Doug Ford and Covid 19

[myata]

29 minutes ago, Boges said:

They assume there were lots of gatherings for the Victoria Day weekend. They're giving it 2 weeks to see if there's a bump in cases/hospital admissions due to Victoria. Similar to how there was a spike for Easter that caused the Stay-at-Home Order in the first place.

That is: 1) ridiculous and 2) entirely unacceptable. Every month from now to and including October there will be a long weekend and (hopefully) good summer / fall weather. The Canada day holiday is only four weeks away. So where does it leave the country if the the only bureaucratic reasoning that was learned in well over a year (and near twenty from SARS-1) is let's drag it a bit longer and see what happens just in case.

And one more time: this is irresponsible, a failure of duty and responsibility. The bureaucracy was hired and paid for effective management of the epidemics, not experiments on the society. It just cannot get it, that it was paid to manage and deliver results, not order and dictate.

Edited June 3, 2021 by myata

[OftenWrong]

5 minutes ago, myata said:

That is: 1) ridiculous and 2) entirely unacceptable. Every month from now to and including October there will be a long weekend and (hopefully) good summer / fall weather. The Canada day holiday is only three weeks away. So where does it leave the country if the the only bureaucratic reasoning that was learned in well over a year (and near twenty from SARS-1) is let's drag it a bit longer and see what happens just in case.

And one more time: this is irresponsible, a failure of duty and responsibility. The bureaucracy was hired and paid for effective management of the epidemics, not experiments on the society. It just cannot get it, that it was paid to manage and deliver results, not order and dictate.

Because Doug Ford is absolutely way in over his head. He is a bewildered and frightened big stupid monkey.

He was in over his head the day Ontarians bestowed the premiership upon him, with resounding majority, a man who knew nothing. So let the people own what they've done, what they have chosen for themselves.

So let it be written, so let it be done,,,

[Boges]

1 hour ago, OftenWrong said:

Because Doug Ford is absolutely way in over his head. He is a bewildered and frightened big stupid monkey.

He was in over his head the day Ontarians bestowed the premiership upon him, with resounding majority, a man who knew nothing. So let the people own what they've done, what they have chosen for themselves.

So let it be written, so let it be done,,,

So are all the Premieres that have had to tackle a surge with certain lockdowns. No other parts of Canada are as populated as the Greater Toronto Area though. Unique problem in Canada. 

[myata]

8 minutes ago, Boges said:

So are all the Premieres that have had to tackle a surge with certain lockdowns. No other parts of Canada are as populated as the Greater Toronto Area though. Unique problem in Canada. 

Density of population, GTA: 849 pers/km2

Density of population, Oslo (Norway): 1,530.

Now compare the results in epidemics management. Almost twice the density and the economy did not shut down. There's no excuse for carelessness; ineptitude and at times, incompetence; combined with unwarranted, not earned and not deserved entitlements and ambitions.

[Boges]

5 minutes ago, myata said:

Density of population, GTA: 849 pers/km2

Density of population, Oslo (Norway): 1,530.

Now compare the results in epidemics management. Almost twice the density and the economy did not shut down. There's no excuse for carelessness; ineptitude and at times, incompetence; combined with unwarranted, not earned and not deserved entitlements and ambitions.

Oslo is smaller than the city of Mississauga. 

[OftenWrong]

15 minutes ago, Boges said:

So are all the Premieres that have had to tackle a surge with certain lockdowns. No other parts of Canada are as populated as the Greater Toronto Area though. Unique problem in Canada. 

You keep apologizing for Doug's mismanagement. If the GTA is the deal then why should children in eastern, central and northern Ontario stay home. Some places have no community outbreak, and never seen a single case. It's not like opening bars and restaurants. They're not going to get visited by kids from the GTA if they open up. It's just stupidity.

Even the head of Sick Kids hospital has come out against this.

[Boges]

8 minutes ago, OftenWrong said:

You keep apologizing for Doug's mismanagement. If the GTA is the deal then why should children in eastern, central and northern Ontario stay home. Some places have no community outbreak, and never seen a single case. It's not like opening bars and restaurants. They're not going to get visited by kids from the GTA if they open up. It's just stupidity.

Even the head of Sick Kids hospital has come out against this.

I don't have a school-age kid so I'm not bothered by that decision.

I'm not sure bringing kids back for 3 weeks in June does anything more that help out parents. I think they'll be doing Camps this summer, for sure. 

