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Diplomacy is the solution to the war in Ukraine


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18 minutes ago, August1991 said:

Woodrow Wilson "defined" Ukraine.

To be progressive, these foreigners from abroad are now known in English as "Ukrainian".

=====

Putin and so-called Ukrainians are doing what Trudeau Snr avoided for Canada.

In Canada, we get along.

This was the main idea of Trudeau Snr - a federal state - counterweights.

bullshit

when Russia and Ukraine were the same country

Stalin starved millions of Ukrainians

being one country doesn't cause Ukraine and Russia to get along

history shows the exact opposite occurs

Ukrainians are even more poorly treated by Russians than they are now

Edited by Yzermandius19
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On 8/8/2022 at 6:07 PM, TreeBeard said:

Ukraine is well defined by internationally recognized borders.  This was never in dispute.  Until Russia decided so. 

Strongly disagree.

Is Crimea part of Ukraine? Or is it Russian?

=====

More broadly, is Slovakia part of Czechoslavakia? Or Europe?

 

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21 minutes ago, Yzermandius19 said:

bullshit

when Russia and Ukraine were the same country

Stalin starved millions of Ukrainians

....

I have a particular view of Europeans.

They are not civilised. They are violent - every generation or so, they fight each other and cause mayhem for the rest of us.

1618-1648 -Thirty Years War

1789-1815 -Napoleonic Wars

1914-1945 -World War I and II

Tolstoi wrote a book about this.

Edited by August1991
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5 minutes ago, August1991 said:

I have a particular view of Europeans.

They are not civilised. They are violent - every generation or so, they fight each other and cause mayhem for the rest of us.

1618-1648

1789-1815

1914-1945

Tolstoi wrote a book about this.

false dichotomy

violence and civilization are not mutually exclusive terms

civilization is not the absence of war

one can be both violent and civilized

the most civilized nations on the planet are often quite violent and good at violence

Edited by Yzermandius19
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12 minutes ago, Yzermandius19 said:

false dichotomy

violence and civilization are not mutually exclusive terms

civilization is not the absence of war

one can be both violent and civilized

Precisely.

Excepting the Civil War, the USA is a civilised  place without war. 

Edited by August1991
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3 minutes ago, August1991 said:

Precisely.

Excepting the Civil War, the USA is a civilised  place without war. 

America is quite violent

when they don't direct that energy at themselves

they direct it at others

it is hardly without war

it is constantly at war

yet it's the greatest civilization in the history of mankind

Edited by Yzermandius19
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Now, "Europe"?

The Finns fought the Russians.

The Swedes stayed "neutral".

The Norwegians were quislings.

====

We must bring several billion children into the modern world.

I think Steve Jobs has done better than Ingvar Kamprad.

Edited by August1991
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