willy

Galahad, This will be my last post on this topic. This isn't going anywhere but to the old "I know you are but what am I." Chrétien was a great strategist. He would have to be with his limited communication skills. I do admire him for his talents and I try to learn what I can from anyone who is successful. It is what he did with those talents that offends me. Politics shouldn't be personal attacks, it should be about ideas. This I learned from Trudeau, and I don't agree with much that he did. Question how do you think I got a signed copy of Preston book if he didn't do it in person? He is a great man who changed the political landscape, and I hope his legacy has changed the Conservative Party forever.

You can only get better or worse. Things don't stay the same. In the Liberal watch, Our military is falling apart, We are paying more taxes for less service, Healthcare may only have a few years left, Our dollar has encouraged foreign ownership, Quebec is still voting for the Bloc. How is no leadership a good thing?

Thanks for the condescension Galahad always an effective argument. Why am I blind if I don’t agree? I obviously support Harper, his knowledge of policy, and how he would like to apply it. I do like a politician who is a great strategist. This alone is the thing that can get them elected. A bright person with a good idea has to be able to share it. This is where strategy is necessary. My copy of Preston book is signed as well. Signed books tell the same story. “if you are aware of Preston's thought process you can see that he was damning him with faint praise by saying that.” I don’t think Preston would dam anyone not even Stockwell. I guess I should read praise more carefully. When he criticized Harper for not working well with others and being arrogant was that then praise?

Holly Cow. You are a communist. I thought socialist but to go to the logical conclusion of this argument it is ultimate state control. I see the book 1984 flashing through my mind. Capitalism allows for a certain level of freedom. That is why I like it. What you are talking about is just scary. No point in refuting your other arguments. We are starting from a different founation.

Please don't confuse my like for privately run companies as a need to diminish proper regulation. All industries need regulatory requirements and the government should then hold them accountable to meet the requirements. I don't trust the power of greed to regulate. I do like the notion of accountability. A private company is beholden to the government to exist. If they gouged or don't produce you can tender the contract. In the public system you are stuck trying to motivate large bureaucratic beasts into efficiency.

"but most conservative governments advertise broad based tax relief to all industry. even the profitable ones..." As a Conservative, I believe I can't tell the future. From quarter to quarter you can not predict the winners and losers. Knowing which industry is going to be profitable is a crap shoot. Economic forecasts are like the weather. They seem like good predictions but too many factors are at play to know what will really happen. Broad based tax relief is based on that principle. Ahead of time you can't tell who will be successful. A secondary argument is that capital does not sit in accounts but gets reinvested and leveraged to make more money. (i.e. Makes more jobs.) Most major industry takes large amounts of capital to get started. We need profits in Canada to encourage growth.

"Any party can "believe" in something when they're in opposition. The farther away they are from forming a government the more they can "believe" in." * Harris changed Ontario. * Kline changed Alberta. * Campbell is changing BC. * Mulroney made many people very angry when he changed things. * Romano changed Saskatchewan. * Trudeau changed things. You might not like the result but you can't say they didn't believe in something. Chrétien and by legacy Martin don't have a vision. They don't believe in something. Where was/is the leadership? Chrétien’s legacy is that he said no to Iraq and left Martin with a mess. Time for a change?

"a recent study at ubc determined that our health care system is far from "in trouble"." This would be the only study in the last 15 years done in Canada to suggest that our health care system is sustainable. Have a look at the Kirby Report, Mazinkowski Report, or the Romano Report. They all had different solutions but the same diagnosis. The health care system is sick. The BC Liberals added $2 billion dollars to the provincial system in the last two years and the line ups grew. Health care currently takes 1/3 of the $33 billion budget and the cost is growing. (New technology, skilled labour shortage and an aging population) Everyone want public health care but how can we pay for it? What is wrong with public insurance and private delivery of service? If physicians or nurses work for government they still expect to profit. Can we not allow private companies to help with this enormous challenge? Where is the public good? Are we providing high paying union jobs or access to quality, timely health care?

