Let me share a story with you..

[guyser]

MikeDavid thinks there are 20,000,000+ working at DND.............

...and they work when it rains. Imagine that.

[mikedavid00]

MikeDavid thinks there are 20,000,000+ working at DND.............

No. But everything that goes on in there is a makework project.

I worked under an airforce division. Just 1 of the MANY. The whole building is makework projects. The military power structure is simply huge. It's massive. All gov't employees. No actual fighting.

The money spent and banquetts, and flights to all over Canada are something to behold. There was always an event. It's truly the most pampered, spoiled, gov't building i've ever been in. Although the dept of Agriculture was simply amazing. Such beutiful grounds. Better then any private company in Canada could even come close to offering.

But it's this sponsorship of other people that are bankrupting Canada.

[guyser]

But it's this sponsorship of other people that are bankrupting Canada.

Agreed.

How do we stop sponsoring you ? We are open to suggestions.

[Canadian Blue]

Are you trying to imply that all of the military are in the dessert storm in firefights?

Sounds delicious.

That is simply not true. The majority of the money sent to the military goes into make work projects and nothing really of benefit to Canada. How often to you hear of Canada spending the money on something tangeible like fighter jets?

Are you daft man? Do you have any idea how much money it costs to have a fully operating Navy, Army, and Air Force. Do you think that CF-18's are cheap to maintain and fly?

But I'm interested in these "make work projects" you are talking about on here, mind explaining them?

By the way most people who go to field units tend to deploy, even I who work at a static posting could possibly see a deployment before my contract is up.

Perhaps you should start to think before you speak when you tell us about your experience working as a janitor at DND.

I worked under an airforce division. Just 1 of the MANY. The whole building is makework projects. The military power structure is simply huge. It's massive. All gov't employees. No actual fighting.

Well our airspace doesn't need to be protected, that's something we can surely do without. As well there is more to the military than "fighting", while you probably get most of your views from Vietnam movies the military requires surveillance, administration, communications, law enforcement, medical services, etc. The reason why the military is such a massive structure is because it needs to be in order to operate effectively.

Remember a soldiers life is 99% boredom and 1% terror.

Edited December 10, 2007 by Canadian Blue

[mikedavid00]

Agreed.

How do we stop sponsoring you ? We are open to suggestions.

To paraphrase in a nutshell the problem with Canada (and increasingly the US), I believe what is cuasing us to tank is simply the 'sponsorship of other people'. It doesn't get more simple than that.

I have to sponsor the operators of this very website. That's how out of control things are.

[guyser]

Perhaps you should start to think before you speak ...

And I will hop up Mt Everest on one leg wearing only a furry thong as protection....

[M.Dancer]

No. But everything that goes on in there is a makework project.

Yes you do. Your words on on record.

For every troop at war in real danger, there are 10,000 support staff and other civil servants doing nothing living off my tax dollars who really don't serve a role in anything usefull.

[Canadian Blue]

To paraphrase in a nutshell the problem with Canada (and increasingly the US), I believe what is cuasing us to tank is simply the 'sponsorship of other people'. It doesn't get more simple than that.

So once we disband the fire department, the police service, the military, social services, and get rid of medicare, we will no longer be tanking as a society? I can only imagine that the problem would get worse, but go ahead and entertain us with these delusional thoughts.

For every troop at war in real danger, there are 10,000 support staff and other civil servants doing nothing living off my tax dollars who really don't serve a role in anything usefull.

What do you mean by in "real danger"? Are you talking about when the troops are in direct combat, if thats the case I think that your ideas are pretty idiotic, and once again can't be based on fact. Tell us why again the infantry does not require signallers to communicate orders, the air force to bomb the enemy, the supply guys to provide the ammo, the cooks to provide the food, and the admin guys to ensure they get paid?

Edited December 10, 2007 by Canadian Blue

[mikedavid00]

So once we disband the fire department, the police service, the military, social services, and get rid of medicare, we will no longer be tanking as a society? I can only imagine that the problem would get worse, but go ahead and entertain us with these delusional thoughts.

-Fire department should be contracted out. In Toronto firefighters are making $73,000 average and basically, well... do nothing all day.

