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Why do Urban people vote Left, but Rural people vote Right?


August1991

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1 hour ago, CdnFox said:

Probably the simplest explanation,

In my teenage years, I spent a lot of time in very remote and rural central and Eastern Idaho. One observation is that those in the few small towns were basically on equal footing in the socioeconomics. Yes, they were white but there was no poor part of town and no wealthy part either. The houses were remarkably similar and modest. The jobs in these towns were somewhat simple.. restaurant, retail, local government, or federal government. Compare that with any town above 100,000... there is always a run down section and the opposite.. Why does this matter? Simple. In cities, this inequity (does not matter if it is fair or just) drives the economic policies. 

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On 3/10/2023 at 8:17 AM, Americana Antifa said:

What I'm actually saying is that certain material/environmental conditions make people more likely to fall for propaganda about "the other" being dangerous. Humans, in general, are afraid of what they don't understand

I'm pretty sure lefties were the first of our tree dwelling ancestors to leave the trees and explore the ground below. No doubt to escape the screeching poo flinging fearful monkeys above. Maybe that's why conservatives prefer the country, there's more trees.

But how does that explain conservatives want to turn green spaces into cityscapes and that lefties are tree huggers?  BTW I was a pony-tailed lefty who used to cut trees down for a living. Nowadays I clear-cut what hair I still have, vote Green and I still live in the boonies.

Maybe the whole premise of the thread is hooey.

Edited by eyeball
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1 hour ago, eyeball said:

I'm pretty sure lefties were the first of our tree dwelling ancestors to leave the trees and explore the ground

Actually research shows that it's typically what we'd call right leaning types who do almost all the exploring. So it was most likely them. Turns out lefties prefer to stay at home in the trees and tell other people how to live while demanding somone bring them a banana :)

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8 minutes ago, CdnFox said:

Actually research shows that it's typically what we'd call right leaning types who do almost all the exploring. So it was most likely them.

No, research shows that conservatives brains are wired for fear, it's why they're conservative. It's only when mom is handy that they pluck up their courage.

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3 minutes ago, eyeball said:

No, research shows that conservatives brains are wired for fear, it's why they're conservative. It's only when mom is handy that they pluck up their courage.

Sorry - that's just not true. It's the kind of thing lefties tell other lefties in order to make themselves feel better about being lefties.  Conservatives don't let fear or obstacles hold them back - while lefties don't let facts or reason hold them back :) LOL

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A few years ago, I took three "Conservative" guys to the remote Frank Church Wilderness in Central ID. A lot of big talk beforehand. Yet, we turned on to the dirt road at north fork, Idaho and their "explorer" veneer melted away. There was no cell service, no gas stations, and their romantic view of the untouched wilderness turned to "What do they do here"? Was here for two days and upon getting to Salmon.. it was a frantic rush to charge their cell phones, get a cappucino, and such. 

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Next difference between urban and rural voters is land use. The urban voter ventures out to the outdoors occasionally and views it as a shiny new toy or novelty. You should preserve it and keep it nice and shiny. The rural voter views it as an asset. Something that you should use and if possible, preserve. The rural person is more likely to make a living off the land so it makes sense that they come at it from the viewpoint of productivity and not novelty. There is this narrative that if you preserve the pristine outdoors that you will get tourism dollars... that is not always the case. 

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44 minutes ago, impartialobserver said:

Next difference between urban and rural voters is land use. The urban voter ventures out to the outdoors occasionally and views it as a shiny new toy or novelty. You should preserve it and keep it nice and shiny. The rural voter views it as an asset. Something that you should use and if possible, preserve. The rural person is more likely to make a living off the land so it makes sense that they come at it from the viewpoint of productivity and not novelty. There is this narrative that if you preserve the pristine outdoors that you will get tourism dollars... that is not always the case. 

Yeah - again tho i'm not seeing much of a difference between conservative federal gov'ts and libs there. The firearms issue is more likely to be a factor and that kind of ties in to what you said sort of but honestly - other than oil extraction where are the two signficantly different in the eyes of the rural person, most of whom aren't in oil extraction.

