Nordstream Pipeline - Reichstag V2.0

[sharkman]

7 hours ago, Rebound said:

“The German government shelved the Nord Stream 2 project in February, just as Russia began to invade Ukraine.”

https://www.nytimes.com/live/2022/10/03/world/russia-ukraine-war-news?smid=nytcore-ios-share&referringSource=articleShare

 

Wikipedia is not a source, because anyone can edit its contents. But they report that, “German Chancellor Olaf Scholz, who had been in favour of the project,^[2] suspended its certification on 22 February 2022”

Wikipedia is not a source, because it disagrees with your narrative.  99% of the time, you people are fine with Wikipedia.  Such silly assertions betray you.

[DONKIROCK]

On 10/1/2022 at 8:33 AM, WestCanMan said:

Russia built the Nordstream pipeline themselves. It cost a lot of money, it made them a lot of money, and it gave them a lot of sway in Europe. Some would say they liked it.

Back in April, Biden threatened that if Russia invaded Germany he would put an end to Nordstream.

Now Nordstream has been sabotaged, and now the US is blaming Putin. The MSM narrative factory is pushing it, and pooh-poohing all other possibilities.

Let's be honest, everyone on God's green earth knows that Biden did it. It doesn't make any sense at all, aside from a US warmongering POV. 

Does that evil little sonofabitch actually want war now? 

I agree that it is likely Biden did it.

But, we need more proof.

Otherwise, everything the Left alleges about Trump (because it LOOKS LIKELY) must be assumed to be true, also.

Right?

[DONKIROCK]

21 hours ago, robosmith said:

There is actually far more to it. By taking Crimea and Southern Ukraine, Putin has put MAJOR gas reserves in Russian hands.

Eliminating (currently untapped) energy competition from Ukraine AND giving Putin far more wealth to plunder for HIMSELF.

In my humble opinion, it seems Putin's major consideration at this juncture might be to ensure that his invasion doesn't run out of gas (literally) and $8bn/month needed to sustain the war until he thinks he has stolen enough.

Trump's policies prevented this invasion for years.

[Rebound]

1 hour ago, sharkman said:

Wikipedia is not a source, because it disagrees with your narrative.  99% of the time, you people are fine with Wikipedia.  Such silly assertions betray you.

No, Wikipedia does not disagree with my narrative at all. The Wikipedia article says “German Chancellor Olaf Scholz, who had been in favour of the project,^[2] suspended its certification on 22 February 2022,^[3] following official recognition of the Donetsk People's Republic and Luhansk People's Republic by the Russian State Duma and President Putin during the prelude to the 2022 Russian invasion of Ukraine.”

But Wikipedia is not permitted as a source in academic papers because ANYBODY can change a Wikipedia article. There’s an edit button.  Try it. 

Edited October 3, 2022 by Rebound

[Rebound]

50 minutes ago, DONKIROCK said:

In my humble opinion, it seems Putin's major consideration at this juncture might be to ensure that his invasion doesn't run out of gas (literally) and $8bn/month needed to sustain the war until he thinks he has stolen enough.

Trump's policies prevented this invasion for years.

Which specific Trump policy prevented this invasion?  Please be specific and explain the mechanism. 

[WestCanMan]

1 hour ago, DONKIROCK said:

I agree that it is likely Biden did it.

But, we need more proof.

I get your point, but we will never have actual proof. 

Proof required being deep in the Baltic with a camera a week ago, and then apprehending a person in the act of sabotage.

The only thing that we could possibly be shown as 'proof' now will come from a US lab, or a Russian lab, with predictable results depending on which side is doing the talking.

Quote

 

Otherwise, everything the Left alleges about Trump (because it LOOKS LIKELY) must be assumed to be true, also.

Right?

 

I think we're still living that dream, with people saying that "Trump definitely colluded with Russia" from day 1 of the accusation right through 'til today, despite the fact that the FBI said that there is no actual evidence of that.

 

From a logic POV, and a "Let's not escalate towards WWIII" POV, it's really important to consider that a Reichstag-type event is our worst-case-scenario.... an act of war being committed by the leader of a nation who wants to kick this into high gear.  

If Putin even did do it for whatever reason, then it just drives home the point of how much of a bungler Biden actually is, because Biden's own foolish quote is what provided the most cover for Putin in this bit of treachery.

[DONKIROCK]

3 minutes ago, Rebound said:

Which specific Trump policy prevented this invasion?  Please be specific and explain the mechanism. 

Sen. Cruz discusses a Zoom call to the combined membership of the U.S. Senate from Pres. Zelinsky. 

It starts at 27:36 but the smoking "peace", (if you will) begins at 29:45.

"It is why Putin did not invade Ukraine in 2019 or 2020 and it is why he DID invade Ukraine this year. (2022)

29:56 Because in 2019 & 2020, we had the sanctions legislation I authored and Trump had signed.

