Russell by-law spat sparks bilingual study

[g_bambino]

Moderators did not take action against the barrage of insults complete with 'laughing smileys' directed against myself, mainly from bambino (that's you), CANADIEN, Dancer and guyser.

So I simply started returning the compliments.

If you compiled a list of PERSONAL insults directed against myself, including the more serious ones relating to language discrimination, it would be many times longer than the list you provided.

Completely missed the point.

[guyser]

Moderators did not take action against the barrage of insults complete with 'laughing smileys' directed against myself, mainly from bambino (that's you), CANADIEN, Dancer and guyser.

Oh buttercup ,

You should really tell the truth.

I have never put a "laughing smiley" on any post directed at you.

And what you call an insult is merely the truth.

Signed,

Pink Chardonnay drinker

F#$&%$* queer,

Gay Boy

or just guyser.

Edited August 7, 2008 by guyser

[CANADIEN]

You are in no position to dictate play judge as any judge would realize that 4/5 English speaking Canadians constitutes an overwhelming linguistic majority that does NOT need to be influenced by any small minority language.

Less we forget... You are the one who wants to judge and dictate which language should and should not be used on commercial signs.

And English is neither threatened nor "influenced" by any other Canadian language.

Your continual personal insults paint a true picture of what you really are namely an inferior, dominating arrogant Francophone.

Others have already replied to that bit of non-sense a lot better than i would.

No one cares what languages are spoken in Russell and that is what the true reality is.

Your drivel shows otherwise.

The only thing I get is that English speaking jobs are being stolen(...)

Once again, you don't get it

(...) by an inferior culture (...)

You mean an inferior race, right?

(...) jealous of the popularity of the free flowing English language.

:lol: :lol:

Combating Quebec type racial discrimination being propagated in Ontario by Ontario Francophones leaves NO other choice.

Your "they force me to do it" routine was funny at first, then pathetic. Now, it's merely pitiful.

Edited August 7, 2008 by CANADIEN

[CANADIEN]

Russell Township has been brought to court for violating charter fundamental freedoms namely freedom of expression.

I think they will lose, but hey if they win... at least it will show that your little "English onlin on commercial signs" pet project would also be deemed to violate freedom of expression.

In the meantime, thank you for supporting Russell merchants who want to post signage in French only.

[CANADIEN]

Hmm.. It seems you're right. I was under the impression that the Royal Proclamation of 1763 guaranteed the inhabitants of Quebec the use of the French language. But, after having a read through it, it seems I'm wrong. The Quebec Act of 1774, however, states that the residents in Quebec may "hold and enjoy their Property and Possessions, together with all Customs and Usages relative thereto, and all other their Civil Rights." Would "customs" include language?

I know the British North America Act 1867 made the federal government bilingual, but I'm sure there were earlier laws making French an official language in Canada. Any ideas?

The Quebec Act was silent on the issue of language. The unofficial way of doing things was that English was the language of Governor's palace and the higher administration, while French was more often than not the de-facto language in local courts and administration.

Shortly after the Constitutional Act of 1791, the British Government decreed that English would be the sole sole official language of Lower Canada, but in practice both French and English were used in the Legislative Assembly and virtually all laws and regulations were translated. Despite occasional efforts by the Executive Council to increase the number of English-speaking judges, most of the court and local administration was in French. The government also tried to use free non-compulsory education as an assimilation tool but most of the population stayed away from those schools.

The Act of Union of 1840 made English the sole language official language; however, strong resistence from French-speaking members of the Assembly (who just kept using French) was instrumental in the passing of an other British law that reversed the language dispostions of the Act of Union (1848). After that, English and French became de-facto (but not officically, as no other law was ever voted on the topic) equal in status in the Assembly and all laws were enacted in both languages.

[Leafless]

i am still looking for the section of the Charter that reads: "the Federal governments shall invalidate any law it considers to be contrary to the disposition of this Act [the Charter]". You won't find it, because it is not there.

Finding that a provincial law or municipal by-law is unconstitutional is the responsibility of the courts, not the federal government or the Parliament.

The FACT that nothing in these by-laws prevents the use of English or any other languages has been proven. There is nothing in them that violates section 2 of the Charter.