-Police Service. In a gov't union. Get 10% pay raises a year, over 100 street police officers making +$100,000 a year. Don't have anything better to do then sitting around and giving tickets. Could use a 50% cut in funding. That includes their paychecks and staffing. Lets let officers fight crime (rare) rather then 'hanging out' all day and giving out tickets.

-Military - We need 50% cut in spending. As you said, if we don't need an air farce, why are we funding one? You have no idea how huge that airforce division was. I was just in 1 faction, in 1 subdivision. It spreads all over Canada. Every city, even small towns. If you saw the org charge you woudldn't be able to understand it becuase it was so large. But when is the latst time we bought fighter jets with satellite guided missles? Yes. Just as I thought.

-Social services - Give welfare to whoever wants it no questions asked. If you are caught cheating, you will get an automatic 10 years in jail. No more public housing, no more social workers, no more administration, just a machine printing checks to who want them with the signed understanding that you will go to jail if you are caught cheating. Get the homeless of the street, and more importantly, get's rid of a huge gov't administration. Any needed admistration will get contracted out to the lowest bidder. We don't need to question people and create administration. We don't need only 8% of the funding of welfare to go to the recipient anymore. And we certainly don't need people on welfare setting up in public housing for 20 years that we have to subsidize. Some in Toronto now worth $600,000 becuase the units are in such desiriable locations.

Medicare - fully privatized, no gov't built and managed hosptials. No Health Canada. Much like the US. I'm not for letting people die on the street. But the gov't will send a clean cheque to the private hosptial for coverage if someone has HMO. That amount will be VERY low. Only a few hosptials will be sanctioned as an HMO. The rest will be totall private and my employer can pay for that. If not, then I can use HMO (which I wont want to do so i'll look for an employer that wil give me a plan).

And of course there is the elimination of the CRA replaced with a flat tax so there is no additional administration. Just get rid of tax returns all together. NO ADMINISTRATION. NO GOV'T UNIONS. All these employees that are needed will be contracted out to the lowest bidder and garuntee a level of service.

[guyser]

-Fire department should be contracted out. In Toronto firefighters are making $73,000 average and basically, well... .....

.

.

.tax so there is no additional administration. Just get rid of tax returns all together. NO ADMINISTRATION. NO GOV'T UNIONS. All these employees that are needed will be contracted out to the lowest bidder and garuntee a level of service.

Looks like I wont be hopping up Everest.

[Canadian Blue]

Alright special officer doofey I'll look over some of your points.

-Fire department should be contracted out. In Toronto firefighters are making $73,000 average and basically, well... do nothing all day.

What if their is actually an extremely large fire that requires professionals to react. If you honestly think that a volunteer service can deal with the amount of calls large municipalities often recieve you are once again completely delusional.

-Police Service. In a gov't union. Get 10% pay raises a year, over 100 street police officers making +$100,000 a year. Don't have anything better to do then sitting around and giving tickets. Could use a 50% cut in funding. That includes their paychecks and staffing. Lets let officers fight crime (rare) rather then 'hanging out' all day and giving out tickets.

So we're going to have fewer officers patrolling the streets of Toronto. Does anyone feel like turning that city into Baghdad?

-Military - We need 50% cut in spending. As you said, if we don't need an air farce, why are we funding one?

In case of an attack or a hijacking, it probably would be good to have one. However I'm still amazed at how you think we shouldn't protect our airspace. How about Search and Rescue will that be going as well?

You have no idea how huge that airforce division was. I was just in 1 faction, in 1 subdivision. It spreads all over Canada. Every city, even small towns. If you saw the org charge you woudldn't be able to understand it becuase it was so large. But when is the latst time we bought fighter jets with satellite guided missles? Yes. Just as I thought.

I worked out of 17 Wing in Winnipeg which also housed NORAD, I think I understand why we need that large of an air force. It's probably because most people want a jet to intercept a hijacked airliner.

No more public housing, no more social workers, no more administration, just a machine printing checks to who want them with the signed understanding that you will go to jail if you are caught cheating.

Social Workers deal with abused children more often than welfare. However I'm still amazed at how ignorant you are about members of the military and emergency services. It's amazing how much hate can come from this petulant twat.

