Cancel Culture . . . alive and well.

[Guest]

Pretty much any school or university has the right to pick and choose who they invite to speak.  It's not a freedom of speech issue.  The only thing one can do is assess it. 

Myself, I find any university that protects its students from speech to be failing its students.  Kindergartens are different.

[Michael Hardner]

7 hours ago, bcsapper said:

Pretty much any school or university has the right to pick and choose who they invite to speak.  It's not a freedom of speech issue.  The only thing one can do is assess it. 

Myself, I find any university that protects its students from speech to be failing its students.  Kindergartens are different.

Okay, but you're not speaking to the situation at hand here. The community pressured the school and had the speaker cancelled. I believe it's viewed as an infringement on academic freedom and freedom of speech.

What do we think about this?  Can something be done?

[Guest]

5 hours ago, Michael Hardner said:

Okay, but you're not speaking to the situation at hand here. The community pressured the school and had the speaker cancelled. I believe it's viewed as an infringement on academic freedom and freedom of speech.

What do we think about this?  Can something be done?

Yeah, sorry.  When I saw a post about a school banning a speaker I answered in generic terms (without reading the article, as often is my wont) because I do care about it.  Who knew it would actually involve kindergarteners?  My bad, I should pay more attention.  I'll try harder.

Given that, we think it is stupid, ignorant and simple-minded.  Amongst other adjectives, too many to mention.

Of course, the author's use of profanity is probably not the problem.  The problem lies with to what the profanity was referring.  Guns and abortion.  Can't have someone with those views talking to kids in a Texas school.

Anyway, no-one is breaking the law.  The school very much should have had the guts to stand up to the community and tell them where to shove their protests.  All schools should.  But in this case, they probably agreed with the parents.

You said you don't particularly care.  I do.  Nursery shool is probably too young to be concerned overly, but as students get older, the idea that the community, other students, student's unions or councils, should have the right to dictate what can and can't be taught, and who can and cannot speak on campus, is abhorrent to me.  As I said, they do their students a disservice by not allowing them to think for themselves.

Being English, atheist, and pro gay rights, this kind of thing concerns me a great deal.

https://www.secularism.org.uk/news/2019/03/more-schools-suspend-diversity-teaching-under-muslim-pressure

Can something be done?  Not much, while governments seem willing to cave into special interests.  The UK government has made "relationships education" compulsory, from primary school on, but they have still allowed parents to withdraw their children from classes where they wish.  Got it half right.

https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/managing-issues-with-lgbt-teaching-advice-for-local-authorities/primary-school-disruption-over-lgbt-teachingrelationships-education#part-two

Under the burgeoning theocracy that seems to be taking over in the US, I can see the same thing happening with Christianity.

Edited January 21, 2023 by bcsapper

[Michael Hardner]

@bcsapperI don't particularly care because this is Texas. I put a lot more care into examining issues if they're in my country, especially my province, especially my city.

 

The Toronto Library system accepted one speaker who was protested as being anti-trans. I cared a lot about that one.

[Guest]

1 minute ago, Michael Hardner said:

@bcsapperI don't particularly care because this is Texas. I put a lot more care into examining issues if they're in my country, especially my province, especially my city.

 

The Toronto Library system accepted one speaker who was protested as being anti-trans. I cared a lot about that one.

Yes, I can see that.  That's why I am so concerned about issues in the UK, even though I haven't lived there since 1984.

[Michael Hardner]

1 minute ago, bcsapper said:

Yes, I can see that.  That's why I am so concerned about issues in the UK, even though I haven't lived there since 1984.

I do believe it's happening everywhere, and is also happening on all sides of the political compass.

 

Now might be the time for us to come up with objective determinants of urgent cases.

 

The Canadian academic freedom organization, I don't remember their exact name, frames canceled lectures or classes as infringements of academic freedom. So the Texas case would qualify under Canadian rules.

Lindsay Shepherd was told that she couldn't hold an open discussion, and was lied to as to the reasons.

[Guest]

2 minutes ago, Michael Hardner said:

I do believe it's happening everywhere, and is also happening on all sides of the political compass.

 

Now might be the time for us to come up with objective determinants of urgent cases.

 

The Canadian academic freedom organization, I don't remember their exact name, frames canceled lectures or classes as infringements of academic freedom. So the Texas case would qualify under Canadian rules.

Lindsay Shepherd was told that she couldn't hold an open discussion, and was lied to as to the reasons.

I looked them up. 

https://www.caut.ca/latest/publications/academic-freedom

I didn't know about that organization.  I'll have to do some reading.

[Infidel Dog]

7 minutes ago, bcsapper said:

Yes, I can see that.  That's why I am so concerned about issues in the UK, even though I haven't lived there since 1984.

You mean like this one:

JK Rowling is cancelled again: Performing arts school drops Harry Potter author's name from house over her views on transgender rights

At least in Texas the children they're protecting from the agenda of no guns, no baby murder backed up with foul language were just little children.

But yeah...the school council maybe got a little over-twitchy here if it's a free speech issue. The gun-hating, baby killing author claimed she just wanted to talk to kids about hats. She didn't want to bring in a Tranny with a strap-on or anything. (At least not this time.)

Oh well, that's what happens in Texas when you're a writer who wants to build yourself a hardcore Prog-comm rep. Maybe it shouldn't.

[Guest]

11 minutes ago, Infidel Dog said:

You mean like this one:

JK Rowling is cancelled again: Performing arts school drops Harry Potter author's name from house over her views on transgender rights

At least in Texas the children they're protecting from the agenda of no guns, no baby murder backed up with foul language were just little children.

