Atleo calls for end of Indian Act within five years

[justme]

I wouldn't know as that's not what's happening in Canada.

Before Trudeau's policy of multiculturalism, more than 80% of immigration came from Europe. Today, more than 80% comes from, to put it politely, developing countries. The same pattern can be found in the US with its 1965 immigration bill, Great Britain, throughout Europe and Australia.

"Our cities will not be flooded with a million immigrants annually. Under the purposed Bill, the present level of immigration remains substantially the same. Secondly, the ethnic mix of this country will not be upset. Contrary to the charges in some quarters, S500 will not inundate America with immigrants from any other country or area, or the most populated and economically deprived nations of Asia and Africa. Only haters would make such assertions." -- Senator Edward Kennedy (Chairman of the Subcommittee that conducted the hearing on the 1965 Immigration Bill)

What happened?

"The US added at least 40 million immigrants after 1965. Before 1965, 95% of the new immigrants had come from Europe. After 1965, 95% came from the third world. The 1965 Act has transformed American society and had consequences exactly the opposite of what were promised." -- Steven Dillon (Dean of the Honors College of Oklahoma University - 2006 gathering of the American Immigration Control Foundation)

This video explains some of the problems with this immigration policy:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n7WJeqxuOfQ

Multiculturalism doesn't eradicate racial tension, it fuels it:

That nearly one quarter of British people might vote for a neo-Nazi party with views inimical to democracy, human rights and common decency is truly appalling.

The core reason is that for years they have watched as their country's landscape has been transformed out of all recognition - and that politicians from all mainstream parties have told them first that it isn't happening and second, that they are racist bigots to object even if it is.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/debate/article-1222977/MELANIE-PHILLIPS-The-outrageous-truth-slips-Labour-cynically-plotted-transform-entire-make-Britain-telling-us.html

How many honour killings happened in Canada prior to multiculturalism?

Did we need the level of airport security we now have prior to multiculturalism?

But of course, it isn't happening.

[Guest TrueMetis]

Before Trudeau's policy of multiculturalism, more than 80% of immigration came from Europe. Today, more than 80% comes from, to put it politely, developing countries. The same pattern can be found in the US with its 1965 immigration bill, Great Britain, throughout Europe and Australia.

Source?

How many honour killings happened in Canada prior to multiculturalism?

quite a few actually, they weren't called that but that's what they were.

[justme]

This is from 2001 so it's probably changed a bit. My link it's not exactly an overwhelming amount of immigrants coming from third world countries.

And this is from 2008 (see Canada - Permanent residents by source country on pg.23):

http://www.cic.gc.ca/english/pdf/research-stats/facts2008.pdf

From 1999-2008, nearly the same amount of people, more in some years, came from Pakistan as the US and UK combined.

[Guest TrueMetis]

And this is from 2008 (see Canada - Permanent residents by source country on pg.23):

http://www.cic.gc.ca/english/pdf/research-stats/facts2008.pdf

From 1999-2008, nearly the same amount of people, more in some years, came from Pakistan as the US and UK combined.

So what? The amount of people from Pakistan is dwarfed by the amount from Asia, and in the last few years immigration from the U.S. and UK has increased quite a lot. By far the most people came from India, China, and the Philippines which are all considered newly industrialized. So much for your 80% number.

[justme]

Source?

"As late as 1966, 87 percent of immigrants were of European origin, but by 1970 that had dropped to 50 percent. Throughout the 1970s and 1980s immigrants would increasingly come from Asia, Africa, Latin America and the Caribbean. Indeed, 40 percent of immigrants between 1978 and 1986 were of Asian origin, while less than 30 percent were European. Canadian demographics were changing rapidly."

http://www.international.gc.ca/history-histoire/world-monde/1968-1984.aspx?lang=eng

For a more recent breakdown of immigration, see the 2008 link from my previous post.

quite a few actually, they weren't called that but that's what they were.

More of your moral equivalence BS. There's a difference between a person who kills his own daughter or sister in a society that finds such behaviour abhorrent and a culture where it is considered acceptable. That you cannot see the difference or choose not to is also disturbing.

