Why do Democrats and Republicans both support Ukraine?

[Nationalist]

1 hour ago, robosmith said:

What extradition? Ukrainians (esp children) taken into Russia were kidnapped.

Putin is indicted by the ICC for those CRIMES.

Situation in Ukraine: ICC judges issue arrest warrants against Vladimir Vladimirovich Putin

 

Oh for Gawds sake...what a load of tweenkie bs...

[robosmith]

3 hours ago, Nationalist said:

Oh for Gawds sake...what a load of tweenkie bs...

Unlike YOU, I posted evidence. Apparently unable to penetrate your COGNITIVE DISSONANCE.

What are you even here for if you REFLEXIVELY REJECT and cannot ABSORB ANY FACTS?

Did you even read the cite? 

"Don't confuse me with the facts" -- Gnat Man. LMAO

[Nationalist]

6 hours ago, robosmith said:

Unlike YOU, I posted evidence. Apparently unable to penetrate your COGNITIVE DISSONANCE.

What are you even here for if you REFLEXIVELY REJECT and cannot ABSORB ANY FACTS?

Did you even read the cite? 

"Don't confuse me with the facts" -- Gnat Man. LMAO

Putin isn't kidnapping kids. Don't you know stupid when you see it?

[Rebound]

3 hours ago, Nationalist said:

Putin isn't kidnapping kids. Don't you know stupid when you see it?

Putin has certainly kidnapped many Ukrainian children and the International Criminal Court had indicted him for it. They even issued an arrest warrant. 
 

https://www.icc-cpi.int/news/situation-ukraine-icc-judges-issue-arrest-warrants-against-vladimir-vladimirovich-putin-and

Edited September 23, 2023 by Rebound

[robosmith]

6 hours ago, Nationalist said:

Putin isn't kidnapping kids. Don't you know stupid when you see it?

I know you're stupid to reject the evidence the ICC used to indict Putin.

That just confirms your cognitive dissonance.

Where do you get that CRAP?

[Nationalist]

19 hours ago, Rebound said:

Putin has certainly kidnapped many Ukrainian children and the International Criminal Court had indicted him for it. They even issued an arrest warrant. 
 

https://www.icc-cpi.int/news/situation-ukraine-icc-judges-issue-arrest-warrants-against-vladimir-vladimirovich-putin-and

What silliness.

[Rebound]

2 hours ago, Nationalist said:

What silliness.

It’s silly to you, cause you’re a fascist who supports kidnapping children. 

[Nationalist]

12 hours ago, Rebound said:

It’s silly to you, cause you’re a fascist who supports kidnapping children. 

FOAD Tweenkie. You're nothing more that a lyin' little death-cultist.

[Mako]

On 9/16/2023 at 10:02 PM, Canadian_Cavalier said:

Because letting Putin take the land of a sovereign nation unchallenged is pure cowardice and sends a message that he can do whatever he wants. The purist isolationist policy of the pre-WWII US was immediately discarded after the bombing of Pearl Harbor because the event thereof instantly rendered it obsolete. Though as Iraq demonstrated, the US should have to have a good warrant to get involved in any conflict, but I believe this is one of them. Independent countries can make their own rules, I'm anything but a globalist, but something must be done about unjust invasions.

No actual soldiers should be sent unless Russia directly attacks a NATO country, of course.

So should we send weapons to help out the Tibetans and the Uyghurs?

Should we go back and fight the Taliban? They’re not so nice.

Should we invade Iran? Nigeria? Ethiopia? Cuba? There’s a lot of injustice in the world.

Is anyone who opposes intervention a coward and an isolationist?

Xi Jin Ping, Raytheon executives, and neocon chicken hawks love this war, but should we?

https://www.realclearpolitics.com/video/2023/02/10/niall_ferguson_the_net_beneficiary_of_the_ukraine_war_is_china.html

These ethnic squabbles are best solved by compromise. But if you prefer a mountain of dead bodies…

And can I ask Canadian Cavalier when will you be galloping into the fray?

Edited September 26, 2023 by Mako

[Mako]

I know some people want to ally themselves with Mitch McConnell. I know some people are really enjoying this war. But can’t we give peace a chance?

https://www.commondreams.org/opinion/give-peace-in-ukraine-a-chance

[robosmith]

15 hours ago, Nationalist said:

FOAD Tweenkie. You're nothing more that a lyin' little death-cultist.

It is hilarious that you believe ^your OPINIONS refute POSTED EVIDENCE. So much ^desperation.

Your intellectual account is OVERDRAWN and scraping the bottom of the barrel. 

