Emergency Act commission

[Army Guy]

14 hours ago, eyeball said:

They burnt the whole city down? Every BLM protester in America was there?  You realize you're talking about 20 million people right?

100000 people were left homeless?  An entire city burned to the ground should be visible from space.  There must be dozens of pictures. How many do you have?

Do you see how easy it is to realize you're talking nonsense with even a minimal amount of critical thought? 

Wake TFU you're saying this is not an example of extreme behavior, or is this something that occurs daily in BC, or any place in NA. You watched the news every night as well as i did, while BLM torched everything in their paths, including taking over large chunks of cities under their BLM protection where murder rates climbed... total of the rails behavior, and you did not see or hear any of it... and i'm talking nonsense. want to take issue with the news articles take it up with the authors. 

[Michael Hardner]

On 10/26/2022 at 12:09 PM, Nationalist said:

The only massive government intervention would be the imposition of very high tariffs.

But instead, the twits in charge...including the Harper government...decided to opt for a short-sighted addiction to cheap-assed goods from China.

Trade tariffs are not new, nor are the some sort of Soviet application. But...over the top fantasies are your bag...aren't they.

Higher than the ones in place between the US and China now ?  

[Army Guy]

12 hours ago, Moonbox said:

I don't get the impression you were really open to being convinced, honestly.  

My definition is the actual definition, but I suppose it's easier to just have your own personal opinions on what words mean as it suits you.  I very clearly explained the difference between what you think the word means and what it actually means.  I gave you an example twice that highlighted that difference, and you casually shrugged it off without even acknowledging it.

Being "a little nuts" is a surefire predictor of extremism. I'll concede to you at least that the EMA wasn't necessary to deal with the trucker protest, but in the same way that I don't think the army needs to be called to deal with Green Peace extremists.  

Not sure how to convince you that i do value your contributions to this board you've help me see the light on several issues if not lighten my stance on certain things. That does not mean we are going to see eye to eye on all things, and this is probably one of them.

Yes you did, as did i give you 2 examples, the word extreme ideology if put on a scale is the worst possible ideology, my example of was terrorist ideology. i also describe the convoyer's behavior at little whacky at best, or just above normal behavior. right after a couple beers behavior, I also asked you to give examples of extreme behavior that the protestors exhibited.

If that was the case every Canadian has done something a little nuts, I joined the military and went to Afghanistan 3 times that was a little nuts, driving to Ottawa from out west to go camping downtown in the winter for a couple weeks, well that's a little nuts...which by the way is not an example of extreme behavior. There is a long way to go before you get to the end of that scale.

I agree the Army should never have to be called out to deal with any Canadian protest in Canada ever. With a couple of exceptions, OKA crises, or if things had gotten as bad as BLM riots in the states. 

Not sure why green peace is brought up, but they may have broken lots of laws but extremist again i would not place them in that category. Just as you put that naked woman in an extremist category a little crazy, or not normal.

 

[ExFlyer]

4 hours ago, Goddess said:

 

Typing "BS" with no explanation or rebuttal is calling someone out to you?  Do you EVER have anything intelligent to add to a discussion?  You need constant attention to your inanity, like a 3 year old.  So here you go - here's all the attention you're gonna get from me.  Enjoy.  And don't forget your wubbie today.

10 days ago:

 

I called you BS for this

" Just this week, again, Trudeau has doubled down on being a terrorist government,  threatening lockdowns, restrictions, business closures if 90% of Canadians dont get jabbed every 3-6 months. For the rest of their lives, I presume, since Zero Covid is a scientifically proven extreme belief."

He never said anything of what you posted. So, there is my explanation and you are full of BS with your post.

And then your retort was "Enjoy your 10 covid jabs." which is also BS, if not BS, it is an uneducated opinion with, in your case equals BS.

 

Edited October 27, 2022 by ExFlyer

[ExFlyer]

4 hours ago, Nationalist said:

Ya except...I have a general idea of the things CSIS gets up to. For instance...privacy is a fantasy and has been for several decades now.

The "general idea" of any "spy" or national security agency of any country can be imagined to be anything. It is the thing of novels and movies but that does not mean those movies or novels are correct, let alone accurate.

Security agencies are, for good reason, secretive and shrouded. Imagination can take you anywhere.

[Nationalist]

24 minutes ago, Michael Hardner said:

Higher than the ones in place between the US and China now ?  

If needed...yes.

And obviously higher than we have here in Canada.

[Nationalist]

2 minutes ago, ExFlyer said:

The "general idea" of any "spy" or national security agency of any country can be imagined to be anything. It is the thing of novels and movies but that does not mean those movies or novels are correct, let alone accurate.