[Guest TrueMetis]

More of your moral equivalence BS. There's a difference between a person who kills his own daughter or sister in a society that finds such behaviour abhorrent and a culture where it is considered acceptable. That you cannot see the difference or choose not to is also disturbing.

Because so many Muslims have stood up and supported what these people did. Actually most of what I've seen has been condemnation by pretty much everyone.

[justme]

So what? The amount of people from Pakistan is dwarfed by the amount from Asia, and in the last few years immigration from the U.S. and UK has increased quite a lot. By far the most people came from India, China, and the Philippines which are all considered newly industrialized. So much for your 80% number.

Per capita incomes:

China: $6600

India: $3100

Philippines: $3300

Tell me again, who was responsible for the worst mass murder in Canadian history? I'll give you a hint: they're from a country where pre-arranged marriage is common.

[Guest TrueMetis]

Per capita incomes:

China: $6600

India: $3100

Philippines: $3300

Tell me again, who was responsible for the worst mass murder in Canadian history? I'll give you a hint: they're from a country where pre-arranged marriage is common.

I have no idea what the hell you're talking about.

Oh course it doesn't really matter because your still failing into the trap of generalization.

Edited July 25, 2010 by TrueMetis

[justme]

Because so many Muslims have stood up and supported what these people did. Actually most of what I've seen has been condemnation by pretty much everyone.

I guess it's worth repeating:

In a chilling police interview on the day of Aqsa's murder, her distraught mother, crying and talking out loud to herself, was recorded as saying she thought her husband was only going to “break legs and arms,” but instead “killed her.”

She told the officer that in her Pakistani culture, if a daughter doesn't listen to her parents, she is punished. “Either they kill the girl or turn her out of the house,” she said.

When she asked him why he killed her, he told her: “This is my insult. My community will say you have not been able to control your daughter. This is my insult. She is making me naked.

http://www.thestar.com/news/gta/crime/article/823705--father-and-son-plead-guilty-to-murdering-aqsa-parvez

[justme]

I have no idea what the hell you're talking about.

Oh course it doesn't really matter because your still failing into the trap of generalization.

I think "failing" would more aptly describe your response.

Per capita income does matter when talking about developing counties, but hey, facts don't matter to multiculturalists.

[Guest TrueMetis]

I guess it's worth repeating:

Unless you have quotes from people in this guys community saying they agree with it all you have is the word of a guy crazy enough to kill his own daughter and a women talking about "her" Pakistani culture. Which doesn't exactly prove this is a common or approved of thing.

I think "failing" would more aptly describe your response.

Per capita income does matter when talking about developing counties, but hey, facts don't matter to multiculturalists.

So does purchasing power which is higher in those newly industrialized countries. Now since I seem to missed it who was responsible for the worst mass murder in Canadian history?

[bloodyminded]

No? How many immigrants do we have from more primitive nations? Do we not embrace their cultures, as per our policy of multiculturalism?

Nope.

In most ways, we've become more liberal, or at any rate more enlightened. The arch-conservatives certainly don't appear to be having much effect.

I don't think that the legalization of same sex marriage, and the overwhelming public support for it (70%, according to a poll cited by MacLeans), is good evidence of the baleful influence of more conservative cultures.

In what ways have they influenced us away from liberty?

Edited July 25, 2010 by bloodyminded

[justme]

Unless you have quotes from people in this guys community saying they agree with it all you have is the word of a guy crazy enough to kill his own daughter and a women talking about "her" Pakistani culture. Which doesn't exactly prove this is a common or approved of thing.

So-called honor killings are part of a community mentality. Large sections of society share traditional conceptions of family honor and approve of "honor" killings to preserve that honor. Even mothers whose daughters have been killed in the name of honor often condone such violent acts. Such complicity by other women in the family and the community strengthens the concept of women as property without personal worth. In addition, communal acceptance of "honor" killings furthers the claim that violence in the name of "honor" is a private issue and one to be avoided by law enforcement. Community acceptance of these killings stifles accurate reporting of the number of violent crimes against women in the name of "honor." As a result, the true extent of the prevalence of "honor" killings is still not fully known.

