Jump to content

Canada Must Exit Climate Agreement Immediately


Recommended Posts

5 hours ago, Zeitgeist said:

If current and past human activity is causing climate change on a scale that will actually lead to human extinction 1. (unverifiable) AND we can prevent this through changing our behaviour 2. (unverifiable) AND changing our behaviour doesn’t cause much human suffering 3. (unverifiable), then of course we should change our behaviour.

 

1. Totally verifiable

2. Totally verifiable

3. What human suffering are you talking about?????  Now I have to think about the human suffering of the unborn next 2 billion people, because if we do not prevent them from being born they might actually get born and start screaming for food and jobs!    No matter what you do, human suffering now will be inevitable, unless you believe that those millions of people enduring the 40"C temps did not suffer, those who died in fires and floods were just accidental normal deaths  and so on.

I can already see how it will go.  The changed climate will lead to low land productivity, food scarcity and wide spread hunger.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, cougar said:

 dramatic change in our climate. 

Which dramatic change in climate is that? Do you mean some current heat wave? Probably. I hear about that every summer. Then crickets for the inevitable cold spell in the winter.

Some have this weird perception it's climate if it happens in the summer but weather if it happens in the winter. Where does that come from? I know but I wonder if you do?

 

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, cougar said:

1. Totally verifiable

Verify it then. Show us this overwhelming evidence of an inevitable human caused, humanity ending, climate catastrophe. Contrary to what you may believe there is no scientific consensus of that when you describe it specifically, out loud the way I just did.

You seem to believe you have evidence to the contrary. Very well. Let's see it.

Edited by Infidel Dog
  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, cougar said:

1. Totally verifiable

2. Totally verifiable

3. What human suffering are you talking about?????  Now I have to think about the human suffering of the unborn next 2 billion people, because if we do not prevent them from being born they might actually get born and start screaming for food and jobs!    No matter what you do, human suffering now will be inevitable, unless you believe that those millions of people enduring the 40"C temps did not suffer, those who died in fires and floods were just accidental normal deaths  and so on.

I can already see how it will go.  The changed climate will lead to low land productivity, food scarcity and wide spread hunger.

Our world is more populated so more people are impacted by natural disasters.  Our media gets the word out about human suffering like never before and makes a drama out of the hurt feelings of people who are triggered by their own shadows.

Our ability to adapt and help people who have been impacted by natural disasters has never been better.

How many people as a percentage of the population have lost their lives or suffered because of human made climate change specifically?

Deal with real immediate problems.  Solving those problems is the fastest route to solving longer term problems like climate change, because when people can’t eat or get an education, they can’t move onto bigger and better acts like creating the technology that will end human made climate change.  They’ll stop making babies too as they become more educated, so you won’t have to murder them.  

Edited by Zeitgeist
  • Haha 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

38 minutes ago, Infidel Dog said:

I know but I wonder if you do?

I am convinced you know little of anything.  Why are the heat waves coming in the summer?  Is this really your question?

The question you should be asking yourself is why do we have a 1/100 year event now happening every year, why those record breaking temperatures are now predictably broken every following year.  Why do we have so much land burn like never before in places it never burned before?

But if you had any, and I mean any sound logic, it is enough to take a look at Google earth and see how much of the land surface is not impacted by humans today.  Now compare this footprint with what it was 100 years ago.   Then compare the emissions then and now; then try to figure out how long it takes for these emissions to actually disappear instead of build up in the air or water.

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

36 minutes ago, Zeitgeist said:

1. Our world is more populated so more people are impacted by natural disasters.  2. Our media gets the word out about human suffering like never before and makes a drama out of the hurt feelings of people who are triggered by their own shadows.

Our ability to adapt and help people who have been impacted by natural disasters has never been better.

3. How many people as a percentage of the population have lost their lives or suffered because of human made climate change specifically?

Deal with real immediate problems.  Solving those problems is the fastest route to solving longer term problems like climate change, 4. because when people can’t eat or get an education, they can’t move onto bigger and better acts like creating the technology that will end human made climate change.  They’ll stop making babies too as they become more educated, 5. so you won’t have to murder them.  

1. Bullshit

2. Bullshit

3. This has to be the same rabbit hole as trying to quantify how many people died of COVID alone.   One thing is sure - not a single person died of human caused climate change before, because there was no such thing.

