The Writ Has Been Dropped

[westcoast99]

Anyone want to hazard a guess how this one will work out?

Edited August 11, 2015 by Gugsy

[Neal.F.]

I have a visceral hatred of Liberals, but no great love of Oilcan Ernie.....

In a perfect world , it would be a Family Coalitoon Party majority..

However. since it is not a perfect world, I could live with a PC majority, and settle for a PC minority...(But in such a case, don't you think the Lieberals and NDP would form a coalition as they did in '85?

However, I have a sick feeling that there will be Liberal government, I am not ready to say minority or majority, but if it must be, please let it be minority.

The best thing the PC government has going for its re-election chances is Dalton McGuinty....

For anyone who is interested, Check this page out It should get very active, very soon.

[dnsfurlan]

Finally something exciting to talk about in the world of politics. I think it will be fascinating to see how this plays out in Ontario. Actually, I do think this election is up in the air, and much of it depends on the performances of the party leaders, espeically Eves and McGuinty.

Already a debate is being framed around the issue of leadership. This has been a weakness of McGuinty in the past, but I also think that Eves still has something to prove in this area.

Personally, I have a hard time seeing McGuinty projecting an aura of leadership around himself. Some in the media may think he's ready for the challenge. I'll believe it when I see it.

As for Eves, I think the book is still out on the guy. Frankly he seems a bit more tired a politician than I thought he would be. But if he can come across as someone who can take charge of the province and continue the successful policies of the Tories then he might have a chance. Part of the problem is that he has had a year to do this. Maybe he's gotten all the kinks out. Anyhow, I think he's going to need to be sharper in the campaign.

I think Howard Hampton is going to be the wild card in the race. I do think he sometimes gets carried away with the shrill rhetoric. For example. using the gay marriage issue as an excuse to attack Eves' personal situation. The logic of this excapes me and I think can be easily defended (eg. Eves choice to not be married has nothing to do with the public policy stance of recognizing gay and lesbian marriage)

However, it is clear that Hampton is umapologetic about using government in order to solve some perceived problems in the province. Actually, I think this might play well to people who have not liked the flirtation with private sector solutions that Mike Harris displayed for the last two terms. Unfortumately, I still think many Ontarians feel safer with the idea that big government can somehow pacify many of these so-called problems.

The challenge this poses for Eves and McGuinty is interesting. I think it will force Eves to articlate a principled argument for a continuing of conservative rule in the province. For McGuinty, I think it puts in in somewhat of a hard place, since he has to face challenges from both sides while appearing to lead at the same time. It might make him look like a waffler.

Just some thoughts. Looking forward to the next 30 days.

[Neal.F.]

It will be an interesting 30 days to be sure... I am becoming more optimistic that the Tories can pull it off, but only with a virtually flawless campaign.

Same sex Marriage will be a big issue in the rural ridings, of which there are many.

Immigration could be a big one in T.O., which the Liberals own anyway.

Dennis, you are right about Howard HAmpton being the potential spoiler. McGuinty is still seen as inept, gutless, a nonentity. As much as I hate the NDP, Howard hampton comes across as a more polished speaker, and Ernie definitely has the aura of P{remier about him. I can see the debate now... McGuinty looking wooden in his ill fitting suit while Ernie and Howie leave him in the dust.

If the NDP can steal enough Liberal votes on account of McGuinty's ineptness, it's over for the Liberals.

PC: 46-54 seats Lib:36-46 seats NDP: 4-7 seats

I can't believe Ontarians could be so stupid as to elect a Liberal government.

[dnsfurlan]

In following the election and reading some of the stuff going on, sometimes I find I have to stop myslef and ask the simple question: WHAT?

This is what McGuinty had to say about Tory government spending Liberals' McGuinty attacks Tory spending:

"No government has ever spent more of your money and given you less in return than this one," McGuinty said.

"It's time for a government that understands that tax dollars belong to taxpayers, and those tax dollars have to be respected."

I wonder if he would have the same thing to say about the federal liberals, or about past ontario liberal goverments. Since when do Liberal governments ever care about tax dollars?

Its fine to criticize the goverment on this account, I suppose. But just how in the world would Mcguinty actually improve the situation? Does he actually have a plan for fiscal management? How does he intend to respect tax dollars?

The more I listen to Dalton the more I think he's the Ontario version of Al Gore. Eves has already taken him to account on some of his criticisms. I just hope he continues to debunk some of the unsupportable claims coming from the liberals.

