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NATO leader, Stoltenberg: We have no indication that the explosion in Poland was the result of a deliberate attack by Russia / Most likely, a Ukrainian anti-aircraft missile. 

The President of France, Emmanuel Macron, says he would like Beijing - which refused to condemn the Russian invasion of Ukraine - to play "a more important mediating role", writes AFP.

"China can play, on our side, a more important mediating role in the coming months, especially to avoid even stronger offensives starting in February," Macron told reporters at the end of the G20 summit in Indonesia.

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As mentioned...heh...this was a Ukrainian owned S-300.

Now the warmongers are in the position of defending their mistake. Suck it.

The S-300...and 400/500 series are very BIG surface to air missiles. Not for shelling elementary schools, hospitals...or Polish farmers. But, it does have reliability problems during launch...not so much while in flight. Quite deadly to aircraft. But, less effective vs a cruise missile.

Reliability during launch?? Yup...it's a terror to its own crews. Once the pop-charge forces the missile out of its launch tube, the main engine fires...but not always. One runs as fast as possible at that point...

All rockets can fail...Patriot failure below. But the S-300 is notorious...

 

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Today the Ukrainian patriot for his people, God bless him, he is a hero for the Ukrainians, but I am a citizen of the West -> Zelenskyy decided to lie or better yet call the U.S. officials and NATO investigators liars by saying the following: 

a) Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelenskiy said he was convinced the missile was not Ukrainian. Speaking to reporters, Zelenskiy said he had received reports from the command of the Ukrainian Armed Forces and Air Force and that he "can only trust them."

went even further: 

b) Ukraine is demanding "immediate access" to the blast site in eastern Poland, a senior Ukrainian defence official said. Oleksiy Danilov said Ukraine wants a "joint study" .

---

So did he try to start a little WW3 taking advantage of the known Polish hatred towards the Russians?! Who cares really?! -> America with Biden had to come in and fixed all this mess. Professionalism. 

Anyhow for the Zelenskyy fans, now you understand what is like to have blind faith in a man, he is a just a man, and absolute power corrupts even if your intent is good. 

Intelligence men and women from the CIA save the day. The speed they got Biden at the microphone to deny the reports was admirable. That is efficiency. 

Let me end with a message from a NATO official that was leaked to the Financial Times:  

Responding to Zelensky’s remarks tonight, a NATO country diplomat told a Financial Times reporter: “This is getting ridiculous. The Ukrainians are destroying [our] confidence in them. Nobody is blaming Ukraine and they are openly lying. This is more destructive than the missile.”

Edited by Contrarian
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14 hours ago, DogOnPorch said:

Now the warmongers are in the position of defending their mistake. Suck it.

The S-300...and 400/500 series are very BIG surface to air missiles. Not for shelling elementary schools, hospitals...or Polish farmers. But, it does have reliability problems during launch...not so much while in flight. Quite deadly to aircraft. But, less effective vs a cruise missile.

They’re not “defending” the mistake they’re accepting it, a concept  you apologists can’t even grasp.  Now you must admit that Biden, NATO and the MSM are being honest and truthful   Doesn’t really tie in to your ridiculous nonsensical conspiracy   

 

Also its time for another DOP correction: As has been reported for some time now, since at least July, the one Russia as has been firing S300s at civilian ground targets due to lack of proper munitions  

 

Is Russia RUNNING OUT of weapons in Ukraine: Putin's army hits ground targets with surface-to-air missiles that are meant to shoot down planes amid 'critical' weapon shortages 

By Chris Jewers For Mailonline and Afp09:52 24 Jul 2022, updated 18:23 25 Jul 2022

 

Russia has been hitting ground targets in Ukraine with a surface-to-air missiles, reports have said, the latest sign of growing logistical issues faced by Moscow.

The Soviet-era S-300 missile system, first deployed in 1979, was originally designed to defend against air raids and cruise missiles for the Soviet Air Defence Forces….

 

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-11043373/amp/Russia-using-surface-air-missiles-hit-ground-targets-Ukraine-reports-say.html
 

But as I said I think in the Poland incident it sounds like a Ukrainian missile 

Edited by BeaverFever
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More likely: recent claims that the relatively short ranged S-300 can be used as a ballistic missile (by completely retooling its very specific 30N6 FLAP LID homing-radar guidance system to "GPS") are intended to cover-up similar stray impacts on friendly targets throughout Ukraine by the Zelensky government.

Russia did it...not us! Never us...

A lot of S-300s are being fired...not all of them hit an aircraft. Not even close to all...

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Here is the big elephant in the room: 

From what it looks, it will be a cold winter in Ukraine, this new Russian general keeps targeting energy supplies and at this rate -> millions will be without power for the winter.

Ukrainians are asking their diaspora to stay in the West as to not burden the energy sector by returning. 

