Another test for O Toole. What happened in the election ?

[Army Guy]

Another chance for the conservatives to find out if O Toole is still their man, There are some cracks already with frustrated members. And although I'm not an expert but now seems like a good time for a leadership challenge, "not like Justin will call another election any time soon" So if not O Toole then who ? is there any one new out there we are not aware of that could challenge the left and win ? Do we toss O Toole and try again seems like a conservative tradition. 

O’Toole facing crucial test as Conservative MPs gather for caucus retreat (msn.com)

 

[West]

O'Toole is just Trudeau lite. Not fiscally conservative. Not socially conservative. He may as well just run for the Liberal party

[blackbird]

3 hours ago, Army Guy said:

Another chance for the conservatives to find out if O Toole is still their man, There are some cracks already with frustrated members. And although I'm not an expert but now seems like a good time for a leadership challenge, "not like Justin will call another election any time soon" So if not O Toole then who ? is there any one new out there we are not aware of that could challenge the left and win ? Do we toss O Toole and try again seems like a conservative tradition. 

O’Toole facing crucial test as Conservative MPs gather for caucus retreat (msn.com)

 

 O'Toole turned the party into a liberal lite party which means continued rule by Trudeau and Liberals.  Politics in this country is hopeless.  Don't put your trust in horses or men as the Bible warns.  Study the King James Bible and put your trust in Jesus Christ.  This world is heading for destruction. 

[Army Guy]

3 hours ago, blackbird said:

 O'Toole turned the party into a liberal lite party which means continued rule by Trudeau and Liberals.  Politics in this country is hopeless.  Don't put your trust in horses or men as the Bible warns.  Study the King James Bible and put your trust in Jesus Christ.  This world is heading for destruction. 

I'm not saying i don't believe in god, You can believe in what ever you want to, i try to limit my religious believes myself and stay away from the bible, i have been to a lot of places that god has just up and left, and has not yet come back to.

[blackbird]

39 minutes ago, Army Guy said:

I'm not saying i don't believe in god, You can believe in what ever you want to, i try to limit my religious believes myself and stay away from the bible, i have been to a lot of places that god has just up and left, and has not yet come back to.

Why do you want to stay away from the Bible?  Not sure what you mean God has up and left.  God is omnipresent.  He does not leave any where.  

[Army Guy]

Just now, blackbird said:

Why do you want to stay away from the Bible?  Not sure what you mean God has up and left.  God is omnipresent.  He does not leave any where.  

I'm not a 100 % believer, I've pray to him when my life was in danger, and i also prayed to him to thank him for all my good things....I've been to a few or the worlds shit holes, or conflict areas, your not going to convince me that a higher power was present and allowed all that shit to happen to good people...the only thing there was 100 % evil...so he is not everywhere. 

[blackbird]

11 hours ago, Army Guy said:

I'm not a 100 % believer, I've pray to him when my life was in danger, and i also prayed to him to thank him for all my good things....I've been to a few or the worlds shit holes, or conflict areas, your not going to convince me that a higher power was present and allowed all that shit to happen to good people...the only thing there was 100 % evil...so he is not everywhere. 

Interesting.  Sounds like you have been and seen some pretty bad places.  You might consider getting a book called "Never Surrender" by a soldier, retired LTG William G. Boykin, former commander of U.S. Army Special Forces and founding member of Delta Force.  He is also on Facebook as Jerry Boykin I believe.  He was chosen in 1978 to make up the first unit in America's Delta Force.  He then became commander of the unit;  then commander of all U.S. Army Special Forces.  Later to tour of Central Intelligence Agency and clandestine missions around the world. Served last four years as deputy undersecretary of defense for intelligence.  He spent time in the elite forces bringing down warlords, war criminals, despots, and dictators.  He took a 50 calibre bullet in the shoulder and chest but survived.  The bullet came through the Blackhawk helicopter and hit him.  When soldiers get hit, they don't have a modern hospital right at their disposal, but fortunately for him a medic put a bandage on the wound and gave him a little morphine.  But I guess he had to hold out until they got to better facilities later.  I think it was during a raid to liberate the island of Grenada from Marxists in 1983.