Security agencies are, for good reason, secretive and shrouded. Imagination can take you anywhere.

So can conversations over beer.

[ExFlyer]

4 hours ago, West said:

Nonsense.. 

https://www.theglobeandmail.com/politics/article-emergencies-act-inquiry-lucki/?utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=twitter

Behind a paywall. Could not read.

The primary thing with all this is that all of these comments were based on initial, before anything happened plans.

As one officer said, they had no tow trucks until EMA enacted and forced the operators to do as they were asked. The OPP said they had 24 tow trucks but they had names but none of them would cooperate. They operators were concerned with their own safety.

[Goddess]

5 minutes ago, ExFlyer said:

I called you BS for this

" Just this week, again, Trudeau has doubled down on being a terrorist government,  threatening lockdowns, restrictions, business closures if 90% of Canadians dont get jabbed every 3-6 months. For the rest of their lives, I presume, since Zero Covid is a scientifically proven extreme belief."

He never said anything of what you posted. So, there is my explanation and you are full of BS with your post.

And then your retort was "Enjoy your 10 covid jabs." which is also BS, if not BS, it is an uneducated opinion with, in your case equals BS.

 

What do you think Trudeau means when he says everyone get the jabs so we don't have to give restrictions like last time?

If someone said to me, "Eat this apple so I don't have to punch you in the face." wouldn't that be a threat?

What part of this is difficult for you to understand? 

[ExFlyer]

4 hours ago, Zeitgeist said:

The problem with such organizations is that they can easily become unaccountable.  The CIA had its own military forces and got up to so many things that the public knew nothing about and might not support.  Watch The Year of Living Dangerously.  The FBI under Hoover were pretty rogue.  Eisenhower warned the public before he left office of the military industrial complex.  Anyway, I don’t pretend to know what any of these organizations are up to or how accountable they are today.  

A unsubstantiated claim.

Are you actually going to use a fictional movie as your defence of comment?? LOL

[ExFlyer]

1 minute ago, Goddess said:

What do you think Trudeau means when he says everyone get the jabs so we don't have to give restrictions like last time?

If someone said to me, "Eat this apple so I don't have to punch you in the face." wouldn't that be a threat?

What part of this is difficult for you to understand? 

Did you even watch your tweet???

He never said that at all. "gotta get vaccinated be it for flu or up to date covid shots" and "encourage everyone to get those" "keep pressure off our front line services" to "reduce the need for other health measures"..

[Army Guy]

30 minutes ago, ExFlyer said:

Behind a paywall. Could not read.

The primary thing with all this is that all of these comments were based on initial, before anything happened plans.

As one officer said, they had no tow trucks until EMA enacted and forced the operators to do as they were asked. The OPP said they had 24 tow trucks but they had names but none of them would cooperate. They operators were concerned with their own safety.

Quote

A Feb. 13 email forwarded to Carrique, and shown to the commission Thursday, said seven companies with 34 heavy towing services were willing to provide services, while 57 companies with 269 heavy tow trucks either said no or did not respond to the OPP.

They had the trucks and drivers, the problem was identified as failure to answer the drivers request for high risk indemnification, requiring finance minister approval ( no reason given why this approval was not given ) Had it been approved trucks would have been able to do their jobs. (again the reason for granting the EMA is not looking good)

Confusion about whether Emergencies Act was needed to compel tow trucks continues as OPP head testifies | CBC News

 

 

Quote

 

n a Feb. 22 letter — written after police had moved to clear Ottawa's streets — Carrique told Ontario Deputy Solicitor General Mario Di Tommaso that the towing industry was "highly reluctant" to assist police and that they were seeking "an unusually broad and high risk indemnification from the province for loss and damage."

That request included indemnification for future retaliation. Carrique said that would require the finance minister's approval and would take time.

 

 

[Moonbox]

5 minutes ago, Army Guy said:

Not sure how to convince you that i do value your contributions to this board you've help me see the light on several issues if not lighten my stance on certain things. That does not mean we are going to see eye to eye on all things, and this is probably one of them.

We disagree one a lot of things, but I can certainly acknowledge you're not one of the silly goof here just looking to pwn people with click-bait and one-liners.  I know you're looking for intelligent debate.  

5 minutes ago, Army Guy said:

Yes you did, as did i give you 2 examples, the word extreme ideology if put on a scale is the worst possible ideology, my example of was terrorist ideology.