Think about that, I know is hard here, but days and days in a cold winter with no power, no water. 

Can a society maintain loyalty without the basic needs?

will Ukrainians become even more nationalistic

or

turn the other way and demand of Zelenskyy a deal with Russia? 

Edited by Contrarian
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31 minutes ago, Contrarian said:

Here is the big elephant in the room: 

From what it looks, it will be a cold winter in Ukraine, this new Russian general keeps targeting energy supplies and at this rate -> millions will be without power for the winter.

Ukrainians are asking their diaspora to stay in the West as to not burden the energy sector by returning. 

Think about that, I know is hard here, but days and days in a cold winter with no power, no water. 

Can a society maintain loyalty without the basic needs?

will Ukrainians become even more nationalistic

or

turn the other way and demand of Zelenskyy a deal with Russia? 

 

I'm assured by fellow posters here that sleeping outside for months in freezing weather (as the bullets fly) is being looked forward to by the always victorious Ukrainian soldiers.

And they're certainly always victorious.

Civilians? Oh yes...them.

Well, whadayahdo? They will love it, too.

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On 11/17/2022 at 7:24 AM, DogOnPorch said:

More likely: recent claims that the relatively short ranged S-300 can be used as a ballistic missile (by completely retooling its very specific 30N6 FLAP LID homing-radar guidance system to "GPS") are intended to cover-up similar stray impacts on friendly targets throughout Ukraine by the Zelensky government.

Russia did it...not us! Never us...

A lot of S-300s are being fired...not all of them hit an aircraft. Not even close to all...

S300 is a poor man’s land attack weapon which is why as I said Russia HAS ALREADY BEEN USING IT FOR MONTHS 

 

But as I also said this missile is prob Ukrainian  

 

 

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13 hours ago, DogOnPorch said:

 

I'm assured by fellow posters here that sleeping outside for months in freezing weather (as the bullets fly) is being looked forward to by the always victorious Ukrainian soldiers.

And they're certainly always victorious.

Civilians? Oh yes...them.

Well, whadayahdo? They will love it, too.

LMAO You think it’s being looked forward to by your Russian conscripts who will be in even worse conditions and have even less motivation ?

How many rubles do get for this weak nonsense?

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10 hours ago, BeaverFever said:

S300 is a poor man’s land attack weapon which is why as I said Russia HAS ALREADY BEEN USING IT FOR MONTHS

 

No it isn't no matter what wikipedia told you. As mentioned, it uses a dedicated and very specific radar homing guidance provided by auxiliary vehicles or separate mounts in the Navy version. One doesn't just slap a GPS unit on one and turn it into a ballistic missile. If Russia needs old ballistic missiles, it will break-open the old Scud garages and let them out.

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10 hours ago, BeaverFever said:

LMAO You think it’s being looked forward to by your Russian conscripts who will be in even worse conditions and have even less motivation ?

How many rubles do get for this weak nonsense?

 

The word is week.

I get paid by the Russians exactly the same amount you get paid by the Ukrainian Nazis.

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Videos Reportedly Shows Massive Fireball Blast Near Russia's St. Petersburg.

https://www.newsweek.com/videos-reportedly-shows-massive-fireball-blast-near-russias-st-petersburg-1760858

Not confirmed yet if related with the war.

Edited by Contrarian
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1 hour ago, DogOnPorch said:

Perhaps a natural gas fire by the smoke plume.

Newsweek tends to exaggerate their titles for clickbait purposes. Is good to have all exits covered. 

So let us take all the scenarios: 

a) Putin and the FSB did it to scare the population so they can surround the leader type of thing. It will not be the first time, this is how he went all in into the Chechen wars too. Well, he chose apartments buildings then, allegedly

b) Zelenskyy the the SBU did it to show that the Ukrainians are not afraid and can strike right in the bear's den. If that is the case, Zelenskyy shows again that can not be controlled as my understanding is that the Americans are asking for a deescalation in messaging (as per the recent reports, CIA's trip there, Poland missile debacle, etc). 

c) It was an accident, in Eastern Europe drinking in the morning is a thing, stress times even for the engineers there. 

d) Western Security Intelligence services did it to scare Putin, he was born in Saint Petersburg, this would be a symbolic act. 

e) Green Peace deployed in the area and decided to send a message against the gas industry. 

f) Aliens did it, they had enough of humanity. 

I will go a choice between a) and b). 

Edited by Contrarian
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4 hours ago, DogOnPorch said:

 

No it isn't no matter what wikipedia told you. As mentioned, it uses a dedicated and very specific radar homing guidance provided by auxiliary vehicles or separate mounts in the Navy version. One doesn't just slap a GPS unit on one and turn it into a ballistic missile. If Russia needs old ballistic missiles, it will break-open the old Scud garages and let them out.