  He has been in the world's trouble spots from Iran to Mogadishu, the Panama.  He helped capture Noriega in the Panama, liberating a nation from a brutal dictator.  He can tell you how his faith kept him going and how God worked with him. Life is often a battle. We wonder sometimes where God is.  But he is there.  

Boykin is on Facebook at  Lieutenant General William "Jerry" Boykin, USA, Ret. | Facebook

He gives his thoughts on some current issues you might find interesting, like the recent meeting between Putin and Biden. I just listened to his 6 minute interview on Putin and the Ukraine.  He doesn't have much faith in what Biden is doing.  He says Biden was in politics 40 years and made 40 years of bad decisions.  He says Putin studies the U.S. very closely and knows exactly how the American government thinks.  He said when Trump was in, the Russians didn't understand Trump because he was unpredictable which created a different situation and a challenge for them.  He doesn't think the threat of sanctions will bother them at all.

But it would be wise for me to address your concern you raised about whether God is present everywhere or not.  I shall attempt to better answer that a little later.

 

Edited January 23, 2022 by blackbird

[Queenmandy85]

1 hour ago, blackbird said:

I think it was during a raid to liberate the island of Barbados from Marxists in 1983.

 

First, the US has never raided Barbados. I think you are thinking of Grenada. I know, picky, picky, picky. ? But the people of Barbados and Grenada probably think it is a big deal. It is like when Canadians are called Americans.

Being a soldier is contrary to Christian values.

Back to the OP. The purpose of a political party is to win elections. Sticking to an ideology goes against electoral success and goes against democracy. We don't have governments to impose a dogmatic belief that a single ideology will solve all problems. Governments are there to provide pragmatic solutions which may not be perfect, but reflect the desires of the electorate.

The CPC is running out of viable potential leaders. They are driving good people out of politics. Ambrose, Moore, Raitt. They currently have a leader who is willing to put up with all the back-stabbing that has been going on, and who has a shot at forming a government. There are not enough voters who have confidence in Pierre Pollievre, or Max Bernier types to run a pragmatic centrist  government. Mr. O'Toole lost my vote when he backed the Northen Gateway pipeline, but I am willing to give him another chance. He is a pragmatist.

Edited January 23, 2022 by Queenmandy85
Rogue spell checker

[blackbird]

2 hours ago, Queenmandy85 said:

First, the US has never raided Barbados. I think you are thinking of Grenada. I know, picky, picky, picky. ? But the people of Barbados and Grenada probably think it is a big deal. It is like when Canadians are called Americans.

Being a soldier is contrary to Christian values.

Back to the OP. The purpose of a political party is to win elections. Sticking to an ideology goes against electoral success and goes against democracy. We don't have governments to impose a dogmatic belief that a single ideology will solve all problems. Governments are there to provide pragmatic solutions which may not be perfect, but reflect the desires of the electorate.

The CPC is running out of viable potential leaders. They are driving good people out of politics. Ambrose, Moore, Raitt. They currently have a leader who is willing to put up with all the back-stabbing that has been going on, and who has a shot at forming a government. There are not enough voters who have confidence in Pierre Pollievre, or Max Bernier types to run a pragmatic centrist  government. Mr. O'Toole lost my vote when he backed the Northen Gateway pipeline, but I am willing to give him another chance. He is a pragmatist.

You are correct about Grenada.  Good point. I will correct that.

Being a soldier is not contrary to Christian values.  You must be a pacifist.  That is why our Canadian Forces have been neglected and underfunded for years.  Trudeau and Liberals are anti-defence/ anti-military.  It is perfectly Biblical for a country to have military forces to defend itself as we did in the two world wars.  Same reason it is fine to have police or for a Christian to become a police officer.  In fact it is preferable such people do those jobs.

Read Romans ch13 in the King James Bible.  God ordained authorities who have the power to use force and the sword.

" 4  For he is the minister of God to thee for good. But if thou do that which is evil, be afraid; for he beareth not the sword in vain: for he is the minister of God, a revenger to execute wrath upon him that doeth evil." Romans 13:4 KJV

All political parties are largely pagan in nature and support a lot of evil or unbiblical policies.  Progressivism is evil and I can't support it.  Mr. O'Toole changed after he was elected leader and embrace some liberal policies such as carbon taxes against the wishes of at least half of conservatives.  He is toast.  I don't think he has a chance of winning an election if he lasts that long as leader.  I support the Northern Gateway pipeline and any pipeline.  They are essential to our prosperity as an energy-producing nation.  There is no climate emergency and the whole man-made climate change thing is a fraud.