These laws are not preventing the use of the English language but forces users of the English language to comply to corrupt French language laws.

Section 16-3 of the Constitution Act 1982 states, " Nothing in this Charter limits the authority of Parliament or a legislature to advance the equality of the status or use of English and French."

So it is apparent that the federal government has some catching up to do in the area of providing protection for users of the English language.

But you're welcome to argue otherwise in court... and lose.

You are counting your chickens before they are hatched.

Ottawa's bilingual policy implemented by mere councillors, Russell language sign laws again implemented by mere councillors, along with Ontario's French Language Services Act is an extension of discriminatory Quebec language laws, particularly Bill-101 otherwise known as the French Language Charter.

We don't need this kind of corrupt politics in Ontario.

Any court that agrees these policies are not corrupt proves that Ontario's provincial government harbours a hidden French linguistic agenda and is not competent to govern.

[CANADIEN]

These laws are not preventing the use of the English language (...)

Thanks for admitting it.

but forces users of the English language to comply to corrupt French language laws(...)

A law that forces people to comply to itself... Whatever. And we'll ignore the fact that the Russell by-law also force users of the French language to have English on commercial signs, right?

Section 16-3 of the Constitution Act 1982 states, " Nothing in this Charter limits the authority of Parliament or a legislature to advance the equality of the status or use of English and French."

So it is apparent that the federal government has some catching up to do in the area of providing protection for users of the English language.

What is apparent is that English is most definitely not denied equality with French in Ontario.

Ottawa's bilingual policy implemented by mere councillors (...)

Acting in accordance and as mandated by provincial laws.

Russell language sign laws again implemented by mere councillors (...)

Acting within their powers, and discriminating (to use your words) against French-speaking residents by mandating that they use English alongside French on business signs

along with Ontario's French Language Services Act (...)

Finally, something new. You acknowledge it exists

(...) is an extension of discriminatory Quebec language laws, particularly Bill-101 otherwise known as the French Language Charter.

We don't need this kind of corrupt politics in Ontario.

As proven again and again and again, the only thing that looks like Quebec language laws is the type of English-only legislation YOU are promoting, and you are right on one thing - we do not need it in Ontario.

Any court that agrees these policies are not corrupt proves (...)

That it knows its job, which is to determine the LEGALITY of a government action. The French Language Services Act has never, to my knowledge, being contested in court, for a very good reason... There is nothing in any provincial or federal law or in the Constitution that prevented the Legislative Assembly from passing it. As for the Ottawa by-law, people have gone to court arguing the same non-sense you serve us again and again (that it is discriminatory and beyong the powers of the City Council) and they have lost.

[Oleg Bach]

Thanks for admitting it.

A law that forces people to comply to itself... Whatever. And we'll ignore the fact that the Russell by-law also force users of the French language to have English on commercial signs, right?

What is apparent is that English is most definitely not denied equality with French in Ontario.

Acting in accordance and as mandated by provincial laws.

Acting within their powers, and discriminating (to use your words) against French-speaking residents by mandating that they use English alongside French on business signs

Finally, something new. You acknowledge it exists

As proven again and again and again, the only thing that looks like Quebec language laws is the type of English-only legislation YOU are promoting, and you are right on one thing - we do not need it in Ontario.

That it knows its job, which is to determine the LEGALITY of a government action. The French Language Services Act has never, to my knowledge, being contested in court, for a very good reason... There is nothing in any provincial or federal law or in the Constitution that prevented the Legislative Assembly from passing it. As for the Ottawa by-law, people have gone to court arguing the same non-sense you serve us again and again (that it is discriminatory and beyong the powers of the City Council) and they have lost.

I don't get it - in the Treaudonian utopia called Multi-culturalism...why do the French culturalists get to take this elite exclutionary apporach to exerting their selfish nationalistic will? I really thought that multi-culturalism meant that ALL cultures have equal say - so maybe the time is right for Somolians or even Shrilankins have the full power to demand that their language is paramount and English and French are discriminatory. I smell a consitutional issue here that is slightly clouded by so-called equality that is obscured and lost in that rediculious utopian concept of total stagnant social equality. Find the smallest nation in the world with the most obscure lost language - grab an immigrant or two and bring them here and hire a lawyer that will demand that Dushadaponian be spoken in the legislature and in the courts - the electronics companies can make a fortune selling personal translators to EVERYBODY...ONE MUST HAVE AND ADHERE TO THE SAME REALITY - AND THE SAME MODE OF COMMUNICATION - ENGLISH! Or Bable will result...or maybe the tower is already fully built and it's to late - confusion causes the collapse of an empire - and we are falling.

