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Facism, by definition is "state controlled capitalism" or "state run capitalism". What the NDP (and the majority of Canadians) want is "state run healthcare". Your attempts to equate the NDP's position with facism demonstrates either ignorance or a malicious attempt to distort the facts. Facism may or may not have anything to do with private enterprise or capitalism. But in essence, fascism involves state control of all aspects of life, dictatorship, and intollerence of different viewpoints. What I see in the verbal outbursts and intolerence of those like you is a fascist or neofascist mentality in that you want the state to control almost all aspects of life. You approve of social engineering and public 'education" projects to propogandize your beliefs, and laws which control behaviour and words beyond our traditional control of what is harmful to others. Argus, Because you use the term facism so flippantly (and obviously don't know what it means), I thought I'd help you so that you have a better idea what the term means, and maybe won't look so foolish next time you use it. I have provided a list of the 14 key points common to facist governments, taken from www.omnicenter.org/warpeacecollection/facism.htm Argus, This sounds a lot more like the Conservatives than the NDP. (Actually, it sounds very like another un-named country just south of us). You'll note that (refer to point number 9) in a facist state, the government helps its "friends" capatilist ventures... such as the type of health-care that you promote. You'll also note that from point 10, facist states are against organized labour and labour unions. The NDP party could never be accused of this. (You'll note that you've got several posts that link you to point number 5. So do I take it that the political position of the party(ies) that you would support are similar.)

If you expand on the half-truths in the above statement, you may arrive at a different conclusion. Of course people want lower taxes.... An our past few federal governments (of both flavours) have been good tax cutters.... except they've only really cut corporate taxes, and business taxes... They run on platforms of "lowering taxes", but who for... not for the majority of Canadians... just corp Canada and the investor class. The NDP is for removing some of the loopholes and allowing corporate taxes to rise (at least to the level that they are taxed in the USA) When this is accomplished, the government will be in a position to lower taxes for the majority of Canadians... who the government is supposed to represent...

Facism, by definition is "state controlled capitalism" or "state run capitalism". What the NDP (and the majority of Canadians) want is "state run healthcare". Your attempts to equate the NDP's position with facism demonstrates either ignorance or a malicious attempt to distort the facts. If I am correct, what you stand for is private enterprise being paid to provide healthcare.... In other words you are for "STATE FUNDED CAPTIALISM" which is a lot closer to the definition of "facism" than non-profit state-run healthcare that the NDP (and majority of Canadians) want. Gee... if an unsuspecting reader were to read the above quote, I think they'd question where the "hate and rant" was eminating from. It would seem to be coming from those who want to oppress the NDP, and compare them to "facists", when their own position is clearly closer to facism than what the left supports.......

I'll be happy as soon as you grasp the point, but I'm not holding my breath. I have to agree with Miss Trudeau and PocketRocket on this one.... The USA should practice their own kind of make-believe freedom on their own soil... and remember that Canada is a sovereign nation.... And Paul Martin needs to make that clear.... but will he...

Brian Mulroney fixed this problem that existed when he got in... with patronage appointments of Conservative... Then Jean Chretien fixed that problem when he got in... with patronage appointmens of Liberals... So what do you think will happen if the Conservative/Evangalis/Reform/Alliance party gets in..... three guesses...

You right wing wanna-be's aught to come up with something more original than the old school-yard "I know you are but what am I" argument.... It would appear the well (of brain-dean ideas) has run dry....

It was part of their last federal election platform. They have since changed their web site.... Why don't you email Jack Layton... his address is [email protected] Because it is a federal matter ????? What a good idea. Why don't you email Jack Layton... I guarantee he'll answer.However, since you challenge the credibility of the NDP on issues, how about asking the Conservative/Alliance/Evangalist/Reform opinion on abortion.... Where do they stand... because they toned it down significantly and then denied their position before the previous election.... When the cock crows three times, or when the Gomery inquiry comes out, what will their position be....

I'll give you credit for being honest about your knowledge of politics and how you choose who to vote for....

Did you call the number on the Mark Emery video and try the stuff out... That doesn't even look like Layton...You Conservatives have to get your facts straight... and try to have some semblance of credibility.... err.

Actually, there was a whole page on it last year. It doesn't appear to be there right now, but they do have to continue to update their site... We're still waiting for it to happen... If you'll note, there's been some activity on that front federally.... Perhaps this is a good time for it to go ahead, with a minority government.... The deep-rooted Liberal principles (anything to stay in power) will probably force them to capitulate on this issue.... However, there are more pressing items on the agenda for the upcoming months, so hang on tight and we'll see what's coming....

I love this line. Cracks me right up. Eureka, Take a look at this older post that talks about comparisons of efficiency/bureaucracy... http://www.mapleleafweb.com/forums/index.p...ic=3577&hl=blue cross&st=15# PS. I doubt Cybercoma will bother to look at it in case it contains offensive truths...