Edited January 23, 2022 by blackbird

[Queenmandy85]

I am far from being a pacifist and therefore, my values, in that regard are at odds with the 5th commandment, "Thou shalt not Kill." I was an officer in the Canadian Scottish Regiment. My second cousin was the longest serving officer in the Canadian Forces and I have always advocated for a Swiss model in Defence policy. My uniforms as a Peace Officer and an Infantry officer were an "abomination in the eyes of the Lord, " in the same way as a homosexual is. 

That being said, the state of climate change is now beyond an "emergency" and I believe Mr. O'Toole is the leader who will respond more vigorously. We can transition away from carbon based energy, or we can toss our great grand children onto the barbecue. Transition away from fossil fuels involves two choices: severe rationing or moving to nuclear and solar power. I believe Mr. O'Toole will choose the latter option.

Northern gateway is the wrong place to put a petroleum pipeline. Just think of the spill in the Slocan river with the ongoning damage that caused. Imagine what a spill would do to the wilderness of northern BC.

[blackbird]

45 minutes ago, Queenmandy85 said:

I am far from being a pacifist and therefore, my values, in that regard are at odds with the 5th commandment, "Thou shalt not Kill." I was an officer in the Canadian Scottish Regiment. My second cousin was the longest serving officer in the Canadian Forces and I have always advocated for a Swiss model in Defence policy. My uniforms as a Peace Officer and an Infantry officer were an "abomination in the eyes of the Lord, " in the same way as a homosexual is. 

That being said, the state of climate change is now beyond an "emergency" and I believe Mr. O'Toole is the leader who will respond more vigorously. We can transition away from carbon based energy, or we can toss our great grand children onto the barbecue. Transition away from fossil fuels involves two choices: severe rationing or moving to nuclear and solar power. I believe Mr. O'Toole will choose the latter option.

Northern gateway is the wrong place to put a petroleum pipeline. Just think of the spill in the Slocan river with the ongoning damage that caused. Imagine what a spill would do to the wilderness of northern BC.

We could debate the Northern Gateway endlessly.  There are thousands of km of pipelines criss-crossing north America.  Nothing wrong with having a pipeline through the wilderness.  Most of Canada is wilderness and they have to go somewhere.  The wilderness in northern B.C. and the coast covers thousands of square kilometers.  A spill can be cleaned up and it would only be in a small area.  It is not going to destroy the wilderness.  There are also thousands of jobs at stake in the energy industry.  We need pipelines.  Trudeau killed the Northern Gateway pipeline project after years of study.  Nuclear and solar is not a legitimate substitute for oil and gas.  There are hundreds of millions of cars, trucks, and ships, and planes in the world that need the oil industry and it will last for the foreseeable future.

[blackbird]

1 hour ago, Queenmandy85 said:

I am far from being a pacifist and therefore, my values, in that regard are at odds with the 5th commandment, "Thou shalt not Kill." I was an officer in the Canadian Scottish Regiment. My second cousin was the longest serving officer in the Canadian Forces and I have always advocated for a Swiss model in Defence policy. My uniforms as a Peace Officer and an Infantry officer were an "abomination in the eyes of the Lord, " in the same way as a homosexual is. 

That being said, the state of climate change is now beyond an "emergency" and I believe Mr. O'Toole is the leader who will respond more vigorously. We can transition away from carbon based energy, or we can toss our great grand children onto the barbecue. Transition away from fossil fuels involves two choices: severe rationing or moving to nuclear and solar power. I believe Mr. O'Toole will choose the latter option.

Northern gateway is the wrong place to put a petroleum pipeline. Just think of the spill in the Slocan river with the ongoning damage that caused. Imagine what a spill would do to the wilderness of northern BC.

As for your concerns about climate change, I would suggest you read the article on the link below on the subject.  