[Leafless]

As proven again and again and again, the only thing that looks like Quebec language laws is the type of English-only legislation YOU are promoting, and you are right on one thing - we do not need it in Ontario.

Quebec language laws are so corrupt and discriminatory that these laws defy the imagination of any democratic society in the world.

What you are totally overlooking and ignoring is that these Quebec language laws are implemented by a minority and in the province of Ontario by an even smaller (tiny) French minority.

I support the notion that Ontario must react in defending the users of Canada's de-facto English language by having the premier of Ontario implement English as the official language of Ontario.

The French Language Services Act has never, to my knowledge, being contested in court, for a very good reason... There is nothing in any provincial or federal law or in the Constitution that prevented the Legislative Assembly from passing it.

That is because no one ever imagined, federally or provincially speaking, such laws would ever be imposed on an unsuspecting de-facto English speaking population of Canada.

As for the Ottawa by-law, people have gone to court arguing the same non-sense you serve us again and again (that it is discriminatory and beyong the powers of the City Council) and they have lost.

What else can one expect from the courts when the discriminatory Charter rules.

The Charter should be scrapped or rewritten to express the judgement of individual Canadian citizens by way of a national referendum.

Edited August 25, 2008 by Leafless

[Oleg Bach]

Quebec language laws are so corrupt and discriminatory that these laws defy the imagination of any democratic society in the world.

What you are totally overlooking and ignoring is that these Quebec language laws are implemented by a minority and in the province of Ontario by an even smaller (tiny) French minority.

I support the notion that Ontario must react in defending the users of Canada's de-facto English language by having the premier of Ontario implement English as the official language of Ontario.

That is because no one ever imagined, federally or provincially speaking, such laws would ever be imposed on an unsuspecting de-facto English speaking population of Canada.

What else can one expect from the courts when the discriminatory Charter rules.

The Charter should be scrapped or rewritten to express the judgement of individual Canadian citizens by way of a national referendum.

You have it wrong - the Charter does not rule - not once did I see the Charter adhered to properly in a court of law - there are intelligent provisions - but they are ignored. Not one judge wants to deal with a charter issue - they hate the charter...You are dreaming if you believe that the charter discriminates. If you are smart you can find protection in the charter -and when you find it - they shut you up and kick you out of court - so don't tell me that the charter is to blame.. we have a judicary that refuses because of policy to rule in black and white - right or wrong - it's moral neutrality that is the policy and this policy assists a few elite and the rest of us are suckers.

[Leafless]

You have it wrong - the Charter does not rule - not once did I see the Charter adhered to properly in a court of law - there are intelligent provisions - but they are ignored. Not one judge wants to deal with a charter issue - they hate the charter...You are dreaming if you believe that the charter discriminates. If you are smart you can find protection in the charter -and when you find it - they shut you up and kick you out of court - so don't tell me that the charter is to blame.. we have a judicary that refuses because of policy to rule in black and white - right or wrong - it's moral neutrality that is the policy and this policy assists a few elite and the rest of us are suckers.

The Charter rules relating to official languages of Canada which primarily focuses on the promotion of the French language and bilingualism.

Section 16-3 which reads, "Nothing in this Charter limits the authority of Parliament or a legislature to advance the equality of status or use of English and French."

The corrupt promotion of French and bilingualism has been abused and overplayed by the feds and French sympathizers within the ranks of provincial and municipal governments. The promotion of English relating to Section 16-3 is nonexistent and only serves as a Charter decoration.

The net result is that majority English speaking Canadians have become second class citizens especially in Quebec and Ontario where French minority language laws are prevalent.

[CANADIEN]

Quebec language laws are so corrupt and discriminatory that these laws defy the imagination of any democratic society in the world.

