charter.rights

Six Nations of the Grand only received about $1600 per person per capita. The $6 billion is the total amount of transfers to ALL First Nations in Canada. Once it is divided up it still only comes to about $1600 pert person. Try reading the whole thread past Slims first comment. I've presented all the numbers that verify the $1600.

Wrong again. The split was really those against colonialism and the teaching of the Code of Handsome Lake (an attempt to integrate Christianity into a Native belief system), which Brant adhered to. The rejection of Brant was as a symbol of all he stood for - assimilation into colonial ways etc. Brant was admired by the British because being British educated and with a command of the English language, he broke the stereotypical image of "Indians". However, he was not well like within the Confederacy. It is well documented both in written history and oral that Brant was nothing more than Pine Tree - still an esteemed position but nonetheless he violated the Great Law and was sanctioned for it. Six Nations honours many of their citizens for various achievements. It wouldn't be unusual to have your portrait painted. Tom Longboat is one example of being idolized not only by Six Nations but other First Nations as well Dr. Oronhyatekha. They painted both of their portraits and neither one was a Chief - not even a Pine Tree Chief. Brant was raised up as Pine Tree because he spoke good English and knew the ways the British thought. He was used to give Six Nations an advantage in negotiations, but when he and John Deseronto got caught with their hand in the till.....so to speak......they quickly silenced him and he lost all confidence of the Confederacy.

When Brant was deposed, it split Six Nation loyalties down the middle. Those who followed Brant became known as the lower Mohawk and those who did not became the Upper Mohawk. On Six Nations reserve today the two faction still exist. However, Brant's /colonial's supporters only represent about 5% of the total population. The inscription was wrong. He was never a "principle chief and only ever a Pine Tree that was silenced.

The words of the Royaner are saying that Brant was deposed because they could no longer trust him. You had better go back and read it again sunshine. It says exactly what I told you it says. Brant was silenced and had no authority. Brethren. It is (erst?) a few words that we, the Six Nations, wish to inform at this time, it is what have been saying at our fireplace in Buffalo Creek. As it is customary for the Six Nations to call Councils for the misconduct of chiefs so as to have all faults related here before such councils, we have learned from information that Captain Brant has not conducted himself to the satisfaction of the Six Nations and according to our Indian customs he is no more a chief. And we the Six Nations all of us agree is no longer to be noticed as a chief in the Six Nations. The following are the names of the principle chiefs in the Six Nations. All Brant was, was a "Pine Tree Chief" brought in to translate for the Confederacy Chiefs and advise on certain dealings with the British. He had no authority, just as other Pine Tree Chiefs had no authority outside of their specific duties. From the Great Law of Peace - The Iroquois Constitution: Election of Pine Tree Chiefs 35. Should any man of the Nation assist with special ability or show great interest in the affairs of the Nation, if he proves himself wise, honest and worthy of confidence, the Confederate Lords may elect him to a seat with them and he may sit in the Confederate Council. He shall be proclaimed a 'Pine Tree sprung up for the Nation' and shall be installed as such at the next assembly for the installation of Lords. Should he ever do anything contrary to the rules of the Great Peace, he may not be deposed from office -- no one shall cut him down -- but thereafter everyone shall be deaf to his voice and his advice. Should he resign his seat and title no one shall prevent him. A Pine Tree chief has no authority to name a successor nor is his title hereditary. When Brant took exile, he had effectively resigned his seat.

Nope. It never happened. The Royal Proclamation forbade it. None of those guys could own Six Nations land because it never passed to the Crown first. Too bad you lose this one and the next. Nope. Brant was deposed shortly after they arrived. Leases are not sales. So you might want to backtrack a bit. Since Six Nations arrived they complained to the British about removing squatters from their lands. All those "sales" are bogus.

