Netherlands

Actually a lot of Liberal MPs were actively working to improve the gas tax funding to municipalities and assist public transit. I live in the Greater Toronto Area, and I am very happy to see this support coming through.

THat's so sad for Canada, no wonder our society is doomed to failure. Outright theft along with, lying and corruption are the order of the day in every Provincial Legislature, the House of Commons, and even at the municipal level. Little wonder that our population is so apathetic and many do not even bother to vote anymore at election-time, why bother? Last I checked there is no spot on the ballot for "None of the above." Maybe it's time we got back to the basics, and make it possible for ordinary hard-working Canadians to take a run at politics, instead of a bunch of corrupt lawyers, and business people. Right now the ordinary person does not have the financial means to participate even at the municipal level, especially in the urban centres. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> I always think that is foolish to say that people and society are more corrupt/evil because they are not as religious as they once were. That implies that if you are not religious that you are ammoral or immoral, a statement that I don't think is true. Just as an example, let us look at Canadian politics in the 19th century, a time that I think everyone here would agree was more religious (practically the entire population was Christian, and church attendance was considerably higher than todays). Yet politicians were far more corrupt than they are now - our first PM John A. Macdonald routinely used pork-barrel politics, promoted his friends to high office (like judges) and had to resign when the public learned of a massive funding scandal (the CPR was secretly funnelling huge amounts of money into the Tories election campaigns in return for deals on their railroad contracts). Every election during that period had problems with falsified voters lists, illegal voters, intimidation tactics and other dirty tricks. At the same time, these politicians were considered to be God-fearing men. Yet they committed acts that they knew were unethical and illegal. Nor did they seem particularly ashamed or sorry for their actions. The point is that considering oneself religious does not guarantee that the person is also a good, upstanding citizen.

Grits, Tories continue to spar over tapes TERRY WEBER 396 words 10 June 2005 The Globe and Mail (Breaking News) Sparring over the authenticity of tapes that the Conservatives say prove the government was trying to buy votes ahead of last month's crucial confidence vote continued Friday in Ottawa, with the Conservatives insisting new tests show no evidence of tampering. But the Liberals – responding to the latest suggestions in the House of Commons – dismissed calls for Tim Murphy, chief of staff for Prime Minister Paul Martin, to step aside. They insisted that a series of earlier tests clearly showed evidence that the tapes had been altered. “I wonder how these members subscribe to the theory of pristine tapes when five independent experts, not partisan experts, Mr. Speaker, but independent experts have testified that these tapes have been altered, doctored and spliced and sliced,” Liberal Deputy House Leader Mauril Bélanger said. “So to ask for anybody to step aside on the basis of such tapes is ludicrous.” Earlier, Conservative Deputy House Leader Jason Kenny released a letter from Ottawa audio editor Randy Dash that the Conservatives said counters earlier claims that tapes secretly recorded by B.C. Conservative MP Gurmant Grewal were altered. In the letter, Mr. Dash said that on the original recordings made by Mr. Grewal, three of the four clips are “clean and unaltered,” and that while a fourth contains several unusual noises, he cannot conclude that it was edited. Several other audio experts, however, have concluded that the tapes initially posted on a website by Conservatives were altered. “It's time they updated their talking points,” Ontario Conservative MP Jeff Watson charged during Friday's session in the House. “A leading audio expert has confirmed that the full recordings are clean and unedited. What isn't clean, Mr. Speaker, is this Prime Minister's right-hand man, Tim Murphy.” Mr. Grewal has accused the government of offering him and his MP wife Nina Grewal cabinet postings and other positions in exchange for their support in last month's crucial confidence vote. Mr. Grewal secretly recorded talks he had with both Mr. Murphy and Health Minister Ujjal Dosanjh. The government has said that Mr. Grewal approached the Liberals and demanded he and his wife be given positions in exchange for their votes, a proposition that the Liberals say was immediately rejected. Mr. Grewal has since gone on stress leave. Globe and Mail Update

The two Grewal ridings would certainly be lost if the couple decides to run again. Since the Conservatives have allowed for the sitting MPs to go uncontested for their nomination, these two would have to resign before any election.

Do people here think that recent news about Christian conservative influence gaining in the Conservative Party is also playing a part in the decreasing support for the Tories? All the news about this is being overshadowed by the Grewal Affair, but I can see it being a bigger issue as time goes on. A few articles/opinion pieces that I have read over the last few months have talked about that image that Stephen Harper has presented of himself - angry and bitter - which is something that turns voters off.