And YOU support adopting the same type of law in Ontario.

What you are totally overlooking and ignoring is that these Quebec language laws are implemented by a minority and in the province of Ontario by an even smaller (tiny) French minority.

The only one supporting implementing Quebec-style language laws on this thread is YOU.

I support the notion that Ontario must react in defending the users of Canada's de-facto English language by having the premier of Ontario implement English as the official language of Ontario.

Like the Quebec Legislature has done time and time again with French in Quebec.

[CANADIEN]

The Charter rules relating to official languages of Canada which primarily focuses on the promotion of the French language and bilingualism.

Section 16-3 which reads, "Nothing in this Charter limits the authority of Parliament or a legislature to advance the equality of status or use of English and French."

The corrupt promotion of French and bilingualism has been abused and overplayed by the feds and French sympathizers within the ranks of provincial and municipal governments. The promotion of English relating to Section 16-3 is nonexistent and only serves as a Charter decoration.

The net result is that majority English speaking Canadians have become second class citizens especially in Quebec and Ontario where French minority language laws are prevalent.

Less we forget...

Ontarians are forbidden to have English on their business signs, They are denied access to provincial or municipal services in English. There are limits to access to an education in English in Ontario.

Whatever.

[Leafless]

And YOU support adopting the same type of law in Ontario.

Absolutely.

The only one supporting implementing Quebec-style language laws on this thread is YOU.

You are improperly shifting the focus of Quebec style language laws on me rather than face the fact Quebec has been using them for years along with similar French language laws being implemented in the Charter and in provinces across the country, especially Ontario.

Like the Quebec Legislature has done time and time again with French in Quebec.

And provinces, cities and municipalities have DONE and ARE in the process of doing outside of Quebec.

If corrupt French language policies are going to discriminate and dictate a linguistic preference, then the English culture must defend its English language to counteract minority linguistic discrimination.

[CANADIEN]

Absolutely.

You are improperly shifting the focus of Quebec style language laws on me rather than face the fact Quebec has been using them for years along with similar French language laws being implemented in the Charter and in provinces across the country, especially Ontario.

And provinces, cities and municipalities have DONE and ARE in the process of doing outside of Quebec.

If corrupt French language policies are going to discriminate and dictate a linguistic preference, then the English culture must defend its English language to counteract minority linguistic discrimination.

There are NO Quebec-style language laws or by-laws in Ontario. But don't worry, nobody expects you to ever get it....

[Leafless]

There are NO Quebec-style language laws or by-laws in Ontario.

Well what then do we call Ottawa Ontario's bilingual policy, Ontario's French Language Services Act, municipal French sign laws and Federal Charter and government language policies?

All these policies were implemented without a federal, provincial or municipal referendum.

This makes these policies offensive and corrupt and discriminatory despite the opinions and rulings of minority French sympathizers.

But don't worry, nobody expects you to ever get it....

The opinion of a French propagandist and his lackeys, really means nothing.

What really matters is the opinion of majority English speaking Canadians whose voices have been excluded and nullified by a totalitarian government.

[CANADIEN]

Well what then do we call Ottawa Ontario's bilingual policy, Ontario's French Language Services Act, municipal French sign laws and Federal Charter and government language policies?

People who get call them laws and regulations that treat the English and French languages, as opposed to Quebec-style laws and regulations that treat one language and its speakers as having more rights than speakers of other languages. Now, who on this site is constantly promoting the second type of legislation and regulation? YOU.

All these policies were implemented without a federal, provincial or municipal referendum.

You still don't get how a representative democracy like ours works? You don't like those laws, run in an election on a program to have them changed.

This makes these policies offensive and corrupt and discriminatory despite the opinions and rulings of minority French sympathizers.

They are offensive to you, because they hurt your prejudiced feelings. They were voted on by elected bodies with the legal authority to vote them (or not), and since English and French are treated equally, the claim that anyone is being discriminated against is a joke, not even funny enough for the Just for Laughs Festival.

The opinion of a French propagandist and his lackeys, really means nothing.

For once we agree on something. The opinion of anyone who is French is irrelevant. When someone who is French, as opposed to a Canadian like me, write anything on this thread, let me know.