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1 hour ago, CdnFox said:

Yeah - again tho i'm not seeing much of a difference between conservative federal gov'ts and libs there. The firearms issue is more likely to be a factor and that kind of ties in to what you said sort of but honestly - other than oil extraction where are the two signficantly different in the eyes of the rural person, most of whom aren't in oil extraction.

An urban voter is going to vote against anything that appears to be diminish the romanticized view of the untouched forest/outdoors. 

 

Here is an example. We have a proposed lithium mine in NW Nevada. As far as the US goes.... this is middle of nowhere. Vast, untouched high desert. Yet as soon as the project was to be approved by county commissioners.. the environmentalists came calling. Where were they from? San Francisco. What was their concern? Wildlife, water supplies. Hmmm... well before this project had you asked them about Thacker Canyon, Nevada they would have said, "huh... is that near Vegas". Answer not even close. Most leftists reflexively agree with them. 

Conservatives view this as a chance to get jobs and milk the land for something. Those who have ever driven this stretch of road know how empty and desolate it is. Hours of no one and nothing except fences, sagebrush, and dirt. What else are you going to do out here. There is no water and so ranching is tough (most operate in the red). Can't grow anything.. soil is alkaline, dry, and has no organic matter. 

Edited by impartialobserver
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On 3/23/2023 at 4:32 PM, eyeball said:

But how does that explain conservatives want to turn green spaces into cityscapes and that lefties are tree huggers? 

It's actually a funny but stupid story. In America, average conservatives used to be big conservationists, since so many of them live in rural areas. But conservatism as an ideology is all about making the rich even richer, so the right-wing establishment needed to change this. Eventually, they started painting environmentalism as a hippy lefty thing. This was done solely to make conservative rural people turn against environmentalism. And because most conservatives have soup for brains, it worked.

Basically, environmentalism wasn't a a culture issue until the establishment made it one. And it's like that with most culture war nonsense. Nobody was scared of drag queens five years ago. The right-wing establishment decided to make it an issue.

 

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Just now, Americana Antifa said:

It's actually a funny but stupid story.

 

Agreed - your story was stupid. And as usual based on your hatred and bigotry towards conservatives. What a sad person you are.

So there's the real reason guys - people like this one live in cities and nobody outside of the city wants to be like them :)

 

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On 3/22/2023 at 8:35 AM, Holubice said:

Fascism is on the rise just because of high level of immigration

New immigrant are a formidable attraction to vote far right for people never did. They are their last resource. Workes are the new voters of far right movements. 

That proves my point. People who have irrational fears are more likely to fall for right-wing propaganda, especially if they  live in an area where they never met the people that the media tells them they're supposed to be afraid of.

Germany is a fantastic example. The former East Germany is very rural and poor due to being a puppet state of the Soviet Union for decades. Today, East Germans are way more likely to vote for right-wing politicians, despite the fact that the majority of immigrants live in West Germany. The East Germans never actually met the migrants that they're afraid of, which is basically how right-wing media works.

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1 minute ago, Americana Antifa said:

That proves my point. People who have irrational fears are more likely to fall for right-wing propaganda,

No, it refutes your point. Those people have no knowledge of or interaction with the newcomers so they have no fear of  them.

Whats driving the far right is the same as what did in Germany in the 20's - people like you spewing hatred and pursuing a facist agenda based on your bigotry. It forces otherwise rational people to feel they have to choose a side.  Obviously they're not going to choose yours - you literally hate them. So it pushes them into the arms of the far right.

Left wing hatred spawns right wing hatred in response. Always has.

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19 minutes ago, CdnFox said:

No, it refutes your point. Those people have no knowledge of or interaction with the newcomers so they have no fear of  them.

But they still vote based on fear of those people. What I'm saying is that if they met the people they're supposed to be afraid of, they wouldn't vote based on fear of them. If more East Germans met Muslims, they wouldn't vote for politicians who are against Muslim immigration.

19 minutes ago, CdnFox said:

Whats driving the far right is the same as what did in Germany in the 20's - people like you spewing hatred and pursuing a facist agenda based on your bigotry.

?

Righties really never change. It's always "we had to do an authoritarianism because you made us!"

What's going on in America now with Trumpism is the exact same thing that happened with Nazism in Germany, as well as with Fascism in Austria, Italy, Spain, and Portugal. It was always that the Left has "gone too far" and that they're the REAL bigots! Righties never change their propaganda. It's always projection and playing the victim.

