LeBlanc Drops Out

[ThatGuy]

Didn't see this posted yet:

http://www.ctv.ca/servlet/ArticleNews/stor...?hub=TopStories

LeBlanc is out reports state.

Edited December 7, 2008 by ThatGuy

[fellowtraveller]

from the link

Both Ignatieff and Rae were quick to blame the political crisis on Harper, and accused him of using divisive rhetoric to characterize the coalition as a deal between the Liberals, the NDP and separatists.

It is Orwellian, the way these idiots pretend that the coalition is anything but a deal with the Bloc, who remain a separatist party. Letters were signed, hands were shaken, pictures were taken. Are they now pretending all that did not happen?

As for Leblanc, I expect promises have been made to Junior to get out of the way for now.

Next up: Rae and Ignatieff will announce some kind of Blair/Brown deal where they take turns on the throne. They'll have to do something, Dion has to go Asap and they cannot wait until May.

The Libs are betting everything on their coaltion surviving until January, and the GG denying Harper an election when they bring him down.

Desperate times, desperate measures.

[-VMG-]

You can deny the bloc all you want... they aren't going anywhere... just because they are separatists does not mean they aren't there... you can't ignore them... and they obviously represent a portion of Canadians.... not long ago the progressive conservatives really only represented Alberta... and a few seats on the atlantic coast... do they have any less say than the BQ does simply because they voted for someone who will attempt to get the best for Quebec?

Isn't that why you vote for a political party? So they will choose the best course for you? They will get the best they can for you?

So why is everyone up in arms over the Bloc? Many people vote for the conservatives because they believe they will do the best they can for the West.... what makes them any less important than the rest of Canada?

This is just ridiculous... partisan politics at its finest... or worst... depending how you look at it i suppose.

[OddSox]

I think there is a major difference between 'getting the best for Quebec' and 'getting the worst for the Country'. It's the latter of those that the Bloc has pledged.

[jdobbin]

It is Orwellian, the way these idiots pretend that the coalition is anything but a deal with the Bloc, who remain a separatist party. Letters were signed, hands were shaken, pictures were taken. Are they now pretending all that did not happen?

Who is pretending? It is what Harper wanted to do in 2004 but felt he couldn't based on what was in the Liberal budget.

As for Leblanc, I expect promises have been made to Junior to get out of the way for now.

I expect it is money. Most of the money is falling into Rae and Ignatieff's hands. With a leadership race that could be decided in January, he probably thought it might be better to sit this one out. We'll see when he makes his speech on Monday.

Next up: Rae and Ignatieff will announce some kind of Blair/Brown deal where they take turns on the throne. They'll have to do something, Dion has to go Asap and they cannot wait until May.

On Wednesday, there will be a push to have Dion either step down or to have the new leader in place before the Throne Speech.

The Libs are betting everything on their coaltion surviving until January, and the GG denying Harper an election when they bring him down.

Desperate times, desperate measures.

And they still might succeed unless Harper has one of the best budgets in Canadian history.

[-VMG-]

I think there is a major difference between 'getting the best for Quebec' and 'getting the worst for the Country'. It's the latter of those that the Bloc has pledged.

It seems you are the expert on this. I shall debate no more.

[Huston]

I think there is a major difference between 'getting the best for Quebec' and 'getting the worst for the Country'. It's the latter of those that the Bloc has pledged.

It is? What does Quebec produce that is so essential to Canada? We import U.S. hollywood movies, British music bands, and what not, why not Quebec culture? Or is it just some made up image that does not really exist. The Bloc is legitimate. I don’t agree with them on everything, like how Duceppe call Harper a Laissez-faire capitalist.. or he just called him Laissez-faire. Harper is not let be, not with bills like C-51 and C-61.

[Sir Bandelot]

Leblanc dropping out is good news for the CPC.

[jdobbin]

Leblanc dropping out is good news for the CPC.

Is it? How so?

[Sir Bandelot]

Is it? How so?

Because I think that the Liberal party needs an overhaul to go from here. The best choice for a leader would be someone who has a chance at defeating Harper, and I don't think either of the other two have the charisma to pull it off. Not sure if LeBlanc could win, but what they need is somebody relatively new and well spoken, someone who can come across as a visionary, intelligent leader. I think if its going to be Rae or Ignatieff, it means another generation of failed leadership for the Liberal party.

Oh well, maybe next time.- Stephan Dion

Edited December 8, 2008 by Sir Bandelot

[jdobbin]

Because I think that the Liberal party needs an overhaul to go from here. The best choice for a leader would be someone who has a chance at defeating Harper, and I don't think either of the other two have the charisma to pull it off. Not sure if LeBlanc could win, but what they need is somebody relatively new and well spoken, someone who can come across as a visionary, intelligent leader. I think if its going to be Rae or Ignatieff, it means another generation of failed leadership for the Liberal party.

I think you are presuming a lot from Leblanc. Most Canadians don't even know him. Most in the Liberal party don't know him. Who can say if he is visionary? I know he is intelligent but dismissing either Rae or Ignatieff for lack of charisma? Come on.

As for relatively new, Leblanc is not a newcomer.

[Sir Bandelot]

I think you are presuming a lot from Leblanc. Most Canadians don't even know him. Most in the Liberal party don't know him. Who can say if he is visionary? I know he is intelligent but dismissing either Rae or Ignatieff for lack of charisma? Come on.