Brant had no authority to do what he did. He made a few unauthorized leases but after that he was stopped and booted out. However, the British used him to try to manipulate Six Nations. There are reams of letters and memos between the Confederacy and the British that not only make it clear Brant had no authority but that there were not going to be manipulated by the British. There is clear evidence that the British stole lands without the Confederacy's or the people's consent. According to all the legal documentation, the lands under claim BELONG to Six Nations and were never ceded. Brant did not screw them out of anything. They hold legal claim and jurisdiction over the entire Haldimand Tract, as well as all of sourthern Ontario south of the Ottawa River. Your ignorance is mounting...Six Nations NEVER lost a war against anyone. However, the British, your ancestors lost quite a few. If not for Six Nations we would probably be speaking Amarrican right now. It is nice to see you would like a resolution. You can't give away the farm, because you don't own it in the first place. Six Nations does if you live in southern Ontario. That's all there is to it.

Good catch. It shows you have been doing your homework. But alas it is irrelevent and you obviously didn't read the whole article - especially the first part.... Brant was NOT as I said, a Royaner (a condoled Chief). He was what was known as a "Pine Tree Chief" who was raised up to do only certain tasks and had no authority at the Confederacy Council except as an adviser on certain matters. Royaner hold their title for life and cannot have their title removed in until at the brink of death (no one will die with title). The act of deposing Brant as a Pine Tree Chief was not really permitted but once he had exhausted his usefulness they chose to silence his voice and never call him chief again from that point onward. From the same site: A Pine Tree Chief has no authority to name a successor nor is his title hereditary. His sole responsibility was to translate. The British and their marionette, Brant, illegally sold and signed away large tracts of Mohawk land in New York State and Ontario. He and the British knew full well he had no authority to do this. Therefore, all his transactions were and are fraudulent. Do try to read and comprehend a little more before you try to make a point. What you have proven is that you really don't understand the point you were trying to make. But thanks for the laugh, anyway.....

Definition of a "redneck": One who looks at road kill and says "Mmmmm Lunch!"

Or perhaps you are too sensitive, drawing an accusation of generalization from a specific case. But if YOU want to paint all white people from one incident as indicative then perhaps it is your own guilt you need to deal with.

No doubt a northern hick born in the oil sands where your mother and father are also your aunt and uncle? Get a dictionary so you can learn how to spell. That way we might know what you are trying to say. Intelligence isn't your strong suit , now is it....?

Perhaps not x-ray glasses but a camera for sure.... But then again, that is reality not the fantasy you live under.

See the discussion here. Then follow the math - the example of Six Nations. And they are one of the largest and more affluent reserves in Canada. See AFN Nation Chief Phil Fountaine's speech and look for "Child Welfare Crisis".

Native bands are thrust into third party management for as little as failing to submit all that paperwork INAC doesn't look at. Your perceptions still are not accurate even thought there may be some differences in the people populating the reserves. That fact is that the government continues to undermine First Nations and I'l bet a dime to a dollar that the government has some hand in the venture failures. You see they don't want native to get ahead, nor it seems do you. BTW I have a dutch client but that does not give me a clue at what happens in Holland from my dealings with him. Your trophy native partner is of no importance to this discussion.

You view is warped by the mass conditioning and myths perpetrated by colonialism and likely by your parents who were also subjects of the backward thinking. If you had half as much ambition as the native people I work with, you might be able to earn six figures too. But alas you don't and you would rather complain about native people then to get your hands dirty working beside them. Poverty isn't an issue on the many of the reserves I deal with since they are tobacco manufactures with hundreds of millions to spend on SUVs and cottages. If only you had it so good!

The reality is that despite an air of tolerance and multiculturalism, Canadians still have an underlying prejudice. This becomes evident not only during protests and when legal issues concerning people of colour in the news but also when the white Anglo Saxon male wants a scapegoat to bitch about. You needn't worry about racists that try to provoke native people in public because a little bit of truth and information quickly shows them for the assholes they truly are. No, you really need to worry about the closet bigots (like some who come out of the closet here from time to time) because they are the ones that are apt to influence public policy or silently undercut someone because of their skin colour, their gender or their religion in an employment situation. When people like that show up they need to be confronted immediately because ignorance cannot defend against truth.

Are you suggesting that "massive majority" in like the CPC's control of parliament? Or as in popular vote? Or perhaps you mean as in popular public opinion, which is non-existent. People do reject racism in any form BUT the majority of people in Canada are left of centre politically. Your right wing minority opinion really doesn't have the substance to depend on anything more but rhetoric and myth.

