[How the NDP frustrates me]

Apparently its going to be next to impossible for me to run for the NDP next time around

Pegasus, if you want to get on the ballot for the next election, you should start working now.

1. Pick a riding with no NDP member and GO AND LIVE THERE. Otherwise you have to try and knock off a sitting NDP MP, which will put the whole local party against your interloping ways.

2. Join the NDP and find out all you can about the local riding association, and get involved with it.

3. Knock on EVERY DOOR in the riding and introduce yourself, while selling NDP memberships. You have time to do this. Should be about 40,000 doors. The more memberships you sell, the more the Party will like you.

4. Take on some local causes in that riding, advocate for people, and get known as a local activist. Try to get some media coverage, even if it is in the local free newspaper. Get some volunteers to help you with your local causes and nomination.

4. When the nomination meeting comes, make sure your new friends show up and vote for you.

5. Once Jack Layton signs your nomination papers, you are good to go!

In other words, I'd have to move tomorrow, spend alot of money I don't have, with probably little or no chance of being successful Some of these things I can do. Its the moving part, being the activist, and at the end, Jack Layton choosing someone else is what tells me that this all may be just a pipe-dream

But I really am going to try. I wanted to move to Ottawa in two years, but instead, I will try to do this in the next three or four months. I will quit my job here, and go there to look for another job. And hopefully the NDP has not found any candidates, by that time, for any one of the ridings they need them in.

[How the NDP frustrates me]

You ask me 'why', so start here:

http://www.elections.ca/content.aspx?section=pol&dir=can/bck&document=index〈=e

You will note for a start that yes, your nominators must be eligible to vote in the riding for which you are being nominated.

Next, West end Montreal, NDG/Cote-St.Luc/Montreal West is not a federal riding. Cote-St. Luc is mostly in Mount Royal; Montreal West is in Lachine; could be Westmount; could be Lasalle; could be....(None of them, by the way, were won by a 19-year-old, male NDP candidate, so that bit is either a mistake, or a lie. )

Soooo... we've established that you know sweet nothing about the organizational structure, processes or personel of the NDP party, and shockingly little about the federal structure of Canada.. certainly nothing at all about basic party function.... Soooo what were your superlative qualifications again? You are a volunteer for an unnamed charity and you have passed through that riding recently? Me, too. I have the additional qualification of being able to find the Elections Canada site on my computer, and reading it.

Now, I know I'm being more than a little rude here, but let that be some hint about how offensive I find your sense of entitlement. Who do you think you are, marching in with no facts and no grasp, no perspective and no background, magnanimously offering yourself for the endorsement of starngers?

Trust and respect must be earned, and you've done so little of it that you don't even know that it must be done at all.

AND... then we get to the qualifications of the folks who were given those endorsements.

This young woman is not a teen-ager, and she's not 'a barmaid'. She is three years older than Ralph Goodale was when he was elected for the first time. She has been self-supporting outside of partisan circles (ie has held down a real job) for, I believe, more years than Stephen Harper has done.

She manages- not slings beer for, but manages- a successful pub. She is a parent. And she has been involved with (not just 'votes for' or even 'held a membership in' the NDP party for 'years'. (That's that 'earned trust' thing.)

So perhaps you should tell me again how you are more qualified than she is... or for that matter, more qualified than any of the new NDP MPs?

I'm not going to answer all the points here, because most are just flaming, and I received a good response from another forum. But I will answer a few. You are correct, the name of the riding is called NDG/Lachine. The coordinates of the riding have been changed since I last lived there. I also never once said that this particular riding was won by anyone unqualified. The woman is a teacher and I have quite a bit of respect for teachers, for I am one also. The only problem I have with Ms. Morin is that she does not speak any English in a riding that has a population that is around 60% English. The NDG/Lachine riding includes the cities of Dorval and Montreal West, the borough of Lachine and the part of the neighbourhood of Notre-Dame-de-Grâce west of Hingston Avenue in the City of Montreal. Trust me. I know it very well.

Apparently, collecting the signatures was a waste of time. But if I could have run, which apparently I couldn't in which an explanation will follow, I'm sure the party could have collected the signatures themselves as they did for Ms. Brosseau.

If you need to know, even though this is not the type of place I like to bring up personal items, but I volunteered coaching Little League Baseball for ten years in NDG and Verdun, in Montreal and I helped deal with certain patients at the Douglas Hospital in Verdun for 2 years. (If any of you remember this in 4 years, happen to live where I hopefully will be running, I guess this is as good a place as any to put up my resume ) My mother also lives in Montreal West and my friends in NDG. Therefore I visit quite often.

