French-English-Canadian dual-identities

[Charles Anthony]

Who are they? What is their cultural identity? Where are they in the political spectrum?

These are just a few questions.

I want to explore life (past and present) for Quebeckers who are of both English and French ancestry. My suspicion is that they represent a group that has very little outward representation. There are lots of members on this forum -- both lurkers and regular posters. I invite those who might identify with these questions to share their experiences or to relate the perspectives of friends and co-workers.

This thread is not an argument nor a debate on my part. Myself, I barely have any knowledge and even less of an opinion. Quebec and French-Canada are a cultural phenomenon that provides a constant marvel to me. Maybe these Franglo-Quebeckers share a similar identity that the Acadians, y inclus ceux de la Louisianne, felt in the past. I do not know.

This thread is triggered by a current article in what I consider to be a highly reputable yet still entertaining newspaper spotlighting a recent album released by a Quebecker:

Kevin Parent

Entre chien et loup

Apprivoiser la bête, préserver le double instinct de sa dualité culturelle. À 34 ans, Kevin Parent s'offre un retour aux sources dans le confort et l'intégrité de sa langue maternelle.

---SNIP---

Canadian? Québécois, Kevin Parent, ce quasi-rénovateur de la chanson québécoise en 95? "Aujourd'hui, je me sens plus québécois que jamais. J'ai appris à comprendre les insécurités des francophones et ce qui les menace."

CROIRE

Entre 2001 et 2006, le Father On The Go prend une pause significative et s'intéresse délibérément aux vertus de la thérapie: "Je cherchais des outils pour m'adapter à un style de vie chaotique et vivre ma dualité linguistique. C'est deux mondes "tough" à gérer. Le désavantage, c'est que je dois me justifier. Il y a du monde qui doute de mon intégrité. Des gens qui sont méfiants, qui pensent que tout ça, c'est une histoire inventée pour vendre aux Anglais. Mais je vis vraiment une double vie depuis que je suis enfant."

Voir.ca

This hit me like a ton of bricks because I honestly started reading this article with the explicit bias stated in the article: I thought his cultural-duality was a fabricated public relations stunt to sell him to a wider audience. I first learned of him when his Pigeon d'argile -- great record! by the way -- came out just over a decade ago. Until I read this recent article, I honestly assumed he was just un Quebecois de souche who knew how to rock and he would not have been the first one at that. The few tracks that were sung in English seemed like a fleeting attempt to step out of Quebec. Now, I see he is more unique than Nanette Workman or Roger Whittaker.

Coupled with observations made by Aug1991 in a few other recent threads:

To put this in an English Canadian context, English Canadian politicians must not appear to kowtow to the Americans. They can be friendly but there can be no question about their loyalty. In Quebec, Charest is perceived too much as Mulroney was perceived in English Canada. (Charest was baptised 'John James Charest'. Imagine if Mulroney had been born in the US...)

and

I have come to the conclusion that this fact disturbs many English Canadians who really want to have a country - a country where everyone works together and there isn't this constant sniping or talk of leaving. Well, Canada will never be such a country. (If that sounds frustrating, imagine for a moment the frustration of many in Quebec who have a country but lack the popular support to make it politically possible.)

I want to learn the political and cultural frustration encountered by mixed-marriage or dual-identity Quebeckers.

DISCLAIMER:

I am singling out people in Quebec because of the gradual identification of Quebec as a nation -- regardless of what that means -- but I see no reason to make restrictions for this thread.

I pray that this thread does not degenerate into anti-immigrant nor anti-French nor anti-bilingual rant-a-thons.

[Bakunin]

I can give my thought about that,

Quebec is a hard place to understand, but i feel like there are 2 worlds, 2 cultures.

I wouldn't say its french canadian, id say its a french-quebec culture wich is the majority in quebec.

You have the french music wich is quite strong combined with american music. Actually quebec is america for the french world, our singer invaded france, it is problably our strongest cultural acheivment.

Then you have the french movies wich is growing really fast since the years 2000's but its not easy to sell those movie on the international market, therefore we need to invest money into it to maintain it alive. Once again it is combined with american movies.