 

 

[robosmith]

40 minutes ago, Mako said:

I know some people want to ally themselves with Mitch McConnell. I know some people are really enjoying this war. But can’t we give peace a chance?

https://www.commondreams.org/opinion/give-peace-in-ukraine-a-chance

"Peace" REQUIRES BOTH SIDES wanting it. Putin could have peace ANYTIME by WITHDRAWING from Ukraine.

Until Putin wants peace, the only ways Ukraine can get peace is by defeating Russia, or surrender.

Of course Putin is at HIGH RISK personally if he withdraws now after killing so many people (Russian and Ukrainian) in a lost cause.

[Nationalist]

24 minutes ago, robosmith said:

It is hilarious that you believe ^your OPINIONS refute POSTED EVIDENCE. So much ^desperation.

Your intellectual account is OVERDRAWN and scraping the bottom of the barrel. 

 

 

Its sad that a grown adult can be such a childish, mindless cultist.

You worship death and destruction, as evidenced by everything you do and say.

Everything you freaks touch, turns to shit.

The border

Afghanistan

Law and order

Energy

spending and inflation

and of course

your support for a man who's unsure where he is and what day it is.

[Mako]

19 hours ago, robosmith said:

"Peace" REQUIRES BOTH SIDES wanting it. Putin could have peace ANYTIME by WITHDRAWING from Ukraine.

Until Putin wants peace, the only ways Ukraine can get peace is by defeating Russia, or surrender.

Of course Putin is at HIGH RISK personally if he withdraws now after killing so many people (Russian and Ukrainian) in a lost cause.

I guess you prefer a mountain of dead bodies to compromise and negotiations.

First they told you Saddam was Hitler, now they tell you Putin is Hitler. Did you fall for the same trick both times?

[robosmith]

22 hours ago, Nationalist said:

Its sad that a grown adult can be such a childish, mindless cultist.

Agreed. We are all sad for those like you stuck in the MAGA CULT and unable to find your way out.

22 hours ago, Nationalist said:

You worship death and destruction, as evidenced by everything you do and say.

Far from it. Right now it is the Republicans who are burning the House down and before that it was YOUR MAGA CULT storming the Capitol.

 

22 hours ago, Nationalist said:

Everything you freaks touch, turns to shit.

Trump has done that to ALL of these:

22 hours ago, Nationalist said:

The border

Afghanistan

Law and order

Energy

spending and inflation

 

22 hours ago, Nationalist said:

and of course

your support for a man who's unsure where he is and what day it is.

No REASON to believe ^this OPINION.

[robosmith]

3 hours ago, Mako said:

I guess you prefer a mountain of dead bodies to compromise and negotiations.

Show us where Putin WANTS to negotiate seriously. You can't negotiate with someone who REFUSES to compromise on Ukraine surrendering.

You're NAIVE to believe otherwise.

3 hours ago, Mako said:

First they told you Saddam was Hitler, now they tell you Putin is Hitler. Did you fall for the same trick both times?

Putin invading Ukraine is NOT A "TRICK." It is what Hitler did to Poland AND France. Duh

And Saddam invaded Kuwait.

[Deluge]

9 minutes ago, robosmith said:

Putin invading Ukraine is NOT A "TRICK." It is what Hitler did to Poland AND France. Duh

And Saddam invaded Kuwait.

Then why hasn't Biden gotten with NATO and attacked Russia? Where the f*ck is the cavalry in this time of woke crisis? 

[Nationalist]

31 minutes ago, robosmith said:

Agreed. We are all sad for those like you stuck in the MAGA CULT and unable to find your way out.

Far from it. Right now it is the Republicans who are burning the House down and before that it was YOUR MAGA CULT storming the Capitol.

 

Trump has done that to ALL of these:

 

No REASON to believe ^this OPINION.

Oh yes there is...

 

[Mako]

23 hours ago, robosmith said:

Show us where Putin WANTS to negotiate seriously. You can't negotiate with someone who REFUSES to compromise on Ukraine surrendering.

You're NAIVE to believe otherwise.

Putin invading Ukraine is NOT A "TRICK." It is what Hitler did to Poland AND France. Duh

And Saddam invaded Kuwait.

The Russians are willing to negotiate.

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/other/russia-may-have-just-given-ukraine-terms-for-ending-war/ar-AA1hixyt#image=1
 

The “trick” was convincing you and other dopes that Saddam and Putin = Hitler. I thought that was obvious. Duh.

Hitler quickly conquered Poland, France, Norway, Denmark, etc. Putin can barely hold SE Ukraine.

[CdnFox]

14 minutes ago, Mako said:

The Russians are willing to negotiate.

