Army Guy Posted February 15, 2023 Report Share Posted February 15, 2023 When is it we are going to wake up from this nightmare we call this liberal government. It seems China keeps coming back to haunt this government, if just half of what we hear is true we are in trouble... Is this normal behavior and when are liberal voters going to do something, instead of dismiss it. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moonbox Posted February 16, 2023 Report Share Posted February 16, 2023 17 hours ago, Army Guy said: Is this normal behavior and when are liberal voters going to do something, instead of dismiss it. I guess Liberal voters will do something about it when they're given a serious alternative. ?♂️ 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Army Guy Posted February 16, 2023 Author Report Share Posted February 16, 2023 The left has always got an excuse not to do something, 3 parties to choose from and still not satisfied, lets not forget it was the left that gave us Justin and his merry gang of lairs in the first place, and if having a Chinese government agent involved in Canadian politics does not bother the left it says volumes about them. And not a whole lot about their patriotism. But they would be lined up around the block for some of that government hand outs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moonbox Posted February 16, 2023 Report Share Posted February 16, 2023 ? Do you actually know anything about this story? Have you read anything about it, or is this just the "latest thing" that came up in your news feed to ramble about? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Queenmandy85 Posted February 16, 2023 Report Share Posted February 16, 2023 21 hours ago, Army Guy said: When is it we are going to wake up from this nightmare we call this liberal government. It seems China keeps coming back to haunt this government, if just half of what we hear is true we are in trouble... Is this normal behavior and when are liberal voters going to do something, instead of dismiss it. Since I never click on links, could you outline the gist of what this is about? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedDog Posted February 16, 2023 Report Share Posted February 16, 2023 This travesty is what “Canadians” want. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Army Guy Posted February 17, 2023 Author Report Share Posted February 17, 2023 6 hours ago, Queenmandy85 said: Since I never click on links, could you outline the gist of what this is about? Sure, the conservatives are asking why a liberal MP is using a known Chinese government agent to assist her in her election campaign, after being warned by CSIS and other governmental agencies who this person is...And now they want to know why. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Army Guy Posted February 17, 2023 Author Report Share Posted February 17, 2023 6 hours ago, Moonbox said: ? Do you actually know anything about this story? Have you read anything about it, or is this just the "latest thing" that came up in your news feed to ramble about? If you have anything more to add to the post then please do so, I'd be happy to read it... once again if you don't like the post do not engage... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moonbox Posted February 17, 2023 Report Share Posted February 17, 2023 (edited) 2 hours ago, Army Guy said: Sure, the conservatives are asking why a liberal MP is using a known Chinese government agent to assist her in her election campaign, after being warned by CSIS and other governmental agencies who this person is...And now they want to know why. No, that's not what this is, and CSIS did not warn or say what you explain here. Once again, you've not actually informed yourself on this story - either that or you're deliberately misrepresenting it. Based on past experience, I'm guessing it's just ignorance. Edited February 17, 2023 by Moonbox 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Army Guy Posted February 17, 2023 Author Report Share Posted February 17, 2023 (edited) 16 hours ago, Moonbox said: No, that's not what this is, and CSIS did not warn or say what you explain here. Once again, you've not actually informed yourself on this story - either that or you're deliberately misrepresenting it. Based on past experience, I'm guessing it's just ignorance. You should watch the video, i think it will explain your confusion, CSIS warned the PMO office and the trade minister that the former liberal MP Chan was on a watch list and was tied to a Chinese spy net work. And despite all of this she continued to have Chan guide her election Campaign... The liberal party have already had mud thrown in their face by failing to properly vet former minister Chan, and it was the same party that had no issues with chan holding a key position in a election campaign as they took no action to stop this...Lack of good judgement by the trade minister and the entire upper chain of command of the liberal party... Based on past experience your blowing hot wind. The story is already out there, if you have proof of anything other wise please let us know, otherwise everything you say is opinion, and like a$$holes everyone has one does not make them fact ... Edited February 17, 2023 by Army Guy 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moonbox Posted February 17, 2023 Report Share Posted February 17, 2023 4 minutes ago, Army Guy said: You should watch the video, i think it will explain your confusion, CSIS warned the PMO office and the trade minister that the former liberal MP Chan was on