Obesity. Disease or Lifestyle Choice? US: The health care system rethinks obesity

[Contrarian]

The question is: Obesity. Disease or Lifestyle Choice?

I finished reading quickly the morning trending, and from the center-left, Axios is bringing up the topic about Doctors and Medical experts are leading a rapid cultural shift around obesity, viewing it as a disease rather than a lifestyle choice. 

Here are my thoughts: life is fast here, and there is a fast food at every single corner, every subway, and even when you go on a simple walk, there is a fast food there.You talk on the phone outside? There is fast food there. Do you watch TV? Of course, you will see the new burgers. 

Also, I think there is some sort of injection that happens in the meat here, something with the hormones. I don't dig too much or I am afraid might find myself into a conspiracy land but when I used to travel Europe and eat like machine, almost zero gain weight. Here, a few days with no exercise and food -> gaining.  

The full article, talks about insurance and a new drug that came out: 

https://www.axios.com/2023/02/18/obesity-treatments-drugs-insurance-coverage-stigma

Edited February 18 by Contrarian

[Rebound]

San Francisco tried to combat obesity with a soda tax. Republicans attacked it. Our food system is the problem, I think. 

[Contrarian]

2 hours ago, Rebound said:

San Francisco tried to combat obesity with a soda tax. Republicans attacked it. Our food system is the problem, I think. 

Welcome back to the arena. 

I think also Jerry Brown, your previous governor did it too according to this: 

California Gov. Jerry Brown signed a bill into law in the state from levying sales taxes on groceries, including soda and other sugary beverages.

(Reason.com)

Both sides are in the pocket it seems. 

Pepsi + Coca Cola vs Lawmakers 1 - 0. 

Did San Francisco try something locally? 

Edited February 18 by Contrarian

[bcsapper]

It's arguable that there are those who cannot afford to eat well, and thus are reduced to relying on junk food, but I think that in most cases it's just a combination of sloth and a lack of discipline.  Junk food is easy, it tastes good, and it amplifies cravings.

I love a good pizza, and I get one about twice a year.  I love chinese fast food even more, and I almost never eat that.

That said, food is one thing, drink is another.  Taxing sugar in pop might lead to people drinking diet pop, and then they have to deal with the aspertame as well as the weight gain, because apparently, diet pop doesn't help.

[Contrarian]

4 minutes ago, bcsapper said:

drinking diet pop, and then they have to deal with the aspertame as well as the weight gain, because apparently, diet pop doesn't help.

Yah that is a big one, So called Diet Coca Cola will catch up with me one day. It brainwashes one because it says zero sugar, meanwhile old aspartame is waiting there. 

---> I don't think I gained weight with it personally, but the damage inside, is unknown. 

Edited February 18 by Contrarian

[bcsapper]

2 minutes ago, Contrarian said:

Yah that is a big one, So called Diet Coca Cola will catch up with me one day. It brainwashes one because it says zero sugar, meanwhile old aspartame is waiting there. 

---> I don't think I gained weight with it personally, but the damage inside that is unknown. 

Apparently it increases the appetite and one gains weight that way.  Of course it might just be that a typical diet soda drinker has poor eating habits anyway, and you do not.

[Perspektiv]

I personally think its lifestyle choices for the most part.

Of course, exceptions apply to every rule. I've played sports with someone who was morbidly obese, but had the endurance of a marathon runner. They simply suffered from an illness which made it impossible for them to lose weight.

Anyone dumb enough to judge them as to being slow and lazy, were quickly regretful when this person ran circles around them.

However, many who are obese have become this way due to poor lifestyle choices.

I think a lack of education of what certain foods will do to you, and financial situations can play a part, but I have traveled the globe.

You go to a country where famine is at play, and will see people eat whatever they can get their hands on, which is incredibly unhealthy, you won't see obesity. There is a reason for this. Lifestyle differences, where one must hustle 24/7 to put food on your table, or literally starve to death as little to no social safety nets will be available to help you. People on a poverty level of this scale, can't afford to drive or public transit. They walk. Fast food is a luxury.

In western society, the car is king. Drive through dining is abundant. Junk food is heavily marketed, with the false promise in it being healthy, low fat, low salt, but high in other junk that makes up for what they took out.

I remember the dramatic change in my health when I became hyper attentive to processed foods, sugars and other foods which had been plaguing me with extreme lethargy, and other issues.

However, all this said--I still chose to eat this way. I knew the only way out was educating myself, and finding my way out of it. The entitlement of someone who would sue a fast food joint for making them fat, is a western problem.

We seem to socially feel like we can play the victim, and not take ownership for choices we make. Accountability is falling out of fashion, like healthy eating.