What really matters is the opinion of majority English speaking Canadians whose voices have been excluded and nullified by a totalitarian government.

Since there is no totalitarian government in Canada, I wonder what is that foreign totalitarian government that exercises so much power in our country?

[Leafless]

People who get call them laws and regulations that treat the English and French languages,

Whatever that is supposed to mean.

as opposed to Quebec-style laws and regulations that treat one language and its speakers as having more rights than speakers of other languages. Now, who on this site is constantly promoting the second type of legislation and regulation? YOU.

I certainly agree that the province of Ontario should make majority English the official language of Ontario rather than have 4% French language sympathizers dictate bilingual policies or sign laws or an abnormal amount of minority French services.

You still don't get how a representative democracy like ours works? You don't like those laws, run in an election on a program to have them changed.

I know how a representative democracy works.

I also know the current representative democracy is dysfunctional due to to many years of French minority PM's running Canada.

I also know there is NO LAW banning referendums in Canada and this is one of the major reasons our current system of representative government is corrupt.

They are offensive to you, because they hurt your prejudiced feelings. They were voted on by elected bodies with the legal authority to vote them (or not), and since English and French are treated equally, the claim that anyone is being discriminated against is a joke, not even funny enough for the Just for Laughs Festival.

It is not up to French propagandist and sympathizers to decide if English and French SHOULD be treated equally.

Federal, Provincial and municipal governments have a duty to represent users of the majority English language in Canada by way of referendums concerning any major questions relating the use of the minority language French in Canada.

Since there is no totalitarian government in Canada, I wonder what is that foreign totalitarian government that exercises so much power in our country?

Don't be ridiculous.

There are no democratic checks and balance in Canada and the PM wields the power of a KING.

[CANADIEN]

I certainly agree that the province of Ontario should make majority English the official language of Ontario rather than have 4% French language sympathizers dictate bilingual policies or sign laws or an abnormal amount of minority French services.

Thank you for reminding us that there are government services in Ontario that are available in French but not in English.

I know how a representative democracy works.

Yeah right. Every time things don't go your way, you whine that it doesn't work.

I also know the current representative democracy is dysfunctional due to to many years of French minority PM's running Canada.

Let me check ... Yep, those PMs were Canadians, and rhey were the leader of the party winning the most votes in elections all adult Canadian citizens were allowed to vote in I wonder how one could change that... passing a law denying Frenchies the right to vote or to run?

It is not up to French propagandist and sympathizers to decide if English and French SHOULD be treated equally.

It's up to the duly elected representatives of the population. And guess what, that's exactly who did it.

Federal, Provincial and municipal governments have a duty to represent (...)

(...) ALL Canadians, by respecting their rights and the Constitution.

Don't be ridiculous.

Don't worry. I'll let you keep your monopoly.

[Leafless]

Thank you for reminding us that there are government services in Ontario that are available in French but not in English.

Don't thank me.

Thank premiers like bilingual Dalton Mc.Guinty and French Quebec activist like Madeleine Meilleur who is now Social Services Minister for Francophone Affairs in majority English Ontario.

Small corrupt world, isn't it.

Yeah right. Every time things don't go your way, you whine that it doesn't work.

I said representative democracy is dysfunctional.

I have every right to complain since I cannot properly defend the English language due to non-existent English language policies in Quebec or any other province in all of Canada.

Let me check ... Yep, those PMs were Canadians,

Oh, so there is a way to differentiate between a Canadian and a separatist.

Please, tell me what it is?

and rhey were the leader of the party winning the most votes in elections all adult Canadian citizens were allowed to vote in

Sometimes lessons are learned the hard way.

I wonder how one could change that... passing a law denying Frenchies the right to vote or to run?

No denying that.

The federal government even allowed a separatist party to run in Quebec to act as a buffer party when Quebecers were dissatisfied with all other Canadian national federal parties.

And they call this a country.

It's up to the duly elected representatives of the population. And guess what, that's exactly who did it.

NOT REALLY.

It is apparent the name of the game is to suppress, oppress and discriminate against Canadian citizens with the majority language beginning with the letter 'E'.

(...) ALL Canadians, by respecting their rights and the Constitution.

