It Begins. . . Quebec and NYC to implement Vaccine Passports.

[Boges]

21 minutes ago, Zeitgeist said:

Vaccine passports and mandatory vaccinations are not leading to a reduction in restrictions at all.  Provide even one example indicating otherwise.

They allow for continuing of the reductions in restrictions seen this summer. 

- Indoor dining
- Gyms
- Organized Sports
- Concerts and Pro Sporting Events
- Movie Theatres 
 

And then, in Ontario anyway, Non-Essential Retail and Personal Care will not be subject to a Vaccine Passport initially because Masking will still be required. That may change if numbers go in the wrong direction.  

Patio dining will also be exempt from a Vaccine Passport. 

I've just signed up for a beer-league sport for later in the month. The organizer is requiring proof of vaccination. Not sure of the legality, but many private gatherings will demand proof of vaccination above and beyond the scope of the provincial mandate. 

[Zeitgeist]

33 minutes ago, Boges said:

They allow for continuing of the reductions in restrictions seen this summer. 

- Indoor dining
- Gyms
- Organized Sports
- Concerts and Pro Sporting Events
- Movie Theatres 
 

And then, in Ontario anyway, Non-Essential Retail and Personal Care will not be subject to a Vaccine Passport initially because Masking will still be required. That may change if numbers go in the wrong direction.  

Patio dining will also be exempt from a Vaccine Passport. 

I've just signed up for a beer-league sport for later in the month. The organizer is requiring proof of vaccination. Not sure of the legality, but many private gatherings will demand proof of vaccination above and beyond the scope of the provincial mandate. 

I’m sorry but all of those facilities were open prior to vaccine passports.  The masking mandates and other restrictions that were in place are continuing.  Nothing is loosening upon implementation of vaccine passports, which means that even though more people are getting vaccinated to get the passports and even though everyone attending these venues will have obeyed vaccine passport rules, masking and other restrictions will continue for those patrons.  Disgusting.  This just proves that we are getting more violated: vaccine passports on top of restrictions.  What’s next? 

Edited September 9, 2021 by Zeitgeist

[Boges]

6 minutes ago, Zeitgeist said:

I’m sorry but all of those facilities were open prior to vaccine passports.  The masking mandates and other restrictions that were in place are continuing.  Nothing is loosening upon implementation of vaccine passports, which means that even though more people are getting vaccinated to get the passports and even though everyone attending these venues will have obeyed vaccine passport rules, masking and other restrictions will continue for those patrons.  Disgusting.  This just proves that we are getting more violated: vaccine passports on top of restrictions.  

I don't think you understand the point. 

For most of the country, these venues were largely shuttered and unable to open. 

For the past 2 or 3 months, things have been pretty open. Masking still exists and international travel sucks, but most almost everything is open. 

Going into this fourth wave, a vaccine passport is required to keep numbers down and NOT experience another Lockdown. 

One element of loosening we'll see is masking in some of these businesses that do require a passport. (Indoor dining, theatres, sporting events, gyms etc) Masking isn't really enforced in these places anyway, like they are in a retail environment. So a passport is especially required. I've been back to the Gym for about a month now. I don't really wear a mask all that much, kind of impractical. 

Edited September 9, 2021 by Boges

[Zeitgeist]

I haven’t seen any loosening of restrictions, including masking, resulting from implementation of vaccine passports, including for the vaccinated.

Edited September 9, 2021 by Zeitgeist

[cougar]

1 hour ago, Zeitgeist said:

Vaccine passports and mandatory vaccinations are not leading to a reduction in restrictions at all.  Provide even one example indicating otherwise.

If they don't that means the lack of a vaccine passport imposes new restrictions on those who are not vaccinated.  Either way, the PASSport gives the owner a PASS to places others will not get.

[cougar]

57 minutes ago, Boges said:

That may change if numbers go in the wrong direction.  

 

If they go in the wrong direction, it is because vaccinated people continue to carry and spread the virus.

No need to vilify those not currently vaccinated.

[Boges]

1 hour ago, cougar said:

If they go in the wrong direction, it is because vaccinated people continue to carry and spread the virus.

No need to vilify those not currently vaccinated.

Yes, because they're the ones overwhelmingly getting sick. 

Spreading the virus isn't all that bad if your chance of serious or even mild illness is almost nil. This is not the case amongst unvaccinated. 

[OftenWrong]

7 minutes ago, Boges said:

Yes, because they're the ones overwhelmingly getting sick. 

Spreading the virus isn't all that bad if your chance of serious or even mild illness is almost nil. This is not the case amongst unvaccinated. 

that may be the case for now, but we've seen it's no longer the cases in couintries that are several months ahead of us in getting vaccines and re-opening.

