French Patriot Posted December 23, 2020 Report Share Posted December 23, 2020 Why does god put the needs of the few above the needs of the many? That moral tenet is about the only objective moral tenet I know of that has not been shown to ever be subjective. Yahweh seems to be doing the wrong thing. We are told that most of us will end on the wide road to hell while the few end on the narrow path to heaven. It is demonstrable that nature creates for the best possible end. Why does Yahweh not follow the better rules he gave nature, and creates us for the worst possible end for the vast majority of us? A decent father would not have the morals or ethics Yahweh seems to follow. If true, then we end with more souls lost to Satan than souls saved by Yahweh. Even as scriptures say that Yahweh wills that all souls be saved. God not getting his will is not allowed. God must always come out ahead. Something is not right for god. Thoughts? Regards DL Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted December 23, 2020 Report Share Posted December 23, 2020 If the scriptures say that Yahweh wills that all souls be saved, and it is obvious that there are an awful lot of souls out there that will not come even close to being saved, does that not indicate that there probably is no Yahweh? Either that or the scriptures are wrong, or Yahweh's just not that strong willed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nancysun Posted December 24, 2020 Report Share Posted December 24, 2020 Quote When e talk about moral or ethics, are we talking about the manmade rules? It is not the will of Yahweh that any should perish. Maybe the quest for more is what has derailed a lot people. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oops Posted December 30, 2020 Report Share Posted December 30, 2020 (edited) Punishment if used properly is meant to be transformational. When we punish our children, it is done to teach them that there are consequences to their actions. Hopefully it helps them them to make better choices, and become more thoughtful, well balanced people. What if God still sees those who have been sentenced to eternal punishment, and doesn't give up the right to redeem those he thinks have seen that they need to change? What if the fire is eternal, but the sentence conditional, and intended to mold, not destroy? Edited December 30, 2020 by oops Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OftenWrong Posted January 3, 2021 Report Share Posted January 3, 2021 Because the 11-dimensional supracosmic space-slug, which oozes quantum slime from which our universe is created, is about to roll over. According to quantum mechanics... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
French Patriot Posted January 4, 2021 Author Report Share Posted January 4, 2021 On 12/23/2020 at 11:39 AM, bcsapper said: If the scriptures say that Yahweh wills that all souls be saved, and it is obvious that there are an awful lot of souls out there that will not come even close to being saved, does that not indicate that there probably is no Yahweh? Either that or the scriptures are wrong, or Yahweh's just not that strong willed. Not come?? You are thinking limits for a limitless god. If you have a gods power, you always get what you want and will to get. If you are willing that none be lost, none are. Regards DL Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted January 4, 2021 Report Share Posted January 4, 2021 1 minute ago, French Patriot said: Not come?? You are thinking limits for a limitless god. If you have a gods power, you always get what you want and will to get. If you are willing that none be lost, none are. Regards DL Excellent. I'm going to Heaven anyway then. I never imagined! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
French Patriot Posted January 4, 2021 Author Report Share Posted January 4, 2021 On 12/24/2020 at 8:11 AM, Nancysun said: Not a lot, if you go by the stats. BTW. Our morals are created by our DNA and nature. That is why our laws are superior to Yahweh's. We create for the best possible end while he does the opposite. Hence his genocidal nature. Regards DL Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
French Patriot Posted January 4, 2021 Author Report Share Posted January 4, 2021 1 minute ago, bcsapper said: Excellent. I'm going to Heaven anyway then. I never imagined! It is a great place but one could imagine better. Jesus, the Gnostic Jesus that is, knew intellectually that we lived in the best of all possible worlds, because it was the only possible world, given history. We can of course imagine better. Regards DL Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
French Patriot Posted January 4, 2021 Author Report Share Posted January 4, 2021 On 12/30/2020 at 11:03 AM, oops said: Punishment if used properly is meant to be transformational. When we punish our children, it is done to teach them that there are consequences to their actions. Hopefully it helps them them to make better choices, and become more thoughtful, well balanced people. What if God still sees those who have been sentenced to eternal punishment, and doesn't give up the right to redeem those he thinks have seen that they need to change? What if the fire is eternal, but the sentence conditional, and intended to mold, not destroy? I agree. To cure is moral and good while to kill is immoral and evil. Dogma says that Yahweh kills when he could just as easily cure. That makes Yahweh evil, but somehow not to Christians. Regards DL Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
French Patriot Posted January 4, 2021 Author Report Share Posted January 4, 2021 22 hours ago, OftenWrong said: Because the 11-dimensional supracosmic space-slug, which oozes quantum slime from which our universe is created, is about to roll over. According to quantum mechanics... Again? Big deal. Regards DL Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oops Posted January 4, 2021 Report Share Posted January 4, 2021 1 hour ago, bcsapper said: Excellent. I'm going to Heaven anyway then. I never imagined! Might not be a direct flight. You might not like the layover. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oops Posted January 4, 2021 Report Share Posted January 4, 2021 1 hour ago, French Patriot said: I agree. To cure is moral and good while to kill is immoral and evil. Dogma says that Yahweh kills when he could just as easily cure. That makes Yahweh evil, but somehow not to Christians. Regards DL When a caterpillar goes into a cocoon, that is the end of the caterpillar, but there is still the butterfly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted January 4, 2021 Report Share Posted January 4, 2021 2 minutes ago, oops said: Might not be a direct flight. You might not like the layover. I could handle a few weeks in purgatory. Get some reading done. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oops Posted January 4, 2021 Report Share Posted January 4, 2021 25 minutes ago, bcsapper said: I could handle a few weeks in purgatory. Get some reading done. Cheers Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
