Harper must expose this treachery

[jdobbin]

He's on the lamb from US authorities for tax fraud apparently, or maybe the Oil-For-Food scandal. Not sure on details.

Since he isn't a scientist, I don't generally account for Strong's activities. I've felt that he is more businessman/bureaucrat than anything else.

He is living in the U.S. so if he is on the lamb, he is hiding in plain sight.

[B. Max]

I see we have us a liar here.

BTW, I reserve the right to take back everything I said here if Mr. Michaels ever authors a paper stating that global warming is impossible, because the exra CO2 simply falls off the edge of the planet before any warming can occur.

http://www.junkscience.com/jan99/singer.htm

The carbon dioxide-warming connection: cause and effect? It has become an article of faith that CO2 increases are the cause of the warmings marking the end of the ice ages observed in the climate record in the past million years. Now comes news from precise Antarctic ice-core data that while warmings and CO2 increases are indeed correlated, the CO2 increases lag the warmings by about 1,000 years. So much for the cause-effect

And again you back up your claim with Steve Milloy, and his discredited website.

It is well known fact by those who know the facts.

[B. Max]

The UN climate panel what a joke. Lets review their credibility.

: Oil for palaces scandal

A couple of genocides

Numerous sex scandals

Questionable accounting practices

Some of the worst human rights abusers countries and on human rights commission.

Most of the scientists who report of global warming don't work for the U.N., are not paid by the U.N. not have anything to do with the U.N.

That can't be said about climate change deniers and the oil industry.

Yeah just like the UN has nothing to do with kyoto.

[jdobbin]

The bulk of the people I know are currently in the energy sector, and none of them would say anything, let alone cite the sources, like those from B. Max. I highly doubt he would even be employable in the sector. I wouldn't beat your head against the wall too much more.

The greenhouse effect has been noted as an effect on the environment since the 70's, now it is taught in elementary schools. Perhaps when B. Max finished attending one of these schools, he'll have a little better grasp of how it works.

You're probably right. However, it's no fantasy that the bulk of the financing against any and all environmental concerns comes from the energy sector.

[sunsettommy]

The UN climate panel what a joke. Lets review their credibility.

: Oil for palaces scandal

A couple of genocides

Numerous sex scandals

Questionable accounting practices

Some of the worst human rights abusers countries and on human rights commission.

Most of the scientists who report of global warming don't work for the U.N., are not paid by the U.N., don't have anything to do with the U.N.

That can't be said about climate change deniers and the oil industry.

Umm who created the IPCC and gives it funding?

[jdobbin]

Yeah just like the UN has nothing to do with kyoto.

You act like the U.N. is some separate entity that does things on its own.

Kyoto was was 160 countries making an agreement.

[jdobbin]

Umm who created the IPCC and gives it funding?

It was created by the World Meteorological Organization and the UNDP.

It assesses research paid for by universities, institutes, countries etc.

These scientists don't get paid by the IPCC.

It is a plenary meeting that takes place once a year to discuss the environment.

[sunsettommy]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Intergovernme..._Climate_Change

Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change

From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Jump to: navigation, search

IPCC redirects here. For other uses see IPCC (disambiguation).

The Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change (IPCC) was established in 1988 by two United Nations organizations, the World Meteorological Organization (WMO) and the United Nations Environment Programme (UNEP) to assess the "risk of human-induced climate change". The Panel is open to all members of the WMO and UNEP.

IPCC reports are widely cited [1] [2] in almost any debate related to climate change [3] [4]. National and international responses to climate change generally regard the UN climate panel as authoritative.

More in the link.

[sunsettommy]

Umm who created the IPCC and gives it funding?

It was created by the World Meteorological Organization and the UNDP.

It assesses research paid for by universities, institutes, countries etc.

These scientists don't get paid by the IPCC.

It is a plenary meeting that takes place once a year to discuss the environment.

You just mentioned 2 United Nations organizations.

Try again.

[sunsettommy]

INTERGOVERNMENTAL PANEL ON CLIMATE CHANGE

[sunsettommy]

From Wikipedia,

[edit] Operations

The current Chair of the IPCC is Rajendra K. Pachauri, elected in May 2002; previously Robert Watson headed the IPCC.