Even provinces like Quebec who did NOT even sign the constitution and who had the nerve to implement a minority regional language as the official language of the province of Quebec.

Don't worry. I'll let you keep your monopoly.

Its not a monoply.

It is simply the freely chosen language by the vast majority of Canadians making the English language the de-facto language of Canada.

I know you have a hard time understanding the words 'freely chosen' and without any form of government intervention.

[CANADIEN]

Don't thank me.

Thank premiers like bilingual Dalton Mc.Guinty and French Quebec activist like Madeleine Meilleur who is now Social Services Minister for Francophone Affairs in majority English Ontario.

Small corrupt world, isn't it.

I insist. I have to thank YOU for not even getting it when I mock you. Unless of course you can provide actual PROOF there are municipal services offered by the City of Ottawa in French only and not English. Same with provincal services offered by the Government of Ontario.

I said representative democracy is dysfunctional.

And I said something everyone around here knows... You call it dysfunctional when you don't get your prejudiced way.

I have every right to complain since I cannot properly defend the English language due to non-existent English language policies in Quebec or any other province in all of Canada.

You have the right to complain, indeed. Like I have the right to complain that the education system doesn't acknowledge that the Earth is flat. The difference is that unlike you I know I would be complaining about something that doesn't exist.

Its not a monoply.

I was referring to the monopoly you exercise on being ridiculous.

I know you have a hard time understanding the words 'freely chosen' and without any form of government intervention.

This coming from the man who wants to use the government to prevent Ontarians from freely choosing to use languages other than English on commercial signs.

Edited September 1, 2008 by CANADIEN

[CANADIEN]

(Canadien)It's up to the duly elected representatives of the population. And guess what, that's exactly who did it.

NOT REALLY.

So... it is not the duly elected members of the Ontario Legislative Assembly who voted the French Language Services Act. It is not the duly elected members of Ottawa City Council who voted the city's blingual services policy? Whatever.

It is apparent the name of the game is to suppress, oppress and discriminate against Canadian citizens with the majority language beginning with the letter 'E'.

As apparent as the sun rising in the West every morning.

[CANADIEN]

Even provinces like Quebec who did NOT even sign the constitution and who had the nerve to implement a minority regional language as the official language of the province of Quebec.

This one merits a place aside from everything else you wrote. Those who get it know by now that I have no lost love for any piece of legislation that states "there is only one official language, and people will be forced by law to use it only, or at least to use it above any other language".

But think about the nerve... the government of a province giving an official recognition to the language used by 80% of its population. I suppose Quebec should declare English as its sole official language? :lol:

[Leafless]

But think about the nerve... the government of a province giving an official recognition to the language used by 80% of its population. I suppose Quebec should declare English as its sole official language?

That is the laughable point.

A minority such as Quebec with such obvious animosity towards the English language and its users, declares this foreign minority language official.

Plain troublemakers is the only way to describe this twisted province.

[Leafless]

I insist. I have to thank YOU for not even getting it when I mock you. Unless of course you can provide actual PROOF there are municipal services offered by the City of Ottawa in French only and not English. Same with provincial services offered by the Government of Ontario.

You still don't understand the meaning of the words 'traitor' and 'corrupt'.

And I said something everyone around here knows... You call it dysfunctional when you don't get your prejudiced way.

We all know who the bigots are who use corrupt language policies to get what they want.

Even the PM called parliament dysfunctional.

You have the right to complain, indeed. Like I have the right to complain that the education system doesn't acknowledge that the Earth is flat. The difference is that unlike you I know I would be complaining about something that doesn't exist.

Your right.

Currently, provincial English language policies don't exist.

This coming from the man who wants to use the government to prevent Ontarians from freely choosing to use languages other than English on commercial signs.

You are a card.

Anyone is free to use any language they wish on commercial signs, that is, without the use of forced government intervention to accomplish that feat.

But if French minorities choose to FORCE their minority language on signs via corrupt language policies, then I will react with advocating the province of Ontario protect the users of the de-facto English language by making the English language the official language of Ontario.

If you had any integrity you would be advocating that the users of the French language develop their own French jobs rather than prey on the majority English speaking Ontarians to forcibly drag them into your French minority problem under the guise of bilingualism.