Land and Sea

[margrace]

Interesting show on Land and Sea yesterday. A small town in Newfoundland that lost its fish plant work when the fisheries collapsed motors on.

36 of the local men work 3 to 4 months a year doing sismic? jobs in Alberta. The work runs in the winter months. The pay is 10 to 12 dollars an hour but they apparently work 12 hours a day 7 days a week while they are there. It is all outside work.

They spend the rest of the year at home in Newfoundland with their families.

When interviewed the company manager said that they were hired because they were good workers and knew how to do hard work. He also said that Albertans would not work part time like that.

They collect unemployment and are rehired each year. Works out great for them all.

[geoffrey]

Collect unemployment that the rest of us pay for them.

EI holidays need to end, it's a huge hinderance to Canada's productivity, not to mention fairness.

[B. Max]

Interesting show on Land and Sea yesterday. A small town in Newfoundland that lost its fish plant work when the fisheries collapsed motors on.

36 of the local men work 3 to 4 months a year doing sismic? jobs in Alberta. The work runs in the winter months. The pay is 10 to 12 dollars an hour but they apparently work 12 hours a day 7 days a week while they are there. It is all outside work.

They spend the rest of the year at home in Newfoundland with their families.

When interviewed the company manager said that they were hired because they were good workers and knew how to do hard work. He also said that Albertans would not work part time like that.

They collect unemployment and are rehired each year. Works out great for them all.

Ten to twelve dollars an hour. That is the reason Albertans don't do it. You can get around fifteen an hour working in Mcdonalds. Pipe line work pays better than that.

[margrace]

Collect unemployment that the rest of us pay for them.

EI holidays need to end, it's a huge hinderance to Canada's productivity, not to mention fairness.

They also pay into the unemployment, what would you suggest these people do. The only job there was the fish plant and it is closed. They would not qualify for unemployment if they could not get a job.

[scribblet]

Collect unemployment that the rest of us pay for them.

EI holidays need to end, it's a huge hinderance to Canada's productivity, not to mention fairness.

I thought the Liberals allready curtailed that a while ago, there were big changes to EI, one of the reasons for the big surplus.

[margrace]

Collect unemployment that the rest of us pay for them.

EI holidays need to end, it's a huge hinderance to Canada's productivity, not to mention fairness.

They also pay into the unemployment, what would you suggest these people do. The only job there was the fish plant and it is closed. They would not qualify for unemployment if they could not get a job.

Would you rather have these people living off welfare? There is no affordable housing in Alberta so what should they do? I know because I have family working in the oil patch from BC

[geoffrey]

Collect unemployment that the rest of us pay for them.

EI holidays need to end, it's a huge hinderance to Canada's productivity, not to mention fairness.

They also pay into the unemployment, what would you suggest these people do. The only job there was the fish plant and it is closed. They would not qualify for unemployment if they could not get a job.

Would you rather have these people living off welfare? There is no affordable housing in Alberta so what should they do? I know because I have family working in the oil patch from BC

I have an affordable house? I have many university friends making half my income (less than those workers) and their getting by. I think people need to take a quick step down from their high horse and deal with some less than ideal conditions for awhile to get ahead.

So your telling me that it's fair that these guys only work a few months a year, collect EI the rest, while I work the full year and pay for them the rest of the year. You just don't get it. EI holidays are the biggest threat to our productivity as a nation.

EI money should have to be paid back in full.

[margrace]

Collect unemployment that the rest of us pay for them.

EI holidays need to end, it's a huge hinderance to Canada's productivity, not to mention fairness.

They also pay into the unemployment, what would you suggest these people do. The only job there was the fish plant and it is closed. They would not qualify for unemployment if they could not get a job.

Would you rather have these people living off welfare? There is no affordable housing in Alberta so what should they do? I know because I have family working in the oil patch from BC

I have an affordable house? I have many university friends making half my income (less than those workers) and their getting by. I think people need to take a quick step down from their high horse and deal with some less than ideal conditions for awhile to get ahead.

So your telling me that it's fair that these guys only work a few months a year, collect EI the rest, while I work the full year and pay for them the rest of the year. You just don't get it. EI holidays are the biggest threat to our productivity as a nation.

EI money should have to be paid back in full.

