Melanie_

Susie already can have two mommies and two daddies, or more, through divorce and remarriage. If we accept that she will be OK in this situation (and I do), we can probably accept that she will be OK in a polygamous family as well.

I agree, Charles, that there shouldn't be a thread about warnings, suspensions, etc, unless it was a read-only thread for everyone but the moderators. Even then, it would probably just spillover into other threads.

Lets keep in mind that Rushdie himself is Muslim; he advocates for change within his religion - a counterpoint to those who claim all Muslims are bloodthirsty jihadists. It's important to recognize that there are people within Islam who speak out and are willing to take risks in order to move forward, just as the brave journalist did when writing the article Scriblett mentions. I have to laugh every time someone brings up the cartoon debate. They were published. They were widely seen. Freedom of speech was not trampled here (I do think it was offensive to publish something to be deliberately provocative, but I feel the same way when I see Hustler magazine). There will always be a push and pull between what is acceptable for some to say in the name of freedom of speech, and what violates community standards, which are always fluid anyway. Theo Van Gogh, the movie director, was murdered by a Muslim who didn't like his movies. Unfortunately, this is why stars pay for bodyguards - there are loony tunes out there. Mark David Chapman comes to mind - should the rest of us hold the Catcher in the Rye responsible for the death of John Lennon, because MDC interpreted it in his own warped way? I don't see the bowing down to bullies that you claim; I'm not denying that there are radicals within Islam, but the appeasement you see is just a figment of your imagination.

This seems to be an example of one person's views, not necessarily shared by other Jews. Not being Jewish myself, I can't comment on whether or not it is a widespread view, but somehow I doubt that the Jewish women I know would be supportive of it. Just as with fundamentalist Christianity or Islam, you can't generalize fundamentalist Judaism to the religion as a whole.

I went to a play at the Fringe Festival yesterday, called "Jesus in Montana: Adventures in a Doomsday Cult". Basically a true story about the author/actor's experiences with a small cult in the early 80's - another way of illustrating the mindset described in the OP (although the scarier part is that the "Rapture Ready" crowd is more mainstream than the cult in the play). It's doing the Canadian Fringe Festival Circuit this summer; if you have the chance to see it, its really funny and well done (not for those who might easily take offense at religious humour, though!)

Aw, shucks, Scott, I'll try to take it easier on you in the future.

Well, Moxie, no one can doubt your passion or conviction. I have no problem with Christmas, Easter, etc. I celebrate them (secularly) in my home every year, and many friends of mine who are not Christian also have no real issue with them. When other people celebrate their own traditions and holidays, that doesn't expel Christian traditions from Canadian society. There is room in Canadian culture for other traditions as well - everyone doesn't have to partake in them, but those who do are no less Canadian than those who celebrate Christmas.

Welcome to the forum, Jillwith3. First, let me point out that it was a Sikh, not a Muslim, who won the right to wear his turban as part of the RCMP uniform. Wearing the turban is required of all practicing Sikhs, and it makes no difference in the way he does his job, so I don't see any harm in it. I agree with you that when you come to Canada you become a Canadian, but that doesn't mean you have to become a Christian. Christian traditions can be followed by anyone who chooses, but they shouldn't be imposed on those who belong to other religions, or on those who choose not to follow any religion at all. Here's an older thread on the topic of prayer in schools... Prayer in schools?

Scott, in this thread you have called me a liar twice, and now you are insulting me. You are going to have to change your signature soon. I've said all I am going to say to you.

Deleted. It wasn't very nice.

Come on, Kimmy, you know the examples you are citing here are also part of a larger reality. Are you really comparing whites in Canada today (or in ScottSA's imagined future) to the whites in South Africa during Apartheid, or the whites in Rhodesia/Zimbabwe pre-Mugabe? These are examples of white people losing power that they used for brutal oppression; this in no way justifies violence from the oppressed, but it also is a poor parallel.

Maybe the Nigerian government was involved because the emails in effect say they are defrauding the Nigerian government (at least the ones I've gotten), and they investigated to see if this was true. That doesn't negate the possibility that the emails originated in Canada, or anywhere else for that matter. Back to the original post, its good to see that Islamic moderates are speaking up and being recognized. They aren't all terrorists, which is something many people have a difficult time wrapping their heads around.

And I'm saying you are imagining potential dangers where there aren't any. There is nothing dishonest about what I have posted - I didn't say you wanted to exterminate non Caucasians, but rather that you wanted to create a homeland only for Caucasians, which you have clearly said. I questioned what would then happen to the non Caucasians who currently live there, which you had not addressed up to this point, other than saying they had somewhere to return to. I am still wondering why you feel Canada is the land of last resort for Caucasians. Sharkman, ScottSA has been very clear that he is not talking about culture, but about race. But I'm curious how you are defining Canadian Caucasian Culture.

4 Nobel Peace Prize winners, 4 democratically elected former Presidents/Prime Ministers, and people who have worked their entire lives to bring positive change to the needy or oppressed. I've never heard of some of these people, but their biographies are impressive (yes, I know they are written to be impressive, and their mistakes or failures aren't included, but what they have accomplished can't be discounted). Of course, they will have their own agendas, everyone does, but I don't see what harm can come from giving them a platform to try to make things better. You are right, the statement of goals is only as good as the actions that flow from it, but they have just organized, so it is premature to judge their actions or assume their direction. One thing that is missing from the list is someone from a Latin American background. The group is overrepresented from Africa, with some Europeans, Asians, and Americans.

