Topaz Posted December 7, 2007 Report Posted December 7, 2007 Why hasn't Harper met with ALL of the Premiers as thy have been asking for one and he's yet to make? Harper seem to be travelling around this country but doesn't make a effort to meet with the Premiers. Quote
Wild Bill Posted December 7, 2007 Report Posted December 7, 2007 Why hasn't Harper met with ALL of the Premiers as thy have been asking for one and he's yet to make? Harper seem to be travelling around this country but doesn't make a effort to meet with the Premiers. For the same reasons Trudeau shunned them - he gave them a meeting and all they did was gang up on him with excessive demands for money! After the first time he swore "Never again!" and he stuck to his oath! Quote "A government which robs Peter to pay Paul can always depend on the support of Paul." -- George Bernard Shaw "There is no point in being difficult when, with a little extra effort, you can be completely impossible."
Topaz Posted December 8, 2007 Author Report Posted December 8, 2007 For the same reasons Trudeau shunned them - he gave them a meeting and all they did was gang up on him with excessive demands for money!After the first time he swore "Never again!" and he stuck to his oath! If that the way he thinks , he's a coward and not a PM! Run away from one's problems only creates bigger ones! Quote
Wild Bill Posted December 8, 2007 Report Posted December 8, 2007 If that the way he thinks , he's a coward and not a PM! Run away from one's problems only creates bigger ones! Then Trudeau was also a coward? Quote "A government which robs Peter to pay Paul can always depend on the support of Paul." -- George Bernard Shaw "There is no point in being difficult when, with a little extra effort, you can be completely impossible."
fellowtraveller Posted December 11, 2007 Report Posted December 11, 2007 No, Trudeau was a fierce federalist/centralist and he didn't meet with the provinces because he did not give a rats ass about what they thought. Quote The government should do something.
Newfie Canadian Posted December 11, 2007 Report Posted December 11, 2007 No, Trudeau was a fierce federalist/centralist and he didn't meet with the provinces because he did not give a rats ass about what they thought. Here, here! What possible outcome could come from a First Minister's meeting besides division and all party's sniping at each other? It would be the wrong message to send to the federal electorate and Harper knows it. Quote "If you don't believe your country should come before yourself, you can better serve your country by livin' someplace else." Stompin' Tom Connors
Wild Bill Posted December 11, 2007 Report Posted December 11, 2007 No, Trudeau was a fierce federalist/centralist and he didn't meet with the provinces because he did not give a rats ass about what they thought. My post was not based on my opinion but rather on history I have read about Trudeau's time in office. His experience with a premiers' conference was a historical fact. If I trip across one of my books that contains the reference I'll post it for you but frankly I'm not going to spend a lot of time searching just to educate you about history. Believe what you like. You won't change what happened. Quote "A government which robs Peter to pay Paul can always depend on the support of Paul." -- George Bernard Shaw "There is no point in being difficult when, with a little extra effort, you can be completely impossible."
Moxie Posted December 11, 2007 Report Posted December 11, 2007 Well Trudeau was a socialist head case who didn't care what anyone outside of his beloved Quebec thought. He was an elitist socialist fool. He was voted the most disliked PM in history wasn't he? Quote Socialism is a philosophy of failure, the creed of ignorance, and the gospel of envy
fellowtraveller Posted December 12, 2007 Report Posted December 12, 2007 My post was not based on my opinion but rather on history I have read about Trudeau's time in office. His experience with a premiers' conference was a historical fact.If I trip across one of my books that contains the reference I'll post it for you but frankly I'm not going to spend a lot of time searching just to educate you about history. Believe what you like. You won't change what happened. Dou you contend that Trudeau was not a fierce federalist who strongly favoured a strong central government? That implies that any meeting to discuss new powersharing or devolution of funding would be anathema for Trudeau, and they were. He had no interst in the West because they wanted more autonmy and delivered few seats for him. He did have a bit of interest in the howlings of Central Canada and the Maritmes because they did deliver seats. Sure he met with the provinces, which he would view as a waste of time because he had no intention of kowtowing to any financial demands, unless they served a larger poltical need. And that is the essence of federal provincial meetings, the provinces dunning the feds for whatever they can get. Quote The government should do something.