"It is an unholy alliance that works against women: the killers take pride in what they have done, the tribal leaders condone the act and protect the killers and the police connive the cover-up." Nighat Taufeeq of the women's resource center Shirkatgah (Lahore, Pakistan).

http://www.amnestyusa.org/violence-against-women/stop-violence-against-women-svaw/honor-killings/page.do?id=1108230

Now since I seem to missed it who was responsible for the worst mass murder in Canadian history?

I hope that the CBC isn't too conservative for you:

The Bombing of Air India Flight 182

On March 16, 2005, a B.C. Supreme Court judge acquitted Ripudaman Singh Malik and Ajaib Singh Bagri on eight charges related to the bombing of Air India Flight 182 on June 22, 1985. It was Canada's worst mass murder - 329 people were killed. Two baggage handlers at Tokyo's Narita Airport died in another connected bombing.

http://www.cbc.ca/news/background/airindia/bombing.html

[charter.rights]

Canada is a metis soceity and any culture it may have comes from that.

The Victorians created the Family Compact to try to destroy our metis culture and replace it with a Victorian one, including altering history, taking control of the executive branch of government etc.

We are in an era of the Family Compact Revival, and Harper's attempts to pirate government for his own use, has been done before - most notable Sir J. A McDonald - and it failed, just as it will fail this time.

[justme]

Surrey Sikh parade's martyrs float angers mayor

More than 100,000 people attended the religious parade and festival in the Vancouver suburb, but Watts said she was disappointed the parade included a float honouring Sikh separatist extremists as martyrs.

The float featured the flag of Khalistan, the independent Sikh state that separatists want to carve out of India's Punjab state.

There were also posters of men who founded what are considered terrorist groups and who played a role in assassinating Indian prime minister Indira Gandhi, along with the slogan "They gave their today for our tomorrow."

....

This is not the first year the parade has drawn controversy because of its support for Sikh militants in India.

In 2007 and 2008, controversial floats — one with a photo of alleged Air India bombing mastermind Talwinder Singh Parmar — drew criticism.

In 2009, the parade itself was free of controversial floats but organizers did set up a separate tent on the grounds of the festival that included photographs of the founders of the Babbar Khalsa and the International Sikh Youth Federation, groups Canada considers to be terrorist organizations.

http://www.cbc.ca/canada/british-columbia/story/2010/04/18/bc-surrey-vaisakhi-parade.html#ixzz0uhIoOXhd

Nope, no evidence of support here.

A lot of Indians in Canada come from Punjab. In the "newly industrialized" country - where a major energy source is cow dung:

Across the border, in Pakistan, "honour killings" are rampant. Scores of women are killed every year for allegedly bringing shame on their husband or family. Women's deaths are explained away on "the flimsiest of grounds", according to Amnesty International.

But Punjab on both sides of the border shares the same feudal ethos. "Prosperity has not has the slightest effect on patriarchy in Punjab," says Veena Kumari, a women's rights activist and lawyer .

A petition before the Punjab state human rights commission by lawyer Ranjan Lakhanpal, based in the Punjabi capital, Chandigarh, triggered the murder inquiry. He said: "This is the most famous, but certainly not the first, honour killing in Punjab.

"In rural Punjab, a girl wanting to marry a boy of her choice against parental wishes runs the risk of being killed especially if the boy is from another caste, religion, income bracket or community. In the last five years I have dealt with four such cases. None have led to convictions because such cases are almost impossible to prove. All traces of the dead body are spirited away."

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2000/nov/20/3

[Borg]

Canada is a metis soceity and any culture it may have comes from that.

Interesting

A frenchman screws an indian and we get a metis culture across canuckleland - that means I must be one too

Where do I line up for the govenment hand outs?

We have been giving out freebies for generations - time some of us who really do pay taxes can get some of that too.

Borg

Edited July 25, 2010 by Borg

[Sir Bandelot]

And with this the genocide of Indian culture wil be complete.

[charter.rights]

Interesting

A frenchman screws an indian and we get a metis culture across canuckleland - that means I must be one too

Where do I line up for the govenment hand outs?

We have been giving out freebies for generations - time some of us who really do pay taxes can get some of that too.

Borg

Of course trying to be stupid is your strong suit. Well done!

If you look at some of the legacies in our society you will find a mixture of aboriginal and settler customs at its core. And that is where we still lie.

