New Brunswick goes full nazi and wants to prevent unvax from buying groceries

[myata]

It impossible to take some statements here with any kind of logic or reason. Let's try:

You are more vulnerable -> you have to take extra precautions -> let's force this into you every 3 months under all kind of threats and losses! Yes, for as long as necessary.

Do you see it, the reason? Now, a question: what kind of decisions can you make, if reason and sanity are long gone?

[Zeitgeist]

6 minutes ago, dialamah said:

Pseudoscience is what informs people that Jews and Blacks are intellectually inferior to Whites, vaccines cause autism, and that that the Covid vaccine is ineffective at best and deadly at worst.

You have personal discretion, and also consequences.  That's life, get used to it 

If say the results prove that these policies reduce spread, since those regions who disregard them have consistently more cases and deaths than those who don't.  If you'd been paying attention you'd have noticed:. Case counts/hospitalizations go down, restrictions ease.  Case counts/hospitalizations go up, restrictions go up.  

You have the freedom not to wear a mask or vaccinate.  Freedom also means personal responsibility for your actions, and personal responsibility includes accepting the consequences of those choices 

No we don’t have that freedom if we want jobs, income, and normal socialization.  If our death rate rises a bit because some people who have freely chosen not to get vaccinated and/or wear masks die, that’s fine.  At least we’ll retain our freedom.  It’s well worth it to people who understand the value of a free society and healthy democracy.  I also think that restrictions are causing many non-Covid problems that probably outweigh the impact of Covid at this point.

[dialamah]

20 minutes ago, Zeitgeist said:

Canada is China.

Hyperbole much?  China disappeared people who secretly documented the situation in Wuhan, before China admitted there was a virus, at the start of Covid.  In Canada, there are full out demonstrations, those demonstrators can still be found in their homes.

You are ridiculous in your claims.

[Zeitgeist]

3 minutes ago, dialamah said:

Hyperbole much?  China disappeared people who secretly documented the situation in Wuhan, before China admitted there was a virus, at the start of Covid.  In Canada, there are full out demonstrations, those demonstrators can still be found in their homes.

You are ridiculous in your claims.

I’m seeing the impacts of restrictions and mandates on the workers and families around me every day.  I can’t even staff my workplace properly because of testing result upload mandates.  The people who are doing everything “right” are burning out.  To a person our workers and managers are upset and frustrated.  It’s nothing less than fascism and slavery.  None of this is necessary.  If you’re still fearful after being fully-vaccinated and having the choice to mask up and stay away from people, your paranoia shouldn’t dictate the behaviour of everyone else.  I feel sorry for our youth, who are being robbed of healthy school and social experiences for no good reason.  

[dialamah]

3 minutes ago, Zeitgeist said:

No we don’t have that freedom if we want jobs, income, and normal socialization.  

Many companies are not requiring proof of vaccination.  Those that are have that right, just as you have the right to not get vaccinated.  Your rights are not any more important than the rights of others.

5 minutes ago, Zeitgeist said:

If our death rate rises a bit because some people who have freely chosen not to get vaccinated and/or wear masks die, that’s fine.  

No, it's not fine.  I'm not in favor of people dying.  Anyway, if you are willing to accept dying on this hill, what's the big deal of a little loss of socialization and income - especially as there's a demand for workers - vaxed or not - in many places.  My unvaxed grandchildren have found jobs, despite being old enough to be vaccinated and deciding not to. 

10 minutes ago, Zeitgeist said:

At least we’ll retain our freedom.

You have freedom.  You are free to not get vaxed.  You are free to accept the consequences of that decision.  Only in authoritarian States would vaccination be absolutely required, without any freedom to choose and accept consequences of that choice.

13 minutes ago, Zeitgeist said:

 I also think that restrictions are causing many non-Covid problems that probably outweigh the impact of Covid at this point.

Vaccinated have more freedom now than at any time since Covid began.

[myata]

Astonishing how a whole society can lose reason to the fear in just two short years. But doesn't it explain so much, now that we can see it with own eyes?

Since when reducing this number is a legitimate cause for arbitrary and mandatory, or equivalent by hook or by crook, limitations and restrictions?

Lifestyle, obesity are factors in any number of serious conditions and limiting them would certainly reduce some numbers. So did we make entry to fast food conditional on some passport of obesity vaccination?

What about drug use? Why don't we close grocery stores to drug users, it'll sure do something for some numbers? The list can go on and on but here's the thing:

Some of us lost their reason, yes these two years was enough. And now, the new insanity is the reason for them, and the old normality, unreasonable and insane. And I don't think there's a rational bridge between the two. Not like it did not happen already.

[Zeitgeist]

2 minutes ago, myata said:

Astonishing how a whole society can lose reason to the fear in just two short years. But doesn't it explain so much, now that we can see it with own eyes?

Since when reducing this number is a legitimate cause for arbitrary and mandatory, or equivalent by hook or by crook, limitations and restrictions?

Lifestyle, obesity are factors in any number of serious conditions and limiting them would certainly reduce some numbers. So did we make entry to fast food conditional on some passport of obesity vaccination?

