

[charter.rights]

My ancestors were amongst the first persons to come to Canada and the Americas. That makes me First Nations, I couldn't care less what you a$$holes want to label me as. Who the hell are you to tell me who I am anyway? You're bloody delusional if you think you're any different than the people who put the First Nations into the situation.

Go figure... That explains a lot given your ancestry derived from Neanderthal people. Or did you mean that your ancestors were the first Spanish or Dutch people to arrive here? Because in order to be Metis you have to have ties to French or Scottish AND some other native, according to The Metis Nation of Canada so you are either not Metis as you say, or your relatives were not the first people to arrive here in the US and Canada.

However, if you are really talking about your native ancestry, there was no Americas or Canada back then. You must have failed history (or perhaps your special ed teacher thought it was too hard for you?) In any case aboriginal people have been here for at least 15-20,000 years and likely longer. And if you have some proof you are realted to them, damn I want the plans for your time machine.

I can see how terribly confused you are. I take back my suggestion about you researching more. You would probably do better with a sleeping pill to knock you out the rest of the way.

Ok mighty whitey. If they're talking your advice most of them are screwed.

Oops! You made another misidentification. You sure are full of it!

Edited November 13, 2010 by charter.rights

[Guest TrueMetis]

I wouldn't trust Wiki either. Except when the authors of a particular articles have done their homework... As is the case here.

I don't I have a lot better sources but generally start with Wikipedia because it's a good starting point.

I strongly suspect that said "advice" to the Government is in the form of long, rambling e-mails or letters that are looked at once for the sake of getting a good laugh then filed and never read again.

He's saying he gives advice to First Nations bands.

Go figure... That explains a lot given your ancestry derived from Neanderthal people. Or did you mean that your ancestors were the first Spanish or Dutch people to arrive here? Because in order to be Metis you have to have ties to French or Scottish AND some other native, according to The Metis Nation of Canada so you are either not Metis as you say, or your relatives were not the first people to arrive here in the US and Canada.

Are you this dense? As a Metis some of my ancestors had to be First Nations IE the First people to arrive in Canada and the Americas.

However, if you are really talking about your native ancestry, there was no Americas or Canada back then. You must have failed history (or perhaps your special ed teacher thought it was too hard for you?) In any case aboriginal people have been here for at least 15-20,000 years and likely longer. And if you have some proof you are realted to them, damn I want the plans for your time machine.

Oh I'm sorry, what you want me to call it Turtle Island or something? I can trace my family History directly to Louis Riel Sr hence I know that my Family has been in Canada and the Americas from the beginning. Is this really all you've got?

Edited November 13, 2010 by TrueMetis

[Who's Doing What?]

Now that is a cool link. I can finally give a more definitive date for the first people in North America so thanks for that. I can also laugh at Europeans for not figuring out agriculture.

Did you notice how at one point humans were in little pockets?

Goes along way to explaining why there is such diversity. Isolated groups, creating genentic lineages that became the different races we know today.

Did you catch in the 2nd link where the Europeans and their modern weaponry, the clovis spear point, were thought to be responsible for wiping out most of the large animals? 15,000 or 500yrs ago somethings never change.

This is who we are. We are ALL immigrants to this continent.

[charter.rights]

I strongly suspect that said "advice" to the Government is in the form of long, rambling e-mails or letters that are looked at once for the sake of getting a good laugh then filed and never read again.

Are you sure?

I was part of a group at Tyendinaga a year ago spring (2009) that communicated with Buckingham Palace about the anniversary of the Silver Covenant Chain Treaty visit in 1710, by Six Nations Chiefs. And I am pretty sure that they listened enough for this to happen....

The Queen presented a set of eight silver hand bells engraved “The Silver Chain of Friendship 1710-2010” to representatives from two Chapels Royal of the Mohawk, located on two First Nations territories in Ontario.

And for verification if you want to waste your time doing the research I preempted the event last summer or fall with a post on this forum about it and the Queen's visit, last summer or fall. As part of that working group I also helped a number of protesters in receiving reduced sentences after I reminded the Crown in September of the requirement to produce Gladue Reports before their .