But yeah...the school council maybe got a little over-twitchy here if it's a free speech issue. The gun-hating, baby killing author claimed she just wanted to talk to kids about hats. She didn't want to bring in a Tranny with a strap-on or anything. (At least not this time.)

Oh well, that's what happens in Texas when you're a writer who wants to build yourself a hardcore Prog-comm rep. Maybe it shouldn't.

Yeah, I think the treatment of J.K. Rowling has been abysmal.

[Michael Hardner]

1 hour ago, bcsapper said:

I looked them up. 

https://www.caut.ca/latest/publications/academic-freedom

I didn't know about that organization.  I'll have to do some reading.

Read about Harry S. Crowe...

[Guest]

On 1/20/2023 at 11:04 PM, bcsapper said:

Myself, I find any university that protects its students from speech to be failing its students.

Exactly. You're robbing them of the ability to think critically.

You're teaching them to be soft, and lost the moment anything deviates from the written instructions.

[Michael Hardner]

On 1/20/2023 at 11:04 PM, bcsapper said:

I find any university that protects its students from speech to be failing its students.  

Has this happened?

[Guest]

1 hour ago, Michael Hardner said:

Has this happened?

Oh sure, I see an article on it every now and then.

[Michael Hardner]

59 minutes ago, bcsapper said:

Oh sure, I see an article on it every now and then.

?

[I am Groot]

On 6/11/2021 at 10:01 PM, Moonlight Graham said:

I think it creates more unity.  The French are anti-British.  Anything 'British" alienates them, and I imagine many aboriginals too.

Okay, then anything French alienates me. So when is the federal government going to do everything they can to destroy their culture and heritage?

[I am Groot]

I'm not sure where this fits but it is another story of how hardcore the illiberal elements of the Left who infest education have become with their endless insertion of their ideological views into the curriculum.

Saying 2+2=4 is an example of covert white supremacy, according to a group of influential math teachers in Ontario. Questioning them on their assertion simply means you are an anti-trans, anti-immigrant person who doesn’t like anyone who isn’t white.

https://torontosun.com/opinion/columnists/lilley-radical-teachers-claim-that-saying-224-is-white-supremacy

[Guest]

11 minutes ago, I am Groot said:

Saying 2+2=4 is an example of covert white supremacy

We are truly making sure we keep generations of kids so low on the education scores, that participation grades would be the only means of passing. 

I see this as those stating professionalism is racist. 

I will die a happy man, when glorifying having a room temperature IQ becomes racist, punishable by 4 lashes from a whip. 

Or, 2+2.

[Michael Hardner]

The Sun isn't a good source.  But we can agree that governments and activism are taking education away from educators.

[Guest]

10 hours ago, Michael Hardner said:

The Sun isn't a good source.

This is part of the issue with news. Nowadays, not the information provided, but the correct political alignment of the news outlet could make a statement come into question. 

Its no longer "the story checks out", but rather "I like the alignment, so I agree."

[Michael Hardner]

50 minutes ago, Perspektiv said:

This is part of the issue with news. Nowadays, not the information provided, but the correct political alignment of the news outlet could make a statement come into question. 

Its no longer "the story checks out", but rather "I like the alignment, so I agree."

Yeah, bad assumption on your part. The Sun was admonished by the Press Council for publishing fake and defamatory stories about Muslims. I like newspapers, pretty much every other newspaper in Canada is conservative.

Don't make bad assumptions.

Edited April 5, 2023 by Michael Hardner

[Guest]

46 minutes ago, Michael Hardner said:

Don't make bad assumptions.

There have been questionable stories from other newspapers. 

There is a growing distrust of the news for a reason.

[Michael Hardner]

1 minute ago, Perspektiv said:

There have been questionable stories from other newspapers. 

There is a growing distrust of the news for a reason.

Do you have another example of a newspaper being admonished by the Press Council of newspapers, and refusing to accept the ruling?  For publishing racist lies?

If not, then your moral compass is off.

Edited April 5, 2023 by Michael Hardner

[I am Groot]

Segregation is a good thing now! It's the progressive thing to do!

Spaces designated for students from marginalized backgrounds are spreading across Canadian universities, as officials say they are a necessary and overdue response to decades of racism on campus.

Toronto Metropolitan University officially opened a space late last month for students who self-identify as Black.

https://www.ctvnews.ca/canada/a-beautiful-community-universities-open-lounges-for-black-students-1.6342294

[Guest]

18 minutes ago, I am Groot said:

Segregation is a good thing now! It's the progressive thing to do!

Spaces designated for students from marginalized backgrounds are spreading across Canadian universities, as officials say they are a necessary and overdue response to decades of racism on campus.

Toronto Metropolitan University officially opened a space late last month for students who self-identify as Black.

https://www.ctvnews.ca/canada/a-beautiful-community-universities-open-lounges-for-black-students-1.6342294

Didn't you say earlier that people just prefer being with their own kind?  I suppose non-white minorities in the west are simply finding out what white people in the west, and non whites in other areas of the world,  have known for a long time.  Life is more fun when you are with people who look like you.

Me, I'd tell them all to mingle or go home.  Otherwise how on Earth are we all going to learn to get along?

Edited April 6, 2023 by bcsapper

[Guest]

8 minutes ago, Michael Hardner said:

Do you have another example of a newspaper being admonished by the Press Council of newspapers, and refusing to accept the ruling?  For publishing racist lies?

There has been a wide ranging history of questionable stories put out as fact. Retractions as well. 

There is a reason why a significant percentage of Canadians who struggle to tell fake news apart from real news.