Your healthy, your body is your choice. Failure to recognize this, has consequences.

 

[robosmith]

Could be that the lifestyle choice is a mental disease of needing to eat comfort foods that cause other diseases like diabetes.

My father got diabetes in his early 50s, but he was also allergic to exercise. I am well past that now and still no diabetes; but I exercise and am not addicted to ice cream and soda.

[Contrarian]

48 minutes ago, robosmith said:

ice cream and soda.

I recalled a debate once:

• Question: Which one is the most dangerous "drug" on the streets?
• Answer: Sugar, and is in every store. 

Edited February 18 by Contrarian

[bcsapper]

48 minutes ago, robosmith said:

Could be that the lifestyle choice is a mental disease of needing to eat comfort foods that cause other diseases like diabetes.

My father got diabetes in his early 50s, but he was also allergic to exercise. I am well past that now and still no diabetes; but I exercise and am not addicted to ice cream and soda.

That's pretty much the same as me.  My father would have never considered actual excercise for its own sake.  He wasn't lazy.  It just would not have occurred to him.  He got type 2 diabetes in his 50s too.  All he ever ate was meat and potatoes.

I exercise for the fun of it.  I have done since the army made me do it every day.

 

[Aristides]

Lifestyle but one that is encouraged in our society by the makers of crap food that is addictive.

I exercise a lot but my dad didn't. He said you only get so many heart beats so don't waste them. He made it to two weeks short of his 98th birthday so what do I know. On the other hand he didn't eat junk and was never over weight. His only addiction was ice cream.

[dialamah]

6 hours ago, bcsapper said:

 I think that in most cases it's just a combination of sloth and a lack of discipline.  Junk food is easy, it tastes good, and it amplifies cravings.

There's also evidence that different people react differently to junk food - a diet that might make person A gain weight will have no effect on person B, so blaming "sloth and lack of discipline" may miss the mark.  There are some conditions and medications that cause weight gain, even if one's diet is good. Your body also has a "set point", a weight which it tries to maintain.  It can change, but it can be really difficult to reduce your weight below that point as your body will take steps to protect itself from that change.  That set point is why it's thought that even people who've successfully lost weight through gastric surgery can gain most or all of it back.  Even one's gut microbiome can have an affect on weight gain and weight loss.

Not that overeating/eating the wrong foods and sitting around are blameless, but there's a lot more nuance to the issue of weight gain and obesity than calories in/calories out.  

[reason10]

On 2/18/2023 at 8:06 AM, Contrarian said:

The question is: Obesity. Disease or Lifestyle Choice?

I finished reading quickly the morning trending, and from the center-left, Axios is bringing up the topic about Doctors and Medical experts are leading a rapid cultural shift around obesity, viewing it as a disease rather than a lifestyle choice. 

Here are my thoughts: life is fast here, and there is a fast food at every single corner, every subway, and even when you go on a simple walk, there is a fast food there.You talk on the phone outside? There is fast food there. Do you watch TV? Of course, you will see the new burgers. 

Also, I think there is some sort of injection that happens in the meat here, something with the hormones. I don't dig too much or I am afraid might find myself into a conspiracy land but when I used to travel Europe and eat like machine, almost zero gain weight. Here, a few days with no exercise and food -> gaining.  

The full article, talks about insurance and a new drug that came out: 

https://www.axios.com/2023/02/18/obesity-treatments-drugs-insurance-coverage-stigma

The Reader's Digest version:

1. Some people eat too much and do not take care of themselves.

2. Other people watch their diets and exercise.

YES, you get fat when your calorie intake exceeds the calories used in daily activity. Simple  math, even for blue staters.

[reason10]

On 2/18/2023 at 8:11 AM, Rebound said:

San Francisco tried to combat obesity with a soda tax. Republicans attacked it. Our food system is the problem, I think. 

Republicans wanted to attack a TAX ON THE POOR and that's the reason so many people are FAT?

(Earth to cretin: EVERYONE, rich or poor, buys sodas. The poor are the ones who buy them and pay more in taxes. The rich can afford it.)

The math is very simple: If calorie intake exceeds the number of calories burned, it will be stored as fat. Obesity is because a human CHOOSES to consume more food than he/she needs for the day.

We ALL pig out. (All in America, that is.) We are ALL yoyo dieters. Some of us work out and watch our diets. Some of us spend a lot of time at Golden Corral.

There is no mystical formula to this. Obesity is VOLUNTARY.

Nobody is forcing fatties to eat at gunpoint.

