Moonlight Graham Posted September 21, 2022 Author Report Share Posted September 21, 2022 32 minutes ago, DogOnPorch said: Do we have too much CO2? Earth has had way higher CO2 levels in the past. So we're really not sure what too much is for this planet. Too many people...I can believe that. But unless we talk some sort of forced birth control...or worse...that ain't gonna happen easy. In not too too many years, we'll be looking at 10-12 billion by extrapolations. What good will civilization's sacrifice be today while there are 8 billion? Any gains will simply vanish in the growing numbers. So what to do...what to do.... BTW, Carbon isn't the same as Carbon-Dioxide. One is an allotrope element while the other is an atomic compound. There has never been more CO2 at any other time in human history, nor at any time over the last 3 million years. So yeah, that's cause for concern. If you want to drag your feet instead of doing something about it well then I can't help you. https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/18480821/ https://www.science.org/doi/10.1126/sciadv.aav7337 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moonbox Posted September 21, 2022 Report Share Posted September 21, 2022 1 hour ago, Moonlight Graham said: Lower income families take the bus. It's green! Why not everyone take the bus? That's even greener! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Hardner Posted September 21, 2022 Report Share Posted September 21, 2022 10 hours ago, Infidel Dog said: You can find the links to those warmist scientists incorrect predictions at the climate skeptic site, Watts Up With That, HERE. So I found an article from the CATO institute that referenced all of the studies you talked about so that opinion piece seems to be where you got your information. Fair enough, I think that lots of scientists are wrong all the time and I very much agree that the media falls over itself to report worse-case studies, doing the overall problem a huge disservice... What's clear is that the models don't come close to each other to pick a year when this could happen. This article suggests that SOME models still predict 2100 as the year the arctic will be ice-free.https://www.ncei.noaa.gov/news/arctic-ice-study Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DogOnPorch Posted September 21, 2022 Report Share Posted September 21, 2022 (edited) 1 hour ago, Moonlight Graham said: There has never been more CO2 at any other time in human history, nor at any time over the last 3 million years. So yeah, that's cause for concern. If you want to drag your feet instead of doing something about it well then I can't help you. https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/18480821/ https://www.science.org/doi/10.1126/sciadv.aav7337 Doing something about it? Flushing civilization down the toilet in order to feel good about a problem you're unwilling to face is not really doing something. That's doing anything. Edited September 21, 2022 by DogOnPorch Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aristides Posted September 21, 2022 Report Share Posted September 21, 2022 5 minutes ago, DogOnPorch said: Doing something about it? Flushing civilization down the toilet in order to feel good about a problem your unwilling to face is not really doing something. That's doing anything. Continuing to add billions of tons of CO2 to the atmosphere every year without doing anything to slow it is flushing civilization down the toilet. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
herbie Posted September 21, 2022 Report Share Posted September 21, 2022 Oh FFS the thread isn't about IF we should do anything about CO2 or what compounds and molecules are it's about a suggestion that might promote EV & hybrid use. If you can't comment on the subject at hand or just don't want to promote their use then bugger off. On subject: just like the oil company gouging for gas is the biggest promoter of EVs, the auto dealers are doing almost what your suggesting by hiking prices on gas vehicles so much in the last couple years. Plus, what's this $20,000 Toyots BS? Get off your butt and look, the MSRP on the lowest price in Canada is 19.5K and add on delivery, dealer prep and taxes. $20,000 doesn't buy shit these days. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Hardner Posted September 21, 2022 Report Share Posted September 21, 2022 5 minutes ago, DogOnPorch said: 1. Flushing civilization down the toilet .... 2....a problem your unwilling to face... 1. You mean the carbon tax of 11 cents per litre ? Hmmmm.... your fears seems a tad exaggerated 2. I don't understand. I mean, clearly you don't want to do more than that right ? We can only do what people will put up with... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DogOnPorch Posted September 21, 2022 Report Share Posted September 21, 2022 Just now, Aristides said: Continuing to add billions of tons of CO2 to the atmosphere every year without doing anything to slow it is flushing civilization down the toilet. Yet you're poised to add billions more to the population which is the real problem. How about the third world stops f**king like rabbits and making those babies? We managed birth control...are they incapable? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Hardner Posted September 21, 2022 Report Share Posted September 21, 2022 1 minute ago, DogOnPorch said: Yet you're poised to add billions more to the population which is the real problem. How about the third world stops f**king like rabbits and making those babies? We managed birth control...are they incapable? They're not driving Cadillacs doggy... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DogOnPorch Posted September 21, 2022 Report Share Posted September 21, 2022 2 minutes ago, Michael Hardner said: 1. You mean the carbon tax of 11 cents per litre ? Hmmmm.... your fears seems a tad exaggerated 2. I don't understand. I mean, clearly you don't want to do more than that right ? We can only do what people will put up with... We do put up with you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DogOnPorch Posted September 21, 2022 Report Share Posted September 21, 2022 Just now, Michael Hardner said: They're not driving Cadillacs doggy... How do you imagine them living? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aristides Posted September 21, 2022 Report Share Posted September 21, 2022 4 minutes ago, DogOnPorch said: Yet you're poised to add billions more to the population which is the real problem. How about the third world stops f**king like rabbits and making those babies? We managed birth control...are they incapable? How the hell am I poised to do nothing about the worlds population? Why do you think the rest of the world isn't entitled to the same standard of living as you. What makes you so special that you can dump all the CO2 into the atmosphere that you want and others shouldn't be allowed to do the same? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moonlight Graham Posted September 21, 2022 Author Report Share Posted September 21, 2022 16 minutes ago, DogOnPorch said: Doing something about it? Flushing civilization down the toilet in order to feel good about a problem you're unwilling to face is not really doing something. That's doing anything. A for effort then. Thrown your hands up it seems. As for me, i'm into revenue-neutral auto rebates. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moonlight Graham Posted September 21, 2022 Author Report Share Posted September 21, 2022 Ok so maybe carbon taxes are the answer, but they should funnel the proceeds back into green vehicle rebates. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DogOnPorch Posted September 21, 2022 Report Share Posted September 21, 2022 (edited) 6 minutes ago, Aristides said: How the hell am I poised to do nothing about the worlds population? Why do you think the rest of the world isn't entitled to the same standard of living as you. What makes you so special that you can dump all the CO2 into the atmosphere that you want and others shouldn't be allowed to do the same? How the Hell are you not for that matter? I never said anything about what other people deserve. But it's the third world making the billions of new babies thanks to lack of basic birth control that you seem to think they are too stupid to employ. Edited September 21, 2022 by DogOnPorch Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aristides Posted September 21, 2022 Report Share Posted September 21, 2022 19 minutes ago, DogOnPorch said: How the Hell are you not for that matter? I never said anything about what other people deserve. But it's the third world making the billions of new babies thanks to lack of basic birth control that you seem to think they are too stupid to employ. You keep using those people as an excuse for your own behaviour. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PIK Posted September 21, 2022 Report Share Posted September 21, 2022 53 minutes ago, Michael Hardner said: So I found an article from the CATO institute that referenced all of the studies you talked about so that opinion piece seems to be where you got your information. Fair enough, I think that lots of scientists are wrong all the time and I very much agree that the media falls over itself to report worse-case studies, doing the overall problem a huge disservice... What's clear is that the models don't come close to each other to pick a year when this could happen. This article suggests that SOME models still predict 2100 as the year the arctic will be ice-free.https://www.ncei.noaa.gov/news/arctic-ice-study I lost my home is a flood, because computer models said there wasn't going to be one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Hardner Posted September 21, 2022 Report Share Posted September 21, 2022 2 minutes ago, PIK said: I lost my home is a flood, because computer models said there wasn't going to be one. Ok. Not sure what to do with that information. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moonlight Graham Posted September 21, 2022 Author Report Share Posted September 21, 2022 1 minute ago, Michael Hardner said: Ok. Not sure what to do with that information. Buy him a canoe (green). 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moonlight Graham Posted September 21, 2022 Author Report Share Posted September 21, 2022 The weather network can predict the weather 2-3 days from now with moderate accuracy using computer models. Models aren't perfect and don't claim to be. They are an educated guess with degrees of accuracy. Climate should be easier to model than weather because weather is much more chaotic and climate much more stable. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moonlight Graham Posted September 21, 2022 Author Report Share Posted September 21, 2022 8 minutes ago, PIK said: I lost my home is a flood, because computer models said there wasn't going to be one. Would have you listened to them if they did? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Hardner Posted September 21, 2022 Report Share Posted September 21, 2022 16 minutes ago, Moonlight Graham said: Buy him a canoe (green). The guy lost his house man... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
herbie Posted September 21, 2022 Report Share Posted September 21, 2022 Which has SFA to do with EV rebates. 3 hours ago, Moonlight Graham said: Ok so maybe carbon taxes are the answer, but they should funnel the proceeds back into green vehicle rebates. Where do you think some of that money is going? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moonlight Graham Posted September 22, 2022 Author Report Share Posted September 22, 2022 1 hour ago, herbie said: Which has SFA to do with EV rebates. Where do you think some of that money is going? I'm not talking about just EV rebates. Hybrids seem like a great transitional solution. So you're saying we're on the right track? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aristides Posted September 22, 2022 Report Share Posted September 22, 2022 5 hours ago, DogOnPorch said: How do you imagine them living? Why can't they drive Cadillacs? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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