PLEASE don't vote Conservative in tomorrow's Ontario election

[shavluk]

PLEASE don't vote Conservative in tomorrow's Ontario election or the upcoming much anticipated Federal election.

Why not, you ask?

Your civil liberties as a Canadian are at stake. Here are JUST A FEW of the ways the Harper Conservatives have already begun eroding your rights as a Canadian:

* By wanting sweeping access to personal information of telecommunication users, as in internet, cell phones, telephones, etc CTV.ca: Feds push for greater access to private info

* By refusing the right for the Council of Canadians to assemble peacefully 6kms from the Security and Prosperity Partnership of North America (SPP) Summit in Montebello, August 2007 (Integrate This!: RCMP, U.S. Army block public forum on the Security and Prosperity Partnership),

* By refusing to allow a petition signed by 10,000 Canadians (Media Release: Harper refuses to receive SPP petitions at Leaders Summit in Montebello), (Media Release: Harper refuses to receive SPP petitions at Leaders Summit in Montebello),

* By denying border access to well respected American dignitary peace activists invited to speak by the Toronto Stop the War Coalition because of their outspokenness against the Bush war policy and how Canada is following suit (News Release: Canada Refuses Entry to CODEPINK Cofounder Medea Benjamin and Retired Colonel Ann Wright).

AND WORST OF ALL:

* By putting $64 million into an American-style War on Drugs that is proven to fail (Ottawa Citizen: Tories' war on drugs termed U.S.-style) Harper's new drug strategy will make criminals out of ordinary Canadians while allowing the multi-billion dollar black market drug business to flourish, putting more guns and dangerous people in our neighbourhoods. The American War on Drugs has resulted in an increase in drug use among Americans, an increase in violent and gang crime, an increase in the number of weapons available to their young people, and the disturbing statistic of imprisoning more of its citizens than any other country in the world. There were more arrests in the US for simple marijuana possession in 2005 (738,916) than there were for all violent crimes combined (611,523), and the number of marijuana arrests has increased since then. The US has 4.6% of the world's population, and 22.5% of the world's prisoners. Can they truly be called 'The Land of The Free"? We do not want this in Canada, do we?

VOTE NDP OR VOTE GREEN BUT PLEASE DON'T VOTE CONSERVATIVE!!!

For more information on how the drug war will be disastrous for Canadians, please visit:

http://www.leap.cc (Law Enforcement Against Prohibition)

http://www.eNDProhibition.ca (Anti-Prohibition wing of the Federal NDP)

http://www.efsdp.org (Educators for Sensible Drug Policy)

http://www.ssdp.org (Students for Sensible Drug Policy)

http://www.drugpolicy.org (Drug Policy Alliance)

http://www.stopthedrugwar.org (DRC Net - Drug War Chronicles)

http://www.frankdiscussion.net (Frank Discussion about Reforming Canada's Marijuana Laws)

Thanks for taking the time to read and consider this. Your vote makes a huge difference to all Canadians. Feel free to contact me with any questions you may have, I'll do my best to direct you to the right answers.

Please forward this note to every Canadian you know. THANKS!

_________________________

HARM REDUCTION WORKS

http://www.fcda.org/harmreduction.htm

SAVE VANCOUVER'S INSITE

[Kapitän Rotbart]

Asking people to not vote for a given politician is almost as silly as asking people to not vote. The provincial Tories are quite unrelated to the federal Tories. Stephen Harper is not bad a PM at the end of the day. Then again, I'll admit that I find George Bush a decent politician, unfortunately no government in this world today is capitalistic enough for my likings.

The SPP petition is, IMHO, terrible. It's Green Party propaganda against free trade. Free trade allows fair trade. And who are you to determine what is fair? Despite "exploitation", non-fair trade is normally better than domestic alternatives. I can't blame Harper for this.

The war on drugs is irrelevant to whether or not John Tory will be elected. The USA has carpool lanes, Canada only has 'em in the GTA. I want Canada to be more like the USA in at least a few aspects. Those websites are quite biased... I wouldn't defend the war on drugs, but it's the least of my worries.

Despite your political preferences, it's tough to label an entire political party... it really depends on the elected candidates, IMHO.

[ScottSA]

Good Grief Shavluk, I suggest you sort out yourself and get a bit of education as to how provincial and federal politics work before you saunter into Ottawa with a broadsword to clean things up. You're in North Delta allegedly running for federal office...what in the world are you doing ranting about a provincial party in another province? Tell me, do you think the Liberal Party in BC and the Liberal party in Ottawa are the same thing?

[jennie]

Good Grief Shavluk, I suggest you sort out yourself and get a bit of education as to how provincial and federal politics work before you saunter into Ottawa with a broadsword to clean things up. You're in North Delta allegedly running for federal office...what in the world are you doing ranting about a provincial party in another province? Tell me, do you think the Liberal Party in BC and the Liberal party in Ottawa are the same thing?

I don't think anyone needs to be told not to vote Tory ... Tory has made such an idiot of himself it is self-evident that he does not have the qualities to govern.

I was thinking of Green, but my daughter tells me they are too capitalist and conservative so now I am not sure.

[shavluk]

I am sorry to all here.

as I forgot to mention I didn't write that and was asked to post it for a friend,SORRY

It Is what it is and my thoughts on it that it seemed more federal than provincial but so what?

again I forgot to mention that I am not the author.

[Canuck E Stan]

I am sorry to all here.

as I forgot to mention I didn't write that and was asked to post it for a friend,SORRY

It Is what it is and my thoughts on it that it seemed more federal than provincial but so what?

again I forgot to mention that I am not the author.

Let Lizzy May join the forum if she has something to say about the Ontario Conservatives..

Until then take responsiblity of the post, because it's got your name on it.