And in 2021, Biden waved those sanctions and gave a multibillion dollar generational gift to Putin and an invitation, a golden ticket, to come and invade Ukraine and Putin took him up on it." 30:15

[WestCanMan]

29 minutes ago, Rebound said:

No, Wikipedia does not disagree with my narrative at all. The Wikipedia article says “German Chancellor Olaf Scholz, who had been in favour of the project,^[2] suspended its certification on 22 February 2022,^[3] following official recognition of the Donetsk People's Republic and Luhansk People's Republic by the Russian State Duma and President Putin during the prelude to the 2022 Russian invasion of Ukraine.”

But Wikipedia is not permitted as a source in academic papers because ANYBODY can change a Wikipedia article. There’s an edit button.  Try it. 

Your link said that he suspended its "certification", not that the work wasn't completed. That's an important distinction.

I could finish building a house but if I don't get a final occupancy permit, no one is allowed to live in it.

I'm pretty sure that lacking certification, NS2 wouldn't be allowed to pump massive amounts of highly explosive gases. 

[DONKIROCK]

5 minutes ago, WestCanMan said:

I get your point, but we will never have actual proof. 

Proof required being deep in the Baltic with a camera a week ago, and then apprehending a person in the act of sabotage.

The only thing that we could possibly be shown as 'proof' now will come from a US lab, or a Russian lab, with predictable results depending on which side is doing the talking.

I think we're still living that dream, with people saying that "Trump definitely colluded with Russia" from day 1 of the accusation right through 'til today, despite the fact that the FBI said that there is no actual evidence of that.

 

From a logic POV, and a "Let's not escalate towards WWIII" POV, it's really important to consider that a Reichstag-type event is our worst-case-scenario.... an act of war being committed by the leader of a nation who wants to kick this into high gear.  

If Putin even did do it for whatever reason, then it just drives home the point of how much of a bungler Biden actually is, because Biden's own foolish quote is what provided the most cover for Putin in this bit of treachery.

Why wouldn't we ever have absolute proof of who blew up the pipelines?

There are always sleuths looking to prove the unproveable.

[DONKIROCK]

3 minutes ago, WestCanMan said:

Your link said that he suspended its "certification", not that the work wasn't completed. That's an important distinction.

I could finish building a house but if I don't get a final occupancy permit, no one is allowed to live in it.

I'm pretty sure that lacking certification, NS2 wouldn't be allowed to pump massive amounts of highly explosive gases. 

Isn't that exactly what the  natural gas that was being sold to Europe was, "massive amounts of highly explosive gases"?

[WestCanMan]

34 minutes ago, Rebound said:

Which specific Trump policy prevented this invasion?  Please be specific and explain the mechanism. 

Trump not being weak and stupid prevented this invasion.

Trump killed two of Iran's top generals when they killed an American contractor. He bombed Syrian targets twice for possibly gassing some of their own civilians. He took out terrorist leaders with impunity. He was able to negotiate peace for his troops in Afghanistan because of all the other things that he did.

Once Biden took over all bets were off. The Talis were in charge. Al Qaeda was suddenly out of hiding, and killing Americans again.

"When the cat's away, the mice will play."

Russia knew that if they were going to get away with anything, it had to be while the weakest loser in the US was in power. Zelenski miscalculated and bet on Biden's offer of NATO membership. It was just stupid, stupid, and more stupid from multiple angles. 

[WestCanMan]

6 minutes ago, DONKIROCK said:

Why wouldn't we ever have absolute proof of who blew up the pipelines?

There are always sleuths looking to prove the unproveable.

Do you trust American sleuths to tell the truth? Biden's sleuths? 

The FBI has been committing crimes of late, and using entrapment schemes. Do you trust them any more than Russia's top cops? 

The last thing that I would believe right now is anyone who comes up with some quick evidence, like for example passports floating to the surface of the water near the site of the explosion lol. 

[DONKIROCK]

3 minutes ago, DONKIROCK said:

Isn't that exactly what the  natural gas that was being sold to Europe was, "massive amounts of highly explosive gases"?

I don't know how to edit or retract or delete my statement.

[WestCanMan]

4 minutes ago, DONKIROCK said:

Isn't that exactly what the  natural gas that was being sold to Europe was, "massive amounts of highly explosive gases"?

Right, and that's why "certification" was necessary in order for the gas to be turned on there. 

It's possible that Sharkman and rebound are both partly right on this one. Construction may have been completed, as Sharkman said, but without certification it's certain that the pipeline was still inactive, as rebound said.

It's a distinction without much of a difference, all that really matters is who blew it up. 

[DONKIROCK]

1 minute ago, WestCanMan said:

Do you trust American sleuths to tell the truth? Biden's sleuths? 

The FBI has been committing crimes of late, and using entrapment schemes. Do you trust them any more than Russia's top cops? 

The last thing that I would believe right now is anyone who comes up with some quick evidence, like for example passports floating to the surface of the water near the site of the explosion lol. 

I am coming to recognize that you may not be a Trump hating Leftist.

??

[WestCanMan]

2 minutes ago, DONKIROCK said:

I don't know how to edit or retract or delete my statement.

Click the 3 buttons on the top right side of the post. 

[WestCanMan]

Just now, DONKIROCK said:

I am coming to recognize that you may not be a Trump hating Leftist.

??

I was a centrist, as far as American politics were concerned, until the riots started in Ferguson.

