Giving the middle finger is a 'God-given right,' says Québec judge. Do you agree?

[Contrarian]

Giving the middle finger is a 'God-given right,' says Québec judge. Do you agree?

---

Montreal-area man acquitted of criminal harassment after flipping off neighbors.

Giving someone the middle finger is a "God-given" right that belongs to all Canadians, a Québec judge said, as he recently acquitted a Montreal-area man of criminal harassment and uttering threats.

In his ruling, Québec court Judge Dennis Galiatsatos wrote that not only was Neall Epstein not guilty, but the fact that he was arrested and prosecuted at all was also a bewildering injustice.

"To be abundantly clear, it is not a crime to give someone the finger," the judge wrote in his Feb. 24 ruling. "Flipping the proverbial bird is a God-given, Charter-enshrined right that belongs to every red-blooded Canadian. It may not be civil, it may not be polite, it may not be gentlemanly. Nevertheless, it does not trigger criminal liability."

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/montreal/middle-finger-god-given-right-quebec-judge-1.6772056

--------

The judge made the right call here in my view for this case, HOWEVER I don't think there is a mention of the middle finger gesture in any religious texts or scriptures, so it cannot be considered a SPECIFICALLY "God-given" right. Does anyone disagree?

• Looking for some reasonable people to change my mind. 

Edited March 9 by Contrarian
edit design

[Aristides]

Rights are a human invention, there is no such thing as a God given right.  I think the middle finger on its own is no way a crime.

Edited March 9 by Aristides

[DMGregoire]

God-given?  No.  Under the the laws of our land yes.  There are somethings that should be enshrined in law and some things that should be enshrined in societal views of what is considered prosocial behaviours: things like personal integrity, virtue, and being a person of good character.

 

In this case both acted in poor character.  Tattling to the court of law.  Throw back to days of juvenile behaviour.  I would be embarrassed if I were either of them.  Shame!

I think this is a reflection of this day and age of social media.  People are becoming more and more juvenile.  Reacting to hot button topics instead of reasoning a response.  The most they do is stop to add some trolly ad hominem remark.  The emotional state of our society is being affected by this significantly.

 

 

[WestCanMan]

🖕

[WestCanMan]

If that's not proof that it comes from God, I dunno what is. 

[Contrarian]

Just now, WestCanMan said:

🖕

MAGA world, destination right here: 

https://www.fbi.gov/wanted/capitol-violence

[Contrarian]

1 minute ago, WestCanMan said:

If that's not proof that it comes from God, I dunno what is. 

Explain, with arguments, and will respond?!

[WestCanMan]

Just now, Contrarian said:

MAGA world, destination right here: 

https://www.fbi.gov/wanted/capitol-violence

Are you turning me in to the FBI because I posted a 🖕?

Sorry, I didn't realize how "seditiony" that looked, or how "violent insurrectiony" it was. 

Just out of curiosity, how close do you think I came to overthrowing the US Gov't when I posted that? 

[Contrarian]

3 minutes ago, WestCanMan said:

Are you turning me in to the FBI because I posted a 🖕?

No, because I read your messages, like supporting the CCP over your own CSIS because of a politician like Trudeau. 

Imagine that, disrespecting your own patriots, over not liking Joe Biden and supporting a MAGA man. 

You are a true hero and an example to follow.  😀

Edited March 9 by Contrarian

[WestCanMan]

1 minute ago, Contrarian said:

Explain, with arguments, and will respond?!

In the beginning, there was nothing. Posting a 🖕was impossible because there weren't any computers, and even if there were, there were no monitors around to show them. 

The only possible way for the 🖕to be a thing now is if an omniscient, omnipotent being suddenly willed himself into existence from the dark eons of nothingness and created a world where 🖕 was possible. 

That logic is flawless. What WCM has posted, let no man tear asunder. 

[WestCanMan]

1 minute ago, Contrarian said:

No, because I read your messages, like supporting the CCP over your own CSIS because of a politician like Trudeau. 

Imagine that, disrespecting your own patriots, over not liking Joe Biden and supporting a MAGA man. 

You are a true hero and an example to follow.  😀

I don't support the CCP over CSIS, you reached deep into your ass to find that one. 

[Contrarian]

Just now, WestCanMan said:

I don't support the CCP over CSIS, you reached deep into your ass to find that one. 

😄 😄 😄

Well, at least you have the words, next is to show via your actions, by not praising "Xi", or do I have to get those screenshots again?!

[blackbird]

8 hours ago, Aristides said:

Rights are a human invention, there is no such thing as a God given right.  I think the middle finger on its own is no way a crime.

Depends whether you are a believer in the true God of the Bible.

