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Ontario lockdowns


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Ontario has been in some form of lockdown since Dec. 24, 2020 with a brief and insignificant interruption. Is it the world record already?

In the meanwhile museums in New York City never closed, and schools in a number of countries stayed open.

In the meanwhile UK has advanced in vaccination, reopened the economy and international travel to EU.

Who is responsible for keeping the public informed and protected without shutting down all and anything on a whim? Is anyone responsible for effective management of the epidemics, rather than the society?

How long and how effective should lockdowns be, should there be clear and meaningful known and explained to the public criteria?

Is it still a tool of public health or already of public control and bureaucratic avoidance of responsibility?

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  • 2 months later...

A lockdown was needed back then two three months ago because we didn't have enough vaccines and most Ontarians were not protected so we have over 4000 daily new cases and close to 100 deaths every day. To protect the public a lockdown was necessary then however, now that 80% of adult population in Ontario are vaccinated and there are ample supply of vaccines to fully vaccinate every Ontarian then NO MORE LOCKDOWNS is necessary or acceptable.

There is a small minority who for childish reasons are refusing vaccines. Those minorities will not only compromise their own safety but will also compromise the safety of others especially those who for health reasons cannot vaccinate or their body will not react as well to build good amount of antibodies. to put it bluntly THEY ARE KILLING PEOPLE because the virus will multiply and transmit to others. Fortunately those vaccinated will be highly (but nt fully) protected and if they are infected in overwhelming majority of cases it will be mild however, many unvaccinated people will catch the virus and die from it too. Their decision and their business not mine BUT I WILL NOT RESTRICT MYSELF ANYMORE AND WILL DISOBEY ANY FUTURE LOCKDOWNS AND REFUSE TO WEAR MASKS.

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There’s no need for future lockdowns and I think that if employees show their employers proof of second vaccination, those citizens should not be required to wear masks in their workplaces.  If they want to wear them they can, but they pose almost no risk to anyone and they shouldn’t be penalized by having to wear PPE for no good reason.

At this point masking should be optional for customers, whether in shops, on transit, at the threatre, or in concerts.  If businesses wish to require proof of full vaccination of customers to go unmasked, they can do this, but people will likely choose to patronize other businesses.

Government should no longer require masking indoors. The only exception would be in certain fields for unvaccinated workers, such as healthcare and education, but fully vaccinated workers in those fields should not be required to mask except in the circumstances that they did pre-pandemic, such as when performing surgeries.

It’s now on individuals to protect themselves and their children as they see fit.

Hopefully schools will be fully opened, vaccinated teachers and students will be unmasked, and parents can make informed decisions about whether to mask their unvaccinated children without government intervention.

Countries will impose their own vaccine rules on visitors and hopefully they follow science.  Here we are in Canada with more of our population fully vaccinated and fewer cases than Britain and the US, and Britain is requiring quarantine of Canadians but not Americans.  So much for the British Commonwealth.  Might as well scrap the monarchy if that’s where Canadians stand.

I also find it ridiculous that after so much lobbying from Chuck Shumer and the border states for Canada to allow non-essential travel to the US across our land border, now it’s Biden keeping the border closed. Daft, unscientific, and damaging to the economies of US border states. Canada did make the right move to reopen the border to fully-vaccinated Americans.  It will help our tourism sector and border towns.  It’s still harder for vaccinated Americans to come in than it is for unvaccinated Canadians to travel between Quebec and Ontario or other provinces.  No proof of vaccination or border checks required.

I think all testing and quarantine requirements must be dropped for all fully-vaccinated international travellers. Otherwise it’s simply too onerous to travel, especially for short trips.

The Delta variant has hardly any impact on vaccinated people.  Most healthy unvaccinated children can also fight it.  Masking indoors for them is advisable, but I’m not sure government should mandate it.  If they do it should be contingent on high local transmission rates.

Edited by Zeitgeist
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  • 5 months later...
1 hour ago, Faramir said:

Much ado about nothing.  A variant that is not deadly and the whole world is losing its shit.  Stupid.

Yup this is media-hyped mass hysteria.  Everyone I know who is really bright and does their homework knows this has become a manufactured crisis.  If there were no restrictions right now, no tests, and no screening, we’d have a higher absentee rate in schools and workplaces for several weeks until Omicron infects everyone.  My guess is that half the population ether got it and was asymptomatic, had mild symptoms and didn’t bother getting tested to find out, or they got a confirmed test result.  It’s spreading rapidly.  Hopefully it crowds out other variants and future variants are milder, which is typically the case.  We’re fine.  The vulnerable should get the boosts I think and should be more careful generally.  That’s it.  Drop all restrictions.  Endemic.  