 

[reason10]

18 hours ago, Aristides said:

Lifestyle but one that is encouraged in our society by the makers of crap food that is addictive.

I exercise a lot but my dad didn't. He said you only get so many heart beats so don't waste them. He made it to two weeks short of his 98th birthday so what do I know. On the other hand he didn't eat junk and was never over weight. His only addiction was ice cream.

Is it a physical addiction or a mental addiction? (LIke the difference between Heroin and Marijuana).

Does the average spermwhale FEEL a compulsion to order three Big Macs and an acre of fries three times a day due to some sort of mystical emanation in the McDonald's ads, or is there a System X additive in the food that makes it addictive to only certain types of people?

Is there such a formula in crap food? (Honest question. I'm not ruling it out.)

Of course, the LAST thing I would do is get a burger from a crap food stand that hires high school dropouts and pays them a dollar an hour more than they are worth.

[robosmith]

59 minutes ago, reason10 said:

Is it a physical addiction or a mental addiction? (LIke the difference between Heroin and Marijuana).

Does the average spermwhale FEEL a compulsion to order three Big Macs and an acre of fries three times a day due to some sort of mystical emanation in the McDonald's ads, or is there a System X additive in the food that makes it addictive to only certain types of people?

Is there such a formula in crap food? (Honest question. I'm not ruling it out.)

Of course, the LAST thing I would do is get a burger from a crap food stand that hires high school dropouts and pays them a dollar an hour more than they are worth.

Maybe you should check with the "spermwhale" named Trump. LMAO

[Contrarian]

I want to thank @bcsapper for bringing up diet soda and taking away days from my life. 

I went down to do grocery and got myself a 2L of aspartane drink. Diet Cola. The taste is great. Damage internal unknown. 

Edited February 19 by Contrarian

[bcsapper]

10 minutes ago, Contrarian said:

I want to thank @bcsapper for bringing up diet soda and taking away days from my life. 

I went down to do grocery and got myself a 2L of aspartane drink. Diet Cola. The taste is great. Damage internal unknown. 

I have nothing to offer but blood, toil, tears, nutritional advice and sweat.  I do what I can.

[Legato]

Was in a Walmart the other day, too many people wider than their shopping carts.

[Contrarian]

8 minutes ago, Legato said:

Was in a Walmart the other day, too many people wider than their shopping carts.

Wallmarts with McDonalds right in it is a deadly combination. 

Damaging people while cashing it to the bank. 

I still don't understand why Fast Foods don't list detail content of each product.

Which lobby group was paid to make sure that did not happen?

Edited February 19 by Contrarian

[Legato]

Lifeguard to two sunbathers.....Please get of the beach, the tide wants to come in.

[reason10]

19 hours ago, robosmith said:

Maybe you should check with the "spermwhale" named Trump. LMAO

LEGALLY ELECTED PRESIDENT TRUMP has nothing to do with this discussion.

[reason10]

17 hours ago, Contrarian said:

I want to thank @bcsapper for bringing up diet soda and taking away days from my life. 

I went down to do grocery and got myself a 2L of aspartane drink. Diet Cola. The taste is great. Damage internal unknown. 

One thing for certain: Diet Coke will not cause your blood sugar to spike.

[Rebound]

On 2/18/2023 at 8:20 AM, Contrarian said:

Welcome back to the arena. 

I think also Jerry Brown, your previous governor did it too according to this: 

California Gov. Jerry Brown signed a bill into law in the state from levying sales taxes on groceries, including soda and other sugary beverages.

(Reason.com)

Both sides are in the pocket it seems. 

Pepsi + Coca Cola vs Lawmakers 1 - 0. 

Did San Francisco try something locally? 

That, my friend, is the political system. 
Nothing gets done without 50% +1.  You can never vote for a bill that you agree with 100%. 

I met Jerry Brown several times. He was a former governor from the 1979’s, and he moved to the Jack London area of Oakland and had a radio show. Oakland is a notoriously unsafe place, but he injected himself into the community and got to know people.  He often ate at a breakfast place we liked, and he talked to people.  Like he’d sit down at your table and talk to you, ask what was going on, and what mattered. When he ran for mayor of Oakland, he had extremely strong support from the African American community. And he was a great mayor.  Oakland thrived while he was mayor. 
Then he became Governor, and he was very fiscally conservative.  California requires a balanced budget and he slashed spending to pass his budgets every year.  California did great while he was Governor. 

[robosmith]

5 hours ago, reason10 said:

LEGALLY ELECTED PRESIDENT TRUMP has nothing to do with this discussion.

YOU'RE the one who brought of "spermwhales" of which Trump is CERTAINLY ONE. LMAO