Canada's missing medical students

[RB]

Mon, June 2, 2008

MANUFACTURING DOCTORS: Sun Media special report

By CHRISTINA SPENCER, SUN MEDIA

Toronto native Craig Stewart holds a bachelor of science degree from Queen's University, and a master's in behavioural neuroscience from Brock University in St. Catharines. From his early teens, he wanted to be a doctor. Link

My kid is weighting her early acceptance for Harvard and U of T forensics medical program. I was thinking since she is still a minor for her to stick around here in Toronto with a good medical school - be patriotic.

But with reports as above I guess it is best for the kids to move along rather quickly. I mean there are so many other reports of shortages of doctors that we have actually gone to lengths in importing them from overseas and yet this report tells a different story.

gasp

[Borg]

My kid is weighting her early acceptance for Harvard and U of T forensics medical program. I was thinking since she is still a minor for her to stick around here in Toronto with a good medical school - be patriotic.

But with reports as above I guess it is best for the kids to move along rather quickly. I mean there are so many other reports of shortages of doctors that we have actually gone to lengths in importing them from overseas and yet this report tells a different story.

gasp

Tell her to pack her bags - head for Harvard - great school and an impressive rolodex of contacts upon graduation. The alumni alone will provide her with something she could never get here in canada - support that is out of this world.

Come back to U of T for advanced training if she wants - even more contacts.

To get a Harvard invite is world class - be proud and encourage her to go.

Bet she gets an offer that she cannot refuse out of Harvard.

Patriotism be danged - go to the place that provides something she will not get here in canada - a look at life outside this sphere of waffling.

Borg

[RB]

isn't it about brain-drain if we allow our own to leave. Ireland and Australia welcomes the lot with open arms and they report that they are happy

I mean is no-one concern that we have to import professionals and offer them compromising programs and allot space, and be lenient and mushy so that the foreign trained professionals are given a chance to succeed

Question is are we compromising our health to be a certain standard and look to find a good Canadian doctor in the US, and elsewhere

[guyser]

isn't it about brain-drain if we allow our own to leave. Ireland and Australia welcomes the lot with open arms and they report that they are happy

How much of this is due to 1-tuition, since UofT et al can charge big bucks to foreign students 2-young people wanting to see the world and get a degree 3- lower standards for admission?

More doctors are returning than leaving, reversing the tide that peaked in 1995.

[Borg]

Whether more are returning or not, the fact remains this is an opportunity for this kid - Go!!

As for brain drain - well this is a different world - hence no real borders. The older generation has fancy ideas on patriotism while the younger generation as a whole does not have those same ideas.

Opportunity and money and adventure often far outweigh the grind of traffic in downtown montreal, toronto or other major centres filled with human resistance folks who hire on the basis of your degree and often pay less than a tradesmans wages.

I am out of this country for a year as of July - maybe two.

I do it for the wallet and the adventure.

Love that tax free salary and benefits.

The risk is even more fun.

To heck with the canadian borders and patriotism - I do this for me.

Young folks see the salaries in the paper - along with the cost of living and taxes and realize advancement in a foreign country is faster and often easier.

Can't do that in canada - land of the "take from the worker" tax machine.

Heck to bring home 100K you nearly have to make 200K and then it can cost as much as 800 bucks a month for transport and parking to go to work. I live it.

Before any smarties tell me to take the bus - find it here and i would use it - simply not there.

Importing professionals? Heck I would not want too many of those third world doctors working on me - make it attractive and our people stay home - do nothing and they will be happy to leave. After all canucks of convenience in Leb country can do it - so why not one who was born here?

Borg

[RB]

How much of this is due to 1-tuition, since UofT et al can charge big bucks to foreign students 2-young people wanting to see the world and get a degree 3- lower standards for admission?

More doctors are returning than leaving, reversing the tide that peaked in 1995.

You are correct about the cost of medical school $17,000 per academic term to a debt tune of $150,000 at the end of the program Link, an international student would really have to be rolling in dough (pardon the pun)

Although many doctors are returning the avg age of the doctors are 49 and 28% of doctors are over age 60, so, it really do not sort out the shortages

I think the future of young doctors approach to work emphasize the importance of work-life balance, I see this trend with our family doctor in his 40's. He actually takes time off and would not see as many patients as an older doctor

Edited June 6, 2008 by RB

[madmax]

My kid is weighting her early acceptance for Harvard and U of T forensics medical program. I was thinking since she is still a minor for her to stick around here in Toronto with a good medical school - be patriotic.

Sounds like you have a great kid with great opportunities. U of T is excellent, so there is no problem if accepted. Harvard won't be challenging on the academic side, but the social side, and the networking connections are unobtainium for the majority. Going to Harvard can change peoples lives dramatically, with all the connections and opportunities that arise.

Your daughter has great choices and opportunities ahead. I am certain no matter what choices she makes, she will remain a patriotic Canadian. No matter where she continues her education and career.

Best of Luck

[RB]

Updated: Mon Jun. 16 2008 5:48:19 PM

Ont. introduces bill to get more foreign doctors

The Canadian Press

Ontario Health Minister George Smitherman says the government's new bill will help bring more foreign doctors to Ontario hospitals.

how about it, fixing our shortages problem...

[Fain]

U of T can't compare. Harvard is another class entirely

[RB]

U of T can't compare. Harvard is another class entirely

I guess.

Thanks all for your encouraged words. Because my kid is still under 18 (we still have to babysit), she registers tomorrow at U of T for the next 2 years and then proceeds to that "other" class. She is excited to get started as she had the opportunity last year to spend time with the Ph.D. students examining cells, thanks to support from her high school. As parents we are very pleased, U of T has the best medical school in the country.

I keep thinking there is so much opportunities and future for young people, all people and yet we hear the distressed stories of those rejected or looking elsewhere perhaps for easier routes for their choices.

I mean are we failing some of own?

Edited June 24, 2008 by RB