You have french tv, all you can ask for, 2 french continuous channel for news coverage. A quebecker doesn't have to watch english american tv at all even if it's still available.

there are of course french newspapers, french litterature, in fact quebec is culturally autonomous in all area, but is mostly completed with american cultural product.

This is for the french but the same thing is also true for an english quebecker, they won't read the same newspaper, they won't listen to the same movies or the same tv channel, they won't be feeded with the same news coverage and etc... A french quebec superstar can walk anonymously in the west part of montreal.

The only place where those culture connect is through the american culture.

Culture is the hearth of a country, just look at the immigrant, when they want to integrate their new country, they have to slowly learn the culture and give up their old culture or make compromise. However it is possible to live in montreal without speaking an english word or without speaking a french world so there are in fact 2 different world.

One person that live into the french-quebec culture will definatly end up with a different perspective of the world than someone that live into english-quebec culture. Therefore i think it is totally normal that english-quebec do not want sovreignty over canada, because they have access to english canada that a french won't have.

It will always be that way and even i when i write on this board, i adapt my post to the canadian political perspective, when i write on a french board i will post with a french-quebec perspective wich can be a contradiction sometime.

This is where i believe multiculturalism fail... sure it can work if there is one dominant culture to make the link between all of them but in canada it's not the case.

I fell like there is an incompatibility between the french world and the english world, it is very hard to share things, for sample a movie like "Bon cop, bad cop" end up being a flop in english canada and a succes in quebec. Can we believe that the canadian movie who earned the most money through our history is problably ignored by the majority of its people... Well Its not different with Politics, there will always have 2 different world, the french perspective where the federal government is ignored and unwelcome wich explain the sucess of the bloc, and a provincial party that is seen has the main government.

Of course, it is not black and white, there are as much perspective as there are different people, it is not fully incompatible, but it is just enough to make it a major and permanent problem.

But in some way, it is a good thing for canada to have a quebec that is poor because there is no doubt that the day quebec will be richer than the rest of canada, they will separate. English canadian must understand one thing, french quebecker have close to no loyalty torwards canada and when they have, most of the time its easily broken. Why ? because quebec is culturally autonomous, therefore its hard to attach ourself to canadian culture is inexistant in french-canada.

[Rue]

I can give my thought about that,

Quebec is a hard place to understand, but i feel like there are 2 worlds, 2 cultures.

I wouldn't say its french canadian, id say its a french-quebec culture wich is the majority in quebec.

You have the french music wich is quite strong combined with american music. Actually quebec is america for the french world, our singer invaded france, it is problably our strongest cultural acheivment.

Then you have the french movies wich is growing really fast since the years 2000's but its not easy to sell those movie on the international market, therefore we need to invest money into it to maintain it alive. Once again it is combined with american movies.

You have french tv, all you can ask for, 2 french continuous channel for news coverage. A quebecker doesn't have to watch english american tv at all even if it's still available.

there are of course french newspapers, french litterature, in fact quebec is culturally autonomous in all area, but is mostly completed with american cultural product.

This is for the french but the same thing is also true for an english quebecker, they won't read the same newspaper, they won't listen to the same movies or the same tv channel, they won't be feeded with the same news coverage and etc... A french quebec superstar can walk anonymously in the west part of montreal.

The only place where those culture connect is through the american culture.

Culture is the hearth of a country, just look at the immigrant, when they want to integrate their new country, they have to slowly learn the culture and give up their old culture or make compromise. However it is possible to live in montreal without speaking an english word or without speaking a french world so there are in fact 2 different world.

One person that live into the french-quebec culture will definatly end up with a different perspective of the world than someone that live into english-quebec culture. Therefore i think it is totally normal that english-quebec do not want sovreignty over canada, because they have access to english canada that a french won't have.

It will always be that way and even i when i write on this board, i adapt my post to the canadian political perspective, when i write on a french board i will post with a french-quebec perspective wich can be a contradiction sometime.

This is where i believe multiculturalism fail... sure it can work if there is one dominant culture to make the link between all of them but in canada it's not the case.

I fell like there is an incompatibility between the french world and the english world, it is very hard to share things, for sample a movie like "Bon cop, bad cop" end up being a flop in english canada and a succes in quebec. Can we believe that the canadian movie who earned the most money through our history is problably ignored by the majority of its people... Well Its not different with Politics, there will always have 2 different world, the french perspective where the federal government is ignored and unwelcome wich explain the sucess of the bloc, and a provincial party that is seen has the main government.