What about drug use? Why don't we close grocery stores to drug users, it'll sure do something for some numbers? The list can go on and on but here's the thing:

Some of us lost their reason, yes these two years was enough. And now, the new insanity is the reason for them, and the old normality, unreasonable and insane. And I don't think there's a rational bridge between the two. Not like it did not happen already.

What we’re doing at this point to protect people from Covid is sick and sadistic.  After providing free vaccines to everyone from vulnerable age groups who want them and getting an extremely high percentage of the vulnerable fully vaccinated, I can’t help but think that continued restrictions and mandates have nothing to with Covid.  This is about control.  Our continued assent to this level of control is the single biggest problem in our society.

[dialamah]

11 minutes ago, Zeitgeist said:

I’m seeing the impacts of restrictions and mandates on the workers and families around me every day.  I can’t even staff my workplace properly because of testing result upload mandates.  The people who are doing everything “right” are burning out.  To a person our workers and managers are upset and frustrated.  It’s nothing less than fascism and slavery.  None of this is necessary.  If you’re still fearful after being fully-vaccinated and having the choice to mask up and stay away from people, your paranoia shouldn’t dictate the behaviour of everyone else.  I feel sorry for our youth, who are being robbed of healthy school and social experiences for no good reason.  

Consequences.  And notice that you'll hire people that aren't vaccinated. 

13 minutes ago, Zeitgeist said:

f you’re still fearful after being fully-vaccinated and having the choice to mask up and stay away from people, your paranoia shouldn’t dictate the behaviour of everyone else.  I feel sorry for our youth, who are being robbed of healthy school and social experiences for no good reason.  

The decision of the minority should not dictate the behavior of the majority.  In a democracy, the majority gets to make the decisions.  Only in a fascist country does the minority have that power - which they enforce through much worse means than limits on dining out and gym attendance.

[dialamah]

18 minutes ago, Zeitgeist said:

 I feel sorry for our youth, who are being robbed of healthy school and social experiences for no good reason.  

I don't know where you are, but the youth here have been attending school and having "healthy school and social experiences" since June of 2020. 

Seems to me that if this were a power grab to a fascist State, the same restrictions would be in place everywhere, not differ between Provinces, countries and regions.

[myata]

9 minutes ago, Zeitgeist said:

What we’re doing at this point to protect people from Covid is sick and sadistic.

Not only that it is unreasonable and authoritarian, it is also not intelligent, in plain words, dumb. Simply, the problem can be more complex, way more complex than tying eyes and marching in a given direction with a banner, hoping you would get somewhere eventually. And I expect most problems in this age would require way more smartness, intelligence and ingenuity than that. Even if it worked before, anyhow, does not guarantee that it would work again and again.

No, not a good news.

[Yzermandius19]

56 minutes ago, dialamah said:

I'd say the results prove that these policies reduce spread, since those regions who disregard them have consistently more cases and deaths than those who don't.

the results don't say that at all

the results show that these policies don't reduce much of anything and the juice ain't worth the sqeeze

those who avoided lockdowns and mandates faired better than those who didn't

yet you champion the policies of the nations and states who have handled covid the worst

so clearly you don't know the results

or you wouldn't be pretending that lockdowns or vax mandates work

you still keep thinking that government policy is based on science

without any evidence, just on a leap of faith that is unjustified

 

science does not back your position on this issue

the propaganda you read just claims that it does

and you don't even care enough to fact check their lying asses

you just take their word for it

confirmation bias is a helluva drug

Edited December 6, 2021 by Yzermandius19

[Zeitgeist]

16 minutes ago, dialamah said:

Consequences.  And notice that you'll hire people that aren't vaccinated. 

The decision of the minority should not dictate the behavior of the majority.  In a democracy, the majority gets to make the decisions.  Only in a fascist country does the minority have that power - which they enforce through much worse means than limits on dining out and gym attendance.

Totally wrong.  The reason we have Charter protections for minorities is to protect their rights and prevent the stomping of their interests, as happened to the Jews in the Holocaust.  Totalitarian governments eliminate all opposition.  Hitler made all parties except the Nazi party illegal.  Communist countries are also one party systems.

”I may disagree with what you say, but I’ll fight to the death for your right to say it.”  Voltaire

[Aristides]

3 hours ago, OftenWrong said:

Surely we can do better than a binary choice? Or are Canadians willing to accept that.

t would help if the entitled weren't so willing to burden the system with their entitlement.

[Aristides]

9 minutes ago, Zeitgeist said:

Totally wrong.  The reason we have Charter protections for minorities is to protect their rights and prevent the stomping of their interests, as happened to the Jews in the Holocaust.  Totalitarian governments eliminate all opposition.  Hitler made all parties except the Nazi party illegal.  Communist countries are also one party systems.

”I may disagree with what you say, but I’ll fight to the death for your right to say it.”  Voltaire

You can say anything you want, you just can't do anything you want. No one can.

So do you think a Jew might have got vaccinated if he knew it would keep him out of Auswitzch?

You ain't no martyr bud, just someone making a bad choice.

