Violent Europeans

[August1991]

In the coming few days, while we watch the anti-Bush demos or the memorials for World War II vets, I hope some thought is given to three points:

First. The Europeans are far more violent than Americans. Europeans have been involved in many terrible wars and even attempts at genocide. This is not ancient history - or even history of 60 years past. Sarajevo was a beautiful Balkan city. Europeans recently destroyed it. When was the last American war? Roosevelt in Havana harbour? Peru and Ecuador? US Civil War? Compared to Europeans, we Americans, whether Brazilian, Canadian or US American, are generally peaceful.

Second. It was Russians who stopped Nazi Germany. But this is not to diminish the efforts of others. In collective effort, individual effort seems lost. Too often, it is.

Third. What the hell were young guys from small Canadian towns doing in Europe? It was not Imperialism. Those alive came home. Would young European guys today or ever do the same for us?

[takeanumber]

First. The Europeans are far more violent than Americans. Europeans have been involved in many terrible wars and even attempts at genocide. This is not ancient history - or even history of 60 years past. Sarajevo was a beautiful Balkan city. Europeans destroyed it. Recently. When was the last American war? Roosevelt in Havana harbour? Peru and Ecuador? We Americans are peaceful.

Ugh. I don't know where to begin.

See: Native American wars.

See: Civil War

See: American 'opening' of Japan. (1855)

See: American take over Philipines (1898?)

See: American imperial rape of China. (1880-1941).

See: WWII. (Atomic bombs spring to mind.) (1945)

See: CIA involvement in Honduras.

See: Korean War (World War III, as it should be balled.)

See: CIA involvement in Angola.

See: CIA involvement in Uganda.

See: Vietnam War.

See: First Gulf War

See: Second Gulf War

See: LA Riots

See: American equivalent of soccer hooliganism.

Anyway, it's evidence that the US is at least on par with European imperialism during the 1700's to 1945.

History since 1955 would suggest the US is more violent.

I'm not going to make that assertion though.

I offer the points above as fodder for a counter-arguement, and to point out that the US isn't exactly peace loving, that's all.

Second. It was Russians ("Asians") who stopped Nazi Germany. But this is not to diminish the efforts of others. In collective effort, individual effort seems lost. Too often, it is.

Battle of the Atlantic was important.

US contribution to Chinese front somewhat important.

The US contribution was huge, as was the Canadian.

Third. What the hell were young guys from small Canadian towns doing in Europe? It was not Imperialism. Those alive came home. Would young European guys do the same for us?

It wasn't really imperialism.

I think there'd be some European men who would return the favour, especially for Canada.

There'd be a lot of men who wouldn't, just as there were a lot of Quebecois who wouldn't go over during WWI and WWII. So you know, it works both ways.

There'd be a few who would, for sure.

August gets points for being forthright. Great points.

[August1991]

TakeNumber, your examples are "obscure" when compared against the 20 million Russians killed defeating German fascism. I won't go into the slaughter of French and German soldiers in World War I.

There is a myth that Europeans are sophisticated and civilized. This myth is false. Yugoslavia provides recent evidence.

Did any other European country lift a finger? (Have you seen the movie: No Man's Land?)

[Argus]

First. The Europeans are far more violent than Americans. Europeans have been involved in many terrible wars and even attempts at genocide. This is not ancient history - or even history of 60 years past. Sarajevo was a beautiful Balkan city. Europeans destroyed it. Recently. When was the last American war? Roosevelt in Havana harbour? Peru and Ecuador? We Americans are peaceful.

Ugh. I don't know where to begin.

See: Native American wars.

See: Civil War

See: American 'opening' of Japan. (1855)

See: American take over Philipines (1898?)

See: American imperial rape of China. (1880-1941).

See: WWII. (Atomic bombs spring to mind.) (1945)

See: CIA involvement in Honduras.

See: Korean War (World War III, as it should be balled.)

See: CIA involvement in Angola.

See: CIA involvement in Uganda.

See: Vietnam War.

See: First Gulf War

See: Second Gulf War

See: LA Riots

See: American equivalent of soccer hooliganism.

Anyway, it's evidence that the US is at least on par with European imperialism during the 1700's to 1945.

Geeze, boy, read a little history. Check out the European wars since 1700, the absolute slaughter of the Napoleanic era, the brutality of the Nazi era was, aside from the death camps, probably not as bad as what Napoleons boys did in Portugal and Spain. The behaviour of Portugese, Spanish, Dutch, French and English troops abroad in colonies was often worse. Check out Birtish behaviour in the Boer war. They invented concentration camps, y'know. Into this century we can look at what the Turks did to the Armenians, the incredible brutality and slaughter of WW1, the colonial fighting in India, Arabia, Africa, the Spanish civil war, WW2, The Greek civil war and tyranny, Spanish brutality and tyranny, Russian brutality towards their conquered territories, French behaviour in Indochina and Algeria, British screwups which led to immense slaughter in India The deaths so massively eclipse anything the Americans have ever done it's laughable to suggest even comparing them.