Warning to All MLW Members - Fear and the Cronavirus

[Michael Hardner]

1 hour ago, Shady said:

I don’t think a country of over a billion people is going to have issues with labour shortages.  But I agree with the other points.  And the last point is a great example of why our government should be running balanced budgets in relatively good economic times, so that when it becomes necessary, we can run a large temporary deficit without any significant negative impact to the budget.  It’s why Trudeau’s decision to purposely run big deficits since he took office was so dumb and short sighted.

They will have labour shortages.  You can't spin on a dime and hire for a factory.  Also they have low unemployment, but maybe you have a point.

I agree with the last point too but Trudeau's deficit wasn't big.

[Guest]

6 minutes ago, Michael Hardner said:

They will have labour shortages.  You can't spin on a dime and hire for a factory.  Also they have low unemployment, but maybe you have a point.

I agree with the last point too but Trudeau's deficit wasn't big.

You don't need to hire in China.  Just tell people to show up.  Or maybe use the ones in the concentration camps.

[Michael Hardner]

Just now, bcsapper said:

You don't need to hire in China.  Just tell people to show up.  Or maybe use the ones in the concentration camps.

Somehow this doesn't sound Like an easy pivot, maybe worse than the other scenario.

[jacee]

2 hours ago, Rue said:

Usually in the first month or so of such issues people act irrationally I won't run out and buy toilet paper or stock up on  stupidity. Food supplies and logistics are fine. 

In any event I am grouchy these days from all the dumb panic

People need to get a grip on their reality and understand the very cell phone full of their own germs is what is spreading the virus not just on the surface of the screen but in the sheer volume of stupidity going across the internet.

Many businesses are shutting down, people are laid off, EI will be overburdened and slow in replacing people's income.

I understand the 'panic' from that perspective, low wage/precarious workers are stocking up until EI comes through. They have no savings, no personal safety net, and will be entirely dependent on government for rent and necessities. 

[Guest]

3 minutes ago, Michael Hardner said:

Somehow this doesn't sound Like an easy pivot, maybe worse than the other scenario.

Worse, but more likely.

[eyeball]

12 hours ago, Moonlight Graham said:

What is a bane on our existence is a country of 1.4 billion people that eat dog and cat.

Yes and the whole planet has been falling all over itself in the haste to fuel the growth of that bane's existence.  A veritable land of milk and honey for corporations and wealthy investors that was all the more veritable due to a lax business friendly growth and wealth enhancing lack of regulatory oversight.  Globalization is as responsible for this as anything and the globe has been encouraging and walking into this with eyes wide open for decades.

The bane of our existence is also our godsend.

Edited March 14, 2020 by eyeball

[Rue]

12 hours ago, Moonlight Graham said:

What is a bane on our existence is a country of 1.4 billion people that eat dog and cat.  If you think that's a dumb stereotype, they have dog meat food festivals:  https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/asia/yulin-dog-meat-festival-video-china-blow-torch-animal-cruelty-a8969361.html

Coronavirus apparently originated in a seafood market.  They have dirty, unsanitary, unregulated food practices that started SARS, different bird flu's, and now COVID-19:

https://www.businessinsider.com/wuhan-coronavirus-chinese-wet-market-photos-2020-1

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dog_meat#China

"The novel coronavirus and the SARS outbreak of 2003 have two things in common: Both are from the coronavirus family, and both most likely started in wet markets.

At such markets, outdoor stalls are squeezed together to form narrow lanes, where locals and visitors shop for cuts of meat and ripe produce. A stall selling caged chickens may abut a butcher counter, where meat is chopped as nearby dogs watch hungrily. Some vendors hock hares, while seafood stalls display glistening fish and shrimp.

Wet markets put people and live and dead animals — dogs, chickens, pigs, snakes, civets, and more — in constant close contact. That makes it easy for zoonotic diseases to jump from animals to humans.