Wild Bill Posted December 12, 2007 Report Posted December 12, 2007 Dou you contend that Trudeau was not a fierce federalist who strongly favoured a strong central government? That implies that any meeting to discuss new powersharing or devolution of funding would be anathema for Trudeau, and they were. He had no interst in the West because they wanted more autonmy and delivered few seats for him. He did have a bit of interest in the howlings of Central Canada and the Maritmes because they did deliver seats.Sure he met with the provinces, which he would view as a waste of time because he had no intention of kowtowing to any financial demands, unless they served a larger poltical need. And that is the essence of federal provincial meetings, the provinces dunning the feds for whatever they can get. No, I simply said that Trudeau had one and only one premiers meeting which he considered such an aggravating failure that he was quoted as saying "Never again!" I cited an historical fact. Don't put words in my mouth. If you're looking for a Trudeau champion to rail against I'm afraid you've chosen the wrong boy. I didn't like him then and I've never changed my opinion. Quote "A government which robs Peter to pay Paul can always depend on the support of Paul." -- George Bernard Shaw "There is no point in being difficult when, with a little extra effort, you can be completely impossible."
guyser Posted December 12, 2007 Report Posted December 12, 2007 He was an elitist socialist fool. He was voted the most disliked PM in history wasn't he? Nope, the best liked. See it here http://www.canadainfolink.ca/pms.htm Third place-favourite Canadian. CBC contest. Beat out Pearson, McDonald but lost to Tommy Douglas and Terry Fox. Quote
Shakeyhands Posted December 12, 2007 Report Posted December 12, 2007 Well Trudeau was a socialist head case who didn't care what anyone outside of his beloved Quebec thought. He was an elitist socialist fool. He was voted the most disliked PM in history wasn't he? Voted Greatest Canadian no less.... Pierre Trudeau was the top pick as the greatest Canadian of the 20th Century, a new national public opinion survey suggests. In second place was Terry Fox, the inspirational hero who tried to walk across Canada after losing a leg to cancer, while hockey great Wayne Gretzky was the top choice of living Canadians. ........... Former prime ministers William Mackenzie King, Wilfrid Laurier, John Diefenbaker and Brian Mulroney were also named in the survey, but received less than two per cent of the votes. http://www.canadainfolink.ca/pms.htm Quote "They muddy the water, to make it seem deep." - Friedrich Nietzsche
Fortunata Posted December 12, 2007 Report Posted December 12, 2007 He was an elitist socialist fool. I've heard Trudeau called a lot of things but never a fool. If he was a fool, that would make you ...... what? He was voted the most disliked PM in history wasn't he? No, Mulroney was wasn't he? Quote
jawapunk Posted December 12, 2007 Report Posted December 12, 2007 Well Trudeau was a socialist head case who didn't care what anyone outside of his beloved Quebec thought. That's why he sent tanks into his "beloved" province. The rest of the country applauded his actions, but many in Quebec question the necessity or if the FLQ threat was even that big. You obviously know nothing in regards to Trudeau's time in office. http://www.filibustercartoons.com/canguide_3_20-hist.php Quote Leg room, there is none.
jdobbin Posted December 12, 2007 Report Posted December 12, 2007 For the same reasons Trudeau shunned them - he gave them a meeting and all they did was gang up on him with excessive demands for money!After the first time he swore "Never again!" and he stuck to his oath! He did? How did repatriate the constitution? Quote
jdobbin Posted December 12, 2007 Report Posted December 12, 2007 My post was not based on my opinion but rather on history I have read about Trudeau's time in office. His experience with a premiers' conference was a historical fact.If I trip across one of my books that contains the reference I'll post it for you but frankly I'm not going to spend a lot of time searching just to educate you about history. Believe what you like. You won't change what happened. Let me see how many federal provincial meetings Trudeau held. Prime Minister: Pierre Elliott Trudeau31. Constitutional Conference Ottawa, February 10-12, 1969 – Constitutional review 32. Constitutional Conference Ottawa, June 11-12, 1969 – Constitutional review 33. Constitutional Conference Ottawa, December 8-10, 1969 – Constitutional review 34. Federal-Provincial Conference Ottawa, February 16-17, 1970 – Economy, Western agriculture, pollution, Tax Structure Committee 35. Constitutional Conference Ottawa, September 14-15, 1970 – Constitutional review 36. Federal-Provincial Conference Ottawa, September 16, 1970 – Various subjects including Tax reform, agricultural, economic stabilization fund 37. Constitutional Conference Ottawa, February 8-9, 1971 – Constitutional review, unemployment and northern resources 38. Constitutional Conference Victoria, June 14-16, 1971 – Constitutional review (“Victoria Charter”) 39. Federal-Provincial Conference Ottawa, November 15-17, 1971 – Economy, employment, fiscal arrangements, tri-level consultations 40. Federal-Provincial Conference Ottawa, May 23-25, 1973 – Various subjects including social security system, health programs, post-secondary education, regional economic development, economic situation, foreign land ownership 41. Federal-Provincial Conference of First Ministers on Energy Ottawa, January 22-23, 1974 – Various subjects including oil and gas policy, national energy policy and federal-provincial mechanisms for continuing consultation on energy 42. Federal-Provincial Conference of First Ministers on Energy Ottawa, April 9-10, 1975 – The state of the economy and oil and gas prices and other