The Bible tells us that God created man in his own image.  Man is a special creation of God and that means man is not an animal.  The Bible says God gave man dominion over the earth and over all creatures.

He place man on this earth and said man is to love thy neighbour as thyself.  I interpret that to mean man must be respected by his neighbour.  He gave commandments against stealing, murder, adultery, and thereby recognized the right to private property.  This tells me man does have rights.  Everyone has the right to life, liberty, and respect as a person created in the image of God.  

If you don't believe in this God I am talking about, you are not understanding what this subject is all about.  Without God there is no meaning for man's existence.  There is no purpose in man being here.  Man then is just an accident and there is no future.  That is false according to the Bible.  

Without God there is no meaning to life.  Without God, man is nothing more than an animal and is just trying to get what he can among the herd of animals in the world.  A pointless, hopeless way to live and look at the world and life.

Edited March 9 by blackbird

[Contrarian]

Just now, blackbird said:

Without God, man is nothing more than an animal and is just trying to get what he can among the herd of animals in the world.  

Do you really believe this?

[blackbird]

Just now, Contrarian said:

Do you really believe this?

Of course, man is a special creation of God.

"26  And God said, Let us make man in our image, after our likeness: and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth. 27  So God created man in his own image, in the image of God created he him; male and female created he them. 28  And God blessed them, and God said unto them, Be fruitful, and multiply, and replenish the earth, and subdue it: and have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over every living thing that moveth upon the earth. "  Genesis 1:26-28 KJV

[Contrarian]

3 minutes ago, blackbird said:

Of course, man is a special creation of God.

"26  And God said, Let us make man in our image, after our likeness: and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth. 27  So God created man in his own image, in the image of God created he him; male and female created he them. 28  And God blessed them, and God said unto them, Be fruitful, and multiply, and replenish the earth, and subdue it: and have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over every living thing that moveth upon the earth. "  Genesis 1:26-28 KJV

I rather stick with old Marcus: 

[Aristides]

9 minutes ago, blackbird said:

Depends whether you are a believer in the true God of the Bible.

The Bible tells us that God created man in his own image.  Man is a special creation of God and that means man is not an animal.  The Bible says God gave man dominion over the earth and over all creatures.

He place man on this earth and said man is to love thy neighbour as thyself.  I interpret that to mean man must be respected by his neighbour.  He gave commandments against stealing, murder, adultery, and thereby recognized the right to private property.  This tells me man does have rights.  Everyone has the right to life, liberty, and respect as a person created in the image of God.  

If you don't believe in this God I am talking about, you are not understanding what this subject is all about.  Without God there is no meaning for man's existence.  There is no purpose in man being here.  Man then is just an accident and there is no future.  That is false according to the Bible.  

Without God there is no meaning to life.  Without God, man is nothing more than an animal and is just trying to get what he can among the herd of animals in the world.  A pointless, hopeless way to live and look at the world and life.

Everyone's God is the true God.

Man is an animal, we share 99% of our DNA with chimps and gorillas.

[blackbird]

26 minutes ago, Aristides said:

Everyone's God is the true God.

Man is an animal, we share 99% of our DNA with chimps and gorillas.

Darwinism has been thoroughly debunked.  Try some reading.

"

The myth of 1%

Why does the myth that human and chimp DNA differ by 1% persist when the difference is 30%?
Credit: Monkey man © Istockphoto.com/mattjeacock

Human and chimp DNA are very different

Would a 1% difference be ‘almost identical’?

The human genome has about 3,000 million ‘letters’. If the 1% figure were correct, this would amount to 30 million letters difference, which would take 10 Bible-sized books to print. This is 50 times as much DNA as the simplest bacterium.3 This is actually a huge difference that far exceeds the ability of even the most optimistic evolutionary scenarios to create, even given the claimed millions of years.4

What is the real difference?

The publication of the human and chimp DNA sequences made possible a comparison. However, even this is problematic because the chimp genome was not built from scratch. Small pieces of the chimp DNA were first sequenced; that is, the order of the chemical letters was determined using chemical procedures in laboratories. These small strings of ‘letters’ were then aligned with the human genome in the places the evolutionists thought they should go (using computers to compare and place the segments). Then the human genome was removed, leaving a pseudo-chimp genome that assumed common ancestry (evolution), creating a mongrel sequence that is not real. The assumption of evolution in constructing the chimp genome in this way would make it look more like the human genome than it really is. But even with this evolutionary bias, the actual differences are much bigger than 1%.

In 2007 Science published an article on the similarity of human and chimp DNA titled, “Relative differences: the myth of 1%”.2 Author Jon Cohen queried the continued use of the 1% figure, citing comparisons following the publication of the draft chimp DNA sequence of around 5% difference. And yet the 1% myth is perpetuated in 2012 in the same journal.