The Elders website, not some flaky astrology article I'm not sure what you find objectionable about this mission. It seems pretty pie in the sky, but overall it is a laudable goal. Why anti-Semetic and anti-American? You are projecting something that isn't there.

I have read what you have written - these examples are only from the first 6 or 7 pages of this thread, there are more scattered throughout. You seem to believe that genocide is on the horizon, and I just don't buy into it.

I don't feel a moral imperative to promote caucasian or non caucasian majorities. I don't see it as an issue, to tell the truth. It's just a skin colour, with a myriad of potential variations, and I don't think it is in any danger, regardless. You have insisted that race, not culture or religion, is at the heart of a potential genocide, and that whites should fear non whites and take protective measures against them. I'm just trying to make sense of what I've read from you.

Jefferiah, you have made a lot of interesting arguments, and I don’t disagree with you for the most part. But you keep implying that you and ScottSA have the same position and I think that is stretching. Scott wants a Caucasian homeland, which means that yes, he does want to start his own group, and yes, he does want to cause harm to other “races” – what does he propose to do with the non-Caucasians currently living in this homeland? And how white do you have to be to live in this homeland? There are plenty of non white Canadians who have been here for generations – is he proposing a second class citizenship, or shipping them off to other countries that they have only a marginal connection to, based on some ancestor getting on a ship? Oh, I guess he is… ScottSA… Apparently I didn’t get the memo; I didn’t realize I was part of an international plot to undermine my “race” when I married a man whose grandparents were from India, and gave birth to 4 brownish children. Somehow the colour of his skin was only a part of the package, not the impetus for my choice. Good for you. That’s your choice to make, but it seems to carry with it an implied condemnation of other people’s choices. You are imagining bogeymen under the bed. I don’t see any indication that the “white race” will disappear anytime soon; there are plenty of white people around, marrying white people, to continue the genetic footprint. Even my kids, half white and half Indian, are dating whites and are likely to marry whites – should their dad be concerned that this will somehow lead to the destruction of the Indian “race”? Actually, if I am following this thread right (and Lord knows that is a challenge), my kids are more Caucasian from their dad’s heritage (Indian) than from mine (apparently Ukranian isn't Caucasian?). I’m also not sure how you have decided that Canada is the land of last resort for Caucasians.

Scott, your point was that AIDS among homosexual men is on the rise in North America; this website shows that the numbers have stabilized (unfortunately, they haven't decreased). There is a great chart that illustrates this well, about halfway down the page. The website also shows that there is an increase in the spread of HIV from heterosexual contact and drug use. I'm not sure what the Kapitan's point was, as anyone with AIDS (gay or straight) will likely have a shorter lifespan than they would otherwise. While there are a significant number of gay men with AIDS, that doesn't mean that all gay men will have shortened lifespans.

The age of the study is relevent when the authors themselves have stated that it is outdated, as shown in my previous post. Now, after going off on this tangent, I'm wondering what the original point was of this whole line of thought. Kapitan, were you trying to prove that gay men who have AIDS have shorter life spans? OK, but anyone who has AIDS will likely have a shorter lifespan, and not all gay men have AIDS. Linking all gay men to shorter lifespans because of the ones who have AIDS doesn't make sense. Are you saying there is something else that will shorten the lifespan of a man, specifically because he is gay? ScottSA, I'm not ready to believe that AIDS is on the rise in North America among gay men because of intuitive evidence. Lets try this instead... A report from UNaids/WHOaids says it has stabilized in the US We have seen some increase in HIV in Canada but the jump from HIV to AIDS has decreased and in Europe

Lies, damned lies, and statistics Cameron's research has been called into question by a professor of journalism at Columbia University...

The page may not mention Christianity, but it is hosted on the website and written by the same people. This alone makes it subjective. Also, the researchers quoted are not pleased with the way their research is being misrepresented.... Oxford Journals They also state that there has been significant progress in life expectancy in the gay community. AIDS and HIV took a toll, but that toll is decreasing. I'm also skeptical of the statistics quoted earlier in the article. Sure, people may have tried to do research on older gay men, but that was in a time when gay men were firmly in the closet, particularly those who had reached maturity, and were perhaps married with families, living in denial all their lives. Participating in studies like this would have left them, and their families, far too vulnerable.

Your link leads back to a very biased website, with an ultra Christian agenda. Anything this website posts has to be viewed as subjective, rather than objective. There aren't links to the studies cited, and the two studies listed are 9 and 10 years old. I don't think you've proven your point at all. Through the narrow gate.....

Can god truly be omnipotent? Omnipotence Paradox

Of all the nonsense in the opening post, this takes the cake. If you want to subject yourself to laws made by (people who claim to know the will of) the magic sky pixie, feel free. But don't expect everyone else to subject themselves to them. And don't bother with the smug, self satisfied answer of, "It doesn't matter if you don't believe it, it still applies to you". Save the patronizing attitude for the congregation.