[u]

Section 718.2(e) of the Criminal Code, as well as the Supreme Court of Canada in\ n _blankR. v. Gladue, [1999] 1 S.C.R. 688 have stated that judges should account for these considerations when making sentencing decisions. Gladue asks judges to apply a method of analysis that recognizes the adverse background cultural impact factors that many Aboriginals face. In a Gladue analysis these factors, if present in their personal history, work to mitigate or reduce the culpability of offenders. Judges are then asked to consider all reasonable alternatives to jail in light of this. Such an analysis is designed to to lead to a "restorative justice remedy" being used either in place of a jail sentence or combined with a reduced term.

[/u]

So you too might not be capable understanding too much.

Edited November 13, 2010 by charter.rights

[Guest TrueMetis]

Did you notice how at one point humans were in little pockets?

Goes along way to explaining why there is such diversity. Isolated groups, creating genentic lineages that became the different races we know today.

Just Imagine if that had kept up for a longer length of time, there could have been multiple species of Humans again. Then just Imagine the fighting. We got off lucky.

Did you catch in the 2nd link where the Europeans and their modern weaponry, the clovis spear point, were thought to be responsible for wiping out most of the large animals? 15,000 or 500yrs ago somethings never change.

Well the most widely accepted theory is a combo of Humans and climate change. So things really haven't changed we're just using climate change directly.

This is who we are. We are ALL immigrants to this continent.

Yep, doesn't matter where you came from or when as long as you are here to contribute.

[CANADIEN]

He's saying he gives advice to First Nations bands.

and legal advice to the crown. Mind you, I don't think that there are many people within the First Nations that take him that seriously either.

Are you this dense? As a Metis some of my ancestors had to be First Nations IE the First people to arrive in Canada and the Americas.

Nope, there was not a country called Canada then, so obviously they didn't arrive anywhere. Yeah right.

[Who's Doing What?]

The Out of Africa theory isn't based on mitochondrial DNA theory.

Ya DNA is a theory.

Metis are not First Nation. There is a distinction, girl . Maybe you should go study that too.

Y'all ain't of pure enough blood for ol' charter. Makes me think...

[Guest TrueMetis]

Y'all ain't of pure enough blood for ol' charter. Makes me think...

He's just trying to use some bs legal definitions.

[CANADIEN]

This is who we are. We are ALL immigrants to this continent.

Nope. But some can claim (rightfully) ancestors here from the beginning of human occupation.

[Who's Doing What?]

Oh I'm sorry, what you want me to call it Turtle Island or something? I can trace my family History directly to Louis Riel Sr hence I know that my Family has been in Canada and the Americas from the beginning. Is this really all you've got?

Louis Riel? Wow. I haven't gone much beyond 1800 in my own family. I do know where there is a graveyard that in those days would have been 2days travel north of Fort York, with a relative buried in 1802.

I should look into it further. Did you use ancestry.com or something else?

[CANADIEN]

He's just trying to use some bs legal definitions.

You mean the legal definition created by the big bad whiteys. Interesting, isn't it, that some here would use that to deny you your ancestry while denouncing white society every time they start typing?

[charter.rights]

He's saying he gives advice to First Nations bands.

And The Crown.

Are you this dense?

As dense as you? Hell no. You are confused remember. Maybe a haldol might be in order for you.

As a Metis some of my ancestors had to be First Nations IE the First people to arrive in Canada and the Americas.

Well no, again. the definition of "First Nation" didn't exist back then. And the concept of "metis" (little 'm') didn't exist either at least until after the unions and children were born to mixed parentage. So all you are doing is trying to make a ghost and implying it is real and has substance.

Oh I'm sorry, what you want me to call it Turtle Island or something? I can trace my family History directly to Louis Riel Sr hence I know that my Family has been in Canada and the Americas from the beginning. Is this really all you've got?

Well, again that isn't enough to call yourself Metis (big 'M'). Do you have a Metis Status card?Or do you have am Indian Status card?

[Who's Doing What?]

Nope.

Whaaa...?

But some can claim (rightfully) ancestors here from the beginning of human occupation.

Sure, I have a full blood Blackfoot in my direct ancestry.

Which reminds me I need to get in touch with my Grandfathers family.

[Guest TrueMetis]

Louis Riel? Wow. I haven't gone much beyond 1800 in my own family. I do know where there is a graveyard that in those days would have been 2days travel north of Fort York, with a relative buried in 1802.