Wow.... step aside Ernst Zundell.... Mr. Open-minded is coming through, and you won't want any of the stuff coming out of his mouth to get stuck on your suit.. or the bottom of your shoes.... It would appear to me that, based on your open-minded expressions of your perceptions, that you haven't spent much time in higher education, or in educating yourself by reading much more than "The Sun".... It is interesting that you so vehemently defend a class that you obviously don't belong to.... could it be the result of brainwashing ???

You sound like an ignorant gay-bashing low-life thug, and it takes away any credibility that you might ever have earned (from gullible people) with your arguments. Your attempt to paint the NDP party and its policies based on one MP who has embarrased himself is pathetic.... If that's the kind of argument you have to resort to in your quest to promote the Conservative party, then I would have to say... if you've got nothing intelligent to say... say nothing...

I've not seen a lot of quotes from Liberal or Conservative type posters on this forum who seem to think anything that our recent history (20 years) governments have done has improved medicare. Instead, all I hear is these types slagging our health care system... and the governments that have helped degrade it.The system needs reform but the NDP are fixated with a model where the gov't pays for 100% of a medical expenses that are incurred in a hospital but 0% of services outside of a hospital. Every other non-US system I have looked at pays for less in hospital services but covers a much broader range of services outside a hospital (i.e. dental care). I think you mean that the government pays 100% of publicly funded health care and 0% of private health care ??? I agree with that assessment, and direction. If private companies wish to compete with the public system, let them, but no public money should go to pay for them.... (I do like your idea of publicly provided dental care though...) All parties are concerned about middle and low income families. The difference is The Liberals and Conservatives understand that taking a hostile 'rich are evil' attitude hurts the poor in the long run. Balancing the need to encourage the private creation of wealth with the need to ensure the poor have their basic needs met is a complicated task. The NDP does not understand this. I don't think the NDP has a 'rich are evil' attitude at all. I think the NDP is more about being fair to all people. If that means removing some tax shelters from Corporate Canada or the wealthy class so that our tax system really is progressive, and it benefits the majority of Canadians, then I think it is good policy. The NDP stands for the MAJORITY of Canadians, unlike the Liberals and Conservatives who favour the wealthier classes. I see a problem wherein the NDP's attempts to improve the lot of the lower and middle-income Canadians (the MAJORITY of Canadians) is perceived as, or rather, painted as an 'attack on the rich', and 'hatred of the rich'.... It is in the interests of the rich and Corporate Canada to keep the incredible benefits given to them by the Liberal and Conservative governments... ... "Lose a tax loophole where I can hide my income so that some lazy person doesn't have to work as hard."... Of course they will be against the NDP... and put their money where there mouth is.... They'll scream blue murder.... They can afford a massive advertising campaign to try to stop the NDP (and promote Liberals and Conservatives) ... because the NDP might try to end their unfair advantages.... If you need examples of how the Liberals and Conservatives favour corporate Canada and the wealthier classes, just let me know... I'll respond in volumes.... But you probably already know about it... don't you....

What is presented in this article is not the NDP position. Most readers would recognise the author of your quote to be an extreme right-wing wing-nut who has taken to attacking Jack Layton personally with his straw-man arguments. (birds of a feather.... . ya you Canuck..) This slur would definitely be to try to discredit some of Layton's stances that Canadians clearly agree with...

I've not seen a lot of quotes from Liberal or Conservative type posters on this forum who seem to think anything that our recent history (20 years) governments have done has improved medicare. Instead, all I hear is these types slagging our health care system... and the governments that have helped degrade it. It is interesting to note that these (Liberal and Conservative) governments (and the sheep that follow them) have always said that the NDP approach is no good. That is what the Liberals and Conservatives said about health care when the NDP (then CCF) was promoting the impementation of a universal health care system. The NDP got us the health care system, despite all of the resistance from the Liberals and Conservatives. It would seem to me that if you kept vascillating between a GM garage and a Ford garage to fix your Porshche, and they kept just breaking it further, wouldn't it make sense to try the Porsche dealership. They might be a bit more expensive, but the are probably the people to go to to get your Porsche fixed.... I'll admit that there is something wrong with my analogy.... the part about them being a bit more expensive... I'd have to say, that that is only true if you are in the upper-middle to upper income families.... Because the NDP is one of the only parties whose policies focus on the lower and middle-income families... the majority of Canadians...