And I'm not particularly happy with DoFo, his style is irksome and his communication on this has been lacking. But also don't pretend the Liberals or NDP would have done any better. 

[OftenWrong]

2 minutes ago, Boges said:

I don't have a school-age kid so I'm not bothered by that decision.

Me neither. I'm more of a "caring for others besides myself" kinda guy though. 

Quote

I'm not sure bringing kids back for 3 weeks in June does anything more that help out parents. I think they'll be doing Camps this summer, for sure.

The issues raised by the top doc at Sick Kids has more to do with helping out the kids. There is an epidemic of mental health issues taking place that he claims is unprecedented.

Quote

And I'm not particularly happy with DoFo, his style is irksome and his communication on this has been lacking. But also don't pretend the Liberals or NDP would have done any better. 

I think a true leader would have done better. I'm not interested in parties. Real leadership is a different thing, requiring wisdom and experience. Which Canada at the moment has very little of.

[myata]

2 hours ago, Boges said:

Oslo is smaller than the city of Mississauga. 

You keep moving posts, it may be smaller in size but much higher in density and the results are measured per capita.

But the main problem isn't even with mediocre results at extremely high cost to the society. The main problem is that the bureaucracy is apparently and factually incapable of learning anything new, that isn't trivial and isn't an outrageous expense to the taxpayer. Nothing was learned in 16 years after SARS (travel from Wuhan, care homes); and nothing is leaned in over a year now of this pandemic. And so comes the next one, or the next variant, we can cross and hope all we want but it's all but certain that it will come, we'll have to start back from square one. Yes no problem no shut everything down and call in the army. While the others have learned and moved ahead.

Where will it leave us, in this century? It seems there's only one way to find out.

Edited June 3, 2021 by myata

[taxme]

5 hours ago, OftenWrong said:

Because Doug Ford is absolutely way in over his head. He is a bewildered and frightened big stupid monkey.

He was in over his head the day Ontarians bestowed the premiership upon him, with resounding majority, a man who knew nothing. So let the people own what they've done, what they have chosen for themselves.

So let it be written, so let it be done,,,

I cannot believe that a guy like pro covid globalist Ford can be what I would call a real and true conservative. Ford acts more like a leftist liberal like dictator rather than a real conservative leader. I read that dictator Ford wants to keep his phony emergency covid act in place until the end of the year. I guess that dictator Ford has no real plans in store of trying to open up Ontario anytime soon. I am pretty sure also that he wants to keep this covid lie and hoax going forever. 

Pretty much all of our Canadian politicians have become nothing more than a bunch of communist like tyrannical dictators. While America starts to open up again, Canada keeps up it's control and tyranny over we the sheeple. Will it ever end? Not until the sheeple decide that the end will happen right now. Just saying. 

 

[Zeitgeist]

The current restrictions are complete overkill.  If you haven’t been vaccinated and you’re vulnerable medically, stay home.  Open the businesses, end the travel restrictions on Canadians, open the schools.  If you’re scared, stay home except to access essential services.  

[myata]

12 hours ago, Zeitgeist said:

The current restrictions are complete overkill.  

There's famous theory by Einstein, of relativity. Sure, a server in a restaurant laid off temporarily/indefinitely may suspect that. But how can it be explained to a bureaucrat for whom barely anything has changed including a fav burger from the fav place? Can it still be explained or these are already different languages and planes of communication, hopelessly lost in translation?

[Boges]

14 hours ago, Zeitgeist said:

The current restrictions are complete overkill.  If you haven’t been vaccinated and you’re vulnerable medically, stay home.  Open the businesses, end the travel restrictions on Canadians, open the schools.  If you’re scared, stay home except to access essential services.  

This is true. 

Dofo is gun shy about a fourth wave. 

But keeping barring businesses from inperson shopping for months on end province-wide is criminal. 

[Dougie93]

14 hours ago, Zeitgeist said:

The current restrictions are complete overkill.  If you haven’t been vaccinated and you’re vulnerable medically, stay home.  Open the businesses, end the travel restrictions on Canadians, open the schools.  If you’re scared, stay home except to access essential services.  