A lot of people always seem to question polls, especially if they disagree with them, but polling is a well-established science that is nearly always correct. Political parties always conduct their own polling too, and they really do pay attention to what polls say. If polling were so innacuate, than why do so many businesses and groups choose to use them? To me, this latest poll just confirms recent trends which show the Liberals and NDP rising, and the Tories falling. Nothing rogue about it. Here is the Decima report on their latest poll: http://www.decima.com/en/pdf/news_releases/050526E.pdf

Look at the name of the website for the survey....365gay.com, think that would be a biased survey???? The other surveys are off topic, kinda like the Quebec referendum in 95'. They need a direct question!!! I find that website offensive!! If I started a website call 365straightwhiteenglishmale.com, think I would get any grief? It is a double standard society and the straight, white, english speaking man from Alberta will soon be extinct! <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Please remember that it was not this website that conducted the survey, but the Leger Marketing group. Leger is well respected and used by hundreds of different organizations and media groups. It looks as if they were commissioned to do this poll by a pro SSM group, but you can be pretty certain that Leger conducted the poll in a straightforward manner consistent with standard polling practices. You may have noticed that I gave three links to articles discussing this poll. The other two were CTV and Global News, both of which are major media organizations in Canada. I added them in so that it can help confirm that the numbers given by 365gay.com are accurate. In fact, it seems to me that the 365gay.com news item is just a rewrite of what is probably a Canadian Press story. If you really want, I could see if mainstream newspapers also ran this piece if you need more confirmation that these were accurate figures.

There was a recent Leger survey, and here are three news reports about it: From: http://www.365gay.com/newscon05/06/060205canadaMarry.htm Survey shows dichotomy of attitude towards homosexuality A Léger Marketing survey carried out Canada-wide for Fondation Émergence for the National Day Against Homophobia revealed a dichotomy: 49% of Canadians still believe that homosexuality is an “abnormal condition”, yet despite this belief, 66%, or two-thirds, stated that they are “comfortable” with homosexuality. The survey looked at the evolution of attitudes towards the gay community. 24% believe that attitudes in the past five years have become more positive while 11% feel that they have become worse. 66% said that there was no change. While earlier polls examined a respondent’s attitudes toward same sex marriage as a general concept, the current survey asked how individuals would feel about the issue if it involved a close family member. 57% said they would be supportive of the union while 35% indicated opposition. Previous polls have that have tracked attitudes towards same-sex marriage as a broad concept show a slight majority of 51%-52% being in favour. 28% in the Léger survey revealed that they would not attend a same-sex wedding even if they were invited. The survey was conducted May 3 - 11 and involved 1,507 respondents. The margin of error is 2.6% 19 times out of twenty. 2005-06-06 09:54:33 From: http://www.angus-reid.com/polls/index.cfm?...tem&itemID=7491 Many Canadians Would Show Up at Gay Weddings (Angus Reid Global Scan) – Many adults in Canada would have no problem attending a same-sex marriage ceremony, according to a poll by Leger Marketing. 63 per cent of respondents would show up for a gay wedding, while 28 per cent would refuse the invitation. From: http://www.ctv.ca/servlet/ArticleNews/stor...060/?hub=Canada Meanwhile, a new Leger Marketing poll says 49 per cent of Canadians believe homosexuality is "abnormal." "People ask us if we really need to stage a parade any more, and with these answers, obviously we still do," said Christopher DiRaddo, a spokesman for Montreal's gay pride parade's organizers. "Results like these are the reason gay and lesbian organizations still have work to do," he said. If they were invited to a gay wedding, 28 per cent of respondents said they'd refuse to attend. In Quebec, 77 per cent of respondents said they would go, compared to 63 per cent in the rest of the country. The survey, conducted May 3-11, interviewed 1,507 Canadian adults. It is considered accurate within 2.6 percentage points, 19 times out of 20.

I think this development is the beginning of the end for Grewal. It is becoming clearer and clearer to me that this MP has been overrated in the intelligence department. If this news report is confirmed, more questions will be raised it is hard to imagine that the Conservatives will want him to remain. http://www.theglobeandmail.com/servlet/sto...Story/National/ Tory Grewal in Airport Package Mystery Monday, June 6, 2005 Updated at 4:05 PM EDT Canadian Press Ottawa — Air Canada is investigating an incident at Vancouver airport involving a Tory MP embroiled in a taping scandal. Gurmant Grewal was spotted in a waiting area Saturday trying to get passengers to transport a package to Ottawa. Airport sources won't confirm if there was a tape in the envelope the B.C. MP was trying to pass along. “We can confirm that we are currently investigating an incident involving Mr. Grewal,” said Air Canada spokeswoman Laura Cooke. “I have no additional information to provide on this matter at this point.” Security regulations require any passenger must be on a plane carrying that person's luggage. A source says Mr. Grewal was booked on a flight to Ottawa and passed through security to a waiting area, where he was overheard asking “a number of” passengers to transport the package. Mr. Grewal turned over tapes last week to the RCMP from secret recordings he made in meetings with two top Liberals. Several audio experts have agreed the tapes were altered, prompting the Conservatives to issue a statement admitting that small changes had been made to the recordings. On the tapes, Mr. Grewal is overheard negotiating possible job opportunities with the Liberal party in exchange for his vote in a crucial confidence showdown last month. Conservative spokesman Geoff Norquay said he was aware of Air Canada's allegation against Mr. Grewal and planned to make a statement later Monday. Mr. Grewal did not respond to an e-mail request for an interview.