Again, you're really misunderstanding the word.  Extreme is just "very very very something".  The ideology can be anything (good or bad).  Terrorism, however, is not an ideology in itself.  It's the result of an ideology pushed to the furthest extremes  and over the brink.  However extreme you are, you can always get more extreme.  

5 minutes ago, Army Guy said:

I also describe the convoyer's behavior at little whacky at best, or just above normal behavior. right after a couple beers behavior, I also asked you to give examples of extreme behavior that the protestors exhibited.

I don't think blocking the world's most lucrative trade artery for 6 days because you don't believe in a pandemic that's killed millions is best described as "a little whacky".  This was a targeted escalation not meant to create awareness or display discontent, but rather to inflict max pain on the people that disagreed with them.  As far as economic blackmail goes, that's about as extreme as you can get without actually bombing the bridge.  

5 minutes ago, Army Guy said:

I agree the Army should never have to be called out to deal with any Canadian protest in Canada ever. With a couple of exceptions, OKA crises, or if things had gotten as bad as BLM riots in the states. 

Bringing up BLM over and over isn't helpful for your argument.  You're just demonstrating your bias. "But but but BLM!" isn't an argument.  It's a deflection and it's totally unrelated.

5 minutes ago, Army Guy said:

Not sure why green peace is brought up, but they may have broken lots of laws but extremist again i would not place them in that category. Just as you put that naked woman in an extremist category a little crazy, or not normal.

That's because your personal meaning for the word is made-up, self-defeating and arbitrary.  The word "extremists" didn't change the debate.  There were plenty of other perjoratives used to describe the truckers, and none of them invoked accusations of terrorism either.  You getting upset about a word that was never intended as you described is purely a you problem and you're kind of just screaming into the wind.  

[Zeitgeist]

1 hour ago, ExFlyer said:

A unsubstantiated claim.

Are you actually going to use a fictional movie as your defence of comment?? LOL

It’s historical fiction, inaccurate in some unimportant particulars but its account of the context is historically accurate.  Please be intelligent.

[ExFlyer]

12 minutes ago, Zeitgeist said:

It’s historical fiction, inaccurate in some unimportant particulars but its account of the context is historically accurate.  Please be intelligent.

Fiction nonetheless.

I am being very intelligent and fiction is fiction. That makes your claim even more foolish. You on the other hand are assuming accuracy in what? Your hand picked scenes?? LOL

Historical fiction is, by it's own definition, a story told in fiction. A story set in in days gone by. No claim can be made of accuracy. An anachronism at best.

Please, you be intelligent LOL   I cannot believe that  you even try to use a movie as your position.  My my my, this is where you completely fail.

Edited October 27, 2022 by ExFlyer

[Zeitgeist]

13 minutes ago, ExFlyer said:

Fiction nonetheless.

I am being very intelligent and fiction is fiction. That makes your claim even more foolish. You on the other hand are assuming accuracy in what? Your hand picked scenes?? LOL

Historical fiction is, by it's own definition, a story told in fiction. A story set in in days gone by. No claim can be made of accuracy. An anachronism at best.

Please, you be intelligent LOL   I cannot believe that  you even try to use a movie as your position.  My my my, this is where you completely fail.

You don’t understand what historical fiction is.  This movie is just one account but it’s a good backgrounder.  There are many about the lead up to Vietnam and the US /West’s involvement in the opium trade.  Over your head.  

Edited October 27, 2022 by Zeitgeist

[ExFlyer]

9 minutes ago, Zeitgeist said:

You don’t understand what historical fiction is.  This movie is just one account but it’s a good backgrounder.  There are many about the lead up to Vietnam and the US /West’s involvement in the opium trade.  Over your head.  

Please.

I read you and you have good points often but, a movie is a movie and is made according to the directors and writers. There is no basis in history except for the time frame.

It is not over my head but clearly, it explains what you post sometimes and where you get your info.

Fiction Zeitgeist, is a story, the form of prose, especially short stories and novels, that describes imaginary events and people.

Historical fiction the genre of literature, film, etc., comprising narratives that take place in the past and are characterized chiefly by an imaginative reconstruction of historical events and personages.

Using a movie to make your point is beneath even you.

[Zeitgeist]

3 minutes ago, ExFlyer said:

Please.

I read you and you have good points often but, a movie is a movie and is made according to the directors and writers. There is no basis in history except for the time frame.

It is not over my head but clearly, it explains what you post sometimes and where you get your info.

Fiction Zeitgeist, is a story, the form of prose, especially short stories and novels, that describes imaginary events and people.

Historical fiction the genre of literature, film, etc., comprising narratives that take place in the past and are characterized chiefly by an imaginative reconstruction of historical events and personages.