I should look into it further. Did you use ancestry.com or something else?

I had an aboriginal counselor that informed me that I was related to Louis Riel Jr. Then using ancestry.com I put in Louis Riel than went back from there. Louis Riel (the famous founder of Manitoba) is my great great great great (think that's right) uncle. Think it was one of his sisters that's my great great great grandmother. So I say I'm related to Louis Riel Sr (His father) because no one alive today is a direct descendant of Louis Riel as his children all died before having children of their own. After tracing my family back to France and Ireland along that path It kind of peter's off, end's about 1500. I've got a cousin or something that's working on a more extensive family tree so I should look into that. Might even head back to ancestry.com and pay for it because that's what I got without giving them a dime.

[CANADIEN]

Whaaa...?

I was born in this country, and so were my ancester for 12 generations (a lot more counting the ancestors of my one Ojibway ancestor in the 17th century). I am NOT an immigrant. And obviously, this is not to denigrate, belittle or deny the right of any Canadian not born in this country. Simply a statement of FACT.

[CANADIEN]

I had an aboriginal counselor that informed me that I was related to Louis Riel Jr. Then using ancestry.com I put in Louis Riel than went back from there. Louis Riel (the famous founder of Manitoba) is my great great great great (think that's right) uncle. Think it was one of his sisters that's my great great great grandmother. So I say I'm related to Louis Riel Sr (His father) because no one alive today is a direct descendant of Louis Riel as his children all died before having children of their own. After tracing my family back to France and Ireland along that path It kind of peter's off, end's about 1500. I've got a cousin or something that's working on a more extensive family tree so I should look into that. Might even head back to ancestry.com and pay for it because that's what I got without giving them a dime.

I would not trust what is found on ancestry without cross-checking it with actual source (spoking as a genealogist myself, and having heard horror stories about the poor work done by that site in regards to indexing - obviously, no doubting of the veracity of what you say).

[Who's Doing What?]

I was born in this country, and so were my ancester for 12 generations (a lot more counting the ancestors of my one Ojibway ancestor in the 17th century). I am NOT an immigrant. And obviously, this is not to denigrate, belittle or deny the right of any Canadian not born in this country. Simply a statement of FACT.

So you're a decendant of an immigrant.

whoop dee do So is every person living in the Americas.

IS that enough of a FACT for you?

Edited November 13, 2010 by Who's Doing What?

[Guest TrueMetis]

You mean the legal definition created by the big bad whiteys. Interesting, isn't it, that some here would use that to deny you your ancestry while denouncing white society every time they start typing?

It is very Ironic. I'm not Metis and First Nations because I'm not the the Governments definition of it. even though in practice the government doesn't even care, in the few forms I've filled out that ask for it it's entirely self declared. All you have to do is say you are and they accept it. Not that it ever seems to change anything.

Well, again that isn't enough to call yourself Metis (big 'M'). Do you have a Metis Status card?Or do you have am Indian Status card?

I'm getting really tired of you trying to tell me who I am.

I would not trust what is found on ancestry without cross-checking it with actual source (spoking as a genealogist myself, and having heard horror stories about the poor work done by that site in regards to indexing - obviously, no doubting of the veracity of what you say).

After Louis Riel (which isn't taken from ancestry.com It was just curiosity and doesn't even matter much. I can't remember anything about it other than them being from Ireland and France which I could have just assumed anyway. There is also some Belgium in there somewhere judging from my mother's maiden name.

Edited November 13, 2010 by TrueMetis

[CANADIEN]

So you're a decendant of an immigrant.

whoop dee do So is every person living in the Americas.

IS that enough of a FACT for you?

I am indeed the descendant of a immigrant. In fact, everyone is a descendant of an immigrant no matter where they live, unless they are Ethiopians and can claim that none of their ancestor ever moved from there .

Still doesn't me make or anyone else born in this country an immigrant to it.

[charter.rights]

He's just trying to use some bs legal definitions.

Really....? Like this:

35. (1) The existing aboriginal and treaty rights of the aboriginal peoples of Canada are hereby recognized and affirmed.

(2)

In this Act, "aboriginal peoples of Canada" includes the Indian, Inuit, and Metis peoples of Canada.