I liked Reagan, I liked Bush Sr, I liked Clinton far more than Dubya, I liked Obama initially, and I thought that his presidency was initially on track to be a huge plus for the US. 

From 2015 until now I've been pushed farther and farther to the right. It would take an act of God for me to respect the Dems now. 

[robosmith]

3 hours ago, WestCanMan said:

Let's be real, Biden is running his mouth on TV and making declarative statements. Our MSM is quoting Biden when there's every reason to believe that he's lying.

Only in YOUR mind. You've PROVEN yourself unhinged when it comes to Biden AND the FBI.

3 hours ago, WestCanMan said:

If the MSM can make declarative statements based on Biden's blatant bullshit, I can make declarative statements based on  the vast preponderance of evidence. 

You're NOT an objective observer. See above.

3 hours ago, WestCanMan said:

It's almost 100% certain that Biden did it. I'm saying Biden did it. Cry me a river.  

I know what you're saying and IT'S BULLSHIT cause you HAVE NO EVIDENCE and admitted that.

[WestCanMan]

1 minute ago, robosmith said:

Only in YOUR mind. You've PROVEN yourself unhinged when it comes to Biden AND the FBI.

Telling the truth is never unhinged, and the fact is that Clinesmith and McCabe committed crimes on the collusion witch hunt, and the FBI absolutely did entrap people and expose them right before the 2020 election, plus they lied about Hunter's laptop right before the 2020 election.

You might wanna ignore the sad truths about the FBI, I don't have to. 

Quote

You're NOT an objective observer. See above.

Anyone who dares to question CNN and the Dems is no longer impartial, is that it? ?

Quote

I know what you're saying and IT'S BULLSHIT cause you HAVE NO EVIDENCE and admitted that.

Believe what you want, I honestly don't care, but your Dems and MSM lie with metronome consistency, so I'm quite happy to express an informed opinion. 

[robosmith]

30 minutes ago, WestCanMan said:

Telling the truth is never unhinged 

Imagining that your OPINION (without evidence) is "the truth," is completely unhinged.

A couple of minor crimes by individuals in the FBI does NOT TAR the entire organization.

Now maybe Hoover's corruption from decades ago, does have that kind of stain because he RAN the FBI, but he is LONG GONE.

[Rebound]

2 hours ago, DONKIROCK said:

Sen. Cruz discusses a Zoom call to the combined membership of the U.S. Senate from Pres. Zelinsky. 

It starts at 27:36 but the smoking "peace", (if you will) begins at 29:45.

"It is why Putin did not invade Ukraine in 2019 or 2020 and it is why he DID invade Ukraine this year. (2022)

29:56 Because in 2019 & 2020, we had the sanctions legislation I authored and Trump had signed.

And in 2021, Biden waved those sanctions and gave a multibillion dollar generational gift to Putin and an invitation, a golden ticket, to come and invade Ukraine and Putin took him up on it." 30:15

Riiiiight… so you found a video of Ted Cruz blowing smoke. Wowee. 
 

What were those sanctions? Because I looked all over the internet, and could only find Obama era sanctions from 2014/15. What was newly imposed in 2017 and revoked in 2021? 
 

My bs meter doesn’t believe sanctions were imposed by an act of Congress and eliminated via executive action.  

Edited October 3, 2022 by Rebound

[DONKIROCK]

2 hours ago, WestCanMan said:

Click the 3 buttons on the top right side of the post. 

Thank you!

??

[DONKIROCK]

On 10/2/2022 at 10:39 AM, WestCanMan said:

I don't love Putin, I just understand that Putin shouldn't be reviled for doing the exact same thing that Kennedy is revered for.

Ahhh!

This is what confused me about you.

You seem to think that Communism is as morally defensible as freedom.

It isn't. 

[DONKIROCK]

19 minutes ago, Rebound said:

Riiiiight… so you found a video of Ted Cruz blowing smoke. Wowee. 
 

What were those sanctions? Because I looked all over the internet, and could only find Obama era sanctions from 2014/15. What was newly imposed in 2017 and revoked in 2021? 
 

My bs meter doesn’t believe sanctions were imposed by an act of Congress and eliminated via executive action.  

Tit for tat.

Prove your beliefs and assertions as you challenged me to do, or I will reject them as hot air.

[DONKIROCK]

42 minutes ago, robosmith said:

Imagining that your OPINION (without evidence) is "the truth," is completely unhinged.

A couple of minor crimes by individuals in the FBI does NOT TAR the entire organization.

Now maybe Hoover's corruption from decades ago, does have that kind of stain because he RAN the FBI, but he is LONG GONE.

It does tar the entire organization when those "individuals"  are the 'bosses.'

The entire justice system is being turned rotten.

Weaponized.

Face it. For Trump supporters, who are being treated like civil rights advocates in the 1960's, America is becoming a Police State.

We live in fear of attack by Anti Trump Leftists and an anti Trump FBI, IRS & DOJ and their being egged on by an anti Trump media. 

Who do you think Trump was talking about when he said he was going to drain the swamp, take down the Deep  State and stop corruption?

 

Edited October 3, 2022 by DONKIROCK