I think that Newman has hit the nail on the head !!! He's said a lot more than this though... See it at theTyee.ca - Peter Newman Tapes

Canada not prepared for Mars attack either !!!! Actually, I think it is "terrorism prevention" that we should aim for instead of "anti-terrorism prevention"... Maybe we could get higher on the list by posing for pictures with George Bush, calling them "Islamofacists" and "scumbags" a little more... "come and get us"... Childish ..... huh... Saddam's greed?? he took his country's life savings an put them in PM's company to make a fortune ???? Who's fighting... I thought it was George Bush who declared a war... not Canada... "Fighting back" assumes that we've been attacked..... and as far as I know, Canada has not been attacked... How do you fight an "invisible" enemy... wave a red flag for the bull so that he attacks, so that you have a reason and opportunity to fight ??? Take on Nazis.... do you even know what a Nazi was.... or just that they were bad guys a long time ago.... re-read line above.... (a few times if that's what it takes).

I'm sorry for the distraction, Stubblejumper, but this is a relavent, parallel case. Did you know that Ontario law stated that citizens couldn't be charged for the construction of nuclear reactors until they went into commission. Darlington went into service the week Bob Rae's NDP government took power. This ridiculous law was one of the major reasons for the accumulation of debt. You can choose to ignore the fact that the new owners of our hydro-electric generating stations are gouging us now. When the public owned the hydro-electric generators, it amounted to a huge subsidy in the cost of our hydro. Now, Stubblejumper, back to how this applies to health care. If the "provider" gets to charge a profit, it will cost more than if we owned the system, by more than just the "profit" that is taken by the shareholders. We also have to consider that the government can build the facilities and purchase the equipment cheaper than can private industry. This is so because the government can borrow at lower rates than private industry. Thus, the private provider's costs will be elevated by the increased finance costs. One can then argue, as Canuck already has, that any public system is rife with inefficiency and bureaucracy. Private industry that wants to capitalize on the sale of public assets has a great interest in exposing any inefficiencies, and then tries to pretend that they will provide the same service "more efficiently", and hence require less remuneration.... Which all might sound wonderful to a fool... who doesn't realize that business is trying to get our tax dollars....

You obviously don't know anything about electicity generation in Ontario... The problem was more that we had an evil spirited government (of the Conservative variety) who didn't care about the public welfare as much as their own private agenda. They (Mike Harris et al.) reduced taxes to the point of extreme deficit in their first term. In order to hide the deficit when running for their re-election, they fire-sold all kinds of public assets ---- the 407, electric power generating station, etc... all so they could stay in power.... It wasn't for any other reason than to save their own skin, to get re-elected.... There was no public benefit intended in their actions... and none realized.....

Paying 0.50 cents per kWh was ridiculously low. Especially considering the capital costs of those nuclear plants. Oh wait - the publicly run utility NEVER tried to recover capital cost because the politicians didn't want to charge people real costs for electricity. The fantasy is that the public sector could provide anything at all without running the system into the ground. Right now in Alberta, the spot market price for electricity is about 2 cents per kWh and new facilities CANNOT be justified economically at this price - because we have enough capacity now. And this winter it will be beneficial to me to partially heat my house with electricity because it's cheaper than natural gas. When Ontario owned the electricity generating capabilities, it generated hydro-electric electricity for 0.5 cents per kilowatt hour, coal powered generation for 2.7 cents per kilowatt hour, and nuclear for 7 cents per kilowatt hour. They used to add up the costs for generation and arrive at a sale price of about 4.5 cents per kilowatt hour. They never sold electricity for 0.5 cents per kWh... only a dummy would do that, or even imagine that the province would have done that.... Now that they sold of the hydro-electric generating stations, the new owners can sell the electricity to the province for 16.5 cents per kWh.... One example of smart conservative financing was the sale of the three (3) Massasagi generating stations (near Thunder Bay) to Brascon (a division of Great Lakes Energy) for $340 million. Brascon paid for the stations out of their profits in 6 months.... that means that Ontario taxpayers are paying over $600 million more than they used to for the same amount of electricity from these stations... from now on.... Our electricity prices are far higher than they ever were... because of the efficient free market...

However, if you have as much as posession of a single joint on your record, you can forget being admitted into the "land of the free", just south of us.... Which, given the magnitude of the crime, in many circumstances is an unreasonable punishment... It could result in loss of employment with an international firm.... Inability to attend family funerals, etc....

I wouldn't say an ounce is a ton of weed. I'd say its the rough equivalent of 2 flats of beer. That would be about if you can get high off just one beer.....

I don't know if any of you guys are familiar with the fire sale of Ontario's power generation facilities. In the summer, the new owners can get 16.5 cents per kilowatt hour for electricity (hydro-electric) that we used to pay 0.5 cents per kilowatt hour.. all year round. Whether they run it more efficiently or not, we're still paying through the nose for this power..... You guys are dreaming if you think you can sell the farm and buy the fruit cheaper from the new owners....

You're joking, right ??? It will greatly increase the cost of whatever it is that you privatize.... Cost plus profit is more than cost.... always....