Cut and run jack

[B. Max]

I guess jack thinks that with the passing of five years people will have forgotten the reason we went into Afghanistan and jack can now begin telling lies. I wonder if he got those marching orders from the pro terrorist crowd at the UN or did the Toronto or Montreal connection put him up to it. You are a real piece of leftist work jack.

http://cnews.canoe.ca/CNEWS/Politics/2006/...1789786-cp.html

[jdobbin]

I guess jack thinks that with the passing of five years people will have forgotten the reason we went into Afghanistan and jack can now begin telling lies. I wonder if he got those marching orders from the pro terrorist crowd at the UN or did the Toronto or Montreal connection put him up to it. You are a real piece of leftist work jack.

http://cnews.canoe.ca/CNEWS/Politics/2006/...1789786-cp.html

He is certainly going to an extreme with his position. I think that the British General was correct though in saying that NATO has about another three months to improve the security situation before they start losing support both in Afghanistan and in the home countries of NATO countries.

As it stands now, Harper doesn't have enough support for a majority and one of the issues affecting that is Afghanistan.

It is now the toughest fight Canada has had since the Korean War. Just this weeek a British soldier and Dutch pilot were killed. The toll on Afghan police and soldiers mounts as well.

If the situation devolves to full sectarian violence, there might be little alternative but to consider options on remaining in the country. Eventually, Afghans have to look after Afghan affairs.

[Charles Anthony]

So, any rebuttal to what Jack Layton says?

Well, quoted directly from your citation:

NDP Leader Jack Layton says Canada should pull its troops out of Afghanistan by February because the mission has gone astray.

Sniping at both Prime Minister Stephen Harper and President George W. Bush, Layton said the Afghan mission has lost its direction. It has no clear goals, no exit strategy and no criteria to judge success, he said at a news conference Thursday.

Unless, anybody can state clearly what the direction of the mission happens to be, the goals, an exit strategy and a criteria to judge success, I would say Jack Layton has it right.

I guess jack thinks that with the passing of five years people will have forgotten the reason we went into Afghanistan and jack can now begin telling lies.

Not everybody in Canada supports what Canadian troups are doing in Afghanistan. Maybe Jack Layton is speaking for them.

[B. Max]

So, any rebuttal to what Jack Layton says?

Well, quoted directly from your citation:

NDP Leader Jack Layton says Canada should pull its troops out of Afghanistan by February because the mission has gone astray.

Sniping at both Prime Minister Stephen Harper and President George W. Bush, Layton said the Afghan mission has lost its direction. It has no clear goals, no exit strategy and no criteria to judge success, he said at a news conference Thursday.

Unless, anybody can state clearly what the direction of the mission happens to be, the goals, an exit strategy and a criteria to judge success, I would say Jack Layton has it right.

I guess jack thinks that with the passing of five years people will have forgotten the reason we went into Afghanistan and jack can now begin telling lies.

Not everybody in Canada supports what Canadian troups are doing in Afghanistan. Maybe Jack Layton is speaking for them.

Yeah and we know the type. Anti American, anti Israel.

http://www.westernstandard.ca/liberal/liberal.html

[Charles Anthony]

Yeah and we know the type. Anti American, anti Israel.

http://www.westernstandard.ca/liberal/liberal.html

As much as I despise all Liberals in Canada, I find The Western Stardard to be even more despicable for hosting such disgusting bigotry on its webserver.

Furthermore, your argumentative style will never be as neurotic as mine. Give up.

[Wilber]

Layton moved to stave off predictable attacks by insisting that his party supports Canadian troops and multilateral efforts to fight terrorism.

But he says Canada needs an independent foreign policy that stresses international development, peace-building and human rights.

"Why are we blindly following the defence policy prescriptions of the Bush administration?"

Are we independent or do we support multilateral efforts. Which is it? Or is it we support multilateral efforts as long as they don't involve Americans? Most of the time I have no idea what this guy is talking about. Then again, I think I do, but I don't think he does.

[gerryhatrick]

That's the problem with warmongers, they think war is all about "politics".

There's no appreciation of the realities.

Jack Layton is entitled to his opinion about our involvement in Afghanistan. All Canadians are. You can disagree with Layton, but it's not necessary to paint a military involvement in which our soldiers are dying as nothing more than "politics".

I personally feel we should fulfill out 2009 comittment. The government should indicate right away that we depart on that date. That would motivate people to get things done before then.

[jbg]

So, any rebuttal to what Jack Layton says?

I'll repeat what I've said ad infinitem; decolonization and "self-determination" were ideas that did not work. Decolonization was, in general, not idealistic; basically the West got fed up with playing schoolmarm and up and left. The result is that the leaders of these countries, in almost all cases (except Israel and India) despots have proven dangerous to the West. These countries are not to be confused with "real" independent countries, such as the US, Canada and Australia.

Basically, this is recolonization under another name. It will be a long, ugly and necessary haul. It will get a lot bloodier and more expensive, but unless you want to fight them in the streets of New York, Toronto and Winnipeg, we have no choice but to rope these lands down.

