msj

How does anyone know who among the Muslims present want to murder all Jews? Just because some crazy guy says something does not mean everyone within ear shot is going to support him and agree with him.

What a strange question. Of course I disagree with segregation of all kinds. However, I also realize that religious freedom allows for certain things as disgusting as they are. Should the State impose gender equality on religious institutions? Sure, why not - if they want to avoid paying income tax, property tax and would like to receive any kind of government funding then yes, by all means go ahead. Good luck with the Supreme Court challenges etc... which is likely why this issue has yet to reach a head.

When I ask for a cite I expect a certain quality to it. Yours was lacking, to say the least.

Oh, ok, I forgot about the Queen. I'm no fan of her so we will agree to disagree here.

If I saw pictures of him on his Twitter stream talking to members of the church while standing with black people (just like the pictures of him with women at the Mosque) then I would say: good for him. He is making a point by attending, respecting their stupid beliefs in a polite manner, while also bringing women who have positions of power with him. It is subtle which is the point. It says: we share certain things but there are also differences.

We are not defending Islam. We are defending people's right to believe in stupid ideas which is protected under our Constitution.

Well he is our Prime Minister whether we voted for him or not (for which only the people in his riding are capable of doing) or whether we agree with him or not. Life is complicated - I agree with Trudeau on some things and not on others. Just like Harper, Martin, Chretien, Mulroney etc.... I suspect most of us are the same.

That's all you got? Really? Maybe some real source rather than someone's memory, no? As for wearing religous garb - I think if Quebec and Harper and the media would not make such a big deal out of it then there would likely have been little to no change. It is like banning a book - once you bring attention to it more people want to read it. Well, try banning religious garb and you find that more practitioners all of a sudden want to wear it even if they haven't before. This is basic human psychology here.

Nope. Some of us realize that the world is complicated and sometimes it makes sense to call people's ideas deplorable and sometimes it makes more sense to focus on similarities to bring people together. I think Trudeau was trying to do that. Should women be segregated? No. Is it allowed in certain conditions usually involving "freedom of religion" bigotry? Yes. Will it help if we were to force Mosques to not do this and force Christian Churches to allow for women priests, etc etc? Probably not.

I don't think he supports their beliefs such as killing Jews. I also don't think he supports segregation of men and women. Do you? I think he had a goal of trying to "build bridges" and focus on similarities between their community and the ROC as a means to get buy in to work towards common goals - for Muslims those goals are to have people allow them to practice their religious freedoms. For me it is for them to practice their religion to the extent that it does not violate secular law. I guess Trudeau would likely agree with me - along with many other Canadians. Sure, he, like Michael Hardner on this very forum, takes religious freedom too far, imo. But meh, that's a difference of opinion.

Nope, I am defending a person's right to believe in stupid ideas even when I disagree with them. I am defending a PM's right to visit a Mosque as a means to create relationships with a community where we need to build relationships even though there are fundamental differences. That's it, really.

Oh, then I guess you will point me to those citations supporting those facts?

Nice straw man.

Yes, because I believe people have a right to believe in stupid things so long as they do no behave in stupid ways (and that is when criminal justice system can step in). And our PM has a right to visit stupid people and tries to talk up the similarities between "them" and "us" although those strain credibility at times. I support our Constitution and think it is better to extend a hand to communities rather than make it between "us" and "them."

Maybe if he finds one in Canada then he may pay a visit. Will that mean he has converted from Islam to crazy Orthodox Christianity? If he then goes and visits a synagogue does that mean he will have converted to crazy Orthodox Judaism? Where ever he goes so goes his condoning of religious belief and approval of "their" behaviour I suppose.

This guy for one: http://www.patheos.com/blogs/friendlyatheist/category/steven-anderson/ At one time more Christians would have supported him than not. In modern times, thanks to the enlightenment, not so much. But all kinds of people believe in bad ideas - especially Christians, Jews, and Muslims. Thank GAWD for secularism though.

Yes, because there are not already a nauseating amount of threads criticizing Islam on this forum now. And so many people "defending" Islam too!

THIS MEANS WAR!!! This is increasingly turning into a Mad Magazine.....

Oh what a grand experiment it is too! Letting in the needy like we have never done before. As if such policies were not criticized before on the basis of people coming from the "slavic" parts of Europe, and then it was their "yellow skin and slanty eyes" and now it is their religion - well, I suppose it has always been about the wrong religion even if one was Catholic or protestant depending on one's perspective (which tells us how stupid religion is). People and their ideas change. Canada has become a liberal country thanks to people changing their values and ideas. Sure we could change back to a religiously conservative type country - which would likely share more values with conservative Christians than with people like me. But I doubt our PM visiting a mosque is a step down that slippery slope.

I'm more interested in 2nd and 3rd generation.

Sure, and look at how far Christianity has come. Christianity, too, has been deplorable. Now? Almost all grown up - thanks to the enlightenment and fewer Canadians taking it seriously, of course. Same can and will happen to Islam. Trudeau is not Muslim and he doesn't think Jews should be killed so I am sure this is just more hyperbole along the same lines of "Obama is a Muslim from Kenya...." and will pass in time.

I think change will come sort of like the quiet revolution in Quebec in the 1960's. One day mosques will find that the young are not coming because they have embraced secular values. Even those who do show up will be more secular than the previous generation. So, meh.

Earth to DOP, Earth to DOP, that is not how chronological time works....

So you think Trudeau is going to implement Sharia in Canada? This is going to be like Obama: after 8 years and we still do not see a mosque on every corner in the US, nor the confiscation of guns etc etc. Although I hear if Hillary wins there will be a Mexican taco truck on each corner.

You can hear priests rail against lots of people they are not a friend to. As I have already stated: spend some time with the Friendly Atheist and you will see videos for yourself (although BC_2004 warning - these are US content).