And that makes you the author.

[trex]

I don't think anyone needs to be told not to vote Tory ... Tory has made such an idiot of himself it is self-evident that he does not have the qualities to govern.

I was thinking of Green, but my daughter tells me they are too capitalist and conservative so now I am not sure.

agreed, i certainly dont want them to be teaching creationism in the schools either... Tory is a loon, reminds me of a "reaganite"

i think i will go with hampton myself this time... he seems to have some sense of fairness in his policies. i've had enough of dullton

Edited October 10, 2007 by tbud

[ScottSA]

I was thinking of Green, but my daughter tells me they are too capitalist and conservative so now I am not sure.

Yes, they are far too capitalist and conservative. Better vote Rhino. They're pretty easygoing.

[shavluk]

Let Lizzy May join the forum if she has something to say about the Ontario Conservatives..

Until then take responsiblity of the post, because it's got your name on it.

And that makes you the author.

Oh no problem as I agree with it I just thought it wasnt right towards my friend to not mention it.

I stand by his thoughts though if that helps here.

[margrace]

It appears that the Harris government had a plan to seize private land. Now in some parts of Ontario farmers are finding that fields that they have always used for farming are controlled by the government. Environmental protection is being claimed by the government in these cases. Some of the farmers in eastern Ontario are taking the gov't to court over this.

I have nothing against environmental protection but when it seizes land without paying for it and then forces the owner to continue to pay taxes there is something wrong. The whole lands for life deal needs to be looked into. Wetlands for instance need protection but the government should buy them out the same as road access are.

[mikedavid00]

I have nothing against environmental protection but when it seizes land without paying for it and then forces the owner to continue to pay taxes there is something wrong. The whole lands for life deal needs to be looked into. Wetlands for instance need protection but the government should buy them out the same as road access are.

Imagine that happening in the US?

Lol..

[M.Dancer]

Imagine that happening in the US?

Lol..

Don't have to imagine, just mine the history files and see the Tennessee Valley Authority.

The fast forward to today.

Most of the measures aim to overrule a 2005 US Supreme Court decision that homes can be seized and handed over to private developers. But in some Western states, the eminent domain issue is coupled with other far reaching provisions that would force governments to pay landowners when regulations harm property values.

At stake is the momentum of "smart growth" planning in recent decades that has provided public interests like open space and environmental protection at the expense of private property owners. Supporters of the changes say they want those costs made transparent, while opponents argue that individual property rights, if unfettered, will trample on the rights of neighbors and the collective good.

http://www.csmonitor.com/2006/1005/p01s02-uspo.html#pt2

[mikedavid00]

Don't have to imagine, just mine the history files and see the Tennessee Valley Authority.

The fast forward to today.

http://www.csmonitor.com/2006/1005/p01s02-uspo.html#pt2

Ok yes I remember that. You had to bring up the ONE exception.

If you remember, there were people who refused to leave their homes and people threatening to take arms. Law suits everywhere.

Here?

People just take it.

Remember the Oka crisis? Sure enough the tree huggers in the US threatened law suits and stepped in. This was all during OUR despute.

I think Canadians should encourage law suits. We should sue very quickly like mad when someone infringes on our rights.

IMO, the more law suits you have, the more of a free democracy you have.

Think about it.

[guyser]

Ok yes I remember that. You had to bring up the ONE exception.

It was ONE exception.

Here is a link to many many more.

http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2003/09/26/...ain575343.shtml

...and here...

http://www.castlecoalition.org/

...and here....

http://money.cnn.com/2005/06/23/news/fortu..._eminentdomain/

[mikedavid00]

It was ONE exception.

Here is a link to many many more.

Sorry.

What you are citing has always been around. What m. grace was citing was taking houses to build a shopping mall.

But to seize farm land due to 'environmental concerns' is just wrong.

[guyser]

Sorry.

What m. grace was citing was taking houses to build a shopping mall.

Here is margraces entire post. Please point out where the shopping mall is mentioned

It appears that the Harris government had a plan to seize private land. Now in some parts of Ontario farmers are finding that fields that they have always used for farming are controlled by the government. Environmental protection is being claimed by the government in these cases. Some of the farmers in eastern Ontario are taking the gov't to court over this.

I have nothing against environmental protection but when it seizes land without paying for it and then forces the owner to continue to pay taxes there is something wrong. The whole lands for life deal needs to be looked into. Wetlands for instance need protection but the government should buy them out the same as road access are.

And missing from her post is anything to link to "seizing land and then forces the owner to pay taxes.

Either they own it or not. Hardly believable.

[margrace]

To all intents and purposes the environmental part of the government is seizing this land since it can no longer be used by the owner. A lot of waterfront property in our area is environmentally sensative and below the flood plain. No one objects to the government buying this land but when they put a hold on it so that the owners still have to pay fairly high taxes and cannot use it wouldn't you object.

[guyser]

To all intents and purposes the environmental part of the government is seizing this land since it can no longer be used by the owner. A lot of waterfront property in our area is environmentally sensative and below the flood plain. No one objects to the government buying this land but when they put a hold on it so that the owners still have to pay fairly high taxes and cannot use it wouldn't you object.

Show me where this occurs

[M.Dancer]

Show me where this occurs

I'm trying to figure out what the environemental part of the government is.....

[guyser]

I'm trying to figure out what the environemental part of the government is.....

Not for me to decide but I presume the MNR. But I have heard nothing of which she speaks , and generaly well read due to FOCA concerns.

[Argus]

Oh no problem as I agree with it I just thought it wasnt right towards my friend to not mention it.

I stand by his thoughts though if that helps here.

You stand by incoherent ramblings which appear to have been put together through the misuse of illegal substances?

Edited October 15, 2007 by Argus