The graph shows how global warming did not occur at the same rate as changes in man-made CO2.  If proves man-made CO2 is the main cause of climate change and not the culprit that many people think.  The rates of global warming varied greatly during the 120 year period, while the increase in man-made CO2 was a relatively smooth increase.  So it shows you cannot link man-made CO2 to global warming as the main cause.  There has to be other natural causes such as the water vapour which is a major reason for the greenhouse effect, but also the changes could be related to solar radiation and other factors.   Also man's contribution to the CO2 in the atmosphere is miniscule 18 PPM out of a total of 410 PPM currently.  97% of the CO2 is natural and required for life on earth.  Notice between 1880 to 1910 (30 year period) there was a drop in atmospheric temperature from plus 0.1 degrees C to minus 0.3 degrees C;  yet the man-made CO2 did not drop but continued to increase slowly and evenly.  Why would that be?  So while the temperature rose in general over a long period of time, the connection with man-made CO2 is not clear and cannot be claimed scientifically as the cause.

A biblical and scientific approach to climate change - creation.com

 

Edited January 23, 2022 by blackbird

[Queenmandy85]

1 hour ago, blackbird said:

There are also thousands of jobs at stake in the energy industry.

Deleted for thread drift.

Edited January 23, 2022 by Queenmandy85
Thread drift

[Queenmandy85]

The bottom line for the CPC is, if they oust Mr. O'Toole, who do they replace him with? If past experience is any indication, the new leader will have to appease the reform / Social Credit rump in order to get the leadership. That is what Mr. O'Toole had to do. The problem with that is, that wing is so welded to ideology, they alienate the vast ocean of voters who fill the centre. It is all nice and roses to be ideologically pure. That is what the NDP are, and the only times they have peeked out of their hole is when Jack Layton and Tom Mulcair tried to move them into the real world near the centre. For his efforts, they sacked Tom. I fear the same will happen to the CPC if they sack Mr. O'Toole. The CPC will become another NDP, forever in the wilderness, but happy in their righteous illusion they are pure and it is the electorate that is wrong. Only a moron thinks they are smarter than the average voter. 

[Michael Hardner]

1 hour ago, Queenmandy85 said:

 For his efforts, they sacked Tom. I fear the same will happen to the CPC if they sack Mr. O'Toole.  

Exactly this.  NDP supporters in my feed said "Well we went to the centre and we didn't win".  This is what the CPC people are saying now also.

You can't deny the existence of the centre...

[Yzermandius19]

16 hours ago, Army Guy said:

I'm not saying i don't believe in god, You can believe in what ever you want to, i try to limit my religious believes myself and stay away from the bible, i have been to a lot of places that god has just up and left, and has not yet come back to.

God didn't leave

we are simply not dolls

the existence of evil is not proof of God's absence

 

[Queenmandy85]

 Michael wrote: NDP supporters in my feed said "Well we went to the centre and we didn't win".  This is what the CPC people are saying now also.

You can't deny the existence of the centre...Right. They won't have any better chance of winning by moving away from the centre. Mulcair would have had a better chance if he wasn't up against a fresh young Justin Trudeau. Beating the Grits in the next election will be hard work but if the CPC wants to win, they will have to work for it. Elections are not won by ideology. Campaigning by arguing with a voter that he is wrong and you are right, is not a winning strategy. The voter is always right. It is running good candidates who appeal to the voters and the hard grinding of identifying the vote and getting every supporter into the booth.

Edited January 23, 2022 by Queenmandy85

[Queenmandy85]

8 minutes ago, Yzermandius19 said:

the existence of evil is not proof of God's absence

 

It is not proof of God's presence, either

Edited January 23, 2022 by Queenmandy85

[Yzermandius19]

1 minute ago, Queenmandy85 said:

It is not proof of Her presence, either

so?

[Army Guy]

3 hours ago, blackbird said:

 

Being a soldier is not contrary to Christian values.  You must be a pacifist.  That is why our Canadian Forces have been neglected and underfunded for years.  Trudeau and Liberals are anti-defence/ anti-military.  It is perfectly Biblical for a country to have military forces to defend itself as we did in the two world wars.  Same reason it is fine to have police or for a Christian to become a police officer.  In fact it is preferable such people do those jobs.

 

 Canadians on both sides of the political spectrum have bought into the entire "WE don't need a military, or who is going to attack us meme" besides there is simply nothing in it for the Average Canadian. Both sides have stripped our military of everything, and now military people are leaving in droves becasue they are tired of giving their all, while Canadians piss all over them and their ideals.  