[WestViking]

Jack Layton’s hatred for the USA and international institutions such as NATO are so palpable he contradicts himself openly and is ready to commit Canadian troops to dubious leadership under the United Nations flag in Lebanon to fight terrorism while at the same time decrying the loss of troops under competent military leadership fighting terrorists in Afghanistan.

Layton is all about image and posturing without reason or substance.

The United Nations Interim Force in Lebanon (UNIFAL) is a disaster. It has sat on its hands for 28 years (apparently that is ‘interim’ in UN language) watching Hezbollah grow, amass weapons and make covert attacks on Israel instead of following its mandate to disarm the terrorists and keep the peace. UNIFAL is indirectly responsible for the recent outbreak of war in Lebanon. It failure to follow its mandate to ensure peace in the region has resulted in thousands of needless deaths and major destruction of the captive southern Lebanon.

Jack Layton has no concept of peacekeeping or how it is done. Sending Canadians into Lebanon to be murdered under the auspices of the United Nations, which has not had a successful ‘peacekeeping’ operation in over 30 years is reprehensible.

[jbg]

The United Nations Interim Force in Lebanon (UNIFAL) is a disaster. It has sat on its hands for 28 years (apparently that is ‘interim’ in UN language) watching Hezbollah grow, amass weapons and make covert attacks on Israel instead of following its mandate to disarm the terrorists and keep the peace. UNIFAL is indirectly responsible for the recent outbreak of war in Lebanon. It failure to follow its mandate to ensure peace in the region has resulted in thousands of needless deaths and major destruction of the captive southern Lebanon.

Add to it UNIFIL's supplying of real-time information on Israeli troop movements.

[jdobbin]

Basically, this is recolonization under another name. It will be a long, ugly and necessary haul. It will get a lot bloodier and more expensive, but unless you want to fight them in the streets of New York, Toronto and Winnipeg, we have no choice but to rope these lands down.

If this is the case, we have to take down Iran today.

[Shakeyhands]

Please continue to use the terms "Cut and Run " & "HezboLiberal" ESPECIALLY in public, please also see if you can get a CPC'r to talk to the press and use both these terms. Thank You.

[Topaz]

Harper shouldn't have gone ahead and committed the troops to this mission until we had looked at the pros and cons of doing so. I think this is our Iraq, we went into a war that we can't win because we don't have the people power to maintain the same length of time that is needed. Just look at the US in Iraq, they've been there for 4 years and have loss close to 3000 soldiers and maimed 20,000 for life! So what have we got over there between 2000-2700 over there, by 2.5 years we won't have anyone surviving unless Harper brings in the "draft", which I don't think he will until after an election. So, are we suppose stay there until we loose all the troops? We also, don't know who is friend and whose foe. I read that Pakistan and Saudis, supports the terrorists and supply them with money. Also, like Bush, Harper has no exit for this war.

[M.Dancer]

There's a world of difference between Iraq and Afghanistan. While neither are cake walks, the challenges in Iraq can make Afghanistan look like a cake walk.

One startling difference is memory. People can remember how life was before the west came......in Iraq, they remember peace....in afghansitan, they remember war and they remember the Taliban.

[M.Dancer]

So what have we got over there between 2000-2700 over there, by 2.5 years we won't have anyone surviving unless Harper brings in the "draft", which I don't think he will until after an election.

Plainly ridiculous

[jdobbin]

There's a world of difference between Iraq and Afghanistan. While neither are cake walks, the challenges in Iraq can make Afghanistan look like a cake walk.

One startling difference is memory. People can remember how life was before the west came......in Iraq, they remember peace....in afghansitan, they remember war and they remember the Taliban.

The violence in Afghanistan has plainly escalated. The forces probably have a few months to improve the security or risk the confidence of Afghanis and the Canadian people.

If things look like they are going from bad to worse, it could set the stage for a Conservative defeat in the next election.

[M.Dancer]

There's a world of difference between Iraq and Afghanistan. While neither are cake walks, the challenges in Iraq can make Afghanistan look like a cake walk.

One startling difference is memory. People can remember how life was before the west came......in Iraq, they remember peace....in afghansitan, they remember war and they remember the Taliban.

The violence in Afghanistan has plainly escalated. The forces probably have a few months to improve the security or risk the confidence of Afghanis and the Canadian people.

If things look like they are going from bad to worse, it could set the stage for a Conservative defeat in the nect election.

http://www.icasualties.org/oef/

No question about it the violence has picked up. Personally I would like to see our committment keep up with the challenge. I think we need more troops there now as well as an air presence. Yhe question is, are the taliban picking up the tempo our of desparation or are they flexing their muscles due to new found strength?

[Black Dog]

I'll repeat what I've said ad infinitem; decolonization and "self-determination" were ideas that did not work. Decolonization was, in general, not idealistic; basically the West got fed up with playing schoolmarm and up and left. The result is that the leaders of these countries, in almost all cases (except Israel and India) despots have proven dangerous to the West. These countries are not to be confused with "real" independent countries, such as the US, Canada and Australia.

Basically, this is recolonization under another name. It will be a long, ugly and necessary haul. It will get a lot bloodier and more expensive, but unless you want to fight them in the streets of New York, Toronto and Winnipeg, we have no choice but to rope these lands down.