Ms. Brosseau is a bar manager. I'll give you that. But I never called her a teenager. But the NDP MP representing Sherbrooke is, however, a teenager.

I too have had an NDP membership for many years. It was handed down to me by my father who also was a member of the Co-operative Commonwealth Federation. Do you know who they are? Well you should. If you do not, do a google search.

Anyhoo. As mentioned earlier, I now have a better understanding as to how all this works. This has been an awesome learning experience over the last two days and 4 years from now I will try to use this to gain myself a candidacy somewhere in this great country of ours.

vermonster

rabble-rouser

Member: 23993

Joined: Apr 24 2011

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May 8, 2011 - 9:28am

#35 (permalink)

Based on what you describe, your candidacy would have been rejected because you didn't follow the proper procedures.

You generally don't collect nomination signatures from the public prior to securing the party nomination. The party nominates people either through riding nomination meetings, or through designation by the party leader.

In most cases, this nominee is designated long before the election is called. If you approached the party 2 days after the election was called, in all likelihood there was already a nominee in the riding you were seeking to run. The in Quebec CIty you describe approaching was the campaign headquarters for the already nominated candidate, Raymond Cote, focused solely on getting him elected. It had nothing to do with the nomination of candidates.

The filling in of vacant nominations once the election is called is handled by the party headquarters. That's when we end up with situations like Bethier-Maskinonge, where they have to scramble to find a name to put on the ballot. Under those circumstances, the party headquarters would look at names of known party supporters and approach them about running. If you had previously been in contact with them about your interest in running for Parliament or known to them as a party activist, you might have been in a better position - that's why several of the candidates running were selected from things like university NDP organisatons. (My understanding is that candidate recruitment for Quebec this election was handled out of the party's Montreal office, and was loosely overseen by Thomas Mulcair.)

But the most important thing is to actually buy a membership in your riding association and getting involved there. That is how you find out when nomination meetings are happening, talk to activists and organisers about who is thinking about running in the next election, and help build an organisation on the ground for the party. (This is especially needed in Quebec, where most of our riding associations have historically been very weak).

Election campaigns don't begin 2 days after the election is formally called, they begin long before when parties select their candidates, lay the groundwork for the campaign, and build the infrastructure necessary to compete for votes. Walking into a party campaign office once the election has already been called and saying "I want to run for Parliament" is simply not how it is done.

Finally, I would suggest that if you were told you were "not qualified" it was not a comment on your professional qualifications, but rather a statement that you did not meet the qualifications for obtaining the nomination - because you didn't go through the procedures to obtain a nomination through a riding association or designation from Ottawa prior to collecting signatures, or because there was already a candidate officially selected where you wanted to run. Approaching a local campaign organiser in Quebec city about wanting to run in Montreal wouldn't have helped matters either - there is no reason that person, overwhelmed trying to put together a campaign organisation in the Quebec city region, would know anything about your home riding.

-----

To which I responded

Thank you. This was the best response I have heard It makes me feel better as to why I could not run. I obviously went about this the wrong way, and I apologise if I cased anyone to get angry on this thread. It wasn't my intention. I was just looking for the type of answer that was posted above.

I assume that holding a membership is not enough to gain candidacy in the NDP, so I will do as you suggest. Now with the NDP being as large as it is, here in Quebec, finding the association should not be too difficult. How much is a membership in a riding association? I don't earn very much money amd I have a large student loan still to pay off. But I am more than willing to work. I have already given my name to the local MP, Richard Cote. I'm just waiting to hear back so I can get started.

I really would like the opportunity to do this 4 years from now.

[How the NDP frustrates me]

Pegasus if you're a white guy you need not apply. Haven't you learned anything from Bob Rae Ontario? The NDP only wants women and minorities for their caucus now. They have enough white men.

I could understand. But I could have found better qualified woman who actually lives in Berthier-Maskinonge to run as a candidate, than the one the NDP asked to run.

[How the NDP frustrates me]

I have never been on welfare, (came close to needing it often though) and only once on UIC. The restaurant I was working at as a dishwasher at the time went bye bye. I personally believe that those who are on welfare or UIC should have to contribute to society while on it, such as through volunteering, if physically capable. While I was on UIC, I volunteered for a non-profit organization. I ended up volunteering for them for the next 10 years. I met alot of good people and I learned new skills. I also enjoyed it immensely

[How the NDP frustrates me]

On rabble you'll be banned if you are anything but the most rabid of the socialist breed. I go here often to read up on their pov though I don't post there. I find it necessary to know thine enemy.