Out sourcing human resources costs to Accenture is not privatizing BC Hydro. It is common practice in many large corporations to outsource things like benefits and payroll management. I actually think this is a good thing for our power prices. BC Hydro seems only to make money in spite of their large bureaucratic tendencies. As for education, if the federal Liberals would adequately fund transfer payments and not have some loans plan or scholarship plan we may be able to control the cost of post secondary education. I do think post secondary education should have a cost. For people to value things they need a cost. And the cost of a small car is comparable to a 4 year degree $20, 000.00. Not a bad deal and a very cheap loan program. This is capital investment. I spend money to become marketable. By the way my taxes do pay for much of student’s education and should probably continue to do so.

"b.c. when the Campbell government simply had to slander the ndp and not indicate what their own policies would be at all!" Are you delusional? What sources of information do you depend on? Do you just make this stuff up and hope people will believe it? The BC Liberals released a 171 point plan well before the election of what they would look like. I actually think they were too detailed and built an unrealistic with expectations. After you look at the financial books and thing happen you need to change plans. They said what they would do, and they are doing it. You might not like it but it was no secret. (Smaller government, more user fees, restructure healthcare and more private companies implementing programs.) It was clear. The NDP didn't need to be smeared. They did it to themselves. Do you need the list? Let’s just start with fast ferries.

Moderate Centrist, Why do you bother? "Anyone who believes corruption and scandal is going to be swept away and sanctity and purity reign supreme is living a pipe dream." It is not about sanctity and purity after all we are all people; it is about holding people accountable who become corrupt. And there is a difference between the Liberals and the Conservatives. The Conservatives believe in something. Others in the media have argued they should move more to the center. This only makes them Liberals and that is the root of the problem here. The NDP also believe in something and I just happen to think what they want won’t work. I do appreciate their idealism. Some of us don't want the New Conservative Party to forget its roots. The populism of the reform movement is a real change. This is the big difference form the old PCs.

What does that have to do with employement equity? Ralph must be doing okay as Albertan's keep voting for him. Their province by the way has the best health care in the country and with the work they are doing it will get better. Yes Ralph is a drunk, but he seems to be functional.

You can not send troops to support your largest trading partner and still do it with diplomacy. We insluted the states and didn't need to. And we did send ships to the gulf and continue to have troops in Afghanistan. All we had to do is wish them well, but no we had to make a scene. It didn't change the course of events. All it did was make it hard to get Bush on the phone for any issue. That is not a good example of great politicing.

Thanks for the interesting point of view. The movie did only depict the redemption side of Christ. The good news is the resurrection and the life explanation that came form the incarnation. Needless to say, I did see the movie and it was a powerful movie. It was just a move though and not an experience with God. It did a good job of showing the true (as possible in a movie) suffering of violence that movies tend not to show. The movie was only the last 12 hours of Jesus life and 10 seconds of resurrection. The topic of faith and politics is very interesting to me as I find politics can lack a clear purpose.

Cgarrett, if you need to have an example of why Kyoto is not practical I can give you a few. Let’s just start with one. We have no way of meeting our current power needs and still meeting the targets set by Kyoto. Example: Saskatchewan has no hydro and they must burn coal. Solar and wind are fine concepts but they do not produce the power needed. Unless we start building more nuclear there is no other option but to turn out the lights and shut down the factories. My guess is the Liberal didn’t care to meet the targets. There is no stick if you don’t meet the Kyoto targets. It was just good politics for them to sign on. I would trust Harper on economic policy more than you as he is an economist. What concept of trade do you hold? We have a massive trade surplus with the states. We sell more than we buy. Free trade as a big picture thing has been good. If we can convince our American friends to play by the rules (i.e. softwood lumber) it would be even better. Let me guess you would have voted for David Orchard.

Thanks for the voting advice cgarrett but most people on this site seem to be politically aware and are probably knowledgeable about whom they vote for and why. Your earlier example about the logging industry is a bad example. This is an industry that has been loosing money for a few years. Many of the mills on Vancouver Island and interior BC have closed. They have been challenged with our dollars strength, trade tariffs, high wages, technology improvements and environmental compliance. The growth in the logging sector is in Eastern Europe. They are kicking our butts and that is why mills are closing. Next time European countries protest our forestry industry be a little more Macavellian. Somethings we have control over and others we don't. Reducing taxes in a competitive market is sometimes the only way to make corporations competitive. Capital will move to competitive markets. The notion that we can just show up and make money is ridiculous. For us to enjoy wealth we have to produce it.