Edited December 6, 2021 by Aristides

[Goddess]

Like all the other restrictions, banning from grocery stores has nothing, repeat - NOTHING - to do with health or safety.

It's about forcing the vaccine on everyone.

You comply, or you don't eat.  Expect it to get much, much worse.

Coronavirus not found in 957 grocery store samples | CTV News

Quote

 

Corradini notes that earlier studies on surface transmission were conducted in labs where variables like temperature, humidity and viral load were controlled.

By contrast, in her study she wanted to look at the risk of surface transmission in real-world settings that people would encounter in their everyday lives.

In order to get the virus via surface transmission a combination of events has to “align perfectly,” she said. “It doesn’t happen often, but it can, but the probability is very low.”

 

 

 

Surprisingly, this was in the Toronto Sun.  I guess there's at least ONE journalist who's awake and still able to reason.

FUREY: Canada, it's long overdue that we drop the COVID alarmism cycle | Toronto Sun

Quote

 

It’s long overdue that Canada drops the COVID alarmism cycle, where we sit ready to be fed bad news and then immediately call for shutdowns.

The problem is it’s our new Pavlovian response. The past 20 months have been habit forming. Shutting down schools, for example, is not a normal thing to do. Yet we’ve normalized it.

An accounting of how this came to be will no doubt be the subject of many books in the years to come. So I’ll just narrow in on one factor: We’re not amplifying the info that will allow us to step away from the alarmism. And by we, I specifically mean Canada.

 

 

Edited December 6, 2021 by Goddess

[Queenmandy85]

1 hour ago, Zeitgeist said:

I assume you’re no longer working.  Try masking and adhering to protocols all day and see how you feel.

I'm a potter now. I wear a mask from when I enter the building until I leave and have to show proof of vaccination. I often forget to remove the mask when I drive home at the end of the day.

[Queenmandy85]

15 minutes ago, Goddess said:

t's about forcing the vaccine on everyone.

You comply, or you don't eat.

So, comply. It really is no big deal. It has now been thoroughly tested. Hundreds of millions of people have been vaccinated. That is a pretty big test pool. I've had three shots with no ill effects. As far as I have been able to find out, no one in Canada has been killed by the vaccine. Almost 29,000 people have died from covid.

Edited December 6, 2021 by Queenmandy85

[Goddess]

2 minutes ago, Queenmandy85 said:

It really is no big deal.

Erm, when death is an adverse reaction, it kinda is.

3 minutes ago, Queenmandy85 said:

It has now been thoroughly tested.

Tests do not conclude until 2025.  It has  not been thoroughly tested until then.

3 minutes ago, Queenmandy85 said:

I've had three shots with no ill effects.

I'm happy for you.  My sister is still suffering and so are thousands of other people.  But great that you're okay!

4 minutes ago, Queenmandy85 said:

As far as I have been able to find out, no one in Canada has been killed by the vaccine.

You must not have looked very hard.

5 minutes ago, Queenmandy85 said:

Almost 29,000 people have died from covid.

We already know that is not true, because of the shady way they count "deaths from covid".

I don't know where you're getting your information from ( I do, really, MSM), but you are woefully uninformed.

[Accountability Now]

2 hours ago, dialamah said:

Unvaxed are more vulnerable than vaxed people.  They should take extra precautions to avoid getting sick, such as staying home.

You think a 20 year old unvaxxed person is more vulnerable than a 70 year old double vaxxed? If so, you have clearly bought into the binary divide they are hoping you would have.

[myata]

1 hour ago, Yzermandius19 said:

so clearly you don't know the results

or you wouldn't be pretending that lockdowns or vax mandates work

Or both and of course knowing and understanding is not the point in any of this, only drumming and convincing themselves in the correctness of the predetermined dogma. For a totalitarian mind it's easier to accept logical and factual inconsistencies under any number of excuses and pretexts than to doubt the validity of the dogma that is the cornerstone of the perception of the reality.

[Queenmandy85]

21 minutes ago, Accountability Now said:

You think a 20 year old unvaxxed person is more vulnerable than a 70 year old double vaxxed? If so, you have clearly bought into the binary divide they are hoping you would have.

Who is “they .”

[Accountability Now]

Just now, Queenmandy85 said:

Who is “they .”

Government, media, etc

[Queenmandy85]

So you are saying the government are out to get you.

[Accountability Now]

2 minutes ago, Queenmandy85 said:

So you are saying the government are out to get you.

When you answer the question I asked above, you might see the point I'm making. 

[myata]

"CDC estimates that flu has resulted in 9 million – 41 million illnesses, 140,000 – 710,000 hospitalizations and 12,000 – 52,000 deaths annually between 2010 and ..." (USA).

Proportionally to population, this amounts to approximately 6,5 thousand per year in Canada. Add overdose and it's close 15,000 even without most serious causes. And subtract those resulting from subpar, stressed and under resourced system. Retirement homes fiasco, after two decades of warnings.

Numbers say clearly that sky is falling is a bogus. No, it does not explain or justify anything. Now use your totalitarian goggles to deflect and ignore, like you invented anything new here.

Edited December 6, 2021 by myata