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1 hour ago, Americana Antifa said:

But they still vote based on fear of those people.

They vote in fear of people they don't even know about? LOL Nice trick :)

Nope - it ain't fear kiddo :)

1 hour ago, Americana Antifa said:

?

Righties really never change. It's always "we had to do an authoritarianism because you made us!"

 

We on the left hate you!!!! You're scum  -- we wish you were dead and we'll hunt you down!!! Hey.. why are you banding together against us????

LOL - Leffties never change. :) They spread hatred and bigotry wherever they go, then get mad when that's turned against them.

You never learn do you :)  Well - there you go.

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2 hours ago, Americana Antifa said:

It's actually a funny but stupid story. In America, average conservatives used to be big conservationists, since so many of them live in rural areas.

I've been asking conservatives for years what it is they don't get about conservation. Usually I get some explanation that simply denies the two words are rooted or related in any way whatsoever and that it's me that doesn't get it or that I'm changing the meaning of these words because I'm a commie or Nazi or something.

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2 minutes ago, CdnFox said:

They vote in fear of people they don't even know about? LOL Nice trick :)

Like I said, East Germans vote for the anti-immigration politicians, despite the vast majority of immigrants living in West Germany.

And it's the same thing in America. The right-wing propaganda works much better in rural areas because the people there are less likely to have met a trans or gay person.

2 minutes ago, CdnFox said:

We on the left hate you!!!! You're scum  -- we wish you were dead and we'll hunt you down!!! Hey.. why are you banding together against us????

Name some mainstream leftists or even liberals who talk that way.

The only politicians and pundits who call for violence are on the Right. And because conservatives have a victim-complex, they pretend that their violence is defensive. It was the exact same strategy nazis, fascists, and tankies used in the 20th century.

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4 minutes ago, eyeball said:

I've been asking conservatives for years what it is they don't get about conservation. Usually I get some explanation that simply denies the two words are rooted or related in any way whatsoever and that it's me that doesn't get it or that I'm changing the meaning of these words because I'm a commie or Nazi or something.

The term actually refers to conserving values, which they still use in their propaganda. You know, conserving the "traditional family" and all that nonsense. But the movement's origins were really a negative reaction to democracy during the French Revolution.

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7 minutes ago, Americana Antifa said:

Like I said, East Germans vote for the anti-immigration politicians, despite the vast majority of immigrants living in West Germany.

Nope. They don't care about the anti immigraiton part. They vote for them for other reasons. So - more lies from you

Quote

Name some mainstream leftists or even liberals who talk that way.

You.

And most of the others to be fair :)

9 minutes ago, Americana Antifa said:

The only politicians and pundits who call for violence are on the Right.

AOC does. And i previously pointed out several others. MANY on the left support and condone violence.  They give a cursory 'i'm not saying i condone violence BUUUUUTTTT then go on to condone violence.

The left is OUTRAGEOUSLY violent and promotes it regularly. They want to "fry pigs like bacon" (police). They frequently call for harm to those they feel are not of the same mind as them. They have an entire "punch a nazi' campaign and then - just like you - they claim EVERYONE WHO IS RIGHT OF THEM INCLUDING TIM POOLE is a nazi.  So anyone who disagrees with them.

The left is full of horrible violent bigoted racists angry people who condone violence. Even Pelosi said she didn't understand why people weren't violently rioting  but hey maybe soon....

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1 minute ago, Americana Antifa said:

The term actually refers to conserving values, which they still use in their propaganda. You know, conserving the "traditional family" and all that nonsense. But the movement's origins were really a negative reaction to democracy during the French Revolution.

I wonder if it was just the right-wing co-opting conservative values. The French Revolution is also where the terms right-wing and left-wing were coined and they meant very different things than they do today. 

The initial cleavage at the time of the French Revolution was between supporters of absolute monarchy (the Right) and those who wished to limit the king's authority (the Left). During the 19th century, the cleavage was between monarchists and republicans.

According to the original meanings of the term the right-wing is far more about the distribution of power, and by the same token the Liberal Party of Canada could easily be described as being just about the most right-wing party in Canada - conservatism and progressivism have little to do with it.

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