Medicare - fully privatized, no gov't built and managed hosptials. No Health Canada. Much like the US. I'm not for letting people die on the street. But the gov't will send a clean cheque to the private hosptial for coverage if someone has HMO. That amount will be VERY low. Only a few hosptials will be sanctioned as an HMO. The rest will be totall private and my employer can pay for that. If not, then I can use HMO (which I wont want to do so i'll look for an employer that wil give me a plan).

The United States is highly ranked by the World Health Organization, I believe their at 37th right now. However I'm glad to see that your ignorance of the world is shining through with this one post.

Does anybody else wonder about the sanity of Mikedavid on these forums, or is it very possible that we're dealing with a 13 year old who feels enraged at the sight of immigrants, the police, firefighters, social workers, and teachers.

[Wild Bill]

So who has protected myself and my family all these years? Not Mike!

We could all never afford to buy all the beer we owe each and every soldier!

[Canadian Blue]

But Mike has told us about the Palestinians who forced him to buy a house. Pretty soon all immigrants are going to force us to buy housing in some evil plot to take over Canada.

[M.Dancer]

I hope no one forces me to buy in Forest Hill.....

[Moxie]

So who has protected myself and my family all these years? Not Mike!

We could all never afford to buy all the beer we owe each and every soldier!

Mike's ideas are absurb, to state we don't need an airforce dah. We need one, but the Liberals felt buying antiquainted subs was more important than heavy lift helicopters. Rather brilliant, no gas is needed because they aren't fit to sail. All that gas money saved. Our troops currently depend on our allies to get us in theater, I guess getting a reputation of being poor beggers is better than no reputation.

Welfare for whomever wants it, dah that's already happening.

[Canadian Blue]

I can't believe that somebody would be so inept as to support the abolition of the fire department and cutting the budget for law enforcement by 50%. This guy is simply cut off from reality, and I don't imagine he'll get any sense knocked into him anytime soon.

[guyser]

Mike's ideas are absurb, to state we don't need an airforce dah. We need one, but the Liberals felt buying antiquainted subs was more important than heavy lift helicopters. Rather brilliant, no gas is needed because they aren't fit to sail. All that gas money saved. Our troops currently depend on our allies to get us in theater, I guess getting a reputation of being poor beggers is better than no reputation.

Welfare for whomever wants it, dah that's already happening.

I see...I guess you changed your mind?

[mikedavid00]

What if their is actually an extremely large fire that requires professionals to react. If you honestly think that a volunteer service can deal with the amount of calls large municipalities often recieve you are once again completely delusional.

I didn't say anything about volunteers, but every study shows that when a municipatily outsourced its ambulance service, the quality of service increased. City's in the US had to start to outsource becuase the in the Late 80's the ambulance unions started to get too big, and too lazy, and too expensive (our police, RCMP, etc). Ambulances in many city centers were taking over an hour to arrive. They outsourced these services as well as 911 becuase they were almost forced to. There are no longer problems.

So we're going to have fewer officers patrolling the streets of Toronto. Does anyone feel like turning that city into Baghdad?

The police mainly give out tickets with the odd 'action' involved. The police rarely see that much action becuase of how heavily staffed they are. This isn't the tv and movies.

Cops are not out fighting cimes and removing homeless. Cops are part of a union, are now over paid with benefits that the average worker would only dream of, and are way, way overstaffed.

In case of an attack or a hijacking, it probably would be good to have one. However I'm still amazed at how you think we shouldn't protect our airspace. How about Search and Rescue will that be going as well?

I never said we shouldn't protect our air space, I'm just saying that 90% of our airforce is a gov't union, political organization who do nothing all day and do not benefit Canadians. They are on white collar welfare. That's all it is. It's UNREAL how large it is. You'd have to look at the org chart to appreciate it. It's so large and complicated it needs to printed out on a large format plotter.

I worked out of 17 Wing in Winnipeg which also housed NORAD, I think I understand why we need that large of an air force. It's probably because most people want a jet to intercept a hijacked airliner.

I'd rather chance the hijacking (which the air force can do nothing about) then have to fund the Canadian air force that is more or less useless at home and internationally. Don't think I dont see through the Canadian military and their games.

Social Workers deal with abused children more often than welfare.

Good then they should be outsourced and work at the police station or hispitals.

The United States is highly ranked by the World Health Organization, I believe their at 37th right now.