"Poorly regulated, live-animal markets mixed with illegal wildlife trade offer a unique opportunity for viruses to spill over from wildlife hosts into the human population," the Wildlife Conservation Society said in a statement.

In the case of SARS and the new coronavirus disease, called COVID-19, bats were the original hosts. The bats then infected other animals, which transmitted the disease to humans."

I have read a paper and most virus experts say this one came from a mutated virus from the practice of eating bats. They are now pretty sure this one was from a bat and mutated.

So your comments about zoonotic diseases is dead on. Most of these viruses jump to us from what kind of flesh we eat. This is why for example at one point we had Leviticus trying to create health rules about what type of flesh to eat. It forbid shell fish because of red algae which would make them toxic. It prohibited eating of pig because the only way to guarantee a pig was safe to eat would be to salt it and in a hot desert climate salting meat would kill people.

For thousands of years people did not  mix dairy and meat and realized the transmission of germs while handling food kills.

What we have to day are people out of touch spreading their germs on their cell phones, computers and travelling much larger distances faster. People don't die off in the boats while travelling anymore. They get to where they go within hours carrying their diseases. With progress comes more movement of people and therefore increases in transmission of all kinds of things including viruses.

 

[Scott Mayers]

I don't plan on reacting as others are by making-a-run on the stores. Yet, I am concerned that if I wait patiently while others aren't, I might be losing out for NOT reacting! I'm going to be pissed if I go to the store to buy some simple necessity only to discover it is either not available or available but super-inflated in price. 

What is the best thing to do? I know that the government and media will be intentionally attempting to downplay concern for practical reasons. But it is also hypocritical to keep a 24/7 vigilance constantly in our face telling us: "BREAKING NEWS!...BREAKING NEWS!....BREAKING NEWS!", with the reports asserting, "But there is nothing to panick about." using medical/health authorities with absurd and almost psycho-hypnotically calm voices.

It reminds me of  this old classic:

 

[CITIZEN_2015]

Just now, Rue said:

On a more serious note as people know your intimate ties to Iran, we know that country was hit heavy and I hate to say such a negative thing but if it wipes out the damn idiots running the country good.

Unfortunately the virus doesn't discriminate and it takes many tens of innocent Iranians before killing one regime associate. That said many regime thugs and a few regime ayatollahs have been sent to hell by this virus so far.

The virus spread wildly in Iran directly as a result of regime purposely lying again and hiding the facts and figures from Iranians and the world for weeks so that it doesn't affect the parliamentary election turnout and as a result of them lying again to the nation and to the world many thousands are dead or dying now including many in Canada as many recent sufferers have been travelers from Iran. When the world is going to wake up and take this regime out by any possible means? It is now the safety of the whole world in jeopardy not just Iran nation.

[OftenWrong]

57 minutes ago, Rue said:

I have read a paper

Nice, do you still have any paper? You people are talking about reading. My problems are more fundamental...

Edited March 14, 2020 by OftenWrong

[SpankyMcFarland]

14 hours ago, CITIZEN_2015 said:

Israeli scientists may be close to developing a vaccine!!!!!!!

https://economictimes.indiatimes.com/news/science/scientists-in-israel-likely-to-announce-it-developed-coronavirus-vaccine/articleshow/74592807.cms?from=mdr

If so, then hail to Israel. The Israelis would save so many lives as western scientists all have said that it would take at least a year to have a vaccine for coronavirus. 

The testing process would still take many months. 

[SpankyMcFarland]

4 hours ago, Rue said:

As Shady said stupidity is the problem. If there is a slow down which now appears inevitable there will also be a rebound effect. Usually in the first month or so of such issues people act irrationally then calm down when reality hits in that hoarding toilet paper won't protect the Angel of Death from flying overhead and they should have smeared lamb's blood on their front door if you know what I mean.

Oh for sure all business across the board will feel an impact. Hell I face not working without pay now for at least what 3 weeks.....no problem though..I will eat my toilet paper.On a more serious note as people know your intimate ties to Iran, we know that country was hit heavy and I hate to say such a negative thing but if it wipes out the damn idiots running the country good.