Have another drink. You might be able to delay this hangover until Wednesday or Thursday of next week if you keep yourself as pickled as you are right now.

[charter.rights]

And with this the genocide of Indian culture wil be complete.

You should know that native culture is like the Borg. Resistance is futile and you too will eventually be assimilated into the collective.

[Smallc]

Where do I line up for the govenment hand outs?

Metis don't get any handouts. I should know, I am one. About the only thing I get to do is tick an extra box on a job application....and go hunting in some specific part of Manitoba, apparently.

[charter.rights]

Metis don't get any handouts. I should know, I am one. About the only thing I get to do is tick an extra box on a job application....and go hunting in some specific part of Manitoba, apparently.

Calling yourself metis is not the same thing as being Metis. The latter requires that you hold status in a Metis organization, that you can trace your family back to one of the few Metis settlement areas and that you are active in the culture.

You do all those things? Or are you trying to hide behind a virtual sash and fiddle as a point of trying to create a false shaman persona?

[Guest TrueMetis]

I hope that the CBC isn't too conservative for you:

If that's the worse we've got things are looking pretty good. It's obvious we aren't going to convince each other so it's probably best that we end this debate.

Metis don't get any handouts. I should know, I am one. About the only thing I get to do is tick an extra box on a job application....and go hunting in some specific part of Manitoba, apparently.

You can if you go through a rather long an annoying process but it's just not worth it.

Edited July 26, 2010 by TrueMetis

[Bonam]

Nope.

In most ways, we've become more liberal, or at any rate more enlightened. The arch-conservatives certainly don't appear to be having much effect.

I don't think that the legalization of same sex marriage, and the overwhelming public support for it (70%, according to a poll cited by MacLeans), is good evidence of the baleful influence of more conservative cultures.

In what ways have they influenced us away from liberty?

Umm, take a look at freedom of speech and how it is being trampled in favor of not offending Muslims, all over the Western world. Whether it's cartoons that go unpublished for fear of reprisal, or south park episodes that get censored (and the studio almost bombed anyway), or many other examples, this is clearly driving us "away from liberty". In Canada, we have the human rights commissions that trample all over the rights of Canadians if some minority even pretends to be slightly offended. And this is only the beginning.

Edited July 26, 2010 by Bonam

[Jack Weber]

Umm, take a look at freedom of speech and how it is being trampled in favor of not offending Muslims, all over the Western world. Whether it's cartoons that go unpublished for fear of reprisal, or south park episodes that get censored (and the studio almost bombed anyway), or many other examples, this is clearly driving us "away from liberty". In Canada, we have the human rights commissions that trample all over the rights of Canadians if some minority even pretends to be slightly offended. And this is only the beginning.

Sadly,I agree with you(er...I mean "sadly" because of the situation )

However,if that's the case,the terrorist Islamofascists have won in some regard because they've succeeded in making us afraid to speak the truth.This is the same tactic they have used,quite successfully,in Islamic countries to shut up any dissent of their activities...

Edited July 26, 2010 by Jack Weber

[Bonam]

However,if that's the case,the terorist Islamofascists have won in some regard because they've succeeded in making us afraid to speak the truth.This is the same tactic they have used,quite successfully,in Islamic countries to shut up any dissent of their activities...

Of course they've won, and keep on winning. They are determined and sure of themselves and their cause. We on the other hand constantly doubt ourselves, criticize ourselves, are unsure of the rightness of our actions (I mean we to refer to Western societies). All our material and technical advantages cannot always overcome that simple thing they have over us: confidence.

I'm not sure if there is any cure to this... criticism of the government and its actions is a deep and important part of Western culture. When combined with the modern liberal positions of cultural guilt and shame, however, this becomes very dangerous to our continued prosperity.

If we simply stood up for freedom of speech in a unified way, protected those who chose to speak on whatever topic, and retaliated against those who would take away our right to do so, all the Muslim protests in the world would do nothing to stop us. But instead half our society is busy saying that maybe we should be more sensitive to their feelings, that maybe we don't need to have our free speech be so provocative, that maybe we should limit free speech if it offends some groups, etc.

And so the West falls lower and lower.