I am a socialist, but not a rabid socialist. How about...like...hmmm...lemmee think...oh yeah...a "Realistic Socialist". Which to me includes creating social programs for the needs of today and potential needs of the future. All being "temporary" with the ability to be canceled once they have accomplished their goals.

[Richest people should offer job or pay bill for jobless people.]

Jobless people should get of their back sides and get a damned job. Their is always jobs available for people who want to work. Problem is so many of the "jobless" simply don't want to work and want to continue to collect EI after a 45 day work year or collect welfare until they're 65 then they want a more robust CPP and OAS so they can retire in style.

I understand your point of view. But sometimes people are underemployed. I have always worked. I am an English person who was educated in English and spoke English all my life. When I first came to Quebec City, I took jobs teaching English. I learned to speak French, and although I don't speak like a Quebecois, I can hold quite complicated conversations. I found myself more steady work, but I still conciser myself to be underemployed. I think that has more to do with the language than anything else. I've always figured that if I went west instead of East, I may have been in a better position today than I am.

[Richest people should offer job or pay bill for jobless people.]

I've personally always felt the greatest sympathy for the teenagers that work at McDonalds......constantly putting up with shit and abuse from ignorant people. With that being said, in many cases, that’s enough incentive for some to get a better job

I don't want to come of as condescending, and advice is cheap and opinions are free, did you ever consider going and working in the patch? If the physical work is not your thing, what about joining the armed forces? They're always looking for people with technical abilities, and you might find the lifestyle worth making a career out of, if not a few years in might allow you to take a few collage courses on your own, or depending on the trade you enter as, you might find something applicable in the civilian world

I have a double Major/Minor bachelor degree. If I entered the military, I'd go in as an officer. I tried once shortly after graduating, but I wanted to go into Intelligence. I had all the qualifications, but there were no openings. There were no open positions in any other field that interested me. I was a little interested in signals, but the only openings were for enlisted. Plus iif I were to go through basic training hell, it would have to be for something I really enjoyed doing.

[How the NDP frustrates me]

The election was only called on the 26th. I was actually way ahead of schedule http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Canadian_federal_election,_2011

[How the NDP frustrates me]

Hey, Pegasus

Why don't you try posting on rabble (www.rabble.ca) and asking the same question? That site is chock full of NDPers and I'm sure someone could address your concern or at least tell you where to take it. Be warned, though. There are some true believers who won't countenance anything that sounds like criticism of the NDP.

Good luck!

rabble.ca...Thank you. I was looking for a place where maybe I could find some answers. Writing the NDP party and my new NDP MP is getting me nowhere fast.

[How the NDP frustrates me]

Well, it seems like in Quebec, they didn't have the same degree of rigor that you had.

What I find even stranger is the NDP asked her to run, while I made it easy for the NDP and actively approached the party.

[How the NDP frustrates me]

I was in Montreal the weekend of March 19th and 20th, where I asked my frinds and family to sign my list, I then returned to Quebec and on the 21st, 22nd and halfway through the 23rd, I spent abut 4 hours a day, after work, collecting signatures. I went to the NDP office on Eugene-Lamontagne Ave. after work on Thursday the 24th.

So this was before your magical 26th. I wasn't too late.

[How the NDP frustrates me]

It is not because you were unqualified. That isn't how the party works your story is full of holes though. You went out to get signatures, brought them into the head office before you knew where they needed someone to run and asked them to run you somewhere. I am sure the NDP where making calls all March 26th trying to line up who they would run, if you were a week into the election and walked then you were doing it to late. They were pounding the pavement already by the 4th or the 5th. Heck they had all their candidate nominations approved by the 10th.

Sorry your story makes no sense. I have worked in the party in a number of provinces, never Quebec and it just does not add up.

Please explain to me what "holes" you are referring to.

I find it odd that the NDP had chosen their candidates before the official call of the election. Please explain how this works? And if this is the case, how come candidates were placed in ridings they have never visited or lived in before? What is the process of choosing what candidates serve which ridings?

I am curious. For future reference, you seem to know quite a bit about how the process works. I am interested in learning all I can, so that in four years from now I can be better prepared. From what you are telling me, its never too early to start the campaign.

[How the NDP frustrates me]

I moved into my ridding a few years ago. When I showed up there was no ridding association here either. I saw election planning being very week so I called up some provincial members I knew and we started the search for a candidate. From there people starting asking us about the ridding association so we called an AGM line up a list of people who we thought would help us figure it all it. Long story short we now have a NDP MP after a lot of hard work. That is what it takes.

