Cyber-bullying; Is it Free Speech?

[jbg]

Normally, I am for relatively absolute "free speech". This issue of "cyber-bullying" by and among minors raises slightly different issues, for which I take a sdifferent view. Children have fewer constitutional rights than adults, and given my role as a parent, someone has to patrol that grey area between the schoolyard and a play date at one or the other parents' house. The problem is that people are taking actions that both schools and parents would forbid into a lawless area, which no one contrls. In short, as an adult I don't want to be treated as a child by a nanny state, with the kind of "hate laws" and HRC's that Canada has; however, children need the protection of "nannies". Article excerpts, with link, below.

Online bullying

should be a criminal offence: teachers (link)

Helen Morris, Canwest News Service

Published: Saturday, July 12, 2008

Cyberbullying should be made a separate Criminal Code offence the Canadian Teachers' Federation said on Saturday as they voted unanimously to ratify their policy on the issue.

"Because it's [cyberbullying] so new . . . we haven't caught up and we're trying to catch up," said Emily Noble president of the federation.

"Kids go on, say Facebook, and make harassing comments about someone . . . If I had written you a letter I would be up before the courts for harassment," said Noble. "People do it online and it's anonymous."

********************

The policy indicates a serious recognition of how common it is now for bullying to be carried out by text messaging, in online chat rooms, on blogs or social networking Web sites such as Facebook. The idea goes far beyond the expulsions and suspensions that some students have been punished with for bullying fellow students or targeting teachers.

(snip)

[Bryan]

Kids are mean, always have been. Just because they use a text message now instead of passing a note changes nothing.

[jbg]

Kids are mean, always have been. Just because they use a text message now instead of passing a note changes nothing.

Exactly.

And i don't think children should have nearly the same Charter or First Amendment protection as adults.

[Wilber]

Free speech means being accountable for what you say as well as having the right to say it. Hiding behind the anonymity of the internet to attack individuals is not exercising free speech, it is the act of a coward.

[jbg]

Free speech means being accountable for what you say as well as having the right to say it. Hiding behind the anonymity of the internet to attack individuals is not exercising free speech, it is the act of a coward.

I addressed that "cowardice" issue on another thread (link).

[Wilber]

I addressed that "cowardice" issue on another thread (link).

A typically long winded but none the less wise decision IMO.

[roof_top_eagle]

Cyber bullying is a fact of life now, I went through bullying in my face and there was no law against it. I guess because the teachers are getting it now too they are starting to see the problem.

I see some good can come out of teachers being cyber bullied, maybe someone with say Tourette Syndrome like me one day wont have to put up with teachers giving them the cold shoulder and telling them to "deal with it" as I often got. Perhaps if teachers start getting hit with bullying they will take better action than the just walk away answer they always have had, it's not like the aggressor won't follow! same goes for cyber bullying, you can't just walk away. maybe they'll get their heads wrapped around the problem.

As for making it illegal? I don't think that is the answer. I've got tough skin from being teased, maybe it had a benifit, but to make it illegal will just open the can of worms that comes with making one side of bullying illegal. Soon you'll have the cops called by kids for another student bullying them in the hall and the police will be overwhelmed with calls. This is something you can't govern unless teachers do their jobs.

Bullying isn't a legal matter, kids are mean, I say that teachers should grow some leather skin and deal with it in the school system where it belongs. Things that should have been dealt with long ago will now be because of the anonymity of the internet kids can get at the teachers and now they feel the pain.

To sum it up, teachers need to deal with it in their own capacity and not drag the courts into it. You can't make laws against stuff thats been happening in schools forever just because the teachers are now getting fired at too.

[jbg]

A typically long winded but none the less wise decision IMO.

By Court decision standards it was actually a brief decision. The only problem I have is that I think that the Court should have conducted some inquiry into whether or not the messages could be found malicious "on their face", and only then, sought to "out" the posters.

Cyber bullying is a fact of life now, I went through bullying in my face and there was no law against it. I guess because the teachers are getting it now too they are starting to see the problem.

I see some good can come out of teachers being cyber bullied, maybe someone with say Tourette Syndrome like me one day wont have to put up with teachers giving them the cold shoulder and telling them to "deal with it" as I often got. Perhaps if teachers start getting hit with bullying they will take better action than the just walk away answer they always have had, it's not like the aggressor won't follow! same goes for cyber bullying, you can't just walk away. maybe they'll get their heads wrapped around the problem.

Are you saying that now teachers are "cyber-bullied" too?

As for making it illegal? I don't think that is the answer.

I think part of the answer would be to try to tie the identity of the "cyber-bully" to "real world" bullies and review the incidents/conduct comprehensively.

I've got tough skin from being teased, maybe it had a benifit, but to make it illegal will just open the can of worms that comes with making one side of bullying illegal. Soon you'll have the cops called by kids for another student bullying them in the hall and the police will be overwhelmed with calls. This is something you can't govern unless teachers do their jobs.

Sometimes these are properly "police issues".

[Wilber]

By Court decision standards it was actually a brief decision. The only problem I have is that I think that the Court should have conducted some inquiry into whether or not the messages could be found malicious "on their face", and only then, sought to "out" the posters.

I suppose so. You will have to explain "on their face" to me. Defamation is defamation, whether anonymous or in your face. Anonymous is just more cowardly.

[jbg]

I suppose so. You will have to explain "on their face" to me. Defamation is defamation, whether anonymous or in your face. Anonymous is just more cowardly.

Meaning that the message, if false, would appear to be designed to injure.

[Wilber]

Meaning that the message, if false, would appear to be designed to injure.

Exactly, unless it is a Canadian Human Rights Tribunal, one of which has stated the truth is not a defence.

[roof_top_eagle]

Are you saying that now teachers are "cyber-bullied" too?

That is what they are claiming, that the anonymity of the internet is make students feel they can go after the teachers too.

[roof_top_eagle]

If we make cyber bullying a criminal offense then we have to make bullying a criminal offense and that is what kids do, I'd have the majority of my high school with criminal records as well as my elementary school if that was the case. In some cases I may have been charged while trying to defend myself.

This is a can or worms that shouldn't be opened. In my experience if teachers would stop turning a blind eye bullying would disappear for the most part. The fact is teachers sometimes are right next to the kids teasing someone and they don't do squat!

After turning a blind eye so long and making students feel like crap the teachers are now feeling the heat from being bullied themselves and the same people who told me to tough it out are now crying over what I and so many others went through. Maybe teachers need to do their damn jobs and grow some thick skin too.

Anyhow instant messengers and email have a blocking feature, if you don't want to hear from someone block them. They can make as many alternative profiles to attack you but eventually they will get sick of the hassle and get bored after being blocked so often. Same with myspace and facebook, you can block people. Kids get bored if they get no reaction. In fact my cell phone company blocks phone numbers and I doubt that someone will change their cell number just to bug you.

There are ways to stop this without criminal charges and courts.

Heck I have a teacher who constantly teased me in high school. The teachers need to get thicker skin and teach their students to hit the delete button.