They see it as a waste of funds that cold be directed towards them in some way..., they have moved on and could not give a rats ass about anything military or it's soldiers...not all but most... Why we as Canadians still have a military, well it is an employment giant for one, next it has the largest pork barrel in the country, i mean where else can you buy a 200 million boat and pay a bil plus for it...Defense of this country has nothing to do with it, i mean 5G network is a gleaming example, we are still debating giving it to the Chinese... 

[blackbird]

16 hours ago, Army Guy said:

I'm not a 100 % believer, I've pray to him when my life was in danger, and i also prayed to him to thank him for all my good things....I've been to a few or the worlds shit holes, or conflict areas, your not going to convince me that a higher power was present and allowed all that shit to happen to good people...the only thing there was 100 % evil...so he is not everywhere. 

Man is born with an evil, corrupt nature and a wicked heart because man rebelled against God in the garden of Eden and ate the forbidden fruit.  God does not cause or create evil.  Man has free will and because of his nature man chooses to do evil.  That is why there is all the wars, crime, and evil things happening in the world.  If God had intervened to stop it, he would have to make robots out of man and take away his free will.   Why Is There Suffering? | Bible.org

[blackbird]

2 minutes ago, Army Guy said:

 Canadians on both sides of the political spectrum have bought into the entire "WE don't need a military, or who is going to attack us meme" besides there is simply nothing in it for the Average Canadian. Both sides have stripped our military of everything, and now military people are leaving in droves becasue they are tired of giving their all, while Canadians piss all over them and their ideals.  

They see it as a waste of funds that cold be directed towards them in some way..., they have moved on and could not give a rats ass about anything military or it's soldiers...not all but most... Why we as Canadians still have a military, well it is an employment giant for one, next it has the largest pork barrel in the country, i mean where else can you buy a 200 million boat and pay a bil plus for it...Defense of this country has nothing to do with it, i mean 5G network is a gleaming example, we are still debating giving it to the Chinese... 

Yes, I think if liberals and NDP had their way, we would have no military at all and Canada would become part of China.  Almost all countries in the world have armed forces.  

[Army Guy]

7 hours ago, blackbird said:

Interesting.  Sounds like you have been and seen some pretty bad places.  You might consider getting a book called "Never Surrender" by a soldier, retired LTG William G. Boykin, former commander of U.S. Army Special Forces and founding member of Delta Force.  He is also on Facebook as Jerry Boykin I believe.  He was chosen in 1978 to make up the first unit in America's Delta Force.  He then became commander of the unit;  then commander of all U.S. Army Special Forces.  Later to tour of Central Intelligence Agency and clandestine missions around the world. Served last four years as deputy undersecretary of defense for intelligence.  He spent time in the elite forces bringing down warlords, war criminals, despots, and dictators.  He took a 50 calibre bullet in the shoulder and chest but survived.  The bullet came through the Blackhawk helicopter and hit him.  When soldiers get hit, they don't have a modern hospital right at their disposal, but fortunately for him a medic put a bandage on the wound and gave him a little morphine.  But I guess he had to hold out until they got to better facilities later.  I think it was during a raid to liberate the island of Grenada from Marxists in 1983.

  He has been in the world's trouble spots from Iran to Mogadishu, the Panama.  He helped capture Noriega in the Panama, liberating a nation from a brutal dictator.  He can tell you how his faith kept him going and how God worked with him. Life is often a battle. We wonder sometimes where God is.  But he is there.  

Boykin is on Facebook at  Lieutenant General William "Jerry" Boykin, USA, Ret. | Facebook

He gives his thoughts on some current issues you might find interesting, like the recent meeting between Putin and Biden. I just listened to his 6 minute interview on Putin and the Ukraine.  He doesn't have much faith in what Biden is doing.  He says Biden was in politics 40 years and made 40 years of bad decisions.  He says Putin studies the U.S. very closely and knows exactly how the American government thinks.  He said when Trump was in, the Russians didn't understand Trump because he was unpredictable which created a different situation and a challenge for them.  He doesn't think the threat of sanctions will bother them at all.

But it would be wise for me to address your concern you raised about whether God is present everywhere or not.  I shall attempt to better answer that a little later.

