We pay while Indians live in luxury

[g_bambino]

It's important to remember that the explorer and military and missionary carriers of diseases pre-date by far the colonists.

It wasn't their fault they carried diseases to which the indiginous population was not yet immune.

[jbg]

Who has interpreted Indigenous knowledge for this?

I can't really either.

What I'm getting at is that non-indigenous diseases, not racism, killed the FN's.

[g_bambino]

What I'm getting at is that non-indigenous diseases, not racism, killed the FN's.

Before the formation of the United States, that is.

[jbg]

Before the formation of the United States, that is.

No. Before even the settlement of what's now the United States.

[tango]

What I'm getting at is that non-indigenous diseases, not racism, killed the FN's.

You think the 'diseases-not-racism' theory is news?

You can find that on any white supremacist site.

[jbg]

You think the 'diseases-not-racism' theory is news?

You can find that on any white supremacist site.

Charles Mann is a scientist, not a white supremacist. Just splattering mud does not maketh an argument.

[tango]

Charles Mann is a scientist, not a white supremacist. Just splattering mud does not maketh an argument.

Oh I'm not suggesting that he is. But they like his theory.

The conquest of America took place from 1492 to 1607.

As a result of the achievements of Columbus and de Gama, the Pope divided the Western Hemisphere between Spain and Portugal. For almost the next one hundred years, Spain enjoyed a virtual monopoly in the exploration, settlement and development of North and South America.

For over 100 years the military and missionaries completed the "conquest of America", and the destruction of its Indigenous Peoples.

Funny ... we talk about the explorers and the settlers ... but what about the 100 year "conquest" by the military and the missionaries?

What happened to the Indigenous Peoples then?

They sent the pigs among them?

Ya ... and their blankets too, delivered by wagonloads and boatloads.

You should never rely solely on histories of North America written by and for Euro-Americans.

Indigenous people know their history.

[g_bambino]

No. Before even the settlement of what's now the United States.

Then, I think you meant "yes" ; I added the caveat to your statement to say that non-native diseases killed the majority of aboriginal peoples before the establishment of the United States. After 1776, south of the newly established British North American border, the mode of slaughter became a little less... inadvertent, shall we say.

_{[ed. for sp.]}

Edited April 21, 2009 by g_bambino

[jbg]

Then, I think you meant "yes" ; I added the caveat to your statement to say that non-native diseases killed the majority of aboriginal peoples before the establishment of the United States. After 1776, south of the newly established British North American border, the mode of slaughter became a little less... inadvertent, shall we say.

_{[ed. for sp.]}

I stand corrected.

Oh I'm not suggesting that he is. But they like his theory.

***********************

What happened to the Indigenous Peoples then?

They sent the pigs among them?

Ya ... and their blankets too, delivered by wagonloads and boatloads.

You should never rely solely on histories of North America written by and for Euro-Americans.

Indigenous people know their history.

I guess no matter what, whites bad, everyone else good?

[charter.rights]

Charles Mann is a scientist, not a white supremacist. Just splattering mud does not maketh an argument.

I think you may need to do a bit more research.

Charles Mann is NOT a scientists. He is a journalist who dabbles in scientific thingys. His book is nothing more than an opinion piece.

I am surprised however, that you would have been take in by it....

[tango]

I guess no matter what, whites bad, everyone else good?

jbg, that's just ridiculous mudslinging.

[tango]

So, just as I thought, no proof, no links, no cites. Just more of the usual lies and made up crap.

Please keep posting, every time you do you simply reinforce what I've been saying, you have nothing but lies to present.

Go ahead, refute me, post some legitimate links and cites. Why should I have to do what you would be doing if what you say is true?

See p 202-203 re 1927 decision in US courts, in favour of Jay Treaty rights of Haudenosaunee people:

http://books.google.ca/books?id=7hFh1-xwb5...num=5#PPA203,M1

And Border Control regulations:

1. Proposed Acceptance Of Satisfactory Tribal Enrollment Documents

At Traditional Border Crossing Points For Tribes Who Continue

Traditional Land Border Crossings.

DHS and DOS do not propose to accept any particular tribal enrollment

documents as part of this NPRM. DHS and DOS do propose,

however, to consider such documents for the final rule as discussed

below.

Documents that may be found acceptable and so

designated in the final rule must establish the identity and citizenship

of members of United States tribes. DHS and DOS propose to

accept such tribal enrollment documents only if members of the issuing

tribe continue to cross the land border of the United States for a

historic, religious or other cultural purpose.67 The tribal enrollment

card must be satisfactory to CBP, may only be used at that tribe’s

traditional border crossing points and will only be accepted so long

as that tribe cooperates with the verification and validation of the

document. These tribes must also cooperate with CBP on the enhancement

of their documents in the future as a condition for the

continued acceptance of the document.

DHS and DOS invite comments from those United States tribes

that enroll members who continue to cross the border for a traditional

purpose. Any tribe that wishes to propose its tribal enrollment

card as an acceptable alternative document at one or more traditional

border crossing points should submit comments supporting acceptance

of its tribal enrollment card as an alternative for its members.

All such comments should explain fully why the proposed tribal

enrollment card should be an acceptable alternative document for its

members.

Each comment should explain the traditional border crossings of

that tribe by:

a. specifically identifying the federally recognized tribe;

b. indicating the traditional destination or destinations across the

border that are visited by members of the tribe;

c. explaining in detail the purpose or purposes of all such travel;

d. relating all such travel to traditional ethnic, religious, cultural

or other activities of the tribe;

67From our consultations with Native American communities, DHS understands that

members of a number of federally recognized tribes maintain contact with ethnically related

people across our land border. For example, the Kumeyaay of California, Tohono

O’odham of Arizona, Kickapoo of Texas, Oklahoma and Kansas, and Haudenosaunee or Six

Nations of the New York State area maintain contact with ethnically related people on the

other side of border. We also have been told that the three Kickapoo bands in the United

States all lay their dead to rest in a traditional cemetery in Mexico. Traditional border

crossings may continue for these and similar historic, religious and cultural purposes.