Now if you lived in Newfoundland, had lived there for hundreds of years and your job collapsed how would you deal with it? So you have an affordable house really. There are no houses available in the oil patch so what are you really suggesting that these people do. Your house in Newfoundland is worth nothing because there are no jobs, so how would you go to Alberta and where would you live? These people have families of three generations at least. What happens to the older people, just let them starve?

Would you have the whole construction industry collapse because of no EI? You cannot build roads in the winter. So what do these people do, a lot of people have relied on EI to get them a certain amount of stability.

[watching&waiting]

Why on earth are these people still in Newfoundland? Just like anyone else does when they are in an area where there are no jobs, you move to the areas that has jobs. They can take their families there and live in Mobile homes if need be. This way they can work 12 months of the year.

I just can not fathom where these people are getting aways with this. Since they have employment out in Alberta and are there, they should not be allowed to then collect unemployment in Newfoundland for the rest of the year. Four months even at 12 hours a day would only qualify for six months of regular ful time work and if they were to apply for EI in Alberta they would not qualify, but they do when in Newfoundland. This is palin wrong and it is only because the government saw the troubled time in the fiseries that they have easy qualifications in Newfoundland. This is just plain abuse of the system, and needs to be stopped.

[geoffrey]

Now if you lived in Newfoundland, had lived there for hundreds of years and your job collapsed how would you deal with it? So you have an affordable house really. There are no houses available in the oil patch so what are you really suggesting that these people do. Your house in Newfoundland is worth nothing because there are no jobs, so how would you go to Alberta and where would you live? These people have families of three generations at least. What happens to the older people, just let them starve?

Would you have the whole construction industry collapse because of no EI? You cannot build roads in the winter. So what do these people do, a lot of people have relied on EI to get them a certain amount of stability.

You could sell your house for enough for a downpayment on an Alberta on. I do have an affordable residence... unfortunately I don't live in luxury, but hey, what can I do? Go on EI and move to Newfoundland? Sure!

No one lives for a hundred years. I don't care where they are from. I'm from Ontario, there was little opportunity for my parents so they left to come out here, and did quite well doing so. Do I miss Ontario, absolutely, but now that I'm on my own, I don't plan on going back just for hertiage sake. I go where the jobs are, and people should be required to do the same.

Please.

The ski industry doesn't die in the summers and the ski bums aren't afforded EI protection most of the time.

Listen margrace, heres the deal on seasonal work. You make your money when you can, you save the rest for the off season. Farmers do it. Small business owners do it. Why the hell can't bloody fishermen and construction workers do it?

Why do people expect a free ride on the coat tails of everyone else? They knew what they were getting into before they took the job, they can't claim ignorance now.

Next, you think teachers should get EI in the off-season too?

Please, take another job, do something. But an able bodied person sitting on their ass and collecting EI should be a crime in this country, it hurts all of us and it amounts to fraud.

[margrace]

Now if you lived in Newfoundland, had lived there for hundreds of years and your job collapsed how would you deal with it? So you have an affordable house really. There are no houses available in the oil patch so what are you really suggesting that these people do. Your house in Newfoundland is worth nothing because there are no jobs, so how would you go to Alberta and where would you live? These people have families of three generations at least. What happens to the older people, just let them starve?

Would you have the whole construction industry collapse because of no EI? You cannot build roads in the winter. So what do these people do, a lot of people have relied on EI to get them a certain amount of stability.

You could sell your house for enough for a downpayment on an Alberta on. I do have an affordable residence... unfortunately I don't live in luxury, but hey, what can I do? Go on EI and move to Newfoundland? Sure!

No one lives for a hundred years. I don't care where they are from. I'm from Ontario, there was little opportunity for my parents so they left to come out here, and did quite well doing so. Do I miss Ontario, absolutely, but now that I'm on my own, I don't plan on going back just for hertiage sake. I go where the jobs are, and people should be required to do the same.

Please.

The ski industry doesn't die in the summers and the ski bums aren't afforded EI protection most of the time.

Listen margrace, heres the deal on seasonal work. You make your money when you can, you save the rest for the off season. Farmers do it. Small business owners do it. Why the hell can't bloody fishermen and construction workers do it?

Why do people expect a free ride on the coat tails of everyone else? They knew what they were getting into before they took the job, they can't claim ignorance now.

Next, you think teachers should get EI in the off-season too?

Please, take another job, do something. But an able bodied person sitting on their ass and collecting EI should be a crime in this country, it hurts all of us and it amounts to fraud.