4. "people can't eat" ?   Which people?  You want to feed 3 billion and then 5 billion and then 10 billion, just so they can move to "bigger and better acts"  I will call this BULLSHIT too

5.  Where did I say I was going to murder them?  I just did not want them born.  There should have been international policies and agreements in place for that, but instead we had poorly camouflaged human farms and human trafficking with Canada among the lead traffickers.

Since at least three of your points were BS, you probably qualify as a bullshiter, one of the many Grand Master Bullshiters we have on the board.

Edited by cougar
Link to comment
Share on other sites

8 minutes ago, cougar said:

1. Bullshit

2. Bullshit

3. This has to be the same rabbit hole as trying to quantify how many people died of COVID alone.   One thing is sure - not a single person died of human caused climate change before, because there was no such thing.

4. "people can't eat" ?   Which people?  You want to feed 3 billion and then 5 billion and then 10 billion, just so they can move to "bigger and better acts"  I will call this BULLSHIT too

5.  Where did I say I was going to murder them?  I just did not want them born.  There should have been international policies and agreements in place for that, but instead we had poorly camouflaged human farms and human trafficking with Canada among the lead traffickers.

Since at least three of your points were BS, you probably qualify as a bullshiter, one of the many Grand Master Bullshiters we have on the board.

Your ideas are scarier than anything I’ve ever said.  Your ecofascist approach would bring a second Holocaust.  

  • Thanks 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 minutes ago, Zeitgeist said:

Your ideas are scarier than anything I’ve ever said.  Your ecofascist approach would bring a second Holocaust.  

No.  Burying your head in the sand and making those new babies and importing more people from countries making new babies, destroying what little is left of the healthy ecosystem will bring the end of all of us.

So much so, there will be no Zeitgeist to call it "holocaust" or even a simple "extinction event".  We will remain nothing more than a bad cosmic virus, destroying life on planet Earth and after that, millions year later maybe life will continue somewhere else, with forms of life a bit smarter and more advanced than us.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

45 minutes ago, cougar said:

The question you should be asking yourself is why do we have a 1/100 year event now happening every year, why those record breaking temperatures are now predictably broken every following year.  Why do we have so much land burn like never before in places it never burned before?

So when you say "every" do you just mean every year somewhere a record is being broken? Or do you mean every year "every"where?

The second proposal is wrong. So let's say you weren't suggesting that and address the first one.

First of all let's not forget what you think you're offering evidence of. 

That an inevitable human caused catastrophe of warming is coming and you can verify it.

Well, here's the thing...you didn't.

Let's say it's true. That every year somewhere there's a heat record being set.

First of all why would that surprise anybody? The climate has been warming. About a degree Celsius more or less since the end of the little ice age, a little more than a century ago. So now we're at a plateau and temperatures can be higher every now and again, here and there than they were as the little ice age wound down.

But you said you could verify an imminent humanity ending catastrophe as a result of some human caused warming.

When did you plan to do that?

Currently this is what it looks like by Satellite temps:

UAH_LT_1979_thru_June_2022_v61.jpg

In 1998 there was a bump of about 3/10ths of a degree during a super-el nino. Since that time temperatures have stayed pretty steady within the 10ths of a degree range.

How does that "verify" your hysteria over what you believe will be an inevitable Warmageddon?

You've verified nothing. Try again.

 

Edited by Infidel Dog
Link to comment
Share on other sites

9 minutes ago, Infidel Dog said:

You've verified nothing. Try again.

 

I wouldn't bother.

In this environment of predominantly Grand Master Bullshitters, how can one blame me for that?  ?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

8 minutes ago, cougar said:

I wouldn't bother.

In this environment of predominantly Grand Master Bullshitters, how can one blame me for that?  ?

So you can't verify this wild climate catastrophe claim of yours after all then?

Too bad...I was hoping you could at least offer up something more substantial than a few summer heat records. Kind of a pathetic attempt, if you ask me.

Edited by Infidel Dog
  • Thanks 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

22 minutes ago, Infidel Dog said:

So you can't verify this wild climate catastrophe claim of yours after all then?

Too bad...I was hoping you could at least offer up something more substantial than a few summer heat records. Kind of a pathetic attempt, if you ask me.

You know pretty well I can pull up similar charts to the one you have and back it up with scientific studies to prove what I want to prove, which again you will deny.