My hunch is that this is going to cause serious disruption to the great economies of the world. If the Chinese lift restrictions to supply us with our goodies, the rumbling fire will break out again over there. The Americans are rushing through two new private company viral tests based on the WHO methodology that should have been approved in January, but better late than never. Given that this plague targets the elderly, Iran’s leadership could see a generational change at the least. Research from Germany suggests that people with mild or no symptoms can shed a lot of virus. On a brighter note, our toilet paper reserves are robust. I see Seattle has banned evictions:

https://komonews.com/news/coronavirus/seattle-to-issue-emergency-moratorium-on-evictions-due-to-covid-19

 

Edited March 14, 2020 by SpankyMcFarland

[jacee]

34 minutes ago, SpankyMcFarland said:

Usually in the first month or so of such issues people act irrationally then calm down when reality hits in that hoarding toilet paper won't protect the Angel of Death from flying overhead

Well, I didn't plan on panic buying, just regular shopping, but when I checked, I was low on soaps, TP, disinfectants, etc ... so here I am with bags full of them!  Lol 

Hint: Small stores aren't selling out like big ones. Got everything I need! 

[Army Guy]

3 hours ago, Michael Hardner said:

They will have labour shortages.  You can't spin on a dime and hire for a factory.  Also they have low unemployment, but maybe you have a point.

I agree with the last point too but Trudeau's deficit wasn't big.

Ya whats 60 plus bil, not counting the increases GDP, which brought in close to another  40 plus bil on top of what was already predicted....and he has already stated he would run another 40 bil plus in the next 3 years , which his predictions are always way off ,  on top of what ever this corona virus is going to cost... How big is big according to the left ? 

https://www.macleans.ca/politics/ottawa/then-and-now-justin-trudeau-on-deficit-politics/

[SpankyMcFarland]

12 minutes ago, jacee said:

Well, I didn't plan on panic buying, just regular shopping, but when I checked, I was low on soaps, TP, disinfectants, etc ... so here I am with bags full of them!  Lol 

Hint: Small stores aren't selling out like big ones. Got everything I need! 

Did I say anything about the Angel of Death? That was Rue. 

[Army Guy]

2 hours ago, Scott Mayers said:

I don't plan on reacting as others are by making-a-run on the stores. Yet, I am concerned that if I wait patiently while others aren't, I might be losing out for NOT reacting! I'm going to be pissed if I go to the store to buy some simple necessity only to discover it is either not available or available but super-inflated in price. 

What is the best thing to do? I know that the government and media will be intentionally attempting to downplay concern for practical reasons. But it is also hypocritical to keep a 24/7 vigilance constantly in our face telling us: "BREAKING NEWS!...BREAKING NEWS!....BREAKING NEWS!", with the reports asserting, "But there is nothing to panick about." using medical/health authorities with absurd and almost psycho-hypnotically calm voices.

It reminds me of  this old classic:

 

this whole thing is moving so fast now it is hard to predict what is coming next week, it has got most people across the country panicking, unfortunately that is going to dictate what you have to do, you can get prepared now, or wait in long lines for stuff that may or may not be available, and be that guy, who sounded cool in the early stages, and then was totally unprepared later on... I would get at the minimum of 3 weeks food, supplies, medications, water and what every else you think you need.. I don't know how things are going in the big cities, but here fredricton  NB going to the food stores is getting slightly dicey, lots of heated arguments, even fights breaking out over toilet paper, and believe it or not ice cream for some damn reason....and this is just the start...wait until more stuff gets harder to get... I would not panic just yet, don't be digging your bunker or anything....but I would start preparing today....