Of course, it is not black and white, there are as much perspective as there are different people, it is not fully incompatible, but it is just enough to make it a major and permanent problem.

But in some way, it is a good thing for canada to have a quebec that is poor because there is no doubt that the day quebec will be richer than the rest of canada, they will separate. English canadian must understand one thing, french quebecker have close to no loyalty torwards canada and when they have, most of the time its easily broken. Why ? because quebec is culturally autonomous, therefore its hard to attach ourself to canadian culture is inexistant in french-canada.

I enjoyed the above essay and speaking as an ex English Quebecer who felt forced to leave, I think you hit the nail on the head in a very susinct manner.

It is my personal opinion that Quebec can never be a country to itself for one major reason-its people are not by nature interested in taking a risk and investing in themselves. With the exception of a few noteable businessmen who have been successful, French commerce in Quebec has been non existent as its people will not invest in their own province. Case in point, the Expos, the Quebec Nordiques, the lack of Quebec owned enterprises.

I think part of what makes Quebec what it is, is the security in knowing it can bitch all it wants but never really has to leave. Quebec reminds me of an angry teenager who insists on wanting equality with his parents and being treated as an adult, but not wanting to give up the basement and car keys to Dad's car.

I do think French Quebec's solitude however is very real and you captured it. The above comments I made are my own subjective ones probably tainted by my own English minority bias.

If I had truly felt the nationalism in Quebec was not racist in nature, which I believe it is, I would have stayed. I am bilingual. I was not however interested in being second class and always feeling like I had to apologize for being English.

I will admit this. As an English Quebecer, I failed like many English Quebecers to make more of an effort to visit the East of Montreal. By the time I found the courage to do so and enjoy the French culture of Quebec I was afraid of, I had already become an adult living in Ontario.

There are things about Quebec culture I can not flush out of my system-the way one has a long lunch to do business and how the pace of business and the way people interact is much warmer and friendlier then in Toronto. The style of clothing, art, architecture, the food, all things I will never stop enjoying.

It is very insightful what you said and I can not help but wonder, what if growing up in Quebec I identified with French Quebec artists instead of American ones? What if...a question maybe too late for me to answer but what I do know is my children have grown up bilingual even though not born or living in Quebec.

[August1991]

The posts above by Bakunin and rue are heartfelt and true. I'll return to Charles' OP.

I want to learn the political and cultural frustration encountered by mixed-marriage or dual-identity Quebeckers.

I have many thoughts on this question but let me introduce one initial wrinkle.

For children of mixed parenthood, there's a difference whether the mother or father is English or French. Pierre Trudeau's mother was English-speaking (as was Jean Charest's). They inherited a French family name but in fact they generally spoke English at home. (Louis St-Laurent's mother was also English.)

The mother of Winston McQuade (and Robert Guy Scully) was French but they inherited an English family name through their father. They generally spoke French at home but were seen as English in the community.

Trudeau emphasized his mother's maiden name and for awhile used it as a given name (despite the extra T) with a hyphen "Pierre-Elliott". He famously defended it in a speech in Quebec City in 1980. But it's hard to believe that if his name had been Charles Trudeau Elliott, he would have been as successful. Indeed, in 1919, if his father had had a family name like Elliott, he would never have chosen Trudeau as a middle name for his son - something rare and pretentious in French in any case. Instead, he would be like Charles Margrave Taylor - born of a francophone mother and an anglophone father.

You'll note that the French father/English mother combination is more successful politically.

I want to explore life (past and present) for Quebeckers who are of both English and French ancestry.

In my experience, practicality governs. I met a Peter Harrington who spoke no English at all and a Maurice LeBlanc who spoke no French. As they explained, a grandfather or two in the past was English or French. Irish names are common in French Quebec.

And this leads to my final point (for the moment). The dual identity in the past was less linguistic than religious. Trudeau's mother was Scottish Catholic. Before the war, no Catholic would marry a Protestant. But English-speaking could marry French-speaking.

Once upon a time, Canada was divided by religion - not language.