If you believe those rankings about best medical care and best cities to live then you are on another planet.

However I'm glad to see that your ignorance of the world is shining through with this one post.

Does anybody else wonder about the sanity of Mikedavid on these forums, or is it very possible that we're dealing with a 13 year old who feels enraged at the sight of immigrants, the police, firefighters, social workers, and teachers.

It's natural you support the gov't power structure. Becuase you are also part of the problem, not the solution. We can't keep paying for all this.

We can't continue to have job creation numbers stating 'job gains' in the 'public sector'. That just makes us more poor as a country.

[guyser]

I didn't say anything about volunteers, but every study shows that when a municipatily outsourced its ambulance service, the quality of service increased. City's in the US had to start to outsource becuase the in the Late 80's the ambulance unions started to get too big, and too lazy, and too expensive (our police, RCMP, etc). Ambulances in many city centers were taking over an hour to arrive. They outsourced these services as well as 911 becuase they were almost forced to. There are no longer problems.

Link please

[Canadian Blue]

City's in the US had to start to outsource becuase the in the Late 80's the ambulance unions started to get too big, and too lazy, and too expensive (our police, RCMP, etc). Ambulances in many city centers were taking over an hour to arrive. They outsourced these services as well as 911 becuase they were almost forced to. There are no longer problems.

RCMP is not unionized, and can you please tell us all what jurisdictions have outsourced their law enforcement to private companies?

The police mainly give out tickets with the odd 'action' involved. The police rarely see that much action becuase of how heavily staffed they are. This isn't the tv and movies.

Source? Have you ever done a ride along, or in fact been involved with any law enforcement agency. The RCMP is hardly heavily staffed, the same goes with most police services in the country.

This sure as hell isn't tv and the movies, but it isn't the fantasies you have created in your skull.

Cops are not out fighting cimes and removing homeless. Cops are part of a union, are now over paid with benefits that the average worker would only dream of, and are way, way overstaffed.

Source?

I never said we shouldn't protect our air space, I'm just saying that 90% of our airforce is a gov't union, political organization who do nothing all day and do not benefit Canadians.

Members of the military aren't part of a union doofey, the fact you don't realize that shows how ignorant you are.

I'd rather chance the hijacking (which the air force can do nothing about) then have to fund the Canadian air force that is more or less useless at home and internationally. Don't think I dont see through the Canadian military and their games.

I'm guessing Kosovo wasn't really an international action. However I'm glad that you think the Canadian Forces who are currently operating in Afghanistan are stealing from you, perhaps you should move to Somalia where their is no government.

That's all it is. It's UNREAL how large it is. You'd have to look at the org chart to appreciate it. It's so large and complicated it needs to printed out on a large format plotter.

Really a format plotter, well I'm convinced. Anything that is printed out of a large format plotter should be immediately be disbanded.

If you believe those rankings about best medical care and best cities to live then you are on another planet.

Unfortunately you've got jackshit to back up your claims. However please enlighten us all on how the World Health Organization is not a credible organization.

It's natural you support the gov't power structure. Becuase you are also part of the problem, not the solution. We can't keep paying for all this.

Yes, as a Private I'm really high up on the power scale. However please tell me how having no government could turn out well for us, perhaps we might be successful like Somalia.

We can't continue to have job creation numbers stating 'job gains' in the 'public sector'. That just makes us more poor as a country.

Well it's made most of the western world poor as well because they tend to pay for things like law enforcement, national defence, and emergency services.

[mikedavid00]

Mike's ideas are absurb, to state we don't need an airforce dah.

Actually someone else said that and I was suggesting that if we don't need it, then why keep funding it?

Having worked with the air force, I can say it's 90% make work projects that go no where. I agree we need hellicopters and fighter jets with satellite guided missles would be cool also. But that's NOT where the money is being spent. It's being spent on peoples paychecks who do nothing. Let's just be honest. It's not knock on the military.

Welfare for whomever wants it, dah that's already happening.

Don't you see though? Thats' exactly why you give it out. Just give it out and cut out the administration. Solves the homeless problem, and secures the poor into their own niche. I'm actually for enhancing our welfare system and giving out more welfare. Once you cut away the administration and other needless gov't services, giving someone $600 a month is chicken feed. It's nothing.. and it benefits us so much.

