Iran vs Israel

[WIP]

Daily Beast blogger Ethan Perlson seems to think this is a good news story: Bibi's Unlikely New Fan Club

Well, I suppose it is for the Likud Party, but the prospect that the Israeli left: consisting of socialists, peace activists and secularists; are rallying around the flag, unfortunately means that most Jews living in Israel have decided that the overwhelmingly hostile response to the attack on the aid flotilla, and continued blockade of Gaza, has created enough xenophobia to set aside other important issues for self defense.

It's unfortunate that the majority of Jews in Israel are adopting the fortress mentality, because this strategy means endless war and makes it more and more costly to be in alliance with them. Also, over the years, secular Jews get fed up with the rocket attacks, suicide bombers, and threats of future war and decide to leave Israel. The ultra-Orthodox Jews who have a manifest destiny, are inspired to move there by the threat of war and bombings, and to build more settlements in occupied territories.

The hardline anti-Arab, anti-Muslim, pro-Israel advocates here keep referring to Israel as a secular democracy. Well, set aside the issue of how much of a democracy it is for a non-Jewish resident, there is no mistaking that Israel is becoming more theocratic, more conservative, and less democratic for everyone. Israel is transitioning into a Jewish version of Iran or Saudi Arabia, and unfortunately the remaining secular Jews there have decided to join them. I can't see any peaceful resolution coming between two sides who claim God is on their side.

[Keepitsimple]

The media have missed the real story.....and that is Turkey has increasingly turned away from secularism and is moving toward radical Islamism. The Israeli blockade had been in place for three years, necessitated when Hamas - an organization dedicated to the complete destruction of Israel - won the internal war with the PLO after Israel left. Till last week, there had been no significant incidents with the blockade. It's no coincidence that Turks were a main player in the "Flotilla conflict".....it was shrewdly organized by Turkey as their final act of turning away from Israel as an ally and joining forces with their Muslim brothers in Iran. Watch out for Turkey.....they're on the road to more Burqhas, Veils and beards. The world continues to be duped by the anti-Israel crowd.

[bloodyminded]

The media have missed the real story.....and that is Turkey has increasingly turned away from secularism and is moving toward radical Islamism. The Israeli blockade had been in place for three years, necessitated when Hamas - an organization dedicated to the complete destruction of Israel - won the internal war with the PLO after Israel left. Till last week, there had been no significant incidents with the blockade. It's no coincidence that Turks were a main player in the "Flotilla conflict".....it was shrewdly organized by Turkey as their final act of turning away from Israel as an ally and joining forces with their Muslim brothers in Iran. Watch out for Turkey.....they're on the road to more Burqhas, Veils and beards. The world continues to be duped by the anti-Israel crowd.

Turkey has a lot more friction and disagreements with Iran than it does with Israel. By a long shot.

Anyway, it's amazing that you see "the world" as being duped by the "anti-Israel crowd."

Since this amounts to a conspiracy theory of truly monumental proportions, I think the onus is on you to explain it more fully.

Perhaps it has something to do with "Pallywood"--Palestinian propaganda--which, as some people inform us with straight faces, is a far more effective propaganda machine than the West's...even though propaganda as we know it currently is largely a performance of the British and Americans, circa WW1.

But nope....the poverty-stricken Palestinians are the World Masters at political propaganda.

Like I said: such an astonishing, counterintuitive claim needs to be heavily backed up, and compared to its apaprently inferior Western cousin.

Consider it a challenge.

Edited June 6, 2010 by bloodyminded

[WIP]

Speaking of Turkey'! Look what those crazy fundamentalist Muslims are up to now:

Nude hotel opens — briefly — in Turkey He can't offer orgies, but the owner of Turkey's first nudist hotel promises good times.

[Keepitsimple]

Turkey has a lot more friction and disagreements with Iran than it does with Israel. By a long shot.

Anyway, it's amazing that you see "the world" as being duped by the "anti-Israel crowd."

Like I said: such an astonishing, counterintuitive claim needs to be heavily backed up, and compared to its apaprently inferior Western cousin.

Consider it a challenge.

Look for those frictions to start being resolved. As for my using the term the "world"......a very, very bad choice of words in my haste to finish the post. It should have said the Western Media is duped by the anti-Israel crowd. Any objective look at this disastrous happening would understand that this is the last thing that Israel would want to happen......and the very first thing that Iran and Hamas would love to happen.......and who benefits from it? That's the key.

[Argus]

Turkey has a lot more friction and disagreements with Iran than it does with Israel. By a long shot.

Which is why it is helping Iran to get nuclear material?

[Argus]

Let me see if I can get an answer here. Israel occupied Gaza to keep a lid on attacks on its territory, but that was unacceptable. So then it pulled back behind its own recognized borders. The terrorists started lobbing rockets and missiles into Israeli towns and villages from Gaza so the Israelis sought out terrorist leaders in quick, targeted assassinations to kill them - while still staying out of Gaza. But that was unacceptable. So then Israel just lobbed tons of shells into Gaza when missiles came at them, and that was unacceptable.

So Israel can't occupy the place, can't try to murder the terrorist leaders from afar, and can't shell them, so they decide to blockade them to stifle them of weapons and material to build weapons - and of course, this is unacceptable.

Are there any actions whatsoever you feel ARE acceptable from Israel when Gaza lobs missiles at them?

Other than to die and do it quietly that is?

[bloodyminded]

Which is why it is helping Iran to get nuclear material?

Both the Turks AND the Israelis see the world as more complex than you do, Argus.

And yes, Turkey and Israel have been very close, indeed. So close that Israel, as well as the American ADL, initially joined the genocide-deniers among the turkish elite...so as not to offend their ally.

That should tell you something about the relationship--when the ADL becomes a genocide-denier because of political expedience re Turkey.

Edited June 8, 2010 by bloodyminded

[Jack Weber]

Which is why it is helping Iran to get nuclear material?

The Turks are helping Iran to get nuclear material?

I'm fairly certain Turkey does not want a nuclear power on,or near it's border with a dilly bar like Ahmedinejad(and the Irania clerics) with his/thier finger(s) on the proverbial button.

I am fairly certain both the Russians and the Chinese are involved with Iran and it;s nuclear ambitions.Otherwise,why would they constantly block any sanctions against Iran as it relates to inspections?

[Bonam]

Let me see if I can get an answer here. Israel occupied Gaza to keep a lid on attacks on its territory, but that was unacceptable. So then it pulled back behind its own recognized borders. The terrorists started lobbing rockets and missiles into Israeli towns and villages from Gaza so the Israelis sought out terrorist leaders in quick, targeted assassinations to kill them - while still staying out of Gaza. But that was unacceptable. So then Israel just lobbed tons of shells into Gaza when missiles came at them, and that was unacceptable.

So Israel can't occupy the place, can't try to murder the terrorist leaders from afar, and can't shell them, so they decide to blockade them to stifle them of weapons and material to build weapons - and of course, this is unacceptable.

Are there any actions whatsoever you feel ARE acceptable from Israel when Gaza lobs missiles at them?

Other than to die and do it quietly that is?

I'm sure you'll get some idiotic and useless reply like "they should comply with international law".

[naomiglover]

I'm sure you'll get some idiotic and useless reply like "they should comply with international law".

Your contempt for international law speaks volumes of your sense of justice and morality.

We get it. You don't care for the law and you will unconditionally try to justify anything Israel does, at whatever cost.