Hey sunshine. Nice ad hominem. Too bad you can't debate the real subject. But hey being wrong must really chink your ego.

Is it how they say.... "ignorance is bliss"? Six Nations has documents and letters that go back to prior to the resettlement that challenge Brant's dealings with the British. When they arrived at the Grand River location the Mohawks had it out with him and divided the settlement almost in two. Thus since that time we have what were known as the Upper Mohawk and the Lower Mohawk (who supported Brant) at Six Nations. Brant was not a condoled Royaner (or chief) and only Royaner could speak on behalf of the nation. That is what irritated som many people there. Six Nations had been in the area long before first contact. In fact their territory extended to the Ottawa River, Nipissing, west side of Lake Huron, into Michigan and Ohio, New York and Quebec long before the British entered the area to displace the French. (Mitchell Map 1757). In 1702 they offered the British access to Michigan and parts or the Ohio valley under the Nanfan Treaty 1702 in exchange for continued right to hunt and fish there unmolested. So let's get serious here. Six Nations were not visitors or immigrants as they had always been located along the north shores of Erie, Ontario and the St Lawrence, as well as New York (and Ohio when the Cat Nation was incorporated)...at least over a thousand years or so. North shore archeology confirms it. Like I said you really should read a book. Too many comic books really don't give an accurate historical concept and most of what you hear amongst your xenophobic friends really doesn't count as fact.

Wrong again! There are plenty of workers - even cheap labour. The problem for their businesses as well as our own is cash flow. When you need a piece of equipment and you have to rent it instead of being able to buy it, it will crunch you cash flow. The thing is that my six figure income generates millions of dollars in revenue. It is hardly obscene given that fact that CEOs and CFOs of major corporations tke home millions for sitting on their asses. And when the economic development does take off it won't be stopped by the banks or the government. Locking in that kind of revenue will boost the economy forever. (BTW most of the money I do earn comes from non-natives living close to the reserves. They invest in what we are doing because it benefits them in the long run. Howmuch do you think the average INAC employee earns sunshine?

Fact: 1) No he wasn't. He was not authorized by the Confederacy Council to do anything other than talk with the British. 2) No he wasn't. He leased many lots without authorization of the Confederacy Council. The British tried to snooker him into selling but never approached the community as was required under the Haldimand Proclamation 3) His position was under constant challenge. His son even attempted to murder him because he would not stop trying to take control of Six Nations. 4) The Confederacy Council sent memos and letters to the Crown disputing Brant's actions. On many occasions those letters demanded that the Crown stop dealing with him. 5) No it isn't. Taking an lease and then applying for a quit claim was illegal then and is illegal now. Go read a book or something Gawd! Where do you come up with this misinformation?

Back to reality. You do realize that only $1600 per person per year gets transferred to the reserve for all band administration, social, education and health needs? If you can manufacture corruption from that then I invite you to walk on my pond. $1600 x 500 people. Not very much once you deduct salaries, and overhead from all of that. The only reason it appears there is disproportion is that some of those people are working for the band earning a below poverty level wage and have some disposable cash to spend on things while the remainder do not. There is very little corruption generally that takes place and because they are so heavily audited it is unlikely they go more than a year before getting caught. I work on reserves, dummy. I consult with native people every day and earn a 6 figure income from promoting and implementing native economic development. I have daily business with a number of band governments and am involved in helping them start up their own financial institutions. I also work with an aboriginal capital corporation finding ways to invest in aboriginal investment, away from the federal government. You don't know what you are talking about when it comes to the realities of reserve life or the people who inhabit them. As far as the stuff referenced on the INAC website, it may look impressive to see all those agencies using monies slated for natives. You realize that some of those agencies suck money from the $8 billion a year INAC budget.....As well, most of those agencies have the same criteria as banks and capital is not available unless natives have a credit rating and collateral. As for Aboriginal Business Canada, it once provided a reasonable source for capital but has little money left for small business. Mostly the money from ABC goes towards band projects that do little for local employment but get spent in neighbouring communities. Bank programs listed on that site require the band to underwrite all mortgages and loan 100%, which means any free money within the band system gets frozen until all mortgages and loans are paid. There is absolutely no risk to any bank and the underwriting precludes the band being able to generate its own housing industry, or economic development. CMHC once held mortgages on reserve but they put some many reserves in an endless debt that they will be paying for the next 100 years and still not make a dent in it. Land on reserve is held in common and should never be titled. The reason the Tories want to create a title system is so they can steal it by forcing natives to sell their lands. It has nothing to do with helping natives and has everything to do with advancing the colonialism and assimilation process. However, my native business friends have devised a way where they can lend money and secure the loan directly from the client. INAC tried to stand in the way of that at one point but a threat of a lawsuit by some renowned lawyers made them rethink their position. That at least is one hurdle out of our way. So I suggest that you go back to your friends and talk to them directly about what we are discussing, instead of assuming you know what their lives are all about. The reality is that you don't know beans about the problems, or the solutions and you need to spend a whole lot more time listening than spouting off that you hold the answers.