Its always more effective to counter demagoguery with facts and principle. I wonder if Eves can keep it up. I think the last thing Ontario needs is for Al Gore (Mcguinty) to run the province.

[westcoast99]

Hampton is likely a better alternative to the Tories than McGuinty.

Edited August 11, 2015 by Gugsy

[dnsfurlan]

Now that a few days have passed since the start of the campaign, I couldn't help buy notice a trend in some of the media coverage so far.

Journalists seen to be buying into the theory that Dalton Mcguinty has remade himself since the last election, in part because of a media image makeover he's been working on for the last four years.

This adds to my admittedly biased observation that I think the media is cheering for McGuinty to win the election.

Since when is a media media image consultatin a replacement for an actual aura of leadership? Why not let viewers and voters decide if McGuinty has improved his presentation, instead of immediately buying into the Liberals' assertion that he has because he's been listening to media image consultants?

And if you think my observation of media McGuinty cheerleading is patently biased, think about it a bit more. Don't you think many in the media, who are admittedly liberal in their voting preferences, think that it may be a time for a change. And if McGuinty presents himself better than the last time, it gives people a good reason to consider voting for him, so my media theory goes...

I know. I know. I'm a conservative who wants to see media bias everywhere. Nonetheless, I think it is hard to argue that it does not exist.

For example, I was wathcing a news piece on the supposedly conservative Asper's Global News yesterday. In doing a story on Howard Hampton's appeal among union workers, the reporter felt it necessary to add commentary to the effect that the PC goverments of Harris and Eves have led to the gutting of social services in Ontario.

Whether or not this is true, I think its safe to say that such a sweeping generalization has no place in a piece meant to cover the news - not make it or editorialize on it.

Just some more thoughts.

[Neal.F.]

I am convinced there is a definite media bias toward the Liberals. You don't need to twist my arm on that.

The question I have for you is, Do you think that the media cheerleading will actually help the Lieberals, or will it backfire?

[dnsfurlan]

That's an excellent point, Neal. I know so many of us on the right tend to yell "media bias" every time we watch the news. But does it really matter?

Actually, I think it does. In a way, I think it forces conservative candidates to be better than liberal candidates have to be. I don't know, maybe thats the way it should be.

I guess my gripe with apparrent media bias is what I think is a lack of professionalism. Think of what we expect from all of the sectors of society and democracy meant to serve the people. Then look at some of the pot shots the media like to make in their coverage of things like politics. I guess I just don't like to see that kind of stuff in societies that are considered to be advanced. If we expect a certain level of ethics and professionalism from politicians, for example, then we should expect it from the media too.

Of course, this does not apply to all of the media. But I think there is enough of it around to create an atmosphere of mistrust out there. I don't think that's a good thing.

For example, you had Walter Cronkite, who was generally labelled as the most trusted voice in America. Now, after he's finished communicating to millions of Americans daily, he admits that he was a liberal all along and that liberalism is a more balanced and correct philosophy for society. Why didn't he admit this while reporting on events such as the Tet Offensive in Vietnam?

I don't think media bias wins elections for people. I just think it sets a double standard that I don't think is fair or very professional. Just my two cents worth.

For Ernie Eves, it just means he has to get his act together. I have seen some signs of it. Lets see if he can force Mcguinty to come out from behind the media image he is trying to portray to the media and to the rest of us. Leadership is about more than image. It is also about aura. I think Eves has some of it. I don't think McGuinty does.

With the way the media tends to cover events, I think it just means that Eves has to speak to the people instead of the media. Thats what George W. Bush did to get elected President of the United States.

[dnsfurlan]

Here is another one that you might want to put into the "Did they actually say that?" category:

Conrad Winn, president of Compas Inc., in talking about his latest poll on the Ontario election said this (Eves closes gap with McGuinty):

"Tory voters love Eves. Liberal voters like McGuinty. Eves can count on tremendous enthusiasm from his backers."

Since when have the Tories ever loved Eves? Sure, they like him better than Mcguinty or Hampton, but that doesn't mean they are crazy about him. Many conservatives, including some who post on these boards, prefer Harris or even Flaherty to a guy who has been putting the Common Sense Revolution in the filing cabinet instead of reaffirming its place in Ontario History.

Sometimes I just don't know where they get this stuff.