I'm glad you think that people who work for themselves are protected or what ever. Perhaps you should take some time and watch a show on AChannel out of Barrie. There they interviewed an older man to find out why he was on the street. He was a small business man. He did some work for people who refused to pay him. He lost everything and he said that too many people are just two paychecks away from being on the street. So how does this fit into your theory?

[Hydraboss]

Then he should get a freakin' job! If he's able-bodied, then THERE IS NO EXCUSE FOR BEING ON THE STREET. Margrace, quit pandering to the lazy and the stupid. There are people that are on the street that need help, but that guy is not one of them. He admits that he can work, SO WHY ISN'T HE?

Friggin laziness and a feeling of "oh woe is me" will keep him right where he is.

The Newfoundlanders that you spoke about are exactly the same. "Won't someone please take care of me and my family. I don't feel like working."

I am so sick to death of paying for these rejects.

[margrace]

Then he should get a freakin' job! If he's able-bodied, then THERE IS NO EXCUSE FOR BEING ON THE STREET. Margrace, quit pandering to the lazy and the stupid. There are people that are on the street that need help, but that guy is not one of them. He admits that he can work, SO WHY ISN'T HE?

Friggin laziness and a feeling of "oh woe is me" will keep him right where he is.

The Newfoundlanders that you spoke about are exactly the same. "Won't someone please take care of me and my family. I don't feel like working."

I am so sick to death of paying for these rejects.

I am glad that your jobs are protected for the rest of your life. It is very easy to judge your fellowman. Maybe you should walk in his shoes for several weeks. Self satisfied people who think that life will always be the way it is make me sick. We have these programs because people literally starved in the thirties and don't think that it won't come again.

[Hydraboss]

I never said that my job or any other was protected for life, so quit trying to put words in my mouth. As for walking in his shoes, I did it for a hell of a lot longer than a few weeks. Not once did I cry to the first naive ear that would listen and squeal like a spoiled child that "someone didn't pay me", even though my boss at the time bounced my paychecks religiously. I kept at it and took a second job to boot, and when the opportunity arose, I changed jobs. Never collected welfare or EI (welfare). I WORKED. And I supported my family, not the government, not the working taxpayers. ME.

As for the thirties, it will never happen again TO PEOPLE WHO ARE WILLING TO WORK. I can only HOPE it happens again to lazy bastards that sit on programs. It would serve them right if the government CUT ALL WELFARE AND SUBSIDIES FOR ABLE-BODIED PEOPLE.

Self-satisfied? Thank you. I stress the SELF part in that. Not the welfare-satisfied. Not the taxpayer-supported-no working-lazy ass-someone else will pay my bills-satisfied. At least I can go to sleep at night IN THE BED I PAID FOR knowing that I am not a boat anchor on society.

[margrace]

This man was in his late 50's. In Barrie they have hiring places, you get a job with a lot of promises and then in a month they no longer need you. My son is 35 and he was working at three jobs just trying to get a foothold. At everyone, although there were great promises, at the end of the month, he got laid off from all three. They won;t even talk to someone that man's age.

Now he is working for $12 an hour but not in Barrie. Could you support a family on that. Lucky for him he doesn't have one. He is a good worker and has a great working record but that stood him in no good staid when it came to getting a permanent job.

I expect that sometime in the future there will be a melt down, sooner than later, and people like you who look down on anyone less fortunate may suffer also.

By the way, I am 71 years old and I have never collect EI or any other type of welfare, but then I have always been a healthy animal, thank God. My husband however died at 29 from Leukemia and I raised 4 children.

[Hydraboss]

First, if the man in his 50's can't get work there - move to where you can get work.

Second, if your son is 35 and tried working three jobs - good for him. Tell him to keep trying. If your son is making $12/hour - good for him. I have supported a family on a hell of a lot less. Wasn't what you would call cushy, but we made it. If he's such a good worker, tell him to come to Alberta (if he's not already here).

There will be a melt-down, and when it happens I will finally get the chance to fire about sixty workers that are freakin lazy but necessary. The market always corrects itself. Always. The people who will suffer are those who don't give a damn about working anyway. They are only one step above the useless able-bodied welfare collectors, anyway.

You personally did someone to be proud of (four kids by yourself). Doesn't it iritate the hell out of you when someone in the same situation as you says that it's too hard and wants the government to do it all for them? Shouldn't it iritate you?

My condolences on your husband.