The west never successfully colonized Afghanistan, so there goes that theory (and I'll let a few other glaring historical innaccuracies pass without coment).

I do have to ask, though: who is the "they" that is poised to descend onto Queen Street?

[M.Dancer]

I do have to ask, though: who is the "they" that is poised to descend onto Queen Street?

They're welcome to it. Has been worth descending to since the Bamboo closed.

[jbg]

The west never successfully colonized Afghanistan, so there goes that theory (and I'll let a few other glaring historical innaccuracies pass without coment).

You're quite right, but the presence of colonized India (now Pakistan) and a rather cowed Persia (now Iran) in the area, plus their geographical isolation in the days before air travel limited the dangers posed by what's now called "Afghanistan". Also, their lengthy period of constitutional monarchy prior to 1973 was a relatively calm period.

I do have to ask, though: who is the "they" that is poised to descend onto Queen Street?

Radical Islam.

[Wilber]

Harper shouldn't have gone ahead and committed the troops to this mission until we had looked at the pros and cons of doing so. I think this is our Iraq, we went into a war that we can't win because we don't have the people power to maintain the same length of time that is needed. Just look at the US in Iraq, they've been there for 4 years and have loss close to 3000 soldiers and maimed 20,000 for life! So what have we got over there between 2000-2700 over there, by 2.5 years we won't have anyone surviving unless Harper brings in the "draft", which I don't think he will until after an election. So, are we suppose stay there until we loose all the troops? We also, don't know who is friend and whose foe. I read that Pakistan and Saudis, supports the terrorists and supply them with money. Also, like Bush, Harper has no exit for this war.

Canada put an army of 600,000 into Europe in WWI (all volunteers) with a population of 7 million. In WWII it was over a million (almost all volunteers) with a population of around 13 million. If what you say is true it doesn't say much for the country Canada has become.

[jbg]

Canada put an army of 600,000 into Europe in WWI (all volunteers) with a population of 7 million. In WWII it was over a million (almost all volunteers) with a population of around 13 million. If what you say is true it doesn't say much for the country Canada has become.

There were conscripts in both wars. Thus the argument I'm having with some others about Borden in another thread.

[Argus]

So, any rebuttal to what Jack Layton says?

Well, quoted directly from your citation:

NDP Leader Jack Layton says Canada should pull its troops out of Afghanistan by February because the mission has gone astray.

Sniping at both Prime Minister Stephen Harper and President George W. Bush, Layton said the Afghan mission has lost its direction. It has no clear goals, no exit strategy and no criteria to judge success, he said at a news conference Thursday.

To start with. Layton's position is ignorant - or dishonest, as well as being both intellectually and morally incoherent.

The Liberal government warned at the very start of this mission that it was going to be different, that it was not going to be standard peacekeeping. The job was to go into southern Afghanistan, which had seen very little foreign or government presence up until then, and push out the Taliban. Yes, violence has escalated over last year - when they were more or less being left alone. But we knew that before we went in. To suggest that our mission has changed is absurd. Dosanjh has been trying to suggest the same thing. Only with him we can be pretty sure it's blatant lying. The mission was miltaristic from the get-go.

Layton's contention we should be there only to build schools and bridges and pat small children on the head is absurdly stupid, as we can't do any of that while people are shooting at the builders and blowing up the schools. We have to establish security so that schools can operate - with boys and girls, btw. Just what kind of negotiations does Layton expect to have with the Taliban? We'll agree that girls can't be allowed to be educated if they stop attacking us?

I guess jack thinks that with the passing of five years people will have forgotten the reason we went into Afghanistan and jack can now begin telling lies.

Not everybody in Canada supports what Canadian troups are doing in Afghanistan. Maybe Jack Layton is speaking for them.

Sure he is, but that doesn't mean they, as well as he, aren't ignorant, stupid, or dishonest.

[Argus]

Yeah and we know the type. Anti American, anti Israel.

http://www.westernstandard.ca/liberal/liberal.html

As much as I despise all Liberals in Canada, I find The Western Stardard to be even more despicable for hosting such disgusting bigotry on its webserver.

Would you care to point out how the picture is bigoted?

[Alexandra]

The violence in Afghanistan has plainly escalated. The forces probably have a few months to improve the security or risk the confidence of Afghanis and the Canadian people.

If things look like they are going from bad to worse, it could set the stage for a Conservative defeat in the next election.

It appears you haven't been paying attention to the latest events in Khandar and the various villages and patrol bases in the surrounding areas of operation. Local village chiefs have been feeding the coalition forces intel on who and where the taliban and more particularly the 'foreign' type insurgents are hiding and operating. Why you might ask. It may seem to you that violence has escalated; did it occur to you the reason violence escalates only during the spring/summer months and has done since 2002. No? Have you noticed a lessening of the violence around the villages and patrol bases lately? Do mountains and snow ring a bell?

Probably not. Any successes of our troopers and the coalition forces would not be welcome news; hmmm?

That news may make Harper's/Canada's commitment to 2009 appear less repugnant to the voting public. Couldn't have that, could we?