[Moonlight Graham]

2 hours ago, eyeball said:

Yes and the whole planet has been falling all over itself in the haste to fuel the growth of that bane's existence.  A veritable land of milk and honey for corporations and wealthy investors that was all the more veritable due to a lax business friendly growth and wealth enhancing lack of regulatory oversight.  Globalization is as responsible for this as anything and the globe has been encouraging and walking into this with eyes wide open for decades.

The bane of our existence is also our godsend.

Yes let's blame the evil corporations for dirty azz Chinese food markets and people eating cats and dogs.  LOL.  Yes its always the fault of capitalism and corporations and the west.  Don't make anyone actually responsible for their own actions, China is just a victim of the oppressive western oligarchy.  Give me a break man.

China needs to clean up its act.

[scribblet]

2 minutes ago, Moonlight Graham said:

Yes let's blame the evil corporations for dirty azz Chinese food markets and people eating cats and dogs.  LOL.  Yes its always the fault of capitalism and corporations and the west.  Don't make anyone actually responsible for their own actions, China is just a victim of the oppressive western oligarchy.  Give me a break man.

China needs to clean up its act.

Now they have an out break  of bird flu yet Canada still hasn't shut down travel.  Planeloads are still coming in from China and according to reports there are no screening procedures  in place, the government is lying.

Meanwhile Quebec is asking people over 70 to stay home.  what happens when thousands of seniors all arrive from florida.

[Argus]

31 minutes ago, Moonlight Graham said:

Yes let's blame the evil corporations for dirty azz Chinese food markets and people eating cats and dogs.  LOL.  Yes its always the fault of capitalism and corporations and the west.  Don't make anyone actually responsible for their own actions, China is just a victim of the oppressive western oligarchy.  Give me a break man.

China needs to clean up its act.

Well, it is the corporations which are pushing governments to ever closer ties with China. Back when Harper wanted nothing to do with them it was the corporations lobbying for him to change, and using their other bought and paid for politicians (sometimes known as "Liberals") to complain loudly and shrilly about missed opportunities. It's the corporations who see an opportunity for profit there, even if it's only on paper, since the Chinese generally don't let you take your profits out of country.

[Moonlight Graham]

22 minutes ago, Argus said:

Well, it is the corporations which are pushing governments to ever closer ties with China. Back when Harper wanted nothing to do with them it was the corporations lobbying for him to change, and using their other bought and paid for politicians (sometimes known as "Liberals") to complain loudly and shrilly about missed opportunities. It's the corporations who see an opportunity for profit there, even if it's only on paper, since the Chinese generally don't let you take your profits out of country.

Having our goods made cheaply in China reduces costs, and makes things for us cheaper to buy.  I get it. But we need to look at the longterm effects too.  Turning a fascist dictatorship that has waged economic warfare against us into the world's biggest economy with 1.4 billion people is very dangerous.

[taxme]

19 hours ago, Shady said:

Good news!

I saw a picture the other day on the internet of Jesus passing out rolls of toilet paper to his Christian followers. Gsus, it must be getting really serious and a severe shortage on toilet paper out there if this is what brought Jesus back to earth. Just saying.   

[SpankyMcFarland]

A recession is inevitable. 

[SpankyMcFarland]

Interesting US relaxation on the rules for physicians practicing telehealth in other states. 
 

https://www.cnn.com/2020/03/14/politics/telehealth-us-federal-response-coronavirus/index.html

 

[jacee]

1 hour ago, scribblet said:

Now they have an out break  of bird flu yet Canada still hasn't shut down travel.  Planeloads are still coming in from China and according to reports there are no screening procedures  in place, the government is lying.

Everyone flying in has to self-isolate for 2 weeks, I believe.

1 hour ago, scribblet said:

Meanwhile Quebec is asking people over 70 to stay home.  what happens when thousands of seniors all arrive from florida.

They go home and self-isolate for 2 weeks.

No need to panic. 

[Guest]

1 hour ago, jacee said:

Everyone flying in has to self-isolate for 2 weeks, I believe.

They go home and self-isolate for 2 weeks.

No need to panic. 

What should we do if they don't?