 

Every Soldier has his own tolerances to war Mr Boykin is obvious a much harder man than I am. And we clearly had much different jobs, he worked on a strategic level and got to make a difference in the shape of the war, Me, i did the same thing over and over again patrol to contact with the enemy, kick the shit out of him and all his buddies, and get kicked back and do it all over again the next day... 

God was never in the places i was in, it was nothing but pure evil.... you can't convince me he was in places like Somalia where the country was starving to death form the lack of food, and top it all of, it was in the center of a civil war every where there was death and violence bodies in the streets, along the road sides, run over like road kill here in Canada until you could not tell it was once human... Or Afghanistan where Terrorist strapped explosive onto a 6 year old and told him to drive his bike into our check point.... those that suffer most are always women and kids...Ya no fuc*king god there, You have every right to believe in what you want, me, my whole military career has made me weary of the whole religious thing...

[blackbird]

2 hours ago, Queenmandy85 said:

The bottom line for the CPC is, if they oust Mr. O'Toole, who do they replace him with? If past experience is any indication, the new leader will have to appease the reform / Social Credit rump in order to get the leadership. That is what Mr. O'Toole had to do. The problem with that is, that wing is so welded to ideology, they alienate the vast ocean of voters who fill the centre. It is all nice and roses to be ideologically pure. That is what the NDP are, and the only times they have peeked out of their hole is when Jack Layton and Tom Mulcair tried to move them into the real world near the centre. For his efforts, they sacked Tom. I fear the same will happen to the CPC if they sack Mr. O'Toole. The CPC will become another NDP, forever in the wilderness, but happy in their righteous illusion they are pure and it is the electorate that is wrong. Only a moron thinks they are smarter than the average voter. 

The majority in Canada seem to be of a secular humanist, liberal mind.  What do we expect when Canada brings in millions of third world immigrants without any Judeo-Christian beliefs or culture and destroys our civilization created by our European founding fathers..  Canada has become a post national basket case.  Trudeau was right about becoming a post national state.

"When the prime minister says Canada is the world’s “first postnational state,” I believe he’s saying this is a place where respect for minorities trumps any one group’s way of doing things.

‘There is no core identity, no mainstream in Canada,’ Trudeau claimed after the October election. ‘There are shared values – openness, respect, compassion, willingness to work hard, to be there for each other, to search for equality and justice.”

The New York Times writer who obtained this quote said Trudeau’s belief Canada has no core identity is his “most radical” political position. It seems especially so combined with criticism Trudeau is a lightweight on national security and sovereignty.

Not too many Canadians, however, seem disturbed by Trudeau talking about us as a “postnational state.”

The dangers of Trudeau's 'postnational' Canada | Vancouver Sun

[blackbird]

12 minutes ago, Army Guy said:

Every Soldier has his own tolerances to war Mr Boykin is obvious a much harder man than I am. And we clearly had much different jobs, he worked on a strategic level and got to make a difference in the shape of the war, Me, i did the same thing over and over again patrol to contact with the enemy, kick the shit out of him and all his buddies, and get kicked back and do it all over again the next day... 

God was never in the places i was in, it was nothing but pure evil.... you can't convince me he was in places like Somalia where the country was starving to death form the lack of food, and top it all of, it was in the center of a civil war every where there was death and violence bodies in the streets, along the road sides, run over like road kill here in Canada until you could not tell it was once human... Or Afghanistan where Terrorist strapped explosive onto a 6 year old and told him to drive his bike into our check point.... those that suffer most are always women and kids...Ya no fuc*king god there, You have every right to believe in what you want, me, my whole military career has made me weary of the whole religious thing...

I have not been to those places or situations so can't say anything about that particular aspect.  Only what I've seen on the tube, movies, or read.  But I don't think the existence of such places proves that God is not everywhere.  I have become  convinced that God revealed himself through his written word, in English, the King James Bible.  He did warn there would be wars, etc. until he returns, which could be any time.  We need to be ready.

As far as God being in bad places like Somalia, we are told God is a spirit and separate from the material world.  He created the universe and man, but he is not a material being himself.  He is still there as a spirit and is particularly with those who believe in his Son in a special way.  This is a spiritual presence, but real nonetheless.  He has given man free will; hence all the evil things men choose to do.  But there is a day coming in which he will rule the earth and there will be no more wars or suffering.

Edited January 23, 2022 by blackbird