guyser Posted September 25, 2012 Report Posted September 25, 2012 Americans invented Thanksgiving. Got you beat by a few decades , 1578 w Martin Frobisher vs 1610 Jamestown,Virginia Quote
Guest Peeves Posted September 25, 2012 Report Posted September 25, 2012 Got you beat by a few decades , 1578 w Martin Frobisher vs 1610 Jamestown,Virginia Before that...you turkeys..... http://blog.beliefnet.com/virtualtalmud/2006/11/thanksgiving-is-very-jewish-holiday.html Thanksgiving Is a Very Jewish Holiday posted by mkress After Passover and Hanukkah, Thanksgiving is perhaps the holiday most observed by American Jews. It makes sense for a number of reasons, and not only because we Jews can’t pass up an excuse for a good meal. Thanksgiving, as in giving thanks, is a very Jewish thing to do. According to tradition, Jews are to give thanks 100 times each day. We are to give thanks before we eat, for having food, and after we eat, for having been able to have food. Each morning the traditional liturgy includes thank-yous for such simple acts as standing up and having the strength to get through the day. One more Jewish link is found in our Scripture: The initial Thanksgiving feast was probably based upon our fall thanksgiving festival of Sukkot (Tabernacles) But I think there is more to the American Jewish observance of Thanksgiving than our predilection to thankfulness. I think it has a lot to do specifically with our appreciation for and celebration of being part of life in America. America has been good to the Jews. We have always lived here in relative safety. Our rights as a minority religion are protected by law and the Constitution’s Bill of Rights. Though we may have experienced anti-Semitism at times here, it is nothing compared to the anti-Semitism our grandparents or great-grandparents escaped from elsewhere. Celebrating Thanksgiving, then, is part of affirming the American dream, in which peoples of all races, ethnicities and religions can have enjoy life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness. That is what real democracy, a democracy based on checks and balances and protection for minorities, is really about. While such a dream is not completely realized for all Americans, the potential for such a realization does exist. As Jews, we know that such values cannot be realized or retained unless they are transmitted. Perhaps that is why the American Jewish Committee recently created a lovely Haggadah (a service of sorts) for Thanksgiving that includes the stories of many diverse peoples and a litany of thankfulness that includes being thankful we can express, and change our opinions (another place that Jewish and American values intersect). Easily downloadable, the AJC Thanksgiving Haggadah can add meaning to a meal that all too often focuses either on the Turkey and fixings or on family tensions, thus redeeming the one holiday all Americans can truly share. –Posted by Rabbi Susan Grossman Read more: http://blog.beliefnet.com/virtualtalmud/2006/11/thanksgiving-is-very-jewish-holiday.html#ixzz27VdNLe3L Quote
Guest American Woman Posted September 25, 2012 Report Posted September 25, 2012 Got you beat by a few decades , 1578 w Martin Frobisher vs 1610 Jamestown,Virginia No siree, Bob! Americans invented it. We invented everything. So don't let those dates fool you. But actually, the first Thanksgiving was celebrated by the Spanish in 1565, in what is now St. Augustine, Florida. At least according to this site (and a few others, as well): The First Thanksgiving for the Spanish settlers was in 1565. It was held in the subsequent state of Florida. The celebrations took place at St Augustine, which is the oldest, continuously inhabited city founded by the Europeans in the United States of America. The First Thanksgiving for the English Canadians was in 1578. In that year, Martin Frobisher [c. 1535-1539 - November 15, 1594] held a celebration in the area of the subsequent Newfoundland and Labrador. But his celebration was more thankfulness for a safe homecoming than for a bountiful harvest. He had survived the perilous search for the Northwest Passage that later was to claim the lives of such intrepid explorers as Henry Hudson [d. c. 1611] and Sir John Franklin [ April 16, 1786-June 11, 1847]. The First Thanksgiving for the French Canadians was in 1604. It was held in the all male settlement that was started in that year on Ile Sainte Croix. The celebration was organized under the direction of Francois Grave Du Pont [November 1560-1629] and through the help of Samuel de Champlain [c. 1567-1580 - December 25, 1635]. The First Thanksgiving for the Pilgrims was in 1621. It was held in the subsequent state of Massachusetts. It most likely took place in what nowadays is called Plimouth Plantation. And it's been a national celebration in the U.S. since the Civil War, but not until 1957 in Canada. So there. Quote
guyser Posted September 25, 2012 Report Posted September 25, 2012 Before that...you turkeys..... http://blog.beliefnet.com/virtualtalmud/2006/11/thanksgiving-is-very-jewish-holiday.html Thanksgiving Is a Very Jewish Holiday And not a date in sight. One could argue the natives were with there blessings of a good harvest which predates either countries by a long shot Quote
Guest American Woman Posted September 25, 2012 Report Posted September 25, 2012 Why? Because a lot of people in many parts of the world think very highly of Americans - and a lot of Canadians don't. Quote
bleeding heart Posted September 25, 2012 Report Posted September 25, 2012 Because a lot of people in many parts of the world think very highly of Americans - and a lot of Canadians don't. Yes...but a lot of people in those many parts of the world do not think highly of Americans--and a lot of Canadians do. So I'm afraid I don't get your point. As a lifelong Canadian, I'm extremely aware of all the positive ways that Canadians tend to view our southern neighbours. Perhaps you haven't been subject to the complimentary views, but I assure you, they're legion. Quote “There is a limit to how much we can constantly say no to the political masters in Washington. All we had was Afghanistan to wave. On every other file we were offside. Eventually we came onside on Haiti, so we got another arrow in our quiver." --Bill Graham, Former Canadian Foreign Minister, 2007