Anyhow, the latest poll results might confirm my previous assessment that Mr. Mcguinty is Ontario's version of Al Gore. He has four years to prepare for this election and he somehow manages to squander a double-digit lead in the polls within a matter days.

And some of the stuff I read in the press is laughable. A columnist in the Star wrote that Mcguinty has been taking the high road so far. REALLY. He calls Eves a used car salesman and sais that the Tories want to pit certain Ontarians against others. And this is supposed to be the taking of the high road?

If McGuinty feels he needs to REALLY start going on the negative I think it might truly seal his fate as a runner-up. The challenge for the guy is to look like he can lead, not like he can continue to complain about everything, which he seems to always be doing as leader of the Liberals.

[westcoast99]

He's lost his 15 point lead in a matter of days. A poll by Ekos shows the Liberals at 43% and the Tories at 42%.

Edited August 12, 2015 by Gugsy

[Craig Read]

DNS, I agree, i laughed my ugly little head off when i heard on a news radio station that myself and other tories 'love' Uncle Ernie. I DETEST Uncle Ernie. He is a fraud. Any time a Conservative talks about being 'compassionate' you know that you are dealing with a Liberal who just wears a blue Tory tie.

Eves is the epitome of the ineffectiveness of the political infrastructure that is strangling society.

-No reforms in Health, Education or Energy

-Budget spend goes up 10 % each year

-Health Care spend goes up by 10-15 % each year

-No tax reductions at all except for his promise to rebate $2 per house for mortgage interest deductions !! Wow !!

-No infrastructure improvements

-Continued subsidisation of the energy system

-Continued corporate welfare

-Tacit support of Kyoto

-Tacit support of Gay Marriage

-An unwillingness to allow Toronto to keep its money to develop its economy

Uncle Ernie and his knitting group of women who should be home baking cookies do not deserve to govern.

His only ace card is Howdy Doody McGuinty.

A woeful actor who will soon be wearing knee pads to beg for votes.

[dnsfurlan]

Craig,

Iwouldn't go that far in portraying Eves as a liberal. I see some conservatism in him. And I think many Tories do too. Its one of the reasons they are solidly behind him, despite his "moderation".

George W. Bush coined the term, "Compassionate Conservartive", and I wouldn't exactly call him a liberal. I know government spending has gone up under his watch. It still doesn't disqualify him as a conservative.

Joe Clark, on the other hand, is not a conservative. I think we would both agree on that one.

[westcoast99]

Eves is a Conservative.

Edited August 11, 2015 by Gugsy

[Pellaken]

Eves as a unite-the-right candidate if he can pull this election off???

perhaps, perhaps not.

[westcoast99]

I doubt Eves would ever get into federal politics.

Edited August 11, 2015 by Gugsy

[dnsfurlan]

Howar Hampton seems to think that the solution to every perceived problem in society is to nationalize it, or to have the government run it completely.

When you go buy groceries for the family, do you need to go to a store run by the government? For that matter, the majority of goods and services offered to citizens in a free society comes from the private sector. We don't expect the government to provide everything for us. Nor should we.

I've got some news for Howard Hampton: a government-run society doesn't work - it was called the USSR. Look it up.

I think one of the reasons Howard Hampton's style of socialist advocacy doesn't work is because its nothing new. Nationalized programs and even societies have been tried and they inevitably lead to bankruptcy, lethargy, and inefficiency.

Will there be a time when the Left actually comes up with something new and innovative? The depression happened 70 years ago. Get over it!

P.S. I don't think Mike Harris is the answer to uniting the Right. The next election will determine the landscape of the Right on the federal scene. In my opinion, a strong showing by either one of the Alliance of PCs will mean that that party will make their own mark on that configuration. Otherwise, a status quo I think will mean that a uniting movement will sweep the Right, wherein all kinds of candidates might feel it the right time to enter the fray. Right now, both the CA and PCs leave too many doubts for many conservatives to rally around either one. A more united movement I think will be like attracting flies to honey - everyone will try moving in on it.

I just think Mike Harris has too many drawbacks for the federal scene. I don't see him as being a federal type of guy.

[dnsfurlan]

Dalton McGuinty is showing his true colors as a classic liberal politician. Here are his recommendations for education in Ontario Ontario Liberals to make college and university education available to all:

- Freeze tuition

- Provide Tuition waivers for our neediest students

- Improve financial assistance for all students

- Create 50,000 new spaces in our colleges and universities

- Increase graduate scholarships by 50 percent

Its one thing to make such grandiose promises, its quite another to deliver the goods.