I have to concede, I am of the lockdown class

my wife working from her home office, bringing home the bacon while pampering me around the clock

on our lovely property in our wealthy cantonment by the woods

the lockdown keeping the riff raff out, like a gated community with private park

we are even making profit from it, our property values have gone on a run up, triple what we paid for it now

vive le lockdowns, I say

[Boges]

2 minutes ago, Dougie93 said:

I have to concede, I am of the lockdown class

my wife working from her home office, bringing home the bacon while pampering me around the clock

on our lovely property in our wealthy cantonment by the woods

the lockdown keeping the riff raff out, like a gated community with private park

we are even making profit from it, our property values have gone on a run up, triple what we paid for it now

vive le lockdowns, I say

Many businesses are making a killing from the lockdowns. 

Less travel and eating out leads to more money for home renovations and other tangible purchases. 

[Dougie93]

3 minutes ago, Boges said:

Many businesses are making a killing from the lockdowns. 

Less travel and eating out leads to more money for home renovations and other tangible purchases. 

furthermore, the only alternatives are the lunatic leftist Liberals, Dippers & Greens

all of whom favour even more draconian measures

if you are against big government overreach, you're not going to vote for the left

moreover, I don't think the left has recovered from Kathleen Wynne yet

so I would say Doug Ford has a good chance of reelection, once the lockdowns are over

[Boges]

1 minute ago, Dougie93 said:

furthermore, the only alternatives are the lunatic leftist Liberals, Dippers & Greens

all of whom favour even more draconian measures

if you are against big government overreach, you're not going to vote for the left

moreover, I don't think the left has recovered from Kathleen Wynne yet

so I would say Doug Ford has a good chance of reelection, once the lockdowns are over

None of the people bitching on this site have any real alternative to DoFo. 

You hear Horvath warning against opening too early. "Do what the doctors say". 

The problem is, the doctors are automatically opposed to any risk. Life has risks. 

[Dougie93]

Just now, Boges said:

None of the people bitching on this site have any real alternative to DoFo. 

You hear Horvath warning against opening too early. "Do what the doctors say". 

The problem is, the doctors are automatically opposed to any risk. Life has risks. 

really the problem is that the democracy here is moribund

the system was set up by the British to ensure that a cabal of elites would always rule from Queen's Park

so no matter who you vote for, they will all comply with the establishment elitist agenda in the end

[Dougie93]

it's like remember Bob Rae ?

remember how exultant the Kneedippers were to finally elect their guy ?

then he turns out to be just another elitist Liberal, which he was at the federal level

then the unions all turned on him in a rage

when the Americans did this at the Capitol building in Washington, the Liberal media called it an "insurrection"

https://www.tvo.org/article/the-day-protesters-stormed-queens-park

 

 

[Dougie93]

I would actually like to see Andrea Horwath  running the government

just for the purposes of accelerationism

with Ontario's massive & mounting debt, it's just a matter of time before there is a fiscal & economic crisis

bring it on, I say, the sooner the better

bring on the angry mobs storming Queen's Park once again

burn it to the ground, see if I care, that's a viable way to limit government overreach in extremis, by all means

[Zeitgeist]

End restrictions immediately in Ontario.  Now that everyone 12 and up can get a vaccine easily, it’s on individuals to determine their level of risk and behave accordingly, not government.  This is a violation of people’s right to earn a livelihood.  It’s government overreach.  

Edited June 4, 2021 by Zeitgeist

[OftenWrong]

46 minutes ago, Boges said:

barring businesses from inperson shopping for months on end province-wide is criminal. 

"I just need to sit back and wait, for you people to come around"

-OW

[Dougie93]

3 minutes ago, Zeitgeist said:

  It’s government overreach.  

government in Canada overreaches by its very nature, it's a de facto police state written right into the laws

the only way to constrain it, is for the government to go broke

but since the official debt in Ontario of $400 billion or so is just the tip of the iceberg, we are getting there fast

the actual fiscal gap, total government outlays vs total receipts, is in the trillions

so Ontario is actually bankrupt right now, simply staving it off by kicking it down the road unto the grandchildren

[Dougie93]

it's true that the federal government's fiscal situation is slighter better on paper

but only because the Liberals downloaded their debt onto the provinces under Paul Martin

and the federal government is on the hook for all the provinces liabilities in the end

so when Ontario goes into crisis, that will drag the rest of Canada down in the process

[Boges]

37 minutes ago, OftenWrong said:

"I just need to sit back and wait, for you people to come around"

-OW

I've always thought this. 

But Lockdowns were needed at one point.