Ottawa Urged To Adopt Bush's Guest Worker Plan

[Morgan]

How do you feel about this guest worker permit proposal?

-Are there not enough able-bodied Canadians or new immigrants who have settled in Canada to fill jobs in the construction sector?

-Does the Canadian gov't bureaucracy have a good track record for tracking immigrants? consider that 38,000 deportees are still AWOL in Canada.

-Are the medical/education/welfare costs that may be incurred due to use by guest workers still make such a proposal worthwhile?

Canada urged to follow U.S. moves on migrant permits CBC Jan.08/04

Canada should follow U.S. President George Bush as he moves toward granting legal status to migrant workers, says a representative of the construction industry.

The U.S. president told a gathering at the White House on Wednesday that he would like to grant temporary work permits to about eight million migrants working illegally in the United States.

"Certainly the president probably has other motives for having it happen," said Parsons. "But in terms of getting the legislation in Canada, I think it's a positive thing that the federal government should look at immediately,"

In the Toronto area, for example, the booming construction industry has complained about a chronic shortage of skilled workers and employs as many as 20,000 undocumented workers . Some of them spend years in the underground economy. Construction companies and unions have asked the Immigration Department to offer temporary work permits to help ease the problem.

Former immigration minister Denis Coderre said in November he would support a pilot project to grant permits to underground workers in Toronto. His replacement, Judy Sgro, is considering a proposal, which Parsons hopes will be a working project in the spring.

[KrustyKidd]

I have a few Al Queda friends that are interested at working as janitorial staff at the Chalk River Nuclear Facility up the road. They fly in every now and then for a few Jihads. I imagine that they might wish to take advantage of this. As well, some of the dirtier old men in the nighborhood have expressed some interest in using this as a means to have some twelve year old girlfriends flown in from Thailand.

Me, well I think it's real groovy, I hope the Liberals smoke enough weed to prepare them for this 'Monumental Step' in Human Rights Freedom.

[Morgan]

KrustyKidd said:

I have a few Al Queda friends that are interested at working as janitorial staff at the Chalk River Nuclear Facility up the road. They fly in every now and then for a few Jihads.

Very funny but here's an example of who might apply for a guest permit to do a construction job/jihad and what with the immigration department already admitting to losing track of 38,000 refugees who were to be deported, can you imagine them monitoring temporary guest workers to boot?

Cdn. refugee helped in Los Angeles Airport bomb plot ,Globe&Mail Jan.08/04

Ahcène Zemiri, the former Montrealer who has turned up in U.S. detention in Guantanamo Bay, was a close friend of convicted bomb plotter Ahmed Ressam and helped him with his attempt to blow up Los Angeles International Airport, court documents say.

The Algerian-born Mr. Zemiri, 36, has been held at the U.S. military base since he was taken prisoner in Afghanistan on Dec. 15, 2001. News of his detention was revealed this week after his wife gave an interview to a website supporting the prisoners.

In court testimony, Mr. Ressam said Mr. Zemiri helped him in the bomb plot, giving him $3,500 and offering a video camera to carry as "camouflage." Mr. Ressam also said he asked Mr. Zemiri to find him a pistol, silencer and grenades."He was aware you were about to commit a terrorist act on United States soil, correct?" Mr. Ressam was asked in a U.S. court in 2001."Yes, he knew that I was going to America to carry out a job," Mr. Ressam replied.Mr. Ressam, who had trained in an al-Qaeda camp in Afghanistan, also replied in the affirmative when asked whether Mr. Zemiri had been involved in "jihad activities."

Well before his capture, Mr. Zemiri had been an object of interest to anti-terrorist authorities.His name came up in a 1999 probe in Montreal by two French judges who travelled to Canada to investigate people suspected of terrorist ties. The Canadian Security Intelligence Service questioned Algerian-born Montrealers about Mr. Zemiri in July, 2001.