Wikipedia?  I linked actual news articles and videos from July about Russia firing S300s at ground targets out of desperation and you’re claiming I’m sourcing from Wikipedia? Stop being so dishonest.

Your parents must be embarrassed  by you

Edited by BeaverFever
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Russian military might has always been based on bluff. This war has truthfully exposed the state of "the second best army in the world". Their only strength in the military sense is that they don't run out of cannon fodder any time soon as life is cheap. 

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13 hours ago, BeaverFever said:

No genius,  it’s w-e-a-k, meaning lacking strength. As in your nonsense is weak, just like your ESL. RUSSIAN must be your first language. 

 

So, how much are the Ukrainian Nazis paying you, again?

 

13 hours ago, BeaverFever said:

Wikipedia?  I linked actual news articles and videos from July about Russia firing S300s at ground targets out of desperation and you’re claiming I’m sourcing from Wikipedia? Stop being so dishonest.

 

Your MSM/ McKenzie Intelligence Services links (as well as Wikipedia I note, which just updated their account of what happened) do not change the fact that one can not turn the S-300 into a ballistic missile. Nor does it explain why Russia supposedly took that incredulous route when it has thousands of Scud launchers in reserve waiting for just such a hypothetical 'no ammo' moment.

My first observation is the most likely: Ukraine is shooting-off lots of S-300s (a retired/reserve weapon system the Russians apparently do not even have in the area) and they needed an excuse for those many missiles that fail to hit their targets. One can't tell some poor Ukrainian family that their house was just nailed by a stray round of 'friendly fire'. So the Russians did it...

scud_b_missile_system.jpg

Scud...old ballistic missile...huge warhead.

1024px-S-300_-_2009_Moscow_Victory_Day_P

S-300...old SAM...small warhead.

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The amount of propaganda in this thread is breathtaking.  It really is true, the very first casualty in any war is the truth.
 

What did Churchill say again about the truth? 

"In wartime, truth is so precious that she should always be attended by a bodyguard of lies."

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Those nutsy russians keep attacking nuclear power plants. The attacks have been non-stop, edging closer and closer to striking the crucial part of the target, the reactor building itself.

This can only alter the public's perception nuclear power in negative ways, coming at a crucial time when nations are ramping up the number of nuclear power facilities. Nobody in their right mind should want these things to be built in their region if they are a major target for terrorism.

Strategically it makes perfect sense to target them. For a low-cost missile strike you get not only a radiological nightmare, you also have no power. Can you imagine millions of dumbfounded dipsticks in a disaster without internet? No advice what to do from google.

Edited by OftenWrong
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10 hours ago, DogOnPorch said:

 

So, how much are the Ukrainian Nazis paying you, again?

 

 

Your MSM/ McKenzie Intelligence Services links (as well as Wikipedia I note, which just updated their account of what happened) do not change the fact that one can not turn the S-300 into a ballistic missile. Nor does it explain why Russia supposedly took that incredulous route when it has thousands of Scud launchers in reserve waiting for just such a hypothetical 'no ammo' moment.

My first observation is the most likely: Ukraine is shooting-off lots of S-300s (a retired/reserve weapon system the Russians apparently do not even have in the area) and they needed an excuse for those many missiles that fail to hit their targets. One can't tell some poor Ukrainian family that their house was just nailed by a stray round of 'friendly fire'. So the Russians did it...

scud_b_missile_system.jpg

Scud...old ballistic missile...huge warhead.

1024px-S-300_-_2009_Moscow_Victory_Day_P

S-300...old SAM...small warhead.

FFS you are so simpleminded. Oh sure it’s a conspiracy - all of these separate news sources that make up “the MSM” including ones owned by right wingers like Rupert Murdoch are reporting the s300 that hit Poland is like Ukrainian but at the same time they’re all publishing fake stories about Russian ls firing s300s at ground targets backdated to July   Do you realize how dumb your nonsense sounds??? Now you’re just inventing baseless conspiracies without any evidence like a 12-yr old  whenever you get owned  

 

I REPEAT:  The missile that hit Poland probably was Ukrainian. But regardless, ITS A Documented FACT the Russians.have been firing S300s at ground targets out of pure desperation and lack of resources even though AS I ALREADY SAID the s300 is not effective or designed for it . Once again you prove your ignorance on all subjects. 

Edited by BeaverFever
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Now explain to us why Zelensky insisted and still insists it was a Russian rocket, Beave.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-11433783/World-leaders-plot-response-missile-hits-Poland-killing-two.html

https://apnews.com/article/russia-ukraine-g-20-summit-nato-biden-government-and-politics-c76bead57a11bc8397a30ee7bb06264e

because it sure looks like he's pushing for a WW III based on a false premise.

Edited by Infidel Dog
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