You can believe whatever you like, and, as you can imagine, I do not care.

Stating that there is no human caused climate change would mean all carbon emissions , deforestation,  pollution, industrial and residential development, airplanes in the sky, wars and bombings happening regularly around the world, all have zero impact on climate and the environment.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

20 minutes ago, cougar said:

You know pretty well I can pull up similar charts to the one you have and back it up with scientific studies to prove what I want to prove, which again you will deny.

You can believe whatever you like, and, as you can imagine, I do not care.

I deny nothing Cougar. But I don't mind straightening you out on the facts when they show you to be incorrect.

And yes, I realize you're heavy into "see know evil" mode, but I still think there's hope for you.

Here's a former Obama official whose coming around after being hit over the head by climate reality.

If the day ever comes you're prepared to listen he'll explain to you why heat waves and the odd record heat reading are useless as an indication of any kind of existential threat from your imagined Climate Catastrophe.

 

Edited by Infidel Dog
Link to comment
Share on other sites

11 minutes ago, cougar said:

You know pretty well I can pull up similar charts to the one you have and back it up with scientific studies to prove what I want to prove, which again you will deny.

You can believe whatever you like, and, as you can imagine, I do not care.

Stating that there is no human caused climate change would mean all carbon emissions , deforestation,  pollution, industrial and residential development, airplanes in the sky, wars and bombings happening regularly around the world, all have zero impact on climate and the environment.

So...when are you going to attach solar panels to your windmill. Also, a stationary bike running a generator will be needed for those calm nights. More Chinese coal fed power stations with their smokestacks should help obscure the sun. Would that help? 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

6 minutes ago, blackbird said:

The only saving of the planet I see worthwhile is getting rid of all the climate change alarmist politicians at the ballot box. Our standard of living will continue to fall because of the carbon taxes and anti-energy industry regulations.

It falls because we have reached the point of diminishing returns.    

Beat a horse too much, the speed will not increase, but go down to zero.

  • Thanks 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

16 minutes ago, Infidel Dog said:

If the day ever comes you're prepared to listen he'll explain to you.........

 

No.  I am past the point of listening to guys "explaining to me" 

I believe my eyes and my skin receptors and the experience I have had over many years.    I can also "explain" it to them, and I am sure they would not listen either.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

14 minutes ago, Legato said:

So...when are you going to attach solar panels to your windmill. Also, a stationary bike running a generator will be needed for those calm nights. More Chinese coal fed power stations with their smokestacks should help obscure the sun. Would that help? 

I was talking about overpopulation.

Solar panels, bicycles , wind power plants, all sound environmental concepts would work , BUT AFTER our population is under control.

Imagine we had only 5,000 people on the whole planet.  They could all fly airplanes each day and never do much damage to anything.

But what happens when they are 500,000,000 ?  Then what happens when they are 5,000,000,000 or 10,000,000,000 ?

We put in place many of our regulations because of the state of overpopulation and overconsumption we are in.   Game harvesting limits, fish harvesting limits, even restricting access to Provincial and National parks where supposedly we should be free to go.  But we can't.  Because the trail is good for 10-50 hikers a day and now it needs to handle 5,000 a day.

And this is the main problem.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, cougar said:

I was talking about overpopulation.

Solar panels, bicycles , wind power plants, all sound environmental concepts would work , BUT AFTER our population is under control.

Imagine we had only 5,000 people on the whole planet.  They could all fly airplanes each day and never do much damage to anything.

But what happens when they are 500,000,000 ?  Then what happens when they are 5,000,000,000 or 10,000,000,000 ?

We put in place many of our regulations because of the state of overpopulation and overconsumption we are in.   Game harvesting limits, fish harvesting limits, even restricting access to Provincial and National parks where supposedly we should be free to go.  But we can't.  Because the trail is good for 10-50 hikers a day and now it needs to handle 5,000 a day.

And this is the main problem.

Too bad. You don’t seem to understand demographic trends and the effects of education and urbanization.  The world population will start declining around 2050 once your lot are gone (the Boomers).   Developed countries (you know, the places people want to live where there’s economic opportunities and freedoms) have flat or negative birth rates, which means that their populations decline over time without immigration.  As countries develop they tend to become more urban and educated.  Most of the world’s population lives in cities now.  Urban educated people have small families generally.  In fact they don’t replace themselves.