[Renegade]

Interesting show on Land and Sea yesterday. A small town in Newfoundland that lost its fish plant work when the fisheries collapsed motors on.

36 of the local men work 3 to 4 months a year doing sismic? jobs in Alberta. The work runs in the winter months. The pay is 10 to 12 dollars an hour but they apparently work 12 hours a day 7 days a week while they are there. It is all outside work.

They spend the rest of the year at home in Newfoundland with their families.

When interviewed the company manager said that they were hired because they were good workers and knew how to do hard work. He also said that Albertans would not work part time like that.

They collect unemployment and are rehired each year. Works out great for them all.

EI was intended as insurance against unforseeable and unintended job loss. It woudl seem that in this case the unemployment is forseeable and intended. In my view this kind of EI claim is fradulent and should be disallowed.

They also pay into the unemployment, what would you suggest these people do. The only job there was the fish plant and it is closed. They would not qualify for unemployment if they could not get a job.

I suggest that these workers stop abusing the EI system. If there no longer jobs where they live, I suggest they move to where the jobs are.

[Rovik]

Interesting show on Land and Sea yesterday. A small town in Newfoundland that lost its fish plant work when the fisheries collapsed motors on.

36 of the local men work 3 to 4 months a year doing sismic? jobs in Alberta. The work runs in the winter months. The pay is 10 to 12 dollars an hour but they apparently work 12 hours a day 7 days a week while they are there. It is all outside work.

They spend the rest of the year at home in Newfoundland with their families.

When interviewed the company manager said that they were hired because they were good workers and knew how to do hard work. He also said that Albertans would not work part time like that.

They collect unemployment and are rehired each year. Works out great for them all.

There are several factors one must consider here. First, if they were making 12 to 14 dollars an hour, they would be getting about 7 dollars an hour on EI...not a huge amount of money, and on EI, one does not pay into CPP, therfore, they will have less of a pension when they hit 65. Second, there is a quality of life issue here. These people, many who are uneducated, if they stayed in Alberta making $15 an hour, would have a very hard time buying a house...in fact, more than likely they would be staying in a basement apartment, compare this to having their own home in Newfoundland and being happy compared to living in a basement apartment, perhaps living with many, many others (often fellow workers who can't find accommendations elsewhere) and being misrable. And many, even if they sold their homes in Newfoundland, would still have a hard time getting a down payment for a home in Alberta (and many would have a hard time qualifying for a mortgage in Alberta). Personally I believe no matter how much money one makes, if one is not happy, how can you say that person is living a fulfulling life.

And to all you cold-hearted people who thing that social programs should be scrapped or diminished to a point of not been benefically, how come you are not also saying that 100% of all corporate subsidies, tax breaks and incentives should be scrapped. How come none of you are complaining about the service charges that the banks charge or the very high interest on many credit cards...often at above 25%. I don't hear you complain about that??? Hypocritical, if you ask me.

[geoffrey]

Personally I believe no matter how much money one makes, if one is not happy, how can you say that person is living a fulfulling life.

Should have made better choices, we all can't be responsible to ensure that everyone has a beautiful house, nice fast car, cushy job... or compensate them when they don't.

And to all you cold-hearted people who thing that social programs should be scrapped or diminished to a point of not been benefically, how come you are not also saying that 100% of all corporate subsidies, tax breaks and incentives should be scrapped. How come none of you are complaining about the service charges that the banks charge or the very high interest on many credit cards...often at above 25%. I don't hear you complain about that??? Hypocritical, if you ask me.

Personally I am saying that corporate welfare is as bad as personal welfare, it breeds apathy and reduces our competitiveness internationally.

What do banks have to do with this? Why the hell does anyone have a 25% credit card? Again, choices my friend, you can't protect people from their own stupidity.

I shouldn't have to support Joe Newfie to live in his nice house in Newfoundland when there is a job in Alberta open that needs him... bottom line.

If you don't work, and you could work, you are lazy. Nothing else. Bottom line, done deal. Welfare should only be available to those that are actually incapable of working due to physical or mental restrictions... the rest of them are lazy plain and simple.

I don't blame them though, dont' worry. I blame the government hand holding and head patting from the cradle to the grave. It's time the government cut them off and forced them to stand on their own two feet.

It's amazing the dignity that is restored when people realise they are capable of accomplish anything that they set their mind too, instead of what the government tells them to accomplish before returning to the EI pig trough.