Guest American Woman Posted September 25, 2012 Report Posted September 25, 2012 Yes...but a lot of people in those many parts of the world do not think highly of Americans--and a lot of Canadians do. So I'm afraid I don't get your point. I've traveled to quite a few countries, and I can name a number of countries where I felt that Americans were thought more highly of than they are in Canada, or at least thought as highly of as they are in Canada; perhaps more to the point, where I felt it, as an American. As a lifelong Canadian, I'm extremely aware of all the positive ways that Canadians tend to view our southern neighbours. Perhaps you haven't been subject to the complimentary views, but I assure you, they're legion. Sure I have, but I've been subject to the ugly views, too. Anyway, the original comment came across to me as 'in a world where Americans aren't thought very highly of, they are thought most highly of in Canada,' and I take exception to the whole idea of it. Quote
bleeding heart Posted September 25, 2012 Report Posted September 25, 2012 (edited) I've traveled to quite a few countries, and I can name a number of countries where I felt that Americans were thought more highly of than they are in Canada, or at least thought as highly of as they are in Canada; perhaps more to the point, where I felt it, as an American. Well, maybe so, but that's an impression. It's certainly no more valuable (to put it generously, given timelines) of my impression (matched by the poll in question), garnered from a lifetime of living here. Sure I have, but I've been subject to the ugly views, too. I don't doubt it a bit. Anyway, the original comment came across to me as 'in a world where Americans aren't thought very highly of, they are thought most highly of in Canada,' and I take exception to the whole idea of it. Yeah, well, in the end it comes down to a more or less immeasureable set of impressions and opinions for both of us, I guess. Edited September 25, 2012 by bleeding heart Quote “There is a limit to how much we can constantly say no to the political masters in Washington. All we had was Afghanistan to wave. On every other file we were offside. Eventually we came onside on Haiti, so we got another arrow in our quiver." --Bill Graham, Former Canadian Foreign Minister, 2007
Guest American Woman Posted September 25, 2012 Report Posted September 25, 2012 (edited) Well, maybe so, but that's an impression. Yes, an impression, based on experience, as an American. It's certainly no more valuable (to put it generously, given timelines) of my impression (matched by the poll in question), garnered from a lifetime of living here. You live in Canada, not the rest of the world, so what would a lifetime of living in Canada tell you about what other people think of Americans? Wouldn't my experiences, as an American, be a little more "valuable" as to how people feel about Americans having traveled and met Canadians as well as people from other places in the world? Yeah, well, in the end it comes down to a more or less immeasureable set of impressions and opinions for both of us, I guess. Sure it does. Which is why I said that I, as an American, take exception to it. Just out of curiosity - why do you think that Canadians think higher of Americans than most people do? Is it because you think that Americans are so well thought of in Canada - or that most people think so little of Americans? Edited September 25, 2012 by American Woman Quote
Guest Manny Posted September 25, 2012 Report Posted September 25, 2012 HEY! :angry: I'm just as anti-American, as many other Americans. Because as far as Canadians go, we know, it is our raisin d'etre... Quote
bleeding heart Posted September 26, 2012 Report Posted September 26, 2012 (edited) Just out of curiosity - why do you think that Canadians think higher of Americans than most people do? Is it because you think that Americans are so well thought of in Canada - or that most people think so little of Americans? The former....as is clear from my remarks already. Are you under the impression that I don't mean what I say? Edited September 26, 2012 by bleeding heart Quote “There is a limit to how much we can constantly say no to the political masters in Washington. All we had was Afghanistan to wave. On every other file we were offside. Eventually we came onside on Haiti, so we got another arrow in our quiver." --Bill Graham, Former Canadian Foreign Minister, 2007
Guest American Woman Posted September 26, 2012 Report Posted September 26, 2012 The former....as is clear from my remarks already. If it were clear to me, I wouldn't have asked. Are you under the impression that I don't mean what I say? Why so defensive? Quote
bleeding heart Posted September 26, 2012 Report Posted September 26, 2012 If it were clear to me, I wouldn't have asked. OK, then now it's been answered. Why so defensive? ???? Quote “There is a limit to how much we can constantly say no to the political masters in Washington. All we had was Afghanistan to wave. On every other file we were offside. Eventually we came onside on Haiti, so we got another arrow in our quiver." --Bill Graham, Former Canadian Foreign Minister, 2007
Guest Peeves Posted September 26, 2012 Report Posted September 26, 2012 I married three ladies that resided in the USA. Not at the same time of course...... Only ended hating one of them. :angry: Lawyers too. Two are now deceased.... I had nothing to do with that......... Quote
bleeding heart Posted September 26, 2012 Report Posted September 26, 2012 I married three ladies that resided in the USA. Not at the same time of course...... Only ended hating one of them. :angry: Lawyers too. Two are now deceased.... I had nothing to do with that......... Quote “There is a limit to how much we can constantly say no to the political masters in Washington. All we had was Afghanistan to wave. On every other file we were offside. Eventually we came onside on Haiti, so we got another arrow in our quiver." --Bill Graham, Former Canadian Foreign Minister, 2007
guyser Posted September 26, 2012 Report Posted September 26, 2012 I married three ladies that resided in the USA. Not at the same time of course...... Only ended hating one of them. :angry: Lawyers too. Two are now deceased.... I had nothing to do with that......... Please do go on> This should be interesting Quote
Guest Peeves Posted October 1, 2012 Report Posted October 1, 2012 Please do go on> This should be interesting Short answer, I did. Quote
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