August1991, Just a quick note on Trudeau, he created a western separation party. This was a whole new wound, and he was aged with experience. Just to be clear I am talking about the National Energy Policy, and lets not forget why Quebec is not signed on to the constitution. He was also the brilliant leader behind the night of the long knives. How about old Jean? Would you like some pepper with that salt or tell Israel that they don't need that lake. Let's be clear our past PM's have made some huge blunders. In this context a new leader who was taken out of context in a couple of speeches seems minor.

Read Preston's book again. Before you quote something you should get it right. Preston gave him credit for being as I quote "a brilliant strategist." Harper and Anderson the other strategist didn't see eye to eye. That happens. Harper has also grown in the last twelve years. He started out a strategist and is growing into a leader. As for Stockwell, Preston had a lot more to say about him. The whole party shut him down. Before we look for Mike, and Brian’s support be sure you want it. The Harris government was just kick out of office and the west still hates Brian. As a national leader he would not want Ralph’s support either as he would risk reinforcing the perception that he is Alberta first. Galahad your judgment is proving questionable. This board is hard to spin on as most people here seem to pay attention. Stick to the truth.

And which party owns the last political scandal? A more relevant question I would think.

Was Jesus a liar, a lunatic or God? He said he was God, the bible recorded his miracles, he fulfilled prophecy and now over a billion people world wide follow him. I read Christian books and talk to Christian friends about Jesus but I do wonder what Joe six pack non Christian thinks. Is Jesus relevant? And a more secular political concern, If a politician follows Christ can they govern for those that don't?

"Some of the poster's here seem to think we're in store for a revolution. Let me remind you the new party is a party of politicians so you'd better check your idealism at the door." There is a place for idealism in politics. We need a vision of something better. We need to state our values and our plans. This should bring hope for a better future. Anything less would be pointless. I will be realistic with my expectations but not the direction.

Change this assumption a little. People from both genders and diverse ethnicities are qualified to hold government jobs. If they are not equally represented why not? (Example first nations in the RCMP) If they are not proportionally represented our government should work to enable those communities to provide qualified candidates. Forced employment quotas do not help community development or build a strong civil service. For our civil service to function it needs diversity. It is the government’s responsibility to encourage the elimination of the barriers to full participation in our civil service for all Canadians. August 1991, we do have discrimination in Canada. Cultural and ethnic groups do face structural issues from education to job opportunities. You should not diminish the need to support these groups. The First Nations in this country have been systematically subjugated by the Indian Act. To change this we will need to build bridges and not pretend it does not exist.

We are a confused country. For three terms we elected a government that pretended to be both left and right. More regional programs and cuts to transfer payments were the policy. Appear fiscally responsible while beholding new groups of influence with new directed dollars. (Regional development, corporate subsidies, promotion, scholarship programs) As I accuse the Liberals of action over the last 10 years, I realize what they really lacked was action. The Red Book was their plan but little ever happened. They managed the country as administrators, but did little to lead. The one big new thing was the Gun Registry and it doesn't work. I think Canadians feel most comfortable with the status quo. Very little new policy enacted and then have the courts use the charter to sort out any internal problems. We have had a very reactive government that has spent most of the time playing politics. They are fear mongers of both the left and the right. The curious thing is the Conservative and the NDP represent real change. Now the Liberals have lost the confidence of Canadians will the country go for less or more government?

Maplesyrup, I was not attaching value to an economic class. All individuals are equally valuable. If you have read any of my other posts you would realize that I think business owners and workers need to work together for them to mutually benefit. I object to the right of entitlement. By simply existing you should not receive a standard of living that is equal. Nice utopia but not realistic or sustainable. Those who cannot provide for themselves should be helped but that does not extend to a perfectly employable individual. Barriers to self sufficiency need to be removed and that is the role of government not business. Other posts are confusing conservatism with the Conservative Party. The Conservative Party sees a clear role for government in regulating business and punishing crime.

joseph13, Let me guess you don't have any money. And for students they are heavily subsidized. For the cost of a new car they can have an education that lasts a life time. It was the Liberals that cut the federal education transefer payments and put in its place programs for student loans. It is also possible to go to school and come out without any loan, I did. It is called working for a living. For this country to afford all those great programs you referred to we all need to add value to the economy. And for the PC Ontario party, you smear them with scandal but you don't refer to the details. My guess is you really didn't like the downsizing of government and this is what left you with such a bad taste.