The clear trend in post-secondary education is away from public funding because, guess what, it just cost too darned much. Now along comes Mcguinty promising that the government is going to pay for all of these promises.

How much you wanna bet that, by the odd chance that he actually becomes premier, that none of the above will ever get implemented. Again, its classical liberalism. Scrapping the GST. Cancelling Free Trade. Preserving universal health care. We've hear it all before. They promise the world to everyone but then change their minds when they realize they have to start paying for some of this stuff without raising the taxes on everyone. Oh, I forgot, for a long time they actually did raise taxes on everyone - until, of course, people started to realize that things actually cost money in a free society.

[Craig Read]

All 3 of these guys are left-liberal jokers.

Uncle Ernie with his tearful, do-nothing, don't reform and hug a seal, conservativism.

Howdy Doody McGuinty with his tax and spend nonsense and his wage, and price controls replete with increased gov't size and interventionism.

And Howie Hampton with his Marxian handbook on economic class warfare, exploitation and the need to have a fascist one people, one state, one leader approach to societal organisation.

What choice is there?

I don't trust Eves on his tax cut promises. He will never implement them post election. In fact he broke Ontario law [Taxpayer Protection Act which he amended] with a tax increase without a referendum when he delayed the personal and corporate income-tax reductions that the Progressive Conservative Party promised to deliver in the 1999 election campaign. And, Eves froze the education tax credit for private schools.

I simply don't trust Uncle Ernie.

So I will write Mickey Mouse on the Ballot and hope that he wins.

Mickey is certainly in the same league as Uncle E or Howdy Doody.

[dnsfurlan]

I obviously don't share your lack of confidence in Ernie. Unlike what happens with Liberal parties, if conservatives don't do enough of what they say, especially regarding tax cuts, they will lose support from their own party. It happened to George Bush Sr. It happened to Brian Mulroney.

Acuallly, I don't see where your perception of Eves comes from. He may not be a clear-cut conservative, but I certainly don't think you can compare him to a knee-jerk liberal, or to the other two leaders.

[Craig Read]

Eves is maybe not a knee jerk liberal, just a jerk. This is the man who refuses to reform anything. Increase budgets, increase spend, don't privatise, don't deregulate, break the Tax Payer act and forget how much all the election promises are going to cost the tax payer.

He is a clown and certainly not a true Conservative. I have no faith in his ability to handle or reform any of the pressing problems in Ontario.

He will just milk Toronto, extract the many billions the city provides and buy votes elsewhere with said funds.

No real tax or debt relief or system reform will occur with Uncle Ernie and the knitting crew in power. Speaking of power, bet on another black out too.

[westcoast99]

Not sure I agree with that analysis Craig

Edited August 11, 2015 by Gugsy

[Craig Read]

I can't stand Eves and his knitting crew of crying women. Eves will spend more than $1 billion to buy this election.

He will then go to business with hat in hand, moaning that we are the greatest and it is our duty to spend this money.

Sickening.

When does the vote buying ever stop ?

I will never vote for Eves or Howdy Doody. Either Mickey Mouse or Howard Hampton will get my vote - both are in the same category as policy thinkers.

[Neal.F.]

Of those who contend for seats, let alone government, Only the PCs are a valid choice, Eves notwithstanding.

If Howdy-doody becomes premier either by majority or minority coalition with Howie Hampton, It'll be Buffalo Bob Rae and his cappuccino sucking granola crunchers all over again.

The time to send a government a message with a protest vote is when you know they have no chance of losing, but might be sobered by the loss of a few seats.

Remeber 1990 when enough Ontarians thought voting NDP as a protest was such a great idea!!!!

[Craig Read]

Yes true and Bob Rae is still feted by the media as a genius and visionary statesman - all because he looks like a dork, wears glasses, acts like a pompous ass, almost bankrupted the province and went to Upper Canada College where he learnt to knot ties.

Great leader - in the same ilk as Kim Jong Il - can't wait for the Lefty Libs to start aping the digs that Kim-bo wears -- replete with Mao jacket and boffo hair.

Uncle Ernie is a messy guy. No vision, hard policies or ideas. Too many house wives crying around him. Anyone who is a compassionate Conservate is just a Liberal trying to swing on both sides - a sort of half transgendered politician i suppose.

Ernie is Mr. Flip Flop - what the hell, let's give Howard a shot -- and watch the exodus of tax payers to the States