The IPCC Panel is composed of representatives appointed by governments and organizations. Participation of delegates with appropriate expertise is encouraged. Plenary sessions of the IPCC and IPCC Working Groups are held at the level of government representatives. Non Governmental and Intergovernmental Organisations may be allowed to attend as observers. Sessions of the IPCC Bureau, workshops, expert and lead authors meetings are by invitation only [7]. Attendance at the 2003 meeting was 350 government officials and climate change experts. After the opening ceremonies, plenary sessions are closed meetings [8]. The meeting report [9] states there were 322 persons in attendance at Sessions and with about seven-eighths of participants being from governmental organizations [10].

The IPCC is led by government scientists, but also involves several hundred academic scientists and researchers. It synthesises the available information about climate change and global warming, has published four major reports reviewing the latest climate science, as well as more specialized reports.

The IPCC does not carry out research nor does it monitor climate related data or other relevant parameters. It bases its assessment mainly on peer reviewed and published scientific/technical literature [11].

There are several major groups:

IPCC Panel: Meets in plenary session about once a year and controls the organization's structure and procedures. The Panel is the IPCC corporate entity.

Chair: Elected by the Panel.

Secretariat: Oversees and manages all activities. Supported by UNEP and WMO.

Bureau: Elected by the Panel. Chaired by the Chair. 30 members include IPCC Vice-Chairs, Co-Chairs and Vice-Chairs of Working Groups and Task Force.

Working Groups: Each has two Co-Chairs, one from the developed and one from developing world, and a technical support unit.

Working Group I: Assesses scientific aspects of the climate system and climate change.

Working Group II: Assesses vulnerability of socio-economic and natural systems to climate change, consequences, and adaptation options.

Working Group III: Assesses options for limiting greenhouse gas emissions and otherwise mitigating climate change.

Task Force on National Greenhouse Gas Inventories

The IPCC receives funding from UNEP, WMO, and its own Trust Fund for which it solicits contributions from governments.

my emphasis

Try again.

[jbg]

Sounds like a lot of bureaucratic mumbo jumbo, and expensive paper-pushing.

[jdobbin]

The IPCC receives funding from UNEP, WMO, and its own Trust Fund for which it solicits contributions from governments.

my emphasis

Try again.

Which isn't used to pay scientists for research but to act as a clearing house for that work.

Try again.

[jdobbin]

Sounds like a lot of bureaucratic mumbo jumbo, and expensive paper-pushing.

No, that's what lawyers do.

[jdobbin]

You just mentioned 2 United Nations organizations.

Try again.

They act as a clearing house for scientific research. Universities, institutes and governments pay for the actual research.

Or do you have evidence that the scientists are all paid by the U.N.

Try again.

[jdobbin]

INTERGOVERNMENTAL PANEL ON CLIMATE CHANGE

Which means many governments. You think that it is one entity where scientists are all employees of the U.N.?

[sunsettommy]

The IPCC receives funding from UNEP, WMO, and its own Trust Fund for which it solicits contributions from governments.

my emphasis

Try again.

Which isn't used to pay scientists for research but to act as a clearing house for that work.

Try again.

LOL,

I never said the SCIENTISTS themselves were being funded.But the IPCC they work with is funded by the U.N.

This means they have to follow the guidelines of that body.

Here again from Wikipedia(you need to read more):

The IPCC concentrates its activities on the tasks allotted to it by the relevant WMO Executive Council and UNEP Governing Council resolutions and decisions as well as on actions in support of the UN Framework Convention on Climate Change process [12].

They have to follow it or they are not part of the program.Funding or not.

Try again.

[sunsettommy]

You just mentioned 2 United Nations organizations.

Try again.

They act as a clearing house for scientific research. Universities, institutes and governments pay for the actual research.

Or do you have evidence that the scientists are all paid by the U.N.

Try again.

I never once said they were getting paid by the U.N..

You are sliding around now.

[sunsettommy]

INTERGOVERNMENTAL PANEL ON CLIMATE CHANGE

Which means many governments. You think that it is one entity where scientists are all employees of the U.N.?

Never did say they are employed by the U.N.

What did you drink today?

[sunsettommy]

Yeah just like the UN has nothing to do with kyoto.