Not really. "end the war" means " we get to keep everything we have right now or at least most of it".

It's not a serious position.

 

[Nationalist]

3 minutes ago, CdnFox said:

Not really. "end the war" means " we get to keep everything we have right now or at least most of it".

It's not a serious position.

 

Question: Why is that a bad thing? I mean...obviously those people in those regions are ethnic Russian. They do not want to be Ukrainians. Why force this on them? Isn't that just begging for unending friction?

Edited September 27, 2023 by Nationalist

[CdnFox]

Just now, Nationalist said:

Question: Why is that a bad thing? I mean...obviously those people in those regions are ethnic Russian. They do not want to be Ukrainians. Why force this on them? Isn't that just begging for unending friction?

I make no judgement on whether it's "good" or "bad", but the Ukrainians have made it crystal clear it's unacceptable.  So it's not a serious offer.  If you say  you'll sell me your car for 10,000 dollars and not a penny less and i offer you 500.....  regardless of the real value of the car it's just not a serious offer.

And i don't think you can say those people made anything clear - the recent referendums were a joke of course.  Holding a vote at riflepoint isn't very valid   It may well be that the majority of those people feel that way but that was not the way to find out.  Crimea is more arguably russian oriented but even then

And the ukrainian position will be "if we give you that you'll just attack us to take more later", which is a reasonable position to take and given they can't form an alliance with anyone else that creates problems.  So they'll want that land as a buffer if nothing else.

Now we, sitting in our homes safe and sound,  may have different opinions than they do on the matter and what is or is not a good deal, but at the end of the day there will only be a deal if both parties are ok with the outcome. Giving russia a bunch of land probably isn't going to work for ukraine after the price they paid

 

[Nationalist]

10 minutes ago, CdnFox said:

I make no judgement on whether it's "good" or "bad", but the Ukrainians have made it crystal clear it's unacceptable.  So it's not a serious offer.  If you say  you'll sell me your car for 10,000 dollars and not a penny less and i offer you 500.....  regardless of the real value of the car it's just not a serious offer.

And i don't think you can say those people made anything clear - the recent referendums were a joke of course.  Holding a vote at riflepoint isn't very valid   It may well be that the majority of those people feel that way but that was not the way to find out.  Crimea is more arguably russian oriented but even then

And the ukrainian position will be "if we give you that you'll just attack us to take more later", which is a reasonable position to take and given they can't form an alliance with anyone else that creates problems.  So they'll want that land as a buffer if nothing else.

Now we, sitting in our homes safe and sound,  may have different opinions than they do on the matter and what is or is not a good deal, but at the end of the day there will only be a deal if both parties are ok with the outcome. Giving russia a bunch of land probably isn't going to work for ukraine after the price they paid

 

Indeed. The Ukrainians seem to be upset about this separation and the Russians moving in and annexing land given them not so many years ago. However...that is not my fight. Its not your fight either. Nor is it NATO's fight. Its the Ukrainians' fight.

If they wanna fight...let 'em. If they wanna BUY arms to fight...SELL them arms. But giving the farm away because..."democracy", which is a joke in Ukraine's case...is just f'ing stupid and incredibly dangerous.

Edited September 27, 2023 by Nationalist

[CdnFox]

27 minutes ago, Nationalist said:

Indeed. The Ukrainians seem to be upset about this separation and the Russians moving in and annexing land given them not so many years ago. However...that is not my fight. Its not your fight either. Nor is it NATO's fight. Its the Ukrainians' fight.

 

That's not an unreasonable position but the issue was whether or not the russian offer was serious, and given ukraine's position i don't think it can be claimed that it was.

Quote

If they wanna fight...let 'em. If they wanna BUY arms to fight...SELL them arms. But giving the farm away because..."democracy", which is a joke in Ukraine's case...is just f'ing stupid and incredibly dangerous.

Well we've had that discussion before and your position is valid enough, i hold a slightly different one but it's more of a matter of opinion than fact.

But what IS a fact is that any offer to stop the war short of one side being victorious (whatever that looks like) will have to be at least a reasonable starting position in the other side's mind to have any real meaning.

[robosmith]

On 9/26/2023 at 8:54 AM, Deluge said:

Then why hasn't Biden gotten with NATO and attacked Russia? Where the f*ck is the cavalry in this time of woke crisis? 

Cause Ukraine is not a member of NATO. Duh

On 9/26/2023 at 9:09 AM, Nationalist said:

Oh yes there is...

There is a list just as long for Trump, but you still defend him, so that's proof your attack is only partisan hackery.