a watch list and was tied to a Chinese spy net work. And despite all of this she continued to have Chan guide her election Campaign... I watched the video. I understand what the story is. 4 minutes ago, Army Guy said: Based on past experience your blowing hot wind. The story is already out there, if you have proof of anything other wise please let us know, otherwise everything you say is opinion, and like a$$holes everyone has one does not make them fact ... You just tried to tell us that MP Chan was a known Chinese government agent, which is a far cry from MP Chan being on a CSIS watchlist for ties to people who might be (or even probably are) Chinese agents. It's a lot like Maxime Bernier being on a watchlist for his ex-gf's ties to biker gangs. It shows potential bad judgement and means you probably don't want them on any classified projects, but not that he's a traitor to his country and selling us out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Army Guy Posted February 17, 2023 Author Report Share Posted February 17, 2023 1 hour ago, Moonbox said: I watched the video. I understand what the story is. You just tried to tell us that MP Chan was a known Chinese government agent, which is a far cry from MP Chan being on a CSIS watchlist for ties to people who might be (or even probably are) Chinese agents. It's a lot like Maxime Bernier being on a watchlist for his ex-gf's ties to biker gangs. It shows potential bad judgement and means you probably don't want them on any classified projects, but not that he's a traitor to his country and selling us out. Watch it again if you have to, Chan has close links to known Chinese spys and the transport minister was warned by CSIS and the Liberal party to that it would not be a good idea ... when it smells like shit 99.99 % of the time it is shit. The question you have to ask is why if your a Canadian MP would want to be in close proximity to a man who has close links to a Chinese spy network in an election campaign...is that something liberal voters look for today.... unless that does not matter to the liberal party which we can deduct it does not matter at all as they took no action.... for those that are having a hard time with that question, it makes for bad optics, and opens you up to stupid things like i don't know having these questions asked in the house of commons.. So she was asked why would you have employed a man with close links to a Chinese spy network ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moonbox Posted February 17, 2023 Report Share Posted February 17, 2023 4 minutes ago, Army Guy said: Watch it again if you have to, Chan has close links to known Chinese spys and the transport minister was warned by CSIS and the Liberal party to that it would not be a good idea... Like the Conservatives under Harper were warned of Maxime Bernier's girlfriend having close ties to organized crime, and how he was caught leaving classified documents laying around to boot. Interestingly, I don't remember you hollering about that. It doesn't make him a spy, or a criminal, it just looks bad and could be something worse. If we go back to Michael Chan, this guy is very clearly sympathetic to communist China, and I think it's pretty poor judgement to see him support the Hong Kong protests, just like I think it's questionable that he was on Mary Ng's election committee. This wouldn't be the first time she's shown poor judgement and ethical compromises either, and she shouldn't be part of the Liberal Cabinet. That being said, we can go back again to Maxime Bernier, who was clearly a tool and not only resigned from cabinet in disgrace, but then was appointed back to cabinet a few years later. That smelled like shit too, but again, you weren't too concerned about that, were you? I Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Army Guy Posted February 17, 2023 Author Report Share Posted February 17, 2023 8 minutes ago, Moonbox said: Like the Conservatives under Harper were warned of Maxime Bernier's girlfriend having close ties to organized crime, and how he was caught leaving classified documents laying around to boot. Interestingly, I don't remember you hollering about that. It doesn't make him a spy, or a criminal, it just looks bad and could be something worse. If we go back to Michael Chan, this guy is very clearly sympathetic to communist China, and I think it's pretty poor judgement to see him support the Hong Kong protests, just like I think it's questionable that he was on Mary Ng's election committee. This wouldn't be the first time she's shown poor judgement and ethical compromises either, and she shouldn't be part of the Liberal Cabinet. That being said, we can go back again to Maxime Bernier, who was clearly a tool and not only resigned from cabinet in disgrace, but then was appointed back to cabinet a few years later. That smelled like shit too, but again, you weren't too concerned about that, were you? I Your funney, Nice distraction, MADMAX was thinking with the little head and not the big one, he F***ked up and paid the price for poor judgement... and the two incidents do not even compare... transport minister was aware of the risks and optics and now is having to say sorry as thats all that happens in the liberal government when you screw up on purpose... Not just a sign of bad judgement, she was warned many times it was not a good idea and did it anyways... and the liberals have been struggling with this Chinese image problem and this is just another brick in the wall. But hey liberal voters eat this shit up, they have even got a new bump in the latest polls... I'm not a supporter of Mad MAX, and while he had some good ideas, i also think Justin had a few good ideas, and you know what a fan i am. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moonbox Posted February 17, 2023 Report Share Posted February 17, 2023 34 minutes ago, Army Guy said: Your funney, Nice distraction, MADMAX was thinking with the little head and not the big one, he F***ked up and paid the price for poor judgement... and the two incidents do not even compare... transport minister was aware of the risks and optics and now is having to say sorry as thats all that happens in the liberal government when you screw up on purpose... It's not a distraction. Mad max paid the price, but he was re-appointed to cabinet. There was no good excuse for it, other than the fact that he was popular in his riding in Quebec, and the CPC needed votes in Quebec. That's sort of how this one goes - Michael Chan and Mary Ng are popular in their part of the GTA, which is primarily Chinese, and so they're not held to nearly the same standards or scrutiny that they should be. It's politics over ethics, which sucks, but don't pretend that this unusual or unique. Mary Ng shouldn't be part of the Liberal cabinet. She should be relegated to the deepest recesses of the backbench, and if the media continues focusing on this I suspect that's where she will end up. This is exactly how it went with Bernier too. At first Harper defended him, but then the pressure got to hot and he had to eventually relent and ask for his resignation. Not comparable? "Madmax" literally left classified documents at his girlfriend's apartment, the same girlfriend with close ties to known criminal orgs that CSIS had already warned about. As security breaches go, I'm not sure how it gets much worse than that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Army Guy Posted February 18, 2023 Author Report Share Posted February 18, 2023 No not comparable at all , the bikers were not an intelligence organization, documents were retrieved and mad sent on his way...Nothing will happen to this minister and in a couple days a new scandal will arrive, it is normal for this government ... The transport minister hired a man with known ties to a Chinese spy agency, was warned by the liberal party and then by CSIS, and ignored all that and continues on her day like there was nothing wrong... mean while in the back ground this is not the first time the media has played with the facts that the liberals are friendly with the Chinese, something that is frowned upon by the entire country, our allieds, and the rest of the world... and then it was not dealt with, another black mark on the liberal government who sat around until the day it was discovered and then pretended they are all patriotic Canadians some how, when there is a direct link to a known Chinese spy agency... when there is smoke there is fire... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moonbox Posted February 23, 2023 Report Share Posted February 23, 2023 On 2/17/2023 at 7:30 PM, Army Guy said: No not comparable at all , the bikers were not an intelligence organization, documents were retrieved and mad sent on his way...Nothing will happen to this minister and in a couple days a new scandal will arrive, it is normal for this government ... The Bikers are a criminal organization - drugs, weapons, human trafficking, bribery, fraud, money laundering, murder, intimidation, blackmail etc - it doesn't get much more damaging than that. I think you'd have trouble explaining why elected officials compromised by organized crime were any less bad than by Chinese intelligence, considering that the mob would have no qualms about selling state secrets to say, the Chinese, or the Russians. Worse, however, was that he literally left classified NATO documents at his ex girlfriend's home - the one tied to biker gangs. That didn't damage Canada's reputation abroad, you don't think? It was an embarrassing mess and objectively worse than Mary Ng. Regardless, that doesn't excuse the Mary Ng situation, and I really don't know what you're talking about with the media "playing games" on this. They've been all over it and were calling for her resignation even last year. She should lose her cabinet position at the very least, but our politicians like to talk lots about accountability until it's them running the show. It was the same thing with Harper, where he won his first election in the backdrop of the sponsorship scandal, and once in power reneged on many of his promises and his government demonstrated the same shitty behavior as the Martin Liberals. When push comes to shove, it's the votes that seem to matter. Mad Max was handed a new cabinet position because he could deliver precious quebec votes, and Mary Ng will get a slap on the wrist (or nothing) because she can deliver Chinese votes. It's gross. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WestCanMan Posted February 23, 2023 Report Share Posted February 23, 2023 A gaffe is actually just a mistake, like when Biden was talking to Shinzo Abe and kept saying he was Chinese. The Liberals aren't making mistakes, they're sleazy criminals who just keep getting busted doing things that they know are wrong. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Army Guy Posted February 23, 2023 Author Report Share Posted February 23, 2023 2 hours ago, Moonbox said: The Bikers are a criminal organization - drugs, weapons, human trafficking, bribery, fraud, money laundering, murder, intimidation, blackmail etc - it doesn't get much more damaging than that. I think you'd have trouble explaining why elected officials compromised by organized crime were any less bad than by Chinese intelligence, considering that the mob would have no qualms about selling state secrets to say, the Chinese, or the Russians. Worse, however, was that he literally left classified NATO documents at his ex girlfriend's home - the one tied to biker gangs. That didn't damage Canada's reputation abroad, you don't think? It was an embarrassing mess and objectively worse than Mary Ng. Regardless, that doesn't excuse the Mary Ng situation, and I really don't know what you're talking about with the media "playing games" on this. They've been all over it and were calling for her resignation even last year. She should lose her cabinet position at the very least, but our politicians like to talk lots about accountability until it's them running the show. It was the same thing with Harper, where he won his first election in the backdrop of the sponsorship scandal, and once in power reneged on many of his promises and his government demonstrated the same shitty behavior as the Martin Liberals. When push comes to shove, it's the votes that seem to matter. Mad Max was handed a new cabinet position because he could deliver precious quebec votes, and Mary Ng will get a slap on the wrist (or nothing) because she can deliver Chinese votes. It's gross. Yes the bikers are not what we call good wholesome Canadian citizens, That being said in this case the Bikers had nothing to do with this incident, It was not established if they had seen or had access to the documents, Yes the women involved had some biker boy friends in the past, but the was NO evidence that she still maintained ties with any of the biker groups. As she states all of that was in her past... Bernier quits cabinet post over security breach | CBC News Bernier resigns from Tory cabinet | CTV News Was it Mad Maxs finest hour, no it was not, was it a serious breach of his security clearance sure it was.... this incident was one of many that when combined he was asked to resign which he did...But lets be very clear at no time did the bikers know or have access to these documents...So in that regards is not the same...That being said although classified documents they were not documents that would have been of any real tactical or strategic value. Having a person that is working on your political campaign that happens to be on a CSIS watch list for having direct contacts with known Chinese spy agency people is much more serious. after being warned no once but twice that it was not only bad optics, but would also open her up for investigate by our CSIS teams so they could assess the damage if any was done, or interference. The entire Chinese file has been handled with kid gloves by the media and liberal government...going way back before the two Michaels. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moonbox Posted February 23, 2023 Report Share Posted February 23, 2023 17 minutes ago, Army Guy said: Yes the bikers are not what we call good wholesome Canadian citizens, That being said in this case the Bikers had nothing to do with this incident, It was not established if they had seen or had access to the documents, Yes the women involved had some biker boy friends in the past, but the was NO evidence that she still maintained ties with any of the biker groups. As she states all of that was in her past... Okay, but then Michael Chan doesn't really have any incidents to speak of, does he? CSIS warned that he was potentially under the influence of Chinese intelligence - not that he was caught doing anything wrong, but that his ties were uncomfortably close. Personally, I think he's a rat and/or a dupe, but that's sort of irrelevant. There were no concrete evidence against him, so you're holding him to a different standard. 17 minutes ago, Army Guy said: But lets be very clear at no time did the bikers know or have access to these documents.... We don't actually know that. They sat around at her home for a month. They could have been copied a dozen times, and we don't even know if that was the only thing that got left behind. 17 minutes ago, Army Guy said: Having a person that is working on your political campaign that happens to be on a CSIS watch list for having direct contacts with known Chinese spy agency people is much more serious. Why? I mean I agree it looks and smells bad, but how is it worse? On the one hand, Chan hasn't technically done anything wrong, whereas Maxime Bernier was sleeping with someone with criminal ties, and actually left classified documents at her house for a month. As security breaches go, this is pretty flagrant, and honey-pots are the oldest trick in the espionage book. 17 minutes ago, Army Guy said: after being warned no once but twice that it was not only bad optics, but would also open her up for investigate by our CSIS teams so they could assess the damage if any was done, or interference. I suspect they are doing that, and if they find anything, they should publish it. 17 minutes ago, Army Guy said: The entire Chinese file has been handled with kid gloves by the media and liberal government...going way back before the two Michaels. Yes, agreed. Some of his father's legacy no doubt. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CdnFox Posted February 23, 2023 Report Share Posted February 23, 2023 On 2/16/2023 at 8:16 AM, Moonbox said: I guess Liberal voters will do something about it when they're given a serious alternative. ?