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16 hours ago, Zeitgeist said:

Yup this is media-hyped mass hysteria.  Everyone I know who is really bright and does their homework knows this has become a manufactured crisis.  If there were no restrictions right now, no tests, and no screening, we’d have a higher absentee rate in schools and workplaces for several weeks until Omicron infects everyone.  My guess is that half the population ether got it and was asymptomatic, had mild symptoms and didn’t bother getting tested to find out, or they got a confirmed test result.  It’s spreading rapidly.  Hopefully it crowds out other variants and future variants are milder, which is typically the case.  We’re fine.  The vulnerable should get the boosts I think and should be more careful generally.  That’s it.  Drop all restrictions.  Endemic.  

Well said.  The media just loves this stuff though.

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39 minutes ago, Michael Hardner said:

LOL.... I'm going to start making a list of 'hot button' words.

By 'The Media' I'm assuming you mean CBC and CNN and nothing else...

Have either even mentioned the actual and pitiful death rate of Omicron yet?

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Actually 14 new deaths were reported today in Ontario, but it's not clear over what time period and one hears about the general confusion between those admitted for covid and those admitted with covid.

Here's another real important stat in Ontario that they seem all of a sudden shy to talk about:

"Of those who tested positive, the Ministry of Health says 1,554 were unvaccinated, 386 were partially vaccinated, 9,255 were fully vaccinated and 387 had an unknown vaccination status." 

https://www.cp24.com/news/ontario-reports-14-new-covid-19-deaths-hospitalizations-up-62-per-cent-in-one-day-1.5728291

There was no hesitancy in producing that stat at the beginning of the Delta Wave when the unvaccinated to vaccinated ratio was flipped the other way around.

Edited by Infidel Dog
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Here's another stat the "pandemic of the unvaccinated" aren't bragging about lately:

Last updated: January 5, 2022 at 9:25 a.m. (EST)

Hospitalizations by vaccination status

In hospital but not the ICU

Unvaccinated cases  471
Partially vaccinated cases   108
Fully vaccinated cases  1073
 
Oh and BTW masks and lockdowns don't work. On this one you don't even need the science (even though you can make a good case it agrees.) All you need is common sense. We know masks and lockdowns (I would add vaccine passports and segregation of the unvaccinated) don't work because they haven't worked.
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Ontario (Canada) Admits 50% of “COVID” Hospitalizations Not From COVID, Death Count May Also Be Misleadin

"

COVID hospitalizations and deaths throughout this pandemic have been inaccurately reported. This has been made clear by government health officials throughout the pandemic in multiple regions across the planet. One of them is in Ontario, Canada.

Dr. Kieran Moore, Ontario’s chief medical officer, reaffirmed this once again in a press conference held at the end of December. She stated that Ontario’s daily reported COVID hospitalization numbers haven’t been telling the fully story.

She confirmed that approximately 50% of COVID hospitalizations represent people who aren’t actually there suffering from COVID, but have gone to the hospital with something else, like a broken leg, and just happened to test positive. The Toronto Sun was one of the few media outlets to emphasize this.

Brampton (an outskirt of the Greater Toronto Area) Mayor Patrick Brown Echoed Moore’s statements. On Dec 29, 2021 CTV News Toronto reported that he has heard from a number of physicians that COVID hospitalization numbers may not necessarily paint an accurate picture of the current situation in the province.

He said that approximately 50 per cent of people in hospitals diagnosed with COVID were admitted for another reason."

https://thepulse.one/2022/01/05/ontario-canada-admits-50-of-covid-hospitalizations-not-from-covid-deaths-count-may-also-be-misleading/

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  • 2 weeks later...
1 hour ago, myata said:

December 2021 -January 2022 number 4 now. Keeping the count.

Yes we must remember the number and length of lockdowns and restrictions.  We must also remember their timing.  I have no respect for governments that restrict freedoms so easily and unaccountably.  Perhaps Britain will lead sad colonial Canada back to freedom, since we seem to have forgotten how long it took and how hard it was to forge our parliamentary democracy, so quickly erased and replaced by post-national state.  

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Well...apparently my wife's bar can open up again in a week. Goodie! Beer, buddies and 8Ball!

I know that in Canada we have limp leadership all around but...GAWD I long for a real leader.

Just how far do Canuck Libbies have to be pushed, before they push back?