I understand, but apparently not all ridings had candidates lined up less than a week after the call of the election. That was when I was prepared. I had people in the riding I wanted to run in who were prepared to help me out. I didn't do this all willy nilly. I went to Montreal and collected a few signatures from friends and family, then returned home to Quebec City and stood in front of a Maxi store and asked people to sign, because I planned to run as an NDP member in a riding in Montreal. I had no problems getting signatures.

I then figured I'd return to the NDP office here in Quebec, inform them I've been a long time member, find out which ridings are available, (preferably the one in Montreal where I grew up, but any would have been OK with me). I would have then traveled to wherever that would be (I had a few hundred dollars saved up), meet the people of that riding by going door to door and basically just enjoy the experience, with no expectations of winning. Just for the awesome experience so that one day I could say that I participated in this.

But I was rejected in 20 minutes, because I was considered unqualified. I'm sure other candidates the NDP ran were nowhere near as prepared as I was when they joined the fray.

[Richest people should offer job or pay bill for jobless people.]

Untill the unions priced them selves out of business, a buddy of mine works for a aero space company and he bends alunimum, for 25/hr plus bennifits, and now the owner is trying to control costs and they have now vote for a strike, good bye plant and 600 jobs.Canadian have gotten lazy and expect everything right away. You just can't blame the corporations and bamks and goverment all the time, we the people have to take some resposibilty also.

I'm not saying there are no lazy Canadians. However, not all are. I earn a little over minimum wage, and the work is hard, but not impossibly hard. I don't work in physical labor, but I work more on the technical aspect. The company I work for has a huge turnover rate, except for my department, due to the fact that the client base at the other departments are quite verbally abusive. When I first started at this company, I worked in one of those departments, and I can tell you for a fact, that I would not be working for this organization anymore if I was still in that department.

That being said, there are quite alot of people who go to work and deal with verbal abuse on a daily basis and do this for years. And for those who can't deal with it and leave, I cannot blame and say they are lazy. Some people just have a higher tolerance level for dealing with crap for a little more than $10 an hour.

But if I had a 25$ an hour job, working full time with benefits, a strike would be the last thing I would vote for. I would be able to finally save for the future. Especially a job where there does not appear to be any abuse of any kind.

[How the NDP frustrates me]

I am never one to give up. I thrive on challenges. I was orphaned as a child and worked myself through the various levels of the education system and since then, I have wanted to give back to my community all the things that were given to me. That is why I volunteered for so long, helping those who I considered to be most in need. I'm stating a fact that I love my country and would give anything to be able to serve it in one capacity or another. Right now, I work indirectly for the government, but I don't feel like I am actually contributing much. And since all my applications to work for the Federal Government have thus far been rejected or put on hold, I was hoping to run as a candidate for the party I have supported from the time I was first able to vote. That is why I feel unbelievably discouraged.

[How the NDP frustrates me]

Do you mean Brousseau? Are you aware that she has never even visited the riding she won? Never even been there!

Yes. I meant Brousseau. Whoops. BTW I have visited that riding.

[How the NDP frustrates me]

Head up to your local Liberal Riding Association and tell them your experience. Ask not what they can do for you, but what you can do for them. Participate in the rebuild. Get your ideas into the grassroots. Listen and provide honest feedback.

You are the type of individual that the Liberals should be actively seeking out and offering membership to.

I have really considered this. I figure the Liberal party has nowhere left to go than up. And if the NDP party doen't much care as to who runs as candidates, then it may not be the party I hoped it could be.

[How the NDP frustrates me]

Also - you would assume that the world is under control of the best and brightest. Not so! It is controlled by the ambitious......"The raging flames of greatness burn in but a few, the cool embers of success glow in many"...It is horrifically frustrating when you figure out the system. A personal example is the fact that I am a mature 60 year old man with a lot of skill - talent - in many creative fields...There is an older gentleman I have the odd chat with - He is an acquaintance from my distant past..There is a difference between us - I ended up on welfare - and he swings mulit-billion dollar deals. It was he who educated me on the fact that we live in a quietly repressive society.

He was born privledged and recieved the best training. I was the son of a Russian immigrant who endured the tail end of revolution and war. I have been in this nation all my life. The difference between me and my investment banker buddy is this - He has a rule of thumb...never help anyone unless it furthers your own position...His second rule is never give anyone anything ever - third rule...try to obtain your wealth and power with out cost - In other words plunder in a very sophisticated manner that is exceptable. BUT the conclution that is most frustrating is that this man knows that I am brighter - than he...and he makes sure that he maintains power...That is why the great artists all die in poverty while their works sell for millions years later.