♂️ The liberal voters have been given the serious alternative of NOT voting in favour of corruption and lies. They chose to go with the corruption and lies, Simple fact. So - what does it take for a liberal voter to decide that corruption and lies are unacceptable? The Conservatives certainly know that - just ask the federal PC party. The ndp has proven they won't tolerate it provincially, we've seen them wiped out before. But liberals? They seem to actually REQUIRE it as a prerequiste. Whether it's brown envelopes of money under the table or interfering with the justice system for 'friends' or giving their buddies single source contracts worth millions, they're ALWAYS up for some good ole corruption and theft. What makes that so attractive to the liberals that they just can't say no to that kind of behavior? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moonbox Posted February 23, 2023 Report Share Posted February 23, 2023 1 hour ago, CdnFox said: The liberal voters have been given the serious alternative of NOT voting in favour of corruption and lies. They chose to go with the corruption and lies, Simple fact. Who's that? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CdnFox Posted February 23, 2023 Report Share Posted February 23, 2023 19 minutes ago, Moonbox said: Who's that? Virtually all of them except trudeau. Of course - i understand as a liberal supporter you might not notice a difference between a corrupt (bordering on criminal) person and one that isn't. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Army Guy Posted February 23, 2023 Author Report Share Posted February 23, 2023 1 hour ago, Moonbox said: Okay, but then Michael Chan doesn't really have any incidents to speak of, does he? CSIS warned that he was potentially under the influence of Chinese intelligence - not that he was caught doing anything wrong, but that his ties were uncomfortably close. Personally, I think he's a rat and/or a dupe, but that's sort of irrelevant. There were no concrete evidence against him, so you're holding him to a different standard. We don't actually know that. They sat around at her home for a month. They could have been copied a dozen times, and we don't even know if that was the only thing that got left behind. Why? I mean I agree it looks and smells bad, but how is it worse? On the one hand, Chan hasn't technically done anything wrong, whereas Maxime Bernier was sleeping with someone with criminal ties, and actually left classified documents at her house for a month. As security breaches go, this is pretty flagrant, and honey-pots are the oldest trick in the espionage book. I suspect they are doing that, and if they find anything, they should publish it. Yes, agreed. Some of his father's legacy no doubt. Well that would depend if he is on the watch list, what does that entail, are they monitoring his phone calls, his movements, his home, everything about him... one would assume that all of that would be at the minimum, costing tax payers a few dollars...the warning would have been so she did not get caught up in all that surveillance and have to explain herself like she is doing now... No evidence that we know of, must be something to be on a watch list... Again nothing that has been released to the public, ok i'll give you that, but again your holding her past against her when there is no direct link at the time...I mean i dated a stripper once, and i don't have ties to any criminal elements that i know of. Have they ever found anything of interest in regards to our elected members, and published it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moonbox Posted February 23, 2023 Report Share Posted February 23, 2023 30 minutes ago, Army Guy said: Well that would depend if he is on the watch list, what does that entail, are they monitoring his phone calls, his movements, his home, everything about him... one would assume that all of that would be at the minimum, costing tax payers a few dollars...the warning would have been so she did not get caught up in all that surveillance and have to explain herself like she is doing now... No evidence that we know of, must be something to be on a watch list... Being on a watch list means you're considered a risk and potentially compromised. It could mean more, or it could mean nothing. I don't think it's nothing, considering he spoke out against the protestors in Hong Kong a few years ago. I think at the least, the Chinese Communist Party has his ear, and he's friendly to it. If we had evidence of an actual crime, I suspect even Trudeau couldn't wear kid-gloves on the file, but we don't, so not only is it hard to do much about Michael Chan (who is now an elected city councilor in York Region), but even harder for Mary Ng, who we're trying to link to CPC intelligence via someone who worked on her campaign, who himself hasn't been tied to anything other than (perhaps well-founded) suspicion. 30 minutes ago, Army Guy said: Again nothing that has been released to the public, ok i'll give you that, but again your holding her past against her when there is no direct link at the time...I mean i dated a stripper once, and i don't have ties to any criminal elements that i know of. No direct link, as far as we knew. It was enough, however, for the RCMP to be all over the file and watching it, so it wasn't nothing. Regardless, the bigger issue was the profound lack of judgement by Madmax, the potential compromises to his integrity, and how the Harper government took away his cabinet position only after public outrage, and then gave him a new one later anyways. Politics. ?♂️ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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