Putting people through some kind of totalitarian clamp down so that they won’t sully your mountain retreat, causing them to be poor and miserable, will only put the human race through unnecessary hell so that the rich can enjoy a pristine lifestyle at everyone else’s expense.

Education, freedom, and economic opportunity for all are still the solutions to our problems, including climate change.

Reasonable, inexpensive climate policies in a free market on a level playing field with other countries will create the technology and greener society needed to reduce human-made climate change.

Totalitarianism might slightly speed up the reduction of human made climate change, but you’ll destroy much of what people enjoy and love about life.

If you think taking away rights and freedoms and trusting some committee to tell us how to live is an improvement, you’re lost.

 

Edited by Zeitgeist
Link to comment
Share on other sites

In Canada if you want to travel from Toronto to Vancouver how do you do it? Obviously you fly. The distance is simply too long to do it practically otherwise.

If flying becomes a luxury only the rich can afford it means it will eventually break the country apart.

Edited by -TSS-
Link to comment
Share on other sites

5 minutes ago, -TSS- said:

In Canada if you want to travel from Toronto to Vancouver how do you do it? Obviously you fly. The distance is simply too long to do it practically otherwise.

If flying becomes a luxury only the rich can afford it means it will eventually break the country apart.

Exactly.  Also, apart from the importance of national unity and affordable trade/delivery, frontline workers deserve vacations as much as or more than the rich.  Consumption taxes hurt the poor the most, which is exactly what carbon taxes are.  The rural commuters are often those who can’t afford expensive homes in the city.  Making people and businesses pay taxes and additional expenses in the name of fighting climate change is pure oppression because our very existence is a carbon footprint.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

5 hours ago, Infidel Dog said:

Contrary to what you may believe there is no scientific consensus...

There's way WAY more than enough consensus amongst a vast VAST number of scientists and experts across every branch of science and every single national and international academy of science on the planet. There has been for decades.

https://www.google.com/search?q=climate+change+consensus&oq=climate+change+consensus+&aqs=chrome..69i57.12548j0j7&client=ms-android-telus-ca-revc&sourceid=chrome-mobile&ie=UTF-8

You remind me one of these people we often hear about that are easily influenced by the media and the way it presents news on important issues.

The impression there is a vast lack of consensus is due to the ridiculously outsized amount of air time and bandwidth that is provided for the issue, especially when it comes to scaring the hell out of people over the consequences of taking action.

Of course this is even easier to arrange given a 'little' horizontal integration and conglomeration of Big Oil and Big Media here and there. What's the point of owning a loudspeaker if you can't put it to use?

Many of the same individuals holding executive board positions at corporate media companies also serve on the boards of the world’s biggest oil companies.

https://gcml.org/corporate-media-and-big-oil-coup/

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

11 hours ago, eyeball said:

So you figure is everything is just fine as is - there's nothing to fix so there's no need for solutions?

I figure that your solutions suck

and actual solutions are needed

 

however even under your idiotic false dichotomy

where the only two choices are go with your solutions or do nothing

doing nothing is better than doing something counterproductive

even the strawman you are trying to compete against to sell your bad ideas is better than your bad ideas

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Would it be too much to ask how just much consensus is actually required?  It would be interesting to know if the answer  is based on some consensus principle that is universally applied to all branches of science as opposed to a figure pulled out of someone's ass.  

Link to comment
Share on other sites

8 hours ago, cougar said:

"Prosperity" ????!!!!!  Adding another 2-3 billion human bodies, putting them in trucks or airplanes while all of us keep gasping for air, burning in the heat or drowning in floods is your interpretation of prosperity???? !!!!!

Show me how this improves MY LIFE ???   When I can tell you a million ways how it makes it worse!

being dead or poor ain't prosperity

if you can't understand how human success makes your life better

no one can convince you that it does

you just assume that living and succeeding is bad for the planet, so you cheer on death and poverty

and when you've invested so much of your identity into thinking you're right about that

you will never admit you are wrong no matter what

the environment is just a buzzword you use

to make your hatred of humans palatable to the rubes

Edited by Yzermandius19
  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.

Guest
Unfortunately, your content contains terms that we do not allow. Please edit your content to remove the highlighted words below.
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.


×
×
  • Create New...