Illustrating how wrong this is, in 2012 Drs Jeffrey Tomkins and Jerry Bergman reviewed the published studies comparing human and chimp DNA.5 When all the DNA is taken into account and not just pre-selected parts, they found,

“it is safe to conclude that human-chimp genome similarity is not more than ~87% identical, and possibly not higher than 81%.”

In other words, the differences are huge, possibly greater than 19%. Indeed, Dr Tomkins made his own thorough comparison and found the difference to be ~30%.6 Also, the Y-chromosomes, found only in males, are radically different, contrary to evolutionists’ expectations.7

The large difference does not tally with evolutionary expectations but it is consistent with us being created separately from the animals."

https://creation.com/do-humans-and-chimps-share-99-of-dna.

Edited March 9 by blackbird

[blackbird]

1 hour ago, Contrarian said:

I rather stick with old Marcus: 

Yes, I have heard that from people before.  Many believe something like that but it is false.  Marcus Aurelius and people that think like him have never studied or understood the Bible basic teaching that all men are sinners and lost and on the way to hell unless they are redeemed.  The Bible is quite clear, nobody can be saved by living a "noble life" and everyone is a lost sinner unless they are saved by grace through faith. (Ephesians 2:8, 9 KJV)

"19  Now we know that what things soever the law saith, it saith to them who are under the law: that every mouth may be stopped, and all the world may become guilty before God. {guilty…: or, subject to the judgment of God} 20  Therefore by the deeds of the law there shall no flesh be justified in his sight: for by the law is the knowledge of sin. 21  But now the righteousness of God without the law is manifested, being witnessed by the law and the prophets; 22  Even the righteousness of God which is by faith of Jesus Christ unto all and upon all them that believe: for there is no difference: 23  For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God; 24  Being justified freely by his grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus: 25  Whom God hath set forth to be a propitiation through faith in his blood, to declare his righteousness for the remission of sins that are past, through the forbearance of God; {set forth: or, foreordained} {remission: or, passing over} 26  To declare, I say, at this time his righteousness: that he might be just, and the justifier of him which believeth in Jesus. 27  Where is boasting then? It is excluded. By what law? of works? Nay: but by the law of faith. 28  Therefore we conclude that a man is justified by faith without the deeds of the law."  Romans 3:19-28 KJV

" Sirs, what must I do to be saved? 31  And they said, Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, and thou shalt be saved, and thy house."  Acts 16:31 KJV

Edited March 10 by blackbird

[Contrarian]

7 minutes ago, blackbird said:

Yes, I have heard that from people before.  Many believe something like that but it is false.  Marcus Aurelius and people that think like him have never studied or understood the Bible basic teaching that all men and sinners and lost and on the way to hell unless they are redeemed.  The Bible is quite clear, nobody can be saved by living a "noble life" and everyone is a lost sinner unless they are saved by faith.

Let us leave the Bible quotes, Marcus Aurelius went in front of men like you and said the 3 choices of life: 

a) If there are Gods, they should not care about traditions, but how you live your daily life and what you do here on Earth.

b) If there are Gods, but insane, like some books teach, why in the world would you want to surrender your mind to that?

c) But if there are no Gods, at least one lives a good life and passes down something to the next generation. 

and yet, Marcus Aurelius, in the end, lost the war with men like you. Why is that?

Why? Because weak emotion wins against reason sometimes. 

Edited March 10 by Contrarian
grammar

[blackbird]

2 minutes ago, Contrarian said:

Let us leave the Bible quotes, Marcus Aurelius went in front of men like you and said the 3 choices of life: 

a) If there are Gods, they should not care about traditions, but how you live your daily life and what you do here on Earth.

b) If there are Gods, but insane, like some books teach, why in the world would you want to surrender your mind to that?

c) But if there are no Gods, at least one lives a good life and passes down something to the next generation. 

and yet, Marcus Aurelius, in the end, lost the war with men like you. Why is that?

Why? Because weak emotion wins against reason sometimes. 

You or Aurelius don't get to determine how God operates.  God has already given us his revelation in the form of the Bible.  I will stick with that.

"16  All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness: 17  That the man of God may be perfect, throughly furnished unto all good works." 2 Timothy 3:16, 17 KJV

[Contrarian]

Just now, blackbird said:

You or Aurelius don't get to determine how God operates.

Look, Aurelius believed in "Reason", you can look it up, he had no idea how God operated.

Isn't that the basic of humility? Isn't arrogance thinking you have all the answers? 

[blackbird]

9 minutes ago, Contrarian said:

Look, Aurelius believed in "Reason", you can look it up, he had no idea how God operated.

Isn't that the basic of humility? Isn't arrogance thinking you have all the answers? 