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On 1/4/2022 at 8:13 PM, Zeitgeist said:

Yup this is media-hyped mass hysteria.  Everyone I know who is really bright and does their homework knows this has become a manufactured crisis.  If there were no restrictions right now, no tests, and no screening, we’d have a higher absentee rate in schools and workplaces for several weeks until Omicron infects everyone.  My guess is that half the population ether got it and was asymptomatic, had mild symptoms and didn’t bother getting tested to find out, or they got a confirmed test result.  It’s spreading rapidly.  Hopefully it crowds out other variants and future variants are milder, which is typically the case.  We’re fine.  The vulnerable should get the boosts I think and should be more careful generally.  That’s it.  Drop all restrictions.  Endemic.  

Maybe a better strategy in all these would have been no lock downs from the beginning. Let the unfortunate 1% of population die at home (no hospitals for covid patients and no cancelation of surgeries) and the lucky 99% survivors live a normal life once world population all infected and herd immunity established  within a few weeks. This way with lock downs and closings and bankruptcies , joblessness, bad economy dragging on for 2 years and never ending, they are killing all the 100% soon.

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13 minutes ago, CITIZEN_2015 said:

Maybe a better strategy in all these would have been no lock downs from the beginning. Let the unfortunate 1% of population die at home (no hospitals for covid patients and no cancelation of surgeries) and the lucky 99% survivors live a normal life once world population all infected and herd immunity established  within a few weeks. This way with lock downs and closings and bankruptcies , joblessness, bad economy dragging on for 2 years and never ending, they are killing all the 100% soon.

I think restrictions played a necessary short-term role before we knew more about the virus and how to treat it. Once everyone who was eligible for a vaccine had the opportunity to get it, there was no justification for restrictions.  With 90% of the adult population vaccinated, there’s no need to impose mandates, passports, etc.  It’s a grossly unnecessary affront to democracy.

Edited by Zeitgeist
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10 hours ago, Zeitgeist said:

I think restrictions played a necessary short-term role before we knew more about the virus and how to treat it. Once everyone who was eligible for a vaccine had the opportunity to get it, there was no justification for restrictions.  With 90% of the adult population vaccinated, there’s no need to impose mandates, passports, etc.  It’s a grossly unnecessary affront to democracy.

I agree, this round of restrictions is especially punitive and unhelpful. 

Notice, we're telling everyone their cloth masks are useless, yet we still need to wear them? Only N95 masks? But no one really has the guts to mandate N95 masks or mandate 3rd doses for passports. 

With Omicron, the idea of having a server wear a mask and making people wear masks when going to the bathroom, BUT sitting and eating is a safe zone makes no sense. 

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5 hours ago, Boges said:

I agree, this round of restrictions is especially punitive and unhelpful. 

Notice, we're telling everyone their cloth masks are useless, yet we still need to wear them? Only N95 masks? But no one really has the guts to mandate N95 masks or mandate 3rd doses for passports. 

With Omicron, the idea of having a server wear a mask and making people wear masks when going to the bathroom, BUT sitting and eating is a safe zone makes no sense. 

There are many things that dont make sense here. Remember I complained the masks were a waste of time, even add to the risk if people think they make them safe.

N95’s are another useless suggestion that is expensive and will produce more waste. Unless they are properly fitted there is no advantage. They need to make a good seal. That means the elastic is strong, and it hurts to wear for extended periods. They are not intended for that. You must also be clean-shaven. 

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On 5/18/2021 at 5:41 AM, myata said:

Ontario has been in some form of lockdown since Dec. 24, 2020 with a brief and insignificant interruption. Is it the world record already?

In the meanwhile museums in New York City never closed, and schools in a number of countries stayed open.

In the meanwhile UK has advanced in vaccination, reopened the economy and international travel to EU.

Who is responsible for keeping the public informed and protected without shutting down all and anything on a whim? Is anyone responsible for effective management of the epidemics, rather than the society?

How long and how effective should lockdowns be, should there be clear and meaningful known and explained to the public criteria?

Is it still a tool of public health or already of public control and bureaucratic avoidance of responsibility?

Just ask your local politician as to whether they ever believed in this scamdemic at all and that it was all for real. Some of them will say yes it was all for real when in fact they probably know already that it was not for real at all but all just a scam. No doubt most of them just went along to get along and stay in favor with their dear so called political leaders. Those politicians have betrayed we the peasants and they need to be dealt with as soon as possible for their crimes against Canadians and their crimes against humanity. This has to have been one of the greatest hoaxes ever played on humankind. The joke has been on us folks, and it is time to say I quit and demand your rights and freedoms back. Otherwise, these politicians will gladly keep this hoax alive and going for as long as we the peasants will allow them. Hello? It's time to wake up and tell these liars where to go. I say to them all, truck off. Works for me. ?

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