To give a man money that is smarter than you is not smart...and even the not so smart understand that basic dogma. So to make a long story longer - you have to play stupid if you want to get ahead _ I did not know that and it is to late for me - but not for you.

Thank you. If you speak as well as you write, there may be well-paying jobs for you out there I will not give up, but I am not a great fan of the Reform platform. I plan to change my affiliation unless the NDP party accepts me as a participating member. If no, I will campaign against any NDP incumbent using the information that I have learned during this election process. Which party will that be? I have not yet made that choice, and I am hoping that the NDP party contacts me so that I can help them during the next 4 years, so I won't have to make that choice.

[How the NDP frustrates me]

Years ago I was in the song writing buisness and used to deal with major record companies - It's all about the worst and most insecure parts of human nature. For instanced a musical producer needs to have a job. Engineers need to work - all guard their positions. Like a political party that finally is established it becomes a closed shop... If I recorded a piece of music and the production was superiour to that of the established producer - I would be rejected. As a young person you assume if you are good at something that you will be excepted - of course why not you would think? BUT some times you are rejected not because you are bad - but because you are good.

The NDP used to be the common guys party - but they are now establishment. Establishment protect their perimeters. Put it to you straight and give you some advice - If you want in play stupid - don't show your cards and appear to be controlable.....getting back to the music industry - If a record company finds the artist to be great but uncontrolable - they will choose the less talented and more compliant over the more qualified...that's just the way it works - so dummy down!

So I basically should have dumbed it down for the NDP? I could understand this way of thinking if I was applying for a job at a gas station, but for one of the most important positions in Canada? This doesn't make sense. What kind of strange system is this, where if a natural disaster or war was to break out in Canada witbin the next four years that a few teenagers and a barmaid would be whisked away and get the full protection of the country, while those with any skill would be left to die.

[How the NDP frustrates me]

I'm thinking you didn't put much effort into any of this.

Apparently, neither did Rousseau. But at least, I would have put in a greater effort during the campaign than she did.

[How the NDP frustrates me]

I think you are just making this story up. Getting turned down by the NDP is like being refused a date back in high school by the least attractive girl in town...maybe you are simply inferior...turned down by the NDP? Holy cow - that is an insult!

I wish I was making this story up. To me it is one of the biggest jokes, and major insult that I have ever had to endure. And I am curious if there were any others who were also turned down as potential candidates for the NDP party, who had stronger qualifications than those who ran as candidates.

[How the NDP frustrates me]

First, yes, there was an NDP party there, even if there isn't much of one, and second, if you were turned down, there's far more to the story.

If there was, I had no idea where the office was (I called 411 for this information), however, once the election was called, I saw the campaign office on Eugene-Lamontagne Ave. here in Quebec City, and I went there.

[How the NDP frustrates me]

Then you should have participated in the party and got yourself nominated. You didn't. You could have ran as an independent new democrat. You din't. Too bad, so sad.

I wish I could have. There was no NDP party here before the election was called. Since the election, I have asked to participate, but once again, I was turned down I'm beginning to think the NDP party just wants stupid people in their ranks and any assistance is useless to them. Hey, they are the big official opposition now. They don't need any help from those who were around when the party had 20 or so seats.

[How the NDP frustrates me]

......'aspiring candidate' = Pegasus

..... who claims to have gotten 100+ signatures, presumeably endorsements of his nomination

......while living in Quebec City

..... but hoping to be a candidate in (best guess, Mount Royal in) Montreal.

West end Montreal, NDG/Cote-St.Luc/Montreal West riding, that is and yes, the signatures came from those who live mostly here in Quebec City, save for about 20 friends and family from the riding I wanted to run in. I was informed that the signaatures don't have to be from people in the riding you have to run in.

[How the NDP frustrates me]

Thanks, punked and Molly. That is excellent information!

In this new interview with Ruth-Ellen it says she was asked by the party to run in the riding. She works at Carleton in Ottawa, so she must be from the Ottawa-Gatineau region, but the riding she won is northeast of Montreal. It does say she's been with the party for years. Maybe she expressed an interest at some point and they looked her up when they found they were short of candidates.

-k

Short of candidates? Asked by the party? I could have run in that community and I speak French. The riding I wanted to run in is not far from this riding.