Will Canada learn from what is happening elsewhere, or just stumble forward naively believing the vaccine is the silver bullet?

Experts in epidemiology are shaking their heads at what we have done, and are doing now.

But hey.

Carry on vaccinating.

[OftenWrong]

CBC News - "Tens of thousands of health care workers in Quebec are still unvaccinated as mandatory policy nears"

You got that? Tens of thousands. Will Quebec be in a position to let them go?

Why have so many opted to not get vaccinated? Are they really mindless idiots like some here loudly proclaim? Or are they trained experts in infection control, having worked with outbreaks year after year.

Which one is our health care worker.

 

[Boges]

5 minutes ago, OftenWrong said:

that may be the case for now, but we've seen it's no longer the cases in couintries that are several months ahead of us in getting vaccines and re-opening.

Will Canada learn from what is happening elsewhere, or just stumble forward naively believing the vaccine is the silver bullet?

Experts in epidemiology are shaking their heads at what we have done, and are doing now.

But hey.

Carry on vaccinating.

Which experts? Which countries? 

What are their fatality rates amongst vaccinated people? 

[Boges]

This is why vaccine passports are required. Freedom of Choice has consequences. 

 

[Zeitgeist]

Thank you, Premier Kenny, for resisting the assault on human freedom.  Alberta is a last refuge.  Resist outside pressure to limit freedoms because it won’t end.

[Boges]

12 minutes ago, Zeitgeist said:

Thank you, Premier Kenny, for resisting the assault on human freedom.  Alberta is a last refuge.  Resist outside pressure to limit freedoms because it won’t end.

The pressure is coming within. 

Alberta will be the first province to go back to broad lockdowns inorder to preserve Healthcare capabilities. More freedoms will be lost because of the minority, who are too chicken-shit to get a safe vaccine. 

Alberta will be an example to the rest of the country that vaccination does work and vaccine passports are required to keep the unvaccinated from compromising the Healthcare system. 

 

 

Edited September 9, 2021 by Boges

[Accountability Now]

5 hours ago, Boges said:

Fox News demands its employees are vaxxed. 

No they don't. They just make their staff do extra steps based on their vaccination status. Supplying that vaccination status was mandatory. 

https://www.cnn.com/2021/08/18/media/fox-mandate-vaccine-status/index.html

I don't think people would be upset if they could keep their jobs knowing they just need to do an extra steps like rapid tests for example. Speaking of rapid tests...why is that not an option

https://www.ctvnews.ca/health/coronavirus/experts-recommend-using-more-rapid-tests-so-why-is-canada-so-far-behind-other-regions-1.5578229

[Zeitgeist]

3 hours ago, Boges said:

The pressure is coming within. 

Alberta will be the first province to go back to broad lockdowns inorder to preserve Healthcare capabilities. More freedoms will be lost because of the minority, who are too chicken-shit to get a safe vaccine. 

Alberta will be an example to the rest of the country that vaccination does work and vaccine passports are required to keep the unvaccinated from compromising the Healthcare system. 

 

 

I think at this point restrictions are a political choice.  Enough people are vaccinated, and vaccine mandates and passports are strongarming the resistors.   Hospitals are quiet.  Non-essential surgery is being canceled in Ontario too where ICU’s have plenty of room, though some healthcare workers are leaving their jobs because of vaccine mandates and restrictions, so there may be personnel shortages.

Edited September 9, 2021 by Zeitgeist

[cougar]

12 hours ago, Boges said:

This is why vaccine passports are required. Freedom of Choice has consequences.

 

I am afraid getting re-vaccinated every 6 months will have real health consequences for you.   Keep your passport though, it looks like for you it is more important than your health.

[Boges]

15 hours ago, Zeitgeist said:

Hospitals are quiet.  Non-essential surgery is being canceled in Ontario too where ICU’s have plenty of room, though some healthcare workers are leaving their jobs because of vaccine mandates and restrictions, so there may be personnel shortages.

So we're just making up our own facts now. 

[Boges]

6 hours ago, cougar said:

I am afraid getting re-vaccinated every 6 months will have real health consequences for you.   Keep your passport though, it looks like for you it is more important than your health.

Awww muffin. Cite a mandate for a booster every 6 months in Canada for an otherwise healthy person. 

Also not being vaccinated at all and being skeptical of boosters are two very different things. 

[dialamah]

16 hours ago, Zeitgeist said:

Hospitals are quiet.  Non-essential surgery is being canceled in Ontario too where ICU’s have plenty of room,

Partner went to emergency last night (not life threatening, but a scary symptom of a chronic condition).  He saw a steady influx of obviously sick, coughing people, all of whom answered "No" when asked if they'd been vaccinated.  He had to wait in the reception area because, as a nurse explained to him, the triage area could accommodate fewer people due to physical distancing required from the patients suspected of having Covid.  He left after 30 mins; too many sick people.  