If you want to live in a socialist system, you have to pay off the people who don't want to work. How do you think Montreal does so well with their Hatian community? Everyone there is collecting a huge cheque and those dudes spend it all on their designer clothes and shoes and cruise the mall all day. You cut them off, now you have Toronto part 2. There's no point chasing down people who don't want to work. Just pay not to cause trouble and loiter out on the street.

Again, the police should be fighting crime and removing the homeless. Not entrapping law abiding citizens and handing out tickets all day in a fundraising effort for out gov't.

[mikedavid00]

So who has protected myself and my family all these years? Not Mike!

We could all never afford to buy all the beer we owe each and every soldier!

The police and soldiers have not protected you all these years.

Why? Becuase no one has been after you all these years. That's the movies and tv talking. Not the reality of our civilized society.

People aren't out to get you. Other countries aren't out to get us.

Now someone MIGHT want to be out to get you, but the police wont be notified about this and will only be there after it happens.

To be frank, the police are the ones out to get you when you are going with the flow of traffic and all of a sudden your getting pulled over and handed a ticket.

Think about it.

[mikedavid00]

But Mike has told us about the Palestinians who forced him to buy a house. Pretty soon all immigrants are going to force us to buy housing in some evil plot to take over Canada.

Well I had to buy a house before I was ready or I wouild not be able to afford it.

My new co-worker right here says she can no longer afford to buy a home becuase she waited to long.

My old co-worker just got married in the summer and simply cannot afford to buy a home.

If these people did it three years back they might have had a chance.

[mikedavid00]

Link please

http://www.pnj.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?A...321/1006/NEWS10

[Canadian Blue]

Having worked with the air force, I can say it's 90% make work projects that go no where. I agree we need hellicopters and fighter jets with satellite guided missles would be cool also. But that's NOT where the money is being spent. It's being spent on peoples paychecks who do nothing. Let's just be honest. It's not knock on the military.

What did you do with the Air Force?

Second, I'm not sure what the hell you're talking about when you say we need helicopters and jets with super cool satellite guided missiles.

Don't you see though? Thats' exactly why you give it out. Just give it out and cut out the administration. Solves the homeless problem, and secures the poor into their own niche. I'm actually for enhancing our welfare system and giving out more welfare. Once you cut away the administration and other needless gov't services, giving someone $600 a month is chicken feed. It's nothing.. and it benefits us so much.

I can tell that you have no idea what you're talking about since you think that someone can live on less than $600 a month.

If you want to live in a socialist system, you have to pay off the people who don't want to work. How do you think Montreal does so well with their Hatian community? Everyone there is collecting a huge cheque and those dudes spend it all on their designer clothes and shoes and cruise the mall all day. You cut them off, now you have Toronto part 2. There's no point chasing down people who don't want to work. Just pay not to cause trouble and loiter out on the street.

What the hell are you talking about?

Again, the police should be fighting crime and removing the homeless. Not entrapping law abiding citizens and handing out tickets all day in a fundraising effort for out gov't.

Well the police never deal with homicides, robberies, sexual assaults, fraud cases, domestic disturbances, and a a large portion of other offences. However can you tell us how the police will "remove" the homeless? As well under your plan their will be no police officers out on the street since all of them will be doing paperwork, and raking in huge amounts of OT. But then again it seems logic once again isn't your friend.

The police and soldiers have not protected you all these years.

Well go live in Somalia, and be happy that the police their don't bother good law abiding citizens like yourself.

Why? Becuase no one has been after you all these years. That's the movies and tv talking. Not the reality of our civilized society.

Yes, crime is all a myth, the World Trade Center attacks were all a myth, and the Red River flood was all a myth.

So let me get this straight, you mean people like Clifford Olsen and Paul Bernardo was simply the TV and movies talking, not a "reality" of civilized society. Plus you'd think that law enforcement would be needed to ensure we live in a civilized society, but once again logic is obviously not your friend.

To be frank, the police are the ones out to get you when you are going with the flow of traffic and all of a sudden your getting pulled over and handed a ticket.

Do you know from experience, apparently the police don't look to fondly on things like drunk driving and going 100 kilometers per hour.

Think about it.

That's my problem, I do think.

Edited December 10, 2007 by Canadian Blue