You act like the U.N. is some separate entity that does things on its own.

Kyoto was was 160 countries making an agreement.

Try doing research next time:

From the U.N.

http://www.un.org/apps/news/story.asp?News...global&Cr1=warm

UN’s Kyoto treaty against global warming comes into force

16 February 2005 – The Kyoto treaty against global warming came into force today with United Nations Secretary-General Kofi Annan urging the world to save the planet by adding to the limits on greenhouse gases and the UN environment chief stressing that many in the United States, the world’s top polluter, support the protocol despite the US Government’s opposition.

Under the Kyoto Protocol to the 1992 UN Framework Convention on Climate Change (UNFCCC), industrialized countries are to reduce their combined emissions of six major greenhouse gases during the five-year period from 2008 to 2012 to below 1990 levels. So far 140 countries have ratified the accord.

The European Union and Japan, for example, are to cut these emissions by 8 per cent and 6 per cent respectively. For many countries, achieving the Kyoto targets will be a major change that will require new policies and new approaches.

“By itself, the Protocol will not save humanity from the dangers of climate change,” Mr. Annan said in a video message to a celebratory ceremony in the ancient Japanese capital of Kyoto, where it was negotiated in 1997. “So let us celebrate today, but let us not be complacent.

“I call on the world community to be bold, to adhere to the Kyoto Protocol, and to act quickly in taking the next steps. There is no time to lose,” he added.

[jdobbin]

Never did say they are employed by the U.N.

What did you drink today?

Glad you've seen these scientists are no different from doctors who meet under U.N. auspices of immunization or infectious disease researchers who meet once a year to discuss pandemics and epidemics.

[sunsettommy]

From Wikipedia on the Kyoto Treaty:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kyoto_Protocol

Description

The Kyoto Protocol is an agreement made under the United Nations Framework Convention on Climate Change (UNFCCC). Countries that ratify this protocol commit to reduce their emissions of carbon dioxide and five other greenhouse gases, or engage in emissions trading if they maintain or increase emissions of these gases.

The Kyoto Protocol now covers more than 160 countries globally and over 55% of global greenhouse gas (GHG) emissions.

At its heart, Kyoto establishes the following principles:

Kyoto is underwritten by governments and is governed by global legislation enacted under the UN’s aegis

More in the link.

[jdobbin]

I never said the SCIENTISTS themselves were being funded.But the IPCC they work with is funded by the U.N.

This means they have to follow the guidelines of that body.

Here again from Wikipedia(you need to read more):

The IPCC concentrates its activities on the tasks allotted to it by the relevant WMO Executive Council and UNEP Governing Council resolutions and decisions as well as on actions in support of the UN Framework Convention on Climate Change process [12].

They have to follow it or they are not part of the program.Funding or not.

Try again.

Their work is not funded by the IPCC.

You need to read more. They are funded by their own universities, countries and foundations.

[jdobbin]

From Wikipedia on the Kyoto Treaty:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kyoto_Protocol

Description

The Kyoto Protocol is an agreement made under the United Nations Framework Convention on Climate Change (UNFCCC). Countries that ratify this protocol commit to reduce their emissions of carbon dioxide and five other greenhouse gases, or engage in emissions trading if they maintain or increase emissions of these gases.

The Kyoto Protocol now covers more than 160 countries globally and over 55% of global greenhouse gas (GHG) emissions.

At its heart, Kyoto establishes the following principles:

Kyoto is underwritten by governments and is governed by global legislation enacted under the UN’s aegis

More in the link.

Exactly. 160 countries working together.

[sunsettommy]

I never said the SCIENTISTS themselves were being funded.But the IPCC they work with is funded by the U.N.

This means they have to follow the guidelines of that body.

Here again from Wikipedia(you need to read more):

The IPCC concentrates its activities on the tasks allotted to it by the relevant WMO Executive Council and UNEP Governing Council resolutions and decisions as well as on actions in support of the UN Framework Convention on Climate Change process [12].

They have to follow it or they are not part of the program.Funding or not.

Try again.

Their work is not funded by the IPCC.

You need to read more. They are funded by their own universities, countries and foundations.

Read my words slowly......

I never said the SCIENTISTS themselves were being funded.But the IPCC they work with is funded by the U.N.