related items 43. Federal-Provincial Conference of First Ministers Ottawa, June 14-15, 1976 – Federal-provincial fiscal arrangements including shared-cost programs, revenue guarantee and equalization 44. Federal-Provincial Conference of First Ministers Ottawa, December 13-14, 1976 – Fiscal arrangements and state of the economy 45. Federal-Provincial Conference of First Ministers on the Economy Ottawa, February 13-15, 1978 – Various subjects including economic outlook and objectives, general economic policies, regional aspects of economic development, and sectoral policies 46. Federal-Provincial Conference of First Ministers on the Constitution Ottawa, October 30, 31 and November 1, 1978 – Charter of rights, distribution of powers, institutions, process of constitutional review (creation of the Continuing Committee of Ministers on the Constitution or “CCMC”) and duplication of services 47. Federal-Provincial Conference of First Ministers on the Economy Ottawa, November 27-29, 1978 – Various subjects including economic overview, labour market and employment issues, and economic coordination 48. Federal-Provincial Conference of First Ministers on the Constitution Ottawa, February 5-6, 1979 – Various subjects including consideration of questions raised at the Constitutional Conference (October 30 – November 1, 1978) and future constitutional work program Imagine that...every year. And sometimes more than that! And after one short meeting held by Clark, we have all of these. Prime Minister: Pierre Elliott Trudeau50. Federal-Provincial Conference of First Ministers on the Constitution Ottawa, September 8-13, 1980 – Various subjects including trade, communications, Upper House, Supreme Court, family law, fisheries, offshore resources, equalization, charter of rights, patriation and amending formula and powers over the economy 51. Federal-Provincial Conference of First Ministers on the Constitution Ottawa, November 2-5, 1981 – Consensus on patriation, constitutional amendment formula and charter of rights 52. Federal-Provincial Conference of First Ministers on the Economy Ottawa, February 2-5, 1982 – Economic management and development 53. Federal-Provincial Conference of First Ministers on Aboriginal Constitutional Matters Ottawa, March 15-16, 1983 – Various subjects including charter of rights, amending formula revisions and self-government 54. Federal-Provincial Conference of First Ministers on Aboriginal Constitutional Matters Ottawa, March 8-9, 1984 – Equality rights, treaties and treaty rights, land and resources and self-government And the meetings that Harper has had: 0 So glad I could look that up. Quote
jdobbin Posted December 12, 2007 Report Posted December 12, 2007 No, Trudeau was a fierce federalist/centralist and he didn't meet with the provinces because he did not give a rats ass about what they thought. He met with the provinces every year he was in office. Harper has met with them zero times. Why? Because he doesn't care. Quote
jdobbin Posted December 12, 2007 Report Posted December 12, 2007 No, I simply said that Trudeau had one and only one premiers meeting which he considered such an aggravating failure that he was quoted as saying "Never again!" I cited an historical fact. Hope you will correct this error. Please give the citation that he only had one meeting. I've given you meetings every year in office. Quote
Wild Bill Posted December 13, 2007 Report Posted December 13, 2007 Hope you will correct this error. Please give the citation that he only had one meeting. I've given you meetings every year in office. I plead old age! I'm going to dig into the dustiest part of my library. You've piqued my interest and I want to see the context of what I remember. I agree that obviously he held all those constitutional meetings. He had to! My memory was of premiers meetings where the discussion was on provincial rights, powers and federal monies. That was the context to which I was referring. Still, the fault over context was mine and I cheerfully concede to you as far as YOUR frame of reference! You'll have to give me a couple of days. I have several guitar players crying for their amps to be repaired. Would it surprise you that the ones most impatient procrastinate the most to come pick them up? Quote "A government which robs Peter to pay Paul can always depend on the support of Paul." -- George Bernard Shaw "There is no point in being difficult when, with a little extra effort, you can be completely impossible."
jdobbin Posted December 13, 2007 Report Posted December 13, 2007 I plead old age! I'm going to dig into the dustiest part of my library. You've piqued my interest and I want to see the context of what I remember. Harper may be the only prime minister is in recent memory not to have a First Ministers meetings. I'm not quite sure what the reason is because he really can't point to one bad experience that colours his feelings on the matter. Quote
fellowtraveller Posted December 13, 2007 Report Posted December 13, 2007 He met with the provinces every year he was in office. Harper has met with them zero times. Why? Because he doesn't care. So what if Trudeau met with the provinces? I've already explained why they were clearly meaningless. Pierre was not into power sharing or money sharing, centralism was heart and soul part of his makeup. Next, you'll be arguing that he was not dedicated to a powerful central govt, which de facto means that whatever the provinces wanted, they were going to have to fight him tooth and nail. The meetings Trudeau held were largely without meaning, other than to convince some yokels that he was somehow interested or conciliatory. Hold a meeting, hold your nose, then go home to Ottawa at first opportunity and take a shower. Film at six. Quote The government should do something.
.thumb.jpg.9a49e1b2f22a6d34a345152c50044aa9.jpg)
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.