French Patriot Posted January 8, 2021 Author Report Share Posted January 8, 2021 On 1/4/2021 at 4:40 PM, oops said: When a caterpillar goes into a cocoon, that is the end of the caterpillar, but there is still the butterfly. Your point being? Regards DL Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oops Posted January 9, 2021 Report Share Posted January 9, 2021 4 hours ago, French Patriot said: Your point being? What if death is not an end, but a transformation. What if death is not the most horrible end, but just a homecoming. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
French Patriot Posted January 9, 2021 Author Report Share Posted January 9, 2021 19 hours ago, oops said: What if death is not an end, but a transformation. What if death is not the most horrible end, but just a homecoming. What if I am wrong? What if you are wrong? What if we stop believing in fantasies and start believing in reality? That would be best. Right? Regards DL Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oops Posted January 9, 2021 Report Share Posted January 9, 2021 Since you have all the answers, and are so in touch with reality, what is your insight on near death experiences? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted January 9, 2021 Report Share Posted January 9, 2021 1 hour ago, oops said: Since you have all the answers, and are so in touch with reality, what is your insight on near death experiences? The brain is weird? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
French Patriot Posted January 12, 2021 Author Report Share Posted January 12, 2021 On 1/9/2021 at 4:36 PM, oops said: Since you have all the answers, and are so in touch with reality, what is your insight on near death experiences? I have none. I have never had such an experience so cannot speak honestly on that issue. I do believe in the supernatural and think it natural and likely a part of our seeking appeasement to insecurity. Telepathy is real though. I have first hand experience and will happily speak to that. If real, NDE seems cruel to the dying. They get so close to answers and heaven, then the doorman slams the door shut in your face. Oh well. Gnostic call Yahweh a demiurge for many good reasons. Yahweh always had a lot of cruelty. Not surprising that Jews rejected him. Stranger question still, is why Christians and Muslims tried to make him so much more of a vile god? Regards DL Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oops Posted January 12, 2021 Report Share Posted January 12, 2021 2 hours ago, French Patriot said: If real, NDE seems cruel to the dying. They get so close to answers and heaven, then the doorman slams the door shut in your face. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6172100/ While no two NDEs are the same, there are characteristic features that are commonly observed in NDEs. These characteristics include a perception of seeing and hearing apart from the physical body, passing into or through a tunnel, encountering a mystical light, intense and generally positive emotions, a review of part or all of their prior life experiences, encountering deceased loved ones, and a choice to return to their earthly life. Doesn't seem cruel, or like a door slamming shut in their face. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
French Patriot Posted January 17, 2021 Author Report Share Posted January 17, 2021 It is like a cruel parent showing a child a treat just before eating it all himself. Regards DL Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oops Posted January 17, 2021 Report Share Posted January 17, 2021 2 hours ago, French Patriot said: It is like a cruel parent showing a child a treat just before eating it all himself. Regards DL The group of cardiac arrest survivors with NDEs were statistically more likely have a reduced fear of death, increased belief in life after death, interest in the meaning of life, acceptance of others, and were more loving and empathic. It may take years after NDEs for the aftereffects to become fully manifest. The aftereffects may be so substantial that NDErs may seem to be very different people to their loved ones and family. The consistency, intensity, and durability of NDE aftereffects is consistent with the NDErs’ typical personal assessments that their experiences were very meaningful and significant. It is remarkable that NDEs often occur during only minutes of unconsciousness, yet commonly result in substantial and life-long transformations of beliefs and values. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6172100/ Maybe the cruel parent didn't eat all the treat. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
French Patriot Posted January 17, 2021 Author Report Share Posted January 17, 2021 16 hours ago, oops said: The group of cardiac arrest survivors with NDEs were statistically more likely have a reduced fear of death, increased belief in life after death, interest in the meaning of life, acceptance of others, and were more loving and empathic. It may take years after NDEs for the aftereffects to become fully manifest. The aftereffects may be so substantial that NDErs may seem to be very different people to their loved ones and family. The consistency, intensity, and durability of NDE aftereffects is consistent with the NDErs’ typical personal assessments that their experiences were very meaningful and significant. It is remarkable that NDEs often occur during only minutes of unconsciousness, yet commonly result in substantial and life-long transformations of beliefs and values. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6172100/ Maybe the cruel parent didn't eat all the treat. Too bad it took the fear of death to make those people more moral. NDE is fiction. Prove me wrong. Regards DL Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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