To be Metis (big 'M') you must be a member of recognized Metis Nations and demonstrate that your ancestry comes from one of the Metis regions in Canada. To be an Indian you need to meet the definition in the Indian Act for status, or provide some proof of aboriginal ancestry stemming from one of the various Indian Nations (meaning that while your ancestors might have lost status but the First Nation to which they belonged had you on their rolls at one time). Self-identifying yourself as metis because you have a mutt ancestry doesn't meet the government's or the courts definitions. In order to wear the star of Metis or be numbered as an Indian you would have to actually know who your aboriginal and your metis ancestors are, in a direct descendantcy, not just from your French one.

So do you see the problem with misidentification?

By government rules - you know the institutionalized racism in government - you have no right to claim who you are without a government issued card that separates you from the rest of us Canadians. Hell, you probably are whiter than an untanned baby's butt, and you can't make any claim that separates you from the rest of the pine nuts. You are just an ordinary Canadian until you can prove yourself to me, and anyone else that constantly fights the racism and misidentification on behalf of fair and just Canadians, to recognize aboriginal people are different but equal because of our legal relationships and treaty obligations, and not because of their skin colour.

Yet, is a white Canadian required to show his federal government issued "White Status Card" to obtain benefits? Like walking into a hospital emergency and being stopped to asked for their Indian status cards to obtain treatment?

That IS the point.

[charter.rights]

I had an aboriginal counselor that informed me that I was related to Louis Riel Jr. Then using ancestry.com I put in Louis Riel than went back from there. Louis Riel (the famous founder of Manitoba) is my great great great great (think that's right) uncle. Think it was one of his sisters that's my great great great grandmother. So I say I'm related to Louis Riel Sr (His father) because no one alive today is a direct descendant of Louis Riel as his children all died before having children of their own. After tracing my family back to France and Ireland along that path It kind of peter's off, end's about 1500. I've got a cousin or something that's working on a more extensive family tree so I should look into that. Might even head back to ancestry.com and pay for it because that's what I got without giving them a dime.

So you are neither Metis or First Nation....and your moniker is a misrepresentation of that group.

Edited November 13, 2010 by charter.rights

[charter.rights]

I was born in this country, and so were my ancester for 12 generations (a lot more counting the ancestors of my one Ojibway ancestor in the 17th century). I am NOT an immigrant. And obviously, this is not to denigrate, belittle or deny the right of any Canadian not born in this country. Simply a statement of FACT.

So that 17th century chinks means you are not pur laine, either.

[Guest TrueMetis]

To be Metis (big 'M') you must be a member of recognized Metis Nations and demonstrate that your ancestry comes from one of the Metis regions in Canada. To be an Indian you need to meet the definition in the Indian Act for status, or provide some proof of aboriginal ancestry stemming from one of the various Indian Nations (meaning that while your ancestors might have lost status but the First Nation to which they belonged had you on their rolls at one time). Self-identifying yourself as metis because you have a mutt ancestry doesn't meet the government's or the courts definitions. In order to wear the star of Metis or be numbered as an Indian you would have to actually know who your aboriginal and your metis ancestors are, in a direct descendantcy, not just from your French one.

The Canadian Armed Forces disagree, I self-identified and they accepted that just fine. And I already have told you about my Metis ancestor, LOUIS FREAKING RIEL. Of course this is true for at least a hundred people (the family on my mother side is pretty large)

By government rules - you know the institutionalized racism in government - you have no right to claim who you are without a government issued card that separates you from the rest of us Canadians. Hell, you probably are whiter than an untanned baby's butt, and you can't make any claim that separates you from the rest of the pine nuts. You are just an ordinary Canadian until you can prove yourself to me, and anyone else that constantly fights the racism and misidentification on behalf of fair and just Canadians, to recognize aboriginal people are different but equal because of our legal relationships and treaty obligations, and not because of their skin colour.

I do look white but I have nothing to prove to you. I have the right to claim my Metis and First Nations heritage by virtue of being Metis and First Nations. You on the other hand have no right to tell me who I am.

So you are neither Metis or First Nation....and your moniker is a misrepresentation of that group.

Are you seriously denying the Riel's were Metis? Seriously?

Edited November 13, 2010 by TrueMetis