Mr. Zemiri lived in Canada from 1994 until he and his wife went to Afghanistan in 2001, purportedly to help Afghan civilians. His application for refugee status was rejected in 1996, but a moratorium was placed on deportations to Algeria, starting in 1997.Canadian sources said Mr. Zemiri was deemed a security risk while he lived in Canada -- a suspicion that thwarted his attempts at residency.Yet there appear to have been no attempts to arrest or remove him -- likely so intelligence agents could track his movements and associations.

[Neal.F.]

My wife is an immigrant. she came to Canada after following to the letter all immigration procedures and getting her working permits, landed immigrant status and later citizenship the honest way.

To have people here illegally get an amnesty, and jump ahead in the queue ahead of those who followed legal procedure is an obscenity, and a slap in the face.

[Michael Hardner]

So do you guys actually DISAGREE with Bush on this one ?

I don't have strong feelings one way or the other myself. I can see the reasons for it, but it seems to send a mixed message with the security concerns out there now.

[Neal.F.]

Not only disagree with him, but very strongly as well.

However, politically, it is a stroke of genius for Bush. He gets a nice chunk of the hispanic vote, and while angering conservtives,....well... where else can they go? Certainly not Howard Dean or (worse!) Wesley Clark!

The country will pay a severe price for this later. Tell me why any immigrant would want to jump through all the hoops to come in legally now?

Actually there is one thing that could foil a Bush re-election on this point.... a Pat Buchanan run under a 3d party banner. Buchanan, in retrospect, is starting to sound like a prophet.

[Michael Hardner]

Buchanan, in retrospect, is starting to sound like a prophet.

Pat has a corner on all the usual conservative policies, plus he's anti-Globalization, right ?

But has he said that he'll run again ?

[Neal.F.]

On the anti-globalization issue, he's SPOT ON.

He has not announced his intention to run again. yet.

But a few more reckless moves by Bush such as this one, and he may find men bearing gifts knocking on his door.... and a constituency.

But even he might decide to hold his nose and sit this one out if the Dumbocruds nominate anyone but Gephardt or Lieberman. It would be irresponsible to do anything to facilitate either a Wesley Clark or Howard Dean victory.

[Morgan]

Michael and Neal,

1. There's a discussion thread about Bush's immigration "reform" proposal and how it may affect his re-election under US Politics section. Within that thread I have posted some article links and will be posting more as this reform plan is getting alot of discussion and press in the US.

Keep in mind that guest worker plans have been tried in Europe and for the most part have been a disaster and have contributed to considerable social and economic problems in the long run.

What's even worse for the US trying to implement a guest worker program is that in the USA, unlike most Europeon countries, birthright citizenship is enshrined in the US constitution.So even if a guest worker and spouse are Mexican nationals, as soon as they have a baby in the US, that baby is a US citizen. Bingo.

Subsequently, even if the work dries up for the Mexican worker and spouse in the US, they can stay in the USA forever and get free welfare, medical, educational benefits because of their US citizen child. That's exactly what has happened in California and that's what has contributed to the budget crisis there. Bush can issue 3 year renewable guest worker permits to his heart's content, but as soon as bambino is in the picture, guest worker permit cannot be enforced. Who is going to take care of the American citizen minor in the USA if Mom and Pop are deported????

Bush needs to pass a constitutional amendent through Congress that curtails birth right citizenship, which the Democrats would fight tooth and nail against passing. Bush is saying guest workers are not eligible for citizenship, but what he is not saying is that children of guest workers born in the USA are eligible for citizenship...and there's the rub...

2. Bush only got 30% of the Hispanic vote in 2000. Hispanics traditionally represent a solid voting bloc for the Democrats as well as undervoting at elections. So he'd need to get alot of Hispanic voters to make up for the potential loss of his conservative voters.

3. Here's an article from the National Post that addresses the mess that already exists in the Cdn Refugee system. Do we need to add "guest workers" into the mix?

Canada needs to reform its Refugee system Jan.07/04

4. Neal, I can appreciate how frustrating it must be for your wife to see how disrespectfully some people treat Canadian citizenship and the process that's required, if you are one who always does "the right thing" in life.