Can you believe that Canada lies to the UN about our record in poverty, aboriginal rights and justice?

Oh I live in the real world. Mostly people like you don't really see what is going on in it.

When was the last time you discussed the poor financing of native services with your MP and MPP? And when was the last time you attended a rally to protest the injustices native people are still suffering today? You could easily answer your own question if you simply started to get involved. "We have tried self government...... WE'VE done nothing of the sort. We have IMPOSED a government system modeled after our own and told them they could run it as long as they don't change the way they do things. That system - our system - is full of corruption and is ineffective. Economic development is occurring in many reserves in spite of the government. Only the government constantly interferes and tries to undermine the ventures because money = power and they are afraid that with more money natives will hold more power and start to question the actions of a corrupt and oppressive government. The government is still engaged in colonialism and assimilation. Only there have a lot of complicated policies that hide the fact. You do realize that native people cannot access the capital that we have access to in order to start and run businesses? The government prohibits the use of land as collateral, and income on reserve is not considered "income" for credit purpose. Thus you can't have viable economic development unless you have businesses and you can't have businesses unless you have working capital for equipment and buildings. You also realize that there are more native children in foster care today than all of those that attended residential schools in a one year period? 27,000 native children have been removed from their families on reserved and trek away to our towns and cities as foster children. 27,000! All that and they underfund child and family services on reserve by over 70%. And did you know what the number one reason that native children are removed form their homes? It isn't abuse. It isn't neglect. It isn't because their homes are unsafe. IT IS for poverty! We underfund their reserves. We underfund their education. We underfund their social services. And then we steal their children! All in the hope of making them like us. So what would you do if you were abused by the state, oppressed and had your children subjected to cultural genocide, all the while ignorant vitriolic people blaming you for your own lot in life. Years ago, natives couldn't even hire a lawyer to fight a land rights issue. Today the government simply ties up any claims or complaints in court or in INAC for decades until they give up or run out of money. So the youth of today are taking to the streets instead and taking back stolen lands, and preventing anyone from going any further with development on their land. What is the government's response to that? They jail the Chiefs and leaders of these movements and make political prisoners out of them to protect the illegal actions of the corporations who ignore treaty and aboriginal rights. All in the face of the Supreme Court ruling that says WE must consult natives and accommodate their interests BEFORE we start exploring or developing their land. We ignore the law and then arrest them for trying to uphold it..... Where were you when all of this was going on? Living 3km from a reserve you say? My bet is you have ignored what is going on there because you figure it isn't your problem...right?

There IS personal responsibility. But there is also communal responsibility in native communities. Those deaths did not happen in a vacuum. Alcoholism and substance abuse has a whole list of co-dependents, enablers and those who ignore what is going on. Those things in themselves are causal contributors. In any society, we are all responsible for the attitudes promoted and protected within the society. If we don't like those attitudes then we have to change ours BEFORE we can insist on changing others. Your attitude makes me worry about your own children and those in your community. Growing up without you taking responsibility for correcting the way they act in society makes me shutter.