I never said I have all the answers.  I am simply pointing out what God says in the Bible.

"

1  Blessed is the man that walketh not in the counsel of the ungodly, nor standeth in the way of sinners, nor sitteth in the seat of the scornful. {ungodly: or, wicked} 2  But his delight is in the law of the LORD; and in his law doth he meditate day and night. 3  And he shall be like a tree planted by the rivers of water, that bringeth forth his fruit in his season; his leaf also shall not wither; and whatsoever he doeth shall prosper. {wither: Heb. fade} 

4  The ungodly are not so: but are like the chaff which the wind driveth away. 5  Therefore the ungodly shall not stand in the judgment, nor sinners in the congregation of the righteous. 6  For the LORD knoweth the way of the righteous: but the way of the ungodly shall perish. " Psalm 1

 

[WestCanMan]

2 hours ago, Contrarian said:

😄 😄 😄

Well, at least you have the words, next is to show via your actions, by not praising "Xi", or do I have to get those screenshots again?!

1) If you want to prove something, provide the link so that we can see it in context 

2) As per 1, your screenshots just prove how stupid you are

3) I've never praised Xi, I just said something that was over your head and you could only described it within the confines of your own mental capacity.

It's like when an ant comes out of a hole to see that he's between the treads of a tire. He doesn't know whether it's a dumptruck, a Ferrari, a bicycle, or that it's even part of a larger vehicle at all, he doesn't even understand the concept of tire and vehicle. His description of what he's looking at makes sense from his own POV, but it's not worthwhile to someone who wants to buy the veicle that tire is attached to. 

FYI I said that Xi gets to do a victory lap if he can end the Ukraine-Russia war, and he has the power to do that. I said that it will make him look good, regardless of how evil he actually is. More importantly, it will make China look good at a time when the US looks anything but good. 

It's like when Anderson Cooper accurately reports on the biggest breaking story of the day, for example a volcano: "Oh look, AC is getting accurate info so quickly and he's been right about this story all along! He's so awesome!"

I'd say "AC is right about this volcano, and CNN can do a victory lap for going along with the most accurate predictions about the magnitude and timing, but this is a completely apolitical discussion, he has no reason to lie about it." Get it?

AC's as slimy a weasel as there ever has been, and his job is to disinform as many people as he can as often as he can, but sometimes he gets to be on the right side of history and when he does it gives the false impression that he's someone that he's not. It's possible that AC can have some moments in the sun, just like Xi can. They're birds of a feather though - awful people. 

[Contrarian]

6 minutes ago, WestCanMan said:

1) If you want to prove something, provide the link so that we can see it in context 

2) As per 1, your screenshots just prove how stupid you are

3) I've never praised Xi, I just said something that was over your head and you could only described it within the confines of your own mental capacity.

It's like when an ant comes out of a hole to see that he's between the treads of a tire. He doesn't know whether it's a dumptruck, a Ferrari, a bicycle, or that it's even part of a larger vehicle at all, he doesn't even understand the concept of tire and vehicle. His description of what he's looking at makes sense from his own POV, but it's not worthwhile to someone who wants to buy the veicle that tire is attached to. 

FYI I said that Xi gets to do a victory lap if he can end the Ukraine-Russia war, and he has the power to do that. I said that it will make him look good, regardless of how evil he actually is. More importantly, it will make China look good at a time when the US looks anything but good. 

It's like when Anderson Cooper accurately reports on the biggest breaking story of the day, for example a volcano: "Oh look, AC is getting accurate info so quickly and he's been right about this story all along! He's so awesome!"

I'd say "AC is right about this volcano, and CNN can do a victory lap for going along with the most accurate predictions about the magnitude and timing, but this is a completely apolitical discussion, he has no reason to lie about it." Get it?

AC's as slimy a weasel as there ever has been, and his job is to disinform as many people as he can as often as he can, but sometimes he gets to be on the right side of history and when he does it gives the false impression that he's someone that he's not. It's possible that AC can have some moments in the sun, just like Xi can. They're birds of a feather though - awful people. 

 Man, not sure which garbage from this forum keeps sending you, I was actually having a pleasant discussion with brother @blackbird

You see, someone like @blackbird, has more integrity than you, which is not even capable to be loyal to a King or your own country, let alone a religion. 

This is why, personally, I will respect more a religious man insane in his dogma than a lost soul like you. Get lost, you managed to pollute this conversation too. 😄

Go talk and argue with Fox, he needs your vote, at the Radical Center, I have no room for a drag around. Only when you decide to lower your guard. 😄

WHAT ARE YOU TALKING ABOUT? How does AC, a low-life propagandist from CNN has to do this conversation?!

Edited March 10 by Contrarian