The choice to not get vaccinated reduces the health care available to everyone.     That old saw that "your rights end where my nose begins" applies here.  I'm not a fan of this whole passport idea; I think it's unfair to businesses who'll have to enforce it and to people who really are at risk from a vaccine. 

But in my opinion, people who think "freedom" means putting the health and safety of everyone else at risk should be limited from participating in society.  It's really unfair that so many others have to suffer for the choice made by a few.  

Edited September 10, 2021 by dialamah

[OftenWrong]

49 minutes ago, dialamah said:

Partner went to emergency last night (not life threatening, but a scary symptom of a chronic condition).  He saw a steady influx of obviously sick, coughing people, all of whom answered "No" when asked if they'd been vaccinated.  He had to wait in the reception area because, as a nurse explained to him, the triage area could accommodate fewer people due to physical distancing required from the patients suspected of having Covid.  He left after 30 mins; too many sick people.  

The choice to not get vaccinated reduces the health care available to everyone.     That old saw that "your rights end where my nose begins" applies here.  I'm not a fan of this whole passport idea; I think it's unfair to businesses who'll have to enforce it and to people who really are at risk from a vaccine. 

But in my opinion, people who think "freedom" means putting the health and safety of everyone else at risk should be limited from participating in society.  It's really unfair that so many others have to suffer for the choice made by a few.  

Why is nobody asking that additional facilities and resources be built? New people trained and brought in. Make covid facilities. We can call them sanitariums. Then hospitals can continue to run with less of a burden.

Surely we have the money, and the will. There are young people sitting at home doing nothing.

All the nursing graduates should be offered a course to fast-track towards training in covid treatment, then guaranteed jobs as soon as they graduate.

But these are just the ideas of a simple man. I'm no big wheeler dealer, well connected in the upper eschelon.

[Boges]

30 minutes ago, OftenWrong said:

Why is nobody asking that additional facilities and resources be built? New people trained and brought in. Make covid facilities. We can call them sanitariums. Then hospitals can continue to run with less of a burden.

Surely we have the money, and the will. There are young people sitting at home doing nothing.

All the nursing graduates should be offered a course to fast-track towards training in covid treatment, then guaranteed jobs as soon as they graduate.

But these are just the ideas of a simple man. I'm no big wheeler dealer, well connected in the upper eschelon.

Well considering their is already a staff shortage of qualified people because they're sick of dealing with COVID patients. 

It's cute that you think training for an ICU Nurse is something that can be done as a weekend course. 

[OftenWrong]

5 minutes ago, Boges said:

Well considering their is already a staff shortage of qualified people because they're sick of dealing with COVID patients. 

It's cute that you think training for an ICU Nurse is something that can be done as a weekend course. 

Weekend? WTF are you talking about. Learn to read before yapping incessantly.

This shit has been going on for almost two years, and will likely continue for another year, or more.

Meantime I have been saying this all along.

Do let me know if you have questions...

[OftenWrong]

Instead they shuttered schools, closed every hospital service. If you had cancer, heart disease, you were told to let that go. That is called stochastic occurrence of death, invisible to the average dunderheads.

Whats unconscionable is not when you're dumb. It's when someone takes the time to explain it, and you're still dumb.

All you people

[Boges]

23 minutes ago, OftenWrong said:

Weekend? WTF are you talking about. Learn to read before yapping incessantly.

This shit has been going on for almost two years, and will likely continue for another year, or more.

Meantime I have been saying this all along.

Do let me know if you have questions...

And I'm sure no one thoughts of just training more nurses. ?  And only ICU nurses, of course. 

The reality is that OR and ER nurses are being tasked to help in ICUs, something they are not trained to do. 

Maybe rational people thought that there would be less Gene Pool challenged people thinking a vaccine is some government plot to control them and we'd be done with this pandemic by now. 

[Boges]

23 minutes ago, OftenWrong said:

Instead they shuttered schools, closed every hospital service. If you had cancer, heart disease, you were told to let that go. That is called stochastic occurrence of death, invisible to the average dunderheads.

Whats unconscionable is not when you're dumb. It's when someone takes the time to explain it, and you're still dumb.

All you people

You probably don't comprehend that Acute conditions would take priority over chronic conditions you pretend to care about. 

I think you've got it right, put all the unvaccinated COVID patients in the parking lot. OR put them in the refrigerated trucks they'll need to keep their corpses in ahead of time.