As for relatively new, Leblanc is not a newcomer.

Maybe I am... I did say I wasn't sure if he could win. But if Canadians don't really know him, that might work in his favour. I was thinking more along the lines of an Obama. If its not LeBlanc, then the person I am describing has not been found yet.

[Smallc]

I was thinking more along the lines of an Obama.

Those are one in a million. We had one once, and it will probably be a while before we have one again. We can't always expect there to be an Obama available.

Edited December 8, 2008 by Smallc

[blueblood]

Those are one in a million. We had one once, and it will probably be a while before we have one again. We can't always expect there to be an Obama available.

Trudeau was a national disgrace. He is no Obama. Trudeau threw gas on the fire of national unity problems, and embarassed us on the world stage. I guess that's what happen when socialists take power.

[Smallc]

Trudeau was a national disgrace. He is no Obama. Trudeau threw gas on the fire of national unity problems, and embarassed us on the world stage. I guess that's what happen when socialists take power.

I guess that's one opinion.

[Sir Bandelot]

Those are one in a million. We had one once, and it will probably be a while before we have one again. We can't always expect there to be an Obama available.

In politics you have to present the people with a leader they can believe in. You need someone with a style that reaches the people. What type of person this is, depends on the prevailing attitude of the times. If Obamas cannot be found, they can be made.

Edited December 8, 2008 by Sir Bandelot

[blueblood]

In politics you have to present the people with a leader they can believe in. What type of person this is, depends on the prevailing attitude of the times. You need someone with a style that reaches the people. If Obamas cannot be found, they can be made.

they tried that with harper and dion and layton and duceppe and that has proved to be a disaster.

[Sir Bandelot]

they tried that with harper and dion and layton and duceppe and that has proved to be a disaster.

I think they try to do that all the time... except for Dion. The Liberals have had a series of disasters and I doubt that Rae or Ignatieff can do anything to turn it around. My sense is many Canadians want change but do not see a leader that they truly believe in- even with Harper

[jdobbin]

Maybe I am... I did say I wasn't sure if he could win. But if Canadians don't really know him, that might work in his favour. I was thinking more along the lines of an Obama. If its not LeBlanc, then the person I am describing has not been found yet.

I think Leblanc knew that he didn't have the same amount of lead time that Obama had to get out there and wow the public. His campaign was struggling to line up support or money so it was going to be a hard slog.

With the accelerated leadership, I think Leblanc is doing what he thinks is best for the party.

[blueblood]

I think they try to do that all the time... except for Dion. The Liberals have had a series of disasters and I doubt that Rae or Ignatieff can do anything to turn it around. My sense is many Canadians want change but do not see a leader that they truly believe in- even with Harper

harper is more boring than church. However, there are no "Obama's" in parliament right now.

[fellowtraveller]

And they still might succeed unless Harper has one of the best budgets in Canadian history.

How do you define success?

All Harper has to do is demonstrate to the GG that he has publicly done his best to consult those pesky Bloc Torontois members on the budget, and if they still insist on kciking him out.... Then as First MNinister and prime advisor to the GG, he'll regretfully report back to her that as per their conversations there is nothing left but an election.

And according to you, that is what Harper wants all along. Sounds like success all righty.

Poor Iggy may be reduced to some really poor options... either several months or years of eating the same diet of sh*t sandwiches that were Dions favorites, or going to an election with limited support and no money.

Do you think the Bloc Torontois has handed the CPC at least one majority?

Edited December 8, 2008 by fellowtraveller

[jdobbin]

How do you define success?

Simple. One that the Opposition thinks is worth voting confidence for. Same as any budget.

All Harper has to do is demonstrate to the GG that he has publicly done his best to consult those pesky Bloc Torontois members on the budget, and if they still insist on kciking him out.... Then as First MNinister and prime advisor to the GG, he'll regretfully report back to her that as per their conversations there is nothing left but an election.

And she'll decide what her options are. Election would be only once choice.

And according to you, that is what Harper wants all along. Sounds like success all righty.

Only if the Governor General agrees and there is no indication what her decision will be.

Poor Iggy may be reduced to some really poor options... either several months or years of eating the same diet of sh*t sandwiches that were Dions favorites, or going to an election with limited support and no money.

Or Harper is out and the Opposition forms the government.

In which case, it might be Harper who has to eat it from his own party.

The other choice is that Ignatieff lets the budget pass, plays coy about whether he will support other measures and lets Harper know that he won't accept any brinkmanship, will vote no if there is any and that he is prepared to govern.

I know Tories are now convinced about going to an election but it doesn't mean that the Governor General will go along with it. Harper's future is probably tied to making this government work. I don't think he can afford to be tossed out of office and hope his party won't seek a leadership alternative.

Do you think the Bloc Torontois has handed the CPC at least one majority?

Not under Harper I don't. He has a singular talent for falling short of majorities.

If Ignatieff ends up as leader, I see a different strategy occurring on both sides of the House. If Harper attempts bullying, the Liberals will call him on it, suggest compromise but firmly say no without that compromise. It will be in Harper's court and if he presses forward, I don't know that he will get the desired election out of the Governor General. She could very well deny and election, deny the Opposition government and tell Harper to work it out. That is her prerogative as well.

Edited December 8, 2008 by jdobbin