Using a movie to make your point is beneath even you.

You still don’t get it.  The retelling of major historical events involving the CIA and the manipulation of geopolitics during the Cold War is what that film does well.  I read a lot of books and watch some film.  I suggested a source with which you’re unfamiliar and you made incorrect assumptions and tried to appear knowledgeable where you’re ignorant.  No more on this.  

[ExFlyer]

8 minutes ago, Zeitgeist said:

You still don’t get it.  The retelling of major historical events involving the CIA and the manipulation of geopolitics during the Cold War is what that film does well.  I read a lot of books and watch some film.  I suggested a source with which you’re unfamiliar and you made incorrect assumptions and tried to appear knowledgeable where you’re ignorant.  No more on this.  

Nope and never will. A movie is for entertainment and not to use for factual discussion or argument.

Retelling of historical events, visually, is done in documentaries. Movies are fiction, stories, that describes imaginary events and people.

You never suggested a source, you quoted a movie... a Hollywood movie for gawd sake LOL

I am thinking I know why you live in dreamland if you believe movies are real events (and facebook and tweets and ticktok).

[West]

8 hours ago, Goddess said:

What do you think Trudeau means when he says everyone get the jabs so we don't have to give restrictions like last time?

If someone said to me, "Eat this apple so I don't have to punch you in the face." wouldn't that be a threat?

What part of this is difficult for you to understand? 

Nah.. the police service said the exact plan they executed was carried out well before the EA.. So we know the EA was a farce used for political theater.. 

Next question is whether or not police actions were reasonable.. testimony will flesh out police took and dropped people who they never laid any charges on on the outskirts of the city with no access to funds or telephone service in the middle of winter which should be attempted murder by the police.

[ExFlyer]

9 hours ago, West said:

Nah.. the police service said the exact plan they executed was carried out well before the EA.. So we know the EA was a farce used for political theater.. 

Next question is whether or not police actions were reasonable.. testimony will flesh out police took and dropped people who they never laid any charges on on the outskirts of the city with no access to funds or telephone service in the middle of winter which should be attempted murder by the police.

You are clearly not watching the testimony.

[West]

10 minutes ago, ExFlyer said:

You are clearly not watching the testimony.

Yes I am.. you clearly aren't. 

3 police agencies have said the EA wasn't necessary. And police agencies were grilled on why they dropped off protesters on the city outskirts without phones or funds to get back in. 

Also something of note... a whopping 0 people were charged with an unlawful protest. Another leftist narrative debunked

[ExFlyer]

1 hour ago, West said:

Yes I am.. you clearly aren't. 

3 police agencies have said the EA wasn't necessary. And police agencies were grilled on why they dropped off protesters on the city outskirts without phones or funds to get back in. 

Also something of note... a whopping 0 people were charged with an unlawful protest. Another leftist narrative debunked

I admit, I have not watched every minute of testimony but did see enough and followed on the recaps. to know what was said. So no, they did not say it wasn't necessary. Some said they were not sure it was needed.

What is clear is that all 3 police agencies did not communicate and even the RCMP commissioner said so in emails to Ministers the day before they enacted EMA.  The RCMP knew they were in trouble trying to enforce the area.

The OPP said they had 24 tow companies that could tow vehicles but they also said those operators were scared of any aggressiveness that may occur and would rather not begin towing. With EMA, they had the protection. That was all in testimony this past week.

All people charged (over 500) were charged under existing laws and bylaws. No narratives debunked as no one said anyone was charged with unlawful protest, not one official person.

Edited October 28, 2022 by ExFlyer

[Zeitgeist]

1 hour ago, ExFlyer said:

I admit, I have not watched every minute of testimony but did see enough and followed on the recaps. to know what was said. So no, they did not say it wasn't necessary. Some said they were not sure it was needed.

What is clear is that all 3 police agencies did not communicate and even the RCMP commissioner said so in emails to Ministers the day before they enacted EMA.  The RCMP knew they were in trouble trying to enforce the area.

The OPP said they had 24 tow companies that could tow vehicles but they also said those operators were scared of any aggressiveness that may occur and would rather not begin towing. With EMA, they had the protection. That was all in testimony this past week.

All people charged (over 500) were charged under existing laws and bylaws. No narratives debunked as no one said anyone was charged with unlawful protest, not one official person.

Whitewashing

[ExFlyer]

3 hours ago, Zeitgeist said:

Whitewashing

Au contraire, stating facts which you are